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Hi ATG 
Meat, like what ya like, rag on whatever you want, God knows I do. BUT, even if I don't care for the subject matter of the film, or if an actor is gaffing the whole show (K Reeves), I will still give credit to technical achievement or good craftsmanship.
Take a film like "What Dreams May Come", that, for me, was ultimately a film I didn't really care for. Regardless, I was wowed by the stunning work the DP did on that film.
Me not liking a film doesn't ALWAYS mean it's a poorly made film.
The opposite is also true, as, I like some real turds, which I file in the guilty pleasure department.
Meat, like what ya like, rag on whatever you want, God knows I do. BUT, even if I don't care for the subject matter of the film, or if an actor is gaffing the whole show (K Reeves), I will still give credit to technical achievement or good craftsmanship.
Take a film like "What Dreams May Come", that, for me, was ultimately a film I didn't really care for. Regardless, I was wowed by the stunning work the DP did on that film.
Me not liking a film doesn't ALWAYS mean it's a poorly made film.
The opposite is also true, as, I like some real turds, which I file in the guilty pleasure department.
I don't usually do this, but if you love Hitchcock check out my latest post in the 2008 election thread. Yes, it's on topic.
Ok i'll just watch Chinatown instead .
Originally Posted by meatwadsprite
Sedai - i'm not sure if you know what good camera work looks like : if you think The Fifth Element has good cinemetography.
Lawrence of Arabia
Chinatown
Blade Runner
Legend (All done in-camera, with NO CGI, and it rivals many of today's CGI, yes, including LotR.)
The Thin Red Line
Mulholland Drive
McCabe and Mrs Miller
Images
Ran
Il Conformista
Knife in the Water
A Very Long Engagement
The Fifth Element
This isn't just a random list I snagged on amazon under "Great Cinematography," either. I own all but two of these films, and I have seen the two I don't own (Knife in the Water, Images) at least twice each.
I have also read a fair amount of texts on the subject, as well as watched numerous documentaries on the art form. I am by no means an expert, but I have spent quite a bit of time and effort expanding my knowledge on the art of film making.
Not that it matters, because if you can;t see the skill and craftsmanship of something like Chinatown, you have a long way to go.
gotcha, will revise my usage accordingly.
Originally Posted by meatwadsprite
I might check out that documentary.
The most important element of cinematography is the lighting. But no, cinematography is a specific art and not just a general catch-all or synonym for filmmaking.
ones that have a sandman! 
The sand where the good movies are ? Ok .
*use the word.. sorry
Am I wrong to use the cinematography as a sort of catch all for sight, sound and craft? I always thought it referred to the art of film making in general and is not limited to visual presentation..?