Reply to Topic
It's not so much I have issues with their animation. It's obviously well done. But it's rarely terribly evocative. Frequently brilliantly put together, and an incredible attention to detail but....something is just lacking for me. It doesn't contain that mystery ingredient that something like Pinocchio or My Neighbour Totoro or Triplets of Belleville or It's Such a Beautiful Day has in spades.
A scary thing happened on the way to the Movie Forums - Horrorcrammers
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
Who knew that Olympic figure skater Oksana Baiul had such great taste in film?
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
Hm. See, I find many of their early work very evocative, and even some of their later works. To each their own of course
Evocative might be the wrong word. Maybe mystery? I just find that all of the animation in a Pixar film has a clear purpose. Every object has a function. Every line builds towards the goal of pure representation. The artists at Pixar seem a little handcuffed by whatever the mandate of the movie's purpose is to never entirely lose themselves in the creative process. To allow themselves a few strokes of the pen born purely from sub-conscious intuition. A personal internal logic. Not enough happy accidents. And for me, the end result is not a lot of fun.
Not to mention, the more we buffer the contact of an artists pen to paper with layer upon layer of technology, the more we lose some of the physicality of the artwork.
Great storytelling. They do what they do well. There is good reason for them to have an art department that functions this way. And they certainly don't have to worry about the opinion of Luddites like me. But, even when I connect with their films (and I usually do to some level), that connection is usually pretty surface level.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
Evocative might be the wrong word. Maybe mystery? I just find that all of the animation in a Pixar film has a clear purpose. Every object has a function. Every line builds towards the goal of pure representation. The artists at Pixar seem a little handcuffed by whatever the mandate of the movie's purpose is to never entirely lose themselves in the creative process. To allow themselves a few strokes of the pen born purely from sub-conscious intuition. A personal internal logic. Not enough happy accidents. And for me, the end result is not a lot of fun.
Not to mention, the more we buffer the contact of an artists pen to paper with layer upon layer of technology, the more we lose some of the physicality of the artwork.
Great storytelling. They do what they do well. There is good reason for them to have an art department that functions this way. And they certainly don't have to worry about the opinion of Luddites like me. But, even when I connect with their films (and I usually do to some level), that connection is usually pretty surface level.
Not to mention, the more we buffer the contact of an artists pen to paper with layer upon layer of technology, the more we lose some of the physicality of the artwork.
Great storytelling. They do what they do well. There is good reason for them to have an art department that functions this way. And they certainly don't have to worry about the opinion of Luddites like me. But, even when I connect with their films (and I usually do to some level), that connection is usually pretty surface level.
You mentioned it being surface level, but the story tends to be far more then that, often going into the existential, reaching into a deep bag of emotions often such as loss and loneliness which makes up for whatever shortcomings may be perceived to its CGI, so I can not agree there.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
Well, they’re not going for mystery to be honest. That’s not their aim. And it really doesn’t need to be, does it? Not everything needs little “happy accidents”, especially Pixar films.
Yes. Exactly this. They don't have to. And they don't. And it's why their animation bores me.
For a film to sink its teeth into me, it must in some way play with contrasts and contradictions. If everything I watch has a clear and obvious function, there is nothing left for me once I leave the theatre. I feel I can mentally disassemble and reassemble everything I've just seen, like its some basic, unliving machine. But if there are elements where I am left puzzling over, I'm forced to think of the person who has made this piece of art. And through this, there is a kind of communion with the unknowable element of someone else. Not just the basic manipulations of storytelling, which have mostly been established outside of them. And this make it a much more intimate experience. It has much more value to me.
I'm not saying others need to adopt my preference. But for me, where things like 'the hero's journey' don't work for me anymore, watching an entire film nip and tuck all of its elements to ensure that hero's journey (that I don't care about) functions perfectly, is a bit of a bore. Yes, Pixar does have deeper elements in its narrative structure. And I appreciate those. And I'm glad they are offering them in a children's movie. But they aren't nearly interesting enough to make much of a mark on me (a not-child). Outside of maybe Inside Out, or the first half of Wall-E.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
Yes. Exactly this. They don't have to. And they don't. And it's why their animation bores me.
For a film to sink its teeth into me, it must in some way play with contrasts and contradictions. If everything I watch has a clear and obvious function, there is nothing left for me once I leave the theatre. I feel I can mentally disassemble and reassemble everything I've just seen, like its some basic, unliving machine. But if there are elements where I am left puzzling over, I'm forced to think of the person who has made this piece of art. And through this, there is a kind of communion with the unknowable element of someone else. Not just the basic manipulations of storytelling, which have mostly been established outside of them. And this make it a much more intimate experience. It has much more value to me.
I'm not saying others need to adopt my preference. But for me, where things like 'the hero's journey' don't work for me anymore, watching an entire film nip and tuck all of its elements to ensure that hero's journey (that I don't care about) functions perfectly, is a bit of a bore. Yes, Pixar does have deeper elements in its narrative structure. And I appreciate those. And I'm glad they are offering them in a children's movie. But they aren't nearly interesting enough to make much of a mark on me (a not-child). Outside of maybe Inside Out, or the first half of Wall-E.
