Well I think people shouldn't get it if they don't want to. You take a person who doesn't want to get it, but they are pressured or mandated to do so, and then they have health issues. To me that's a problem.
Coronavirus
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It's not ideal to force one's way of thinking onto others
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I don't think it's nonsense, actually. Are we forgetting that Trump explicitly encouraged the use of drugs and other things that were just hypothesized as maybe helping prevent COVID? As far as him saying that he'd taken hydroxychloroquine to prevent COVID.
So I don't mind her distinguishing that she would take a doctor-approved vaccine and specifically naming Fauci as the authority she would trust. (This was also during a debate, no? And the phrasing of the question was specifically about Trump endorsing a vaccine.)
So I don't mind her distinguishing that she would take a doctor-approved vaccine and specifically naming Fauci as the authority she would trust. (This was also during a debate, no? And the phrasing of the question was specifically about Trump endorsing a vaccine.)
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So I don't mind her distinguishing that she would take a doctor-approved vaccine and specifically naming Fauci as the authority she would trust. (This was also during a debate, no? And the phrasing of the question was specifically about Trump endorsing a vaccine.)
FWIW, I know liberals who were furious about this at the time, too.
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The obvious ones would be like transportation, and since airlines are private (under FAA auspices) they can and have enforced both mask and vaccine mandates. The hardest part of enforcement would be in battling counterfeit vaccine cards.
I would definitely take things on a case by case basis and see where we end up. I have no doubt it will be mandated by the healthcare system I work for at some point. We already have mandated shots.
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Legally, the distinction between a national mandate and state mandates is massive, and important.
It's disheartening to hear people (not accusing anyone here, specifically, to be clear) talk about these genuine legal issues as frustrating technicalities, sometimes. This stuff matters. A lot of chaotic and confusing court battles happening now are the direct result of people (activists, politicians, and even judges themselves) being cavalier about precedent.
It's disheartening to hear people (not accusing anyone here, specifically, to be clear) talk about these genuine legal issues as frustrating technicalities, sometimes. This stuff matters. A lot of chaotic and confusing court battles happening now are the direct result of people (activists, politicians, and even judges themselves) being cavalier about precedent.
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Even implying this was possible--that Trump would pressure the FDA in an unwarranted approval or something--was reckless and implausible.
So we have already moved a long way away from a national mandate, which is what I thought we were talking about.
Will it happen? Not in our current political environment when culture war election issues outweigh national interest. Future generations will be scratching their heads though, I have no doubt.
I think the word "shouldn't" is kinda confusing here. If you mean they shouldn't have to get it, that's a very different statement than saying that not getting it is a good decision. Statistically, if you don't have some existing health condition that gives you a significant chance of having a bad reaction, getting it is clearly the right decision, so they "should" get it.
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And yet, Trump tried to do it anyway, which is what Harris was directly referring to. The FDA, NIH and HHS all had to come out and assure the public that Trump couldn't do what he very much was openly saying that he could do, so Harris' suggestion wasn't as reckless as Trump's actions.
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It's also not cool that the 60% of my state that isn't vaccinated is forcing me to cancel my vacation at the end of the month, or forcing my health-compromised mother to spend the remainder of her life going literally nowhere ever again for the foreseeable future.
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Nothing is as wreckless as Trump’s actions. I thought Trump supporters were going to be the most frustrating thing to come out of his presidency. However, for me it’s been the ridiculously low bar the left now sets for it’s politicians. “Not as bad as Trump” should be the new DNC slogan.
But I'm just saying that Harris' comment wasn't pulled out of thin air. Trump actually had tried to intervene and threaten to fire officials if they didn't get the vaccine out before the election.
Regardless of anything Trump said, the vaccine has to be properly approved right? Harris knows that, so she could just say you're damn I'm taking the vaccine.
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And now I just can't help wondering if that was a really stupid thing to do. We are both vaccinated. I plan to wait 10 days before being indoors with my most vulnerable family members.
…we're just going to be playing ring-around-the-rosie with this disease.
Really?
This is not my memory at all.
The only liberal-leaning people I know who didn't want the vaccine are the whole "vaccines cause autism!" crowd, and they have not budged in their stance one bit no matter who is in office.
This is not my memory at all.
