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I haven't seen them in a while.. Maybe the acting is natural, and the writing isn't, or vice-versa?
Why do people pretend Linklater's a good writer?
I haven't seen them in a while.. Maybe the acting is natural, and the writing isn't, or vice-versa?
For me though, they feel too much a piece of the kind of writing in the 90's I just don't gel with. Everything the characters say seem like the kinds of things they probably rehearsed by themselves in front of a mirror for hours beforehand, getting all of their perfectly articulated pop cultural references just right before they dared speak it in public. Now, undoubtedly, some people definitely talk like this in real life. So I guess it could be argued this is a realistic approach to dialogue. But these are also the kind of people I'd prefer not to eavesdrop on if they sat next to me at a bar. I would change tables.
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Yeah Waking Life is far from depressing. More uplifting in a calm and interesting way. Thought provoking and "big" without getting pretentious or cringy. Sucks you in. Awesome music throughout as well. It's the best Linklater movie by far IMO. Best enjoyed alone with lights off after a doobie.
Because people do think he is a good writer.
Let's back to celebrate this trilogy again six years later.
Let's back to celebrate this trilogy again six years later.
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Based on the release dates for the first three Before movies (1995, 2004, 2013) we should be due for a fourth one in 2022.
Regarding Linklater's writing, his original stuff has always been defined by that kind of slacker philosophising when it's not indulging the comically mundane - the strength of each Before film is in how the practised-sounding small talk of the early stages ends up giving way to the much more personal thoughts and feelings of each character as the films progress. Films like Slacker or Waking Life feel less overwritten because it's more a matter of just letting the actors play versions of themselves and do their own thing (especially in the latter case where much of the film plays out as people monologuing at the main character - exactly how much of that is directly scripted by Linklater is questionable). Dazed and Confused isn't as overtly philosophical as any of these films since it's essentially about dumb teenagers hanging out but there's a similar approach between Linklater and the actors there (though Everybody Wants Some much more readily leans into the philosophy-as-dialogue angle even in the context of something as simple as discussing college jock culture).
Regarding Linklater's writing, his original stuff has always been defined by that kind of slacker philosophising when it's not indulging the comically mundane - the strength of each Before film is in how the practised-sounding small talk of the early stages ends up giving way to the much more personal thoughts and feelings of each character as the films progress. Films like Slacker or Waking Life feel less overwritten because it's more a matter of just letting the actors play versions of themselves and do their own thing (especially in the latter case where much of the film plays out as people monologuing at the main character - exactly how much of that is directly scripted by Linklater is questionable). Dazed and Confused isn't as overtly philosophical as any of these films since it's essentially about dumb teenagers hanging out but there's a similar approach between Linklater and the actors there (though Everybody Wants Some much more readily leans into the philosophy-as-dialogue angle even in the context of something as simple as discussing college jock culture).
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Regarding Linklater's writing, his original stuff has always been defined by that kind of slacker philosophising when it's not indulging the comically mundane - the strength of each Before film is in how the practised-sounding small talk of the early stages ends up giving way to the much more personal thoughts and feelings of each character as the films progress. Films like Slacker or Waking Life feel less overwritten because it's more a matter of just letting the actors play versions of themselves and do their own thing (especially in the latter case where much of the film plays out as people monologuing at the main character - exactly how much of that is directly scripted by Linklater is questionable).
His drive to creatively present real thoughts and ideas somewhat out of what's ordinarily seen in movies seems very sincere and it more than makes up for works of his that I didn't like all that much. Seems to me you'd have to be pretty cynical and closed down to find him pretentious or phony. I sure don't need to pretend liking him.
this thread will be a trilogy the next time people revive it back six years later
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Yup. Say what you like about him but he is great in Waking Life
As bad as he is, he lies less than the mainstream news. And when they lie to get us into war, it has more of an effect than Jones' rants about gay frogs.
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Linklater, maybe not as much as Tarantino, for me was a director for word porn. I enjoyed watching his stuff just based on the dialogue that was written. I haven't watched any of his movies in a while but The Before Trilogy, Waking Life, Scanner Darkly, Boyhood were some movies I enjoyed quite a bit.
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Jones is on Tim Pool today, with Mike Malice in the corner cracking jokes. Probably not the most informative podcast, but damn is it entertaining.
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I find a common theme with much of his work, especially the Before films and Waking Life, is his affection for long thought processes. Waking Life is pretty philosophic already as a concept, but the Before films get quite philosophic as well due to the long conversations.
His drive to creatively present real thoughts and ideas somewhat out of what's ordinarily seen in movies seems very sincere and it more than makes up for works of his that I didn't like all that much. Seems to me you'd have to be pretty cynical and closed down to find him pretentious or phony. I sure don't need to pretend liking him.