For a film to sink its teeth into me, it must in some way play with contrasts and contradictions. If everything I watch has a clear and obvious function, there is nothing left for me once I leave the theatre. I feel I can mentally disassemble and reassemble everything I've just seen, like its some basic, unliving machine. But if there are elements where I am left puzzling over, I'm forced to think of the person who has made this piece of art. And through this, there is a kind of communion with the unknowable element of someone else. Not just the basic manipulations of storytelling, which have mostly been established outside of them. And this make it a much more intimate experience. It has much more value to me.
I'm not saying others need to adopt my preference. But for me, where things like 'the hero's journey' don't work for me anymore, watching an entire film nip and tuck all of its elements to ensure that hero's journey (that I don't care about) functions perfectly, is a bit of a bore. Yes, Pixar does have deeper elements in its narrative structure. And I appreciate those. And I'm glad they are offering them in a children's movie. But they aren't nearly interesting enough to make much of a mark on me (a not-child). Outside of maybe Inside Out, or the first half of Wall-E.
Yeah, I totally understand where you’re coming from. I mentioned this last year, but a film must meet our own expectations, not just accept what the film intended.
It’s a lot like how I feel towards Fulci, I suppose.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
The Howling -
This is a pretty good werewolf horror movie starring Dee Wallace as Karen White, a news reporter who has an encounter with a stalker that's so traumatic, she's unable to function in her job or be there for her fiancé, Bill (real-life husband Christopher Stone). They hope to remedy this by staying in a small retreat in the mountains, which as the couple soon learns is the last place in the world someone in Karen’s condition should be. My favorite quality of Joe Dante's movies is how deftly they shift from funny to scary, a quality that is on full display in the two Gremlins movies and Matinee. This one proves that it took the director a while to master striking this balance because for the most part, the horror isn’t all that scary and the comedy isn’t all that funny. Despite a fireside sex scene that becomes something else entirely and the requisite Dick Miller appearance - this time as an enterprising used book seller - this could be said of the first two acts. They also have a listless, formless and “not quite there” vibe, if you will, that made it hard to stay interested.
Despite not being as scary as I would like, the finale, which features some delightfully gross makeup courtesy of Rob Bottin and a terrifying performance by Robert Picardo, comes close to making up for it. It's a credit to Dante and company that they saved the best for last, so much so that the finale is strong enough for me to recommend the entire product. With that said, if you're in the mood for a werewolf movie, see that other one from 1981 first. Also, if you're in the mood for a Joe Dante movie, unless you're interested in seeing how he started out, watch one of those other ones I mentioned first.
This is a pretty good werewolf horror movie starring Dee Wallace as Karen White, a news reporter who has an encounter with a stalker that's so traumatic, she's unable to function in her job or be there for her fiancé, Bill (real-life husband Christopher Stone). They hope to remedy this by staying in a small retreat in the mountains, which as the couple soon learns is the last place in the world someone in Karen’s condition should be. My favorite quality of Joe Dante's movies is how deftly they shift from funny to scary, a quality that is on full display in the two Gremlins movies and Matinee. This one proves that it took the director a while to master striking this balance because for the most part, the horror isn’t all that scary and the comedy isn’t all that funny. Despite a fireside sex scene that becomes something else entirely and the requisite Dick Miller appearance - this time as an enterprising used book seller - this could be said of the first two acts. They also have a listless, formless and “not quite there” vibe, if you will, that made it hard to stay interested.
Despite not being as scary as I would like, the finale, which features some delightfully gross makeup courtesy of Rob Bottin and a terrifying performance by Robert Picardo, comes close to making up for it. It's a credit to Dante and company that they saved the best for last, so much so that the finale is strong enough for me to recommend the entire product. With that said, if you're in the mood for a werewolf movie, see that other one from 1981 first. Also, if you're in the mood for a Joe Dante movie, unless you're interested in seeing how he started out, watch one of those other ones I mentioned first.
Last edited by Torgo; 07-14-23 at 10:14 AM.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
The Howling -
This is a pretty good werewolf horror movie starring Dee Wallace as Karen White, a news reporter who has an encounter with a stalker that's so traumatic, she's unable to function in her job or be there for her fiancé, Bill (real-life husband Christopher Stone). They hope to remedy this by staying in a small retreat in the mountains, which as the couple soon learns is the last place in the world someone in Karen’s condition should be. My favorite quality of Joe Dante's movies is how deftly they shift from funny to scary, a quality that is on full display in the two Gremlins movies and Matinee. This one proves that it took the director a while to master striking this balance because for the most part, the horror isn’t all that scary and the comedy isn’t all that funny. Despite a fireside sex scene that becomes something else entirely and the requisite Dick Miller appearance - this time as an enterprising used book seller - this could be said of the first two acts. They also have a listless, formless and “not quite there” vibe, if you will, that made it hard to stay interested. I would not say this about the finale, however, which features some delightfully gross makeup courtesy of Rob Bottin and a terrifying performance by Robert Picardo. It is a credit to Dante and company that they saved the best for last, so much so that the finale is strong enough for me to recommend the entire product. With that said, if you're in the mood for a werewolf movie, see that other one from 1981 first. Also, if you're in the mood for a Joe Dante movie, unless you're interested in seeing how he started out, watch one of those other ones I mentioned first.
