The Dark Knight - award winner?

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ADMIN EDIT (YODA): Howdy.

This has been talked about a lot, and we have a few related threads laying around, but I figured this topic, specifically, deserves a thread of it's own.

Many critics are declaring that Heath Ledger deserves an Oscar nomination, and possibly a win, for his bold portrayal of The Joker. The Dark Knight has garnered some early buzz suggesting that it may have transcended the superhero genre enough to earn some more prestigious nominations than the effects-and-sound Oscars that mainstream blockbusters are often restricted to.

So, what say you: is this talk premature? And whether or not it is, do you think there's a chance it will deserve serious nominations, such as Best Director, or Best Picture?

(by the by, I'm starting this thread in part so I can import a bunch of shouts into it. Just to let you know. Okay, back to BobbyB...)
Yeah, The Dark Knight was excellent. It won't happen in a million, trillion years, but The Dark Knight deserves Screenplay, Director and Picture nominations and possibly wins.



Originally Posted by BobbyB
Yeah, The Dark Knight was excellent. It won't happen in a million, trillion years, but The Dark Knight deserves Screenplay, Director and Picture nominations and possibly wins.
You mean before you see any of the other hundred and fifty or so contenders yet to be released you're already sure it "deserves" all these Oscar nominations? 'Kay. There are two coming from Clint Eastwood, one from Fernando Meirelles, one from Fincher, Charlie Kaufman's directorial debut, a new Mike Leigh picture, another Cormac McCarthy adaptation, Ed Zwick's Defiance, Sam Mendes reuniting DiCaprio and Winslet, Ronny Howard's Frost/Nixon, John Patrick Shanley's Doubt, Stephen Daldry's The Reader, Ed Harris' Appaloosa, Gus Van Sant's Harvey Milk biopic, Steve Soderbergh's Che biopics and on and on and on but before August you're all ready to call it?



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Originally Posted by Holden Pike
...and on and on and on but before August you're all ready to call it?
You get me Holden. You just do. :D

Yeah...I think I'm ready to call it. It's what predictions are for. The actions, the score, the direction, the depth with the investigation of America's fears post-9/11...it's all just so well done. So yeah, I'm calling it. :|

I just find it's going to be really hard to find 5 other things better at Screenplay, Directing and Picture than TDK.



28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
So TDK is still at number 1 on IMDB, it has double the votes for what it originally had and it hasn't dropped yet.


And for the record, CHE will not get nominated.



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Originally Posted by BobbyB
I just find it's going to be really hard to find 5 other things better at Screenplay, Directing and Picture than TDK.
As awesome as The Dark Knight is it shouldn't be too difficult to find a better movie than it. Like Holden said, boat load of movies coming out. Odds are one of those suckers is going to kick Batman's arse.



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I'm sorry, but if 5 films come along and kick the crap out of The Dark Knight then this will be the greatest year for film in a long time.

It's like, because The Dark Knight is based on a comic book, people can't fathom that it actually has a ton of artistic merit.

The score is haunting. The camera work is solid even if I wasn't a huge fan of the editing, the commentary on our paranoid sense of living post-9/11 and the compassion Nolan handles Gotham City with is just excellent. And let's not forget Ledger delivering one of the best performances of the decade.

Seriously. The Dark Knight is a film. It's not a mindless Michael Bay blockbuster like other comic book films. Nolan has gone so much deeper and darker and hit our sensitive areas in a subliminal manner.



You ready? You look ready.
Never said it didn't have merit. I ain't parading it as the be all to end all film of the year, though.

I was actually underwhelmed by the score at times, but I was a huge fan of the camera movements. You know those 360 degree shots everyone's bitching about? I loved them.

No one is saying that The Dark Knight isn't a film. We are merely stating that there's still plenty of great films to come. The Dark Knight is great, yes, but it ain't the high point of the year. I'd be willing to call it a great kick off to the upcoming fall season, though.

While it isn't a a mindless blockbuster it is still, indeed, a blockbuster. The size of the film doesn't correspond to its quality. Hell, Spider-Man 3 had the highest midnight opening until The Dark Knight. Besides, what was the last blockbuster to win the majority of the "big awards?"



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I believe what's being discussed is that certain people are disgusted with "worthy", boring films garnering the awards. Of all the "Popcorn films" released this year, or even recently, I'll agree that "The Dark Knight" probably deserves the most respect, Awards-wise. :)



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The screenplay was clearly brilliant. Also, I really dug Ledger's insidious performance. He exercised a lot of restraint, which was a nice surprise, considering the character. A fantastic film, all around; I am having trouble finding any flaws, really.

McClane said he was somewhat underwhelmed by the score, which is a load of horse pucky, if you ask me.

I am also going to have to retract some of my previous comments about Nolan's Auteur style, which has matured quite a bit since Memento.




I am also going to have to retract some of my previous comments about Nolan's Auteur style, which has matured quite a bit since Memento.
Heh, wonder what that old member The Prestige would be saying about now?
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well the first (micheal Keaton) Batman film won an Oscar. If Johnny Depp can be nominated for pirates of the carribean then i can't see why Ledger would be over looked.