His drive to creatively present real thoughts and ideas somewhat out of what's ordinarily seen in movies seems very sincere and it more than makes up for works of his that I didn't like all that much. Seems to me you'd have to be pretty cynical and closed down to find him pretentious or phony. I sure don't need to pretend liking him.
this thread will be a trilogy the next time people revive it back six years later
Jones is on Tim Pool today, with Mike Malice in the corner cracking jokes. Probably not the most informative podcast, but damn is it entertaining.
Don't want to focus too much on Alex Jones in this thread, but he's a fascinating case study in how conspiracy theorists have mutated over the decades - Slacker had the "we've been on the moon since the '60s" guy whose theories just come across as harmless nonsense and Jones' appearances in Waking Life and A Scanner Darkly do have a generically anti-authoritarian bent that sounded like it could find a place in the catch-all philosophical dream of the former and the dystopian sci-fi of the latter, but that all changes when Jones focuses his conspiratorial energy in the wrong ways (like arguing that school shootings were staged to allow the government to enforce stricter gun control). It's especially jarring considering how Linklater's films tend to skew to the left, but even he ended up denouncing Jones in a recent interview because at the time he was just another oddball that was a good fit for one of his movies. So it goes.
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In fairness, sometimes that's just not someone's bag and the opening scene of Slacker where he plays the taxi passenger who rambles at length about dreams and alternate realities really does set the tone for his entire career (one could even argue that he's a more superficial version of similarly philosophical filmmakers like Straub-Huillet).
As an example with another director where similar points could be made about good or bad writing, if Tarantino indeed really is the man behind Pulp Fiction he deserves a tremendous amount of credit, despite the rest of his movies, which I personally consider more or less garbage, except for Reservoir Dogs which I thought was ok.
Kill Bill or say Slacker doesn't make Pulp Fiction or Waking Life bad writing. Whether you happen to like them or not, questionable decisions in other works doesn't take away from the fact that neither of those two movies could have been made by bad writers I guess is my point.
Based on the release dates for the first three Before movies (1995, 2004, 2013) we should be due for a fourth one in 2022.
Regarding Linklater's writing, his original stuff has always been defined by that kind of slacker philosophising when it's not indulging the comically mundane - the strength of each Before film is in how the practised-sounding small talk of the early stages ends up giving way to the much more personal thoughts and feelings of each character as the films progress. Films like Slacker or Waking Life feel less overwritten because it's more a matter of just letting the actors play versions of themselves and do their own thing (especially in the latter case where much of the film plays out as people monologuing at the main character - exactly how much of that is directly scripted by Linklater is questionable). Dazed and Confused isn't as overtly philosophical as any of these films since it's essentially about dumb teenagers hanging out but there's a similar approach between Linklater and the actors there (though Everybody Wants Some much more readily leans into the philosophy-as-dialogue angle even in the context of something as simple as discussing college jock culture).
Regarding Linklater's writing, his original stuff has always been defined by that kind of slacker philosophising when it's not indulging the comically mundane - the strength of each Before film is in how the practised-sounding small talk of the early stages ends up giving way to the much more personal thoughts and feelings of each character as the films progress. Films like Slacker or Waking Life feel less overwritten because it's more a matter of just letting the actors play versions of themselves and do their own thing (especially in the latter case where much of the film plays out as people monologuing at the main character - exactly how much of that is directly scripted by Linklater is questionable). Dazed and Confused isn't as overtly philosophical as any of these films since it's essentially about dumb teenagers hanging out but there's a similar approach between Linklater and the actors there (though Everybody Wants Some much more readily leans into the philosophy-as-dialogue angle even in the context of something as simple as discussing college jock culture).
I think my main distinction between those directors though and what Linklater does in this particular film is there is an earnestness to the Hawk and Delpy characters that we are meant to fall for, whereas there is a cynical distance in how we view the characters in Stillman or Hartley films. They are very much 'characters playing a role'. This doesn't work so much when I'm trying to understand honest emotions like first love.
This is about as good a reason as I can come to why Sunrise doesn't work for me and is more a nuisance than movie for my particular sensibilites.
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My opinion is definitely an outlier on the Sunrise films, and I think the film (both performances and writing) speak to others pretty strongly that my criticisms don't matter.
For me though, they feel too much a piece of the kind of writing in the 90's I just don't gel with. Everything the characters say seem like the kinds of things they probably rehearsed by themselves in front of a mirror for hours beforehand, getting all of their perfectly articulated pop cultural references just right before they dared speak it in public.
For me though, they feel too much a piece of the kind of writing in the 90's I just don't gel with. Everything the characters say seem like the kinds of things they probably rehearsed by themselves in front of a mirror for hours beforehand, getting all of their perfectly articulated pop cultural references just right before they dared speak it in public.
Anyway, I've yet to see the other two films in the trilogy, so if it still has that same feel it would be a little jarring. But in terms of two people starting out with their "game face" and slowly opening up and showing vulnerability, I thought that the writing/dialogue felt right for the scenario.
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