This is a pretty good werewolf horror movie starring Dee Wallace as Karen White, a news reporter who has an encounter with a stalker that's so traumatic, she's unable to function in her job or be there for her fiancé, Bill (real-life husband Christopher Stone). They hope to remedy this by staying in a small retreat in the mountains, which as the couple soon learns is the last place in the world someone in Karen’s condition should be. My favorite quality of Joe Dante's movies is how deftly they shift from funny to scary, a quality that is on full display in the two Gremlins movies and Matinee. This one proves that it took the director a while to master striking this balance because for the most part, the horror isn’t all that scary and the comedy isn’t all that funny. Despite a fireside sex scene that becomes something else entirely and the requisite Dick Miller appearance - this time as an enterprising used book seller - this could be said of the first two acts. They also have a listless, formless and “not quite there” vibe, if you will, that made it hard to stay interested. I would not say this about the finale, however, which features some delightfully gross makeup courtesy of Rob Bottin and a terrifying performance by Robert Picardo. It is a credit to Dante and company that they saved the best for last, so much so that the finale is strong enough for me to recommend the entire product. With that said, if you're in the mood for a werewolf movie, see that other one from 1981 first. Also, if you're in the mood for a Joe Dante movie, unless you're interested in seeing how he started out, watch one of those other ones I mentioned first.
I prefer The Howling over An American Werewolf in London, and I understand there was another werewolf film released the same year called Wolfen which I have read is superior to both.
Need to catch that one, yet.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
This is my director’s cut. The studio pressure made the film what I originally pitched to them, which was the most entertaining Robert Eggers movie I could make. Honestly, without their pressure, I couldn’t have done that. It’s hard for me to tell a story with a beginning, a middle, and an end, for goodness’s sake.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
No mention of Dante is complete with out a shout out to Pirahna.
I prefer The Howling over An American Werewolf in London, and I understand there was another werewolf film released the same year called Wolfen which I have read is superior to both.
Need to catch that one, yet.
I prefer The Howling over An American Werewolf in London, and I understand there was another werewolf film released the same year called Wolfen which I have read is superior to both.
Need to catch that one, yet.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
I should have added, I'm being a bit cryptic on Wolfen since people haven't seen it, and the premise of the movie is a detective investigating some murders, and it feels hard to give basic plot points without potentially spoiling things for people.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
No mention of Dante is complete with out a shout out to Pirahna.
I prefer The Howling over An American Werewolf in London, and I understand there was another werewolf film released the same year called Wolfen which I have read is superior to both.
Need to catch that one, yet.
I prefer The Howling over An American Werewolf in London, and I understand there was another werewolf film released the same year called Wolfen which I have read is superior to both.
Need to catch that one, yet.
All three of those films are low-key favorites of mine.
I prefer The Howling over An American Werewolf in London, and I understand there was another werewolf film released the same year called Wolfen which I have read is superior to both.
Need to catch that one, yet.
Need to catch that one, yet.
You're the devil.
But yeah - Wolfen is one of my favorite horror movies. The church scene is amazing. Albert Finney was absolute top dog in 1981 between Wolfen, Looker and Loophole.
__________________
A hundred percent death proof.
Tomato Necromancy - now with Vitamin R!
https://www.movieforums.com/communit...ad.php?t=65140
A hundred percent death proof.
Tomato Necromancy - now with Vitamin R!
https://www.movieforums.com/communit...ad.php?t=65140
I should have added, I'm being a bit cryptic on Wolfen since people haven't seen it, and the premise of the movie is a detective investigating some murders, and it feels hard to give basic plot points without potentially spoiling things for people.
Fun fact: Wolfen director Michael Wadleigh mostly worked as a cinematographer. The only other movie he directed was Woodstock.
I should revisit An American Werewolf in London someday, because I remember being really disappointed with it when I first watched it.
X
Favorite Movies
X
User Lists
I should revisit An American Werewolf in London someday, because I remember being really disappointed with it when I first watched it.
It is the comedy horror that all other comedy horrors should look to as Mecca.
Maybe only Fright Night has surpassed its greatness at functioning as both nailing its horror tropes perfectly while operating mostly as a comedy. The two elements blend so well, they are never more one than the other. Perfectly hybridized.
Contrariwise, I find The Howling's attempts at humour more clever than actually funny. And while it has at least two really good horror moments (Dee Wallaces traumatic incident at the beginning of the film being probably the best), I don't find it to be firing on all cylinders as a horror movie either. Still very good ultimately though.
I've never clicked with Wolfen. But it's definitely worth seeking out as it is a different take on the genre.
X
Favorite Movies
X