The only liberal-leaning people I know who didn't want the vaccine are the whole "vaccines cause autism!" crowd, and they have not budged in their stance one bit no matter who is in office.
Again, the sky didn't fall when SCOTUS allowed the small pox mandate in 1905, nor did it erupt when we mandated polio in 1955, or when we mandated all of the other childhood vaccinations needed before that child can be admitted into public schools. What we are seeing today with the vaxx resistence is an aberration to the entire history of modern medicine. It really isn't that hard of a decision once you realize that you'll only be hurting a few people's feelings.
Everything's been good and civil about this so far, this is just my preemptive notice to encourage people to keep it that way, since it's obviously a heated topic. Obviously the hook for a thread closure (even if just a temporary one to take the temperature down) will be quick if things escalate.
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I’m here only on Mondays, Wednesdays & Fridays. That’s why I’m here now.
I’m here only on Mondays, Wednesdays & Fridays. That’s why I’m here now.
And yet, Trump tried to do it anyway, which is what Harris was directly referring to. The FDA, NIH and HHS all had to come out and assure the public that Trump couldn't do what he very much was openly saying that he could do, so Harris' suggestion wasn't as reckless as Trump's actions.
I don't think there's any serious argument to be had re: Harris. Public confidence in the vaccine is massively important, as many of you are arguing quite persuasively in this very thread, and it's clearly dissonant to feel that way while downplaying her debate response, which clearly prioritized political attack over public health clarity.
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Regardless of anything Trump said, the vaccine has to be properly approved right? Harris knows that, so she could just say you're damn I'm taking the vaccine.
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My job mandated masks for a little over a year before relaxing them only if you got the shot, with proof.
In June, they removed it completely, but with the new variants, it’s looking likely we’ll have to return to it.
I got the shot, but didn’t want to. Not that I was opposed to it, mind you. I just hate needles and I’m a big fat chicken when ever I see needles. I physically cringe in terror when I see one on screen and have to look away or cover my eyes. When I got my first shot they told me “You won’t feel this.” I felt it. 😭
Also, I moved away the first time when they went to inject me and had to apologize and ask for a moment to myself. I was horrible. Literally went “Ok, ready….wait! Wait! Give me a moment!”
In June, they removed it completely, but with the new variants, it’s looking likely we’ll have to return to it.
I got the shot, but didn’t want to. Not that I was opposed to it, mind you. I just hate needles and I’m a big fat chicken when ever I see needles. I physically cringe in terror when I see one on screen and have to look away or cover my eyes. When I got my first shot they told me “You won’t feel this.” I felt it. 😭
Also, I moved away the first time when they went to inject me and had to apologize and ask for a moment to myself. I was horrible. Literally went “Ok, ready….wait! Wait! Give me a moment!”
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So you think Trump was endorsing a vaccine that wasn’t the ones being developed during his administration?
Considering that one of Trump's favorite things to do was talk about how he'd find ways around regulations if they got in his way, I think that clarifying that she'd want a doctor-approved vaccine is a legit answer, even if a simple "I would definitely take an FDA_approved vaccine" would have been a much better one.
I dislike the ambiguity of "the Trump administration" in the question, because it seems deliberately unclear whether it mainly means Trump himself giving something the thumbs up (as he did with hydroxychloroquine) or the actual agencies.
Even implying this was possible--that Trump would pressure the FDA in an unwarranted approval or something--was reckless and implausible. Trump doesn't have that authority and she could've easily made that distinction. Instead, she muddied the waters on an issue where we need as much clarity as possible, presumably because in a debate context her only instinct was to position herself opposite the other side. It was irresponsible.
FWIW, I know liberals who were furious about this at the time, too.
FWIW, I know liberals who were furious about this at the time, too.
This is partly why I mostly tuned out of the news cycle--almost everything and everyone was annoying and keeping one eye on their own self-interest.
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This is partly why I mostly tuned out of the news cycle--almost everything and everyone was annoying and keeping one eye on their own self-interest.
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I don't think I said people shouldn't get the vaccine, other than if they didn't want to.
I just said there will be some people who as it turned out, would have been better off without it. Of course I'm just talking about people who get health problems from the vaccine.
You can say someone who gets hit by a car shouldn't have gone on that walk, but that obviously doesn't mean going for walks is a bad idea.
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