A system of cells interlinked
Heh, wonder what that old member The Prestige would be saying about now?
Yeah, I thought about that last night as I drove home from the theater after seeing it for the second time. On this film, I would have to agree with his praise, methinks.
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I heard the new Batman movie was very good, except Batman's voice was quite low.
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I still can't decide whether or not I prefer a Baley growl or the classic "Kevin Conroy"

And also I have to wait till next Friday before I can see TDK.Just thought I'd throw that out there.



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Bale's growl is whispery. That's what makes it different. You'd think if he growled loudly, he'd scare those attack dogs away.
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In the Beginning...
I don't want to come off like a nay-sayer, because I really did like The Dark Knight. A lot. I just don't think there was anything particularly Oscar-worthy about it (with the possible exception of Ledger's Joker). To me, everything seemed solid for the scope of the film, but otherwise unremarkable.

The screenplay is tight and involved, but I didn't find it particularly profound or resonant. I get the whole "terrorism" angle, which I don't think was any kind of real commentary on terrorism so much as it was a buzzword component to facilitate the Joker and most of the tension in the film. In other words, there wasn't any lasting effect or moral message; it was merely something familiar for the audience to shudder at.

The direction was decent enough given the amount of scenes (some of them highly complex), but I didn't feel that Nolan and crew captured the best performances from their actors, or in some cases, that the characters were sparsely written in the first place. Michael Caine is steadfast as Alfred, of course, but his role was somewhat neutered from Begins. Gary Oldman is excellent as Gordon, but has to endure feigning over an underused family, and delivering those terribly cheesy and transparent lines at the end. Christian Bale, having been relegated to a pretty clear backseat in The Dark Knight, infuses what charm he can in Bruce Wayne, but lacks subtlety or believability as Batman. Maggie G. as Rachel Dawes is leagues better than Katie Holmes, but I think her character suffers from the viewer's knowledge that, in the end, Batman would never hang up the cape for anyone.

And Aaron Eckart, try as he might to breathe life into Harvey Dent, just can't seem to break through the "paint-by-numbers" manner in which he is written. I thought with Harvey, there was a lot of telling going on, and not much showing. We're told over and over again that he's Gotham's shining beacon of hope, but we don't get to see much of him in action. We're told that he and Rachel are hot and heavy, but their onscreen connection isn't enough to slash our heartstrings later. And because of that, Harvey's motivation for becoming Two-Face is less a moving display of heartbreak, and more a formality. He becomes Two-Face. We know this. There's no suspense.

Ledger's Joker is faultless, of course, but it's clear to me that the entire film was built around that character's inclusion in the series. He delivers all the best and deepest lines, and compared to the rest of the lot, has the most radiant personality by far. Couple that with a capable and hugely devoted actor like Ledger, and of course he's going to shine.

As for the lesser opportunities for award, I've already said in other threads that I thought the cinematography was only pretty good (not overly impressive or visionary, by any means); and that the editing was more problematic than it ought to have been. I had a few issues with continuity, and other sequences (like the final battle on the construction site) were awkwardly arranged. Someone above called the musical score "haunting," and far be it for me to nay-say Hans Zimmer. It's a fine score. But actually, I felt that Begins boasts the more powerful score, and I only got bits of that score in The Dark Knight.

I'm re-reading this, and it sounds like I'm bashing the hell out of the film. Believe me, I'm not. It's a well-constructed film given its nature as a high-profile comic book blockbuster, and what faults I find can only moderately damage an otherwise fun thrillride of a movie. I just don't think it's got the artistic chops to win awards. It's hard to make superheroes accessible to anyone, especially when there's a certain status quo that must be maintained to appease fans. We expect Batman to ghost criminals and glide around on this cool Bat-cape. We don't expect him to ruminate in monologue on the deep, socially poignant aspects of... well, anything. I know that's a superficial example, but the point is we're talking about a summer blockbuster that knows its limits and does everything well enough that it all comes together and delivers. In other words, I don't even think this film is trying to win awards so much as to be just a fun, competent, modestly emotional summer flick.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
Sleezy, that's a well-thought-out post, but it only makes sense if you tell us what films you've found in the last ten or so years to be Award-worthy. Did they win any Awards? What films which you found to be non-worthy actually went ahead and scooped up some major Awards? Just as in the film, what something means is all shaped by context. What did the films which you found to be worthy have which The Dark Knight doesn't? How many times have you watched it?

I often find people going overboard at many populist films and complaining that they aren't recognized often enough. Sometimes, I'm the one going off. I often find the most honored films to be pretentious, boring and downright unwatchable. That doesn't mean that I need my best films of the year to be all popcorn, but my favorite film is Jaws, so that tells you something. I only hope that it tells you something pertinent to this discussion and not that I need to return to the Booby Hatch.

There's lots more to discuss here. I'm only scratching the surface, but I have family to attend to now.



28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
I hope the Oscars recognize it and stop with the traditional indie film or "art house" nominations.

don't get me wrong, those films are good and all, but if you are to be honouring the best films of the year, pick the best ones. The Dark Knight is one of the best films of the year. It should get a nomination for something more then just the tech department (more then Ledger too).

Unfortunately, we'll probably get the same old contenders with the same old films...*cough*EASTWOOD*cough*
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