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In short. I should watch Mad Max: Fury Road and stop getting into discussions about stuff I haven't seen.
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I don't think that complimenting people just for voicing a contrary opinion helps to normalize the situation, if anything it will make it worse. And it's easy to mistake as an arrogant way to dismiss popular opinions given the context.
There's been some pretty heated posts regarding Fury Road. JD's review struck me as particularly brave on a popularity-contest-style-forum inhabited by some cliquey troll-prone members who often appear to be baiting others for nothing more than a pointless argument - or meaningless sense of aloof superiority.
You're right some mediocre blockbusters receive a disproportionate amount of media praise, and whilst I definitely wasn't trying to 'normalise' this phenomena whatever that means (your assumption); I certainly feel baffled by the extent of it where Fury Road is concerned. If that can be interpenetrated as dismissive arrogance then I guess I'm guilty, but you really didn't need to make that insulting stretch in the first place considering what you go on to say next.
we all respect each other's opinions here and their right to like or dislike whatever stuff they watch, so this is kind of an unnecessary demonstration.
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Doesn't surprise me...you gave Deep Rising, Charlie's Angels, The Expendables 2 all higher ratings than the more impressive, on all levels, Mad Max.
No longer care to read essay reviews from someone with obviously bad taste.
No longer care to read essay reviews from someone with obviously bad taste.
One of the complaints I've seen over and over from those who dislike the film, is in regards to the "mask" (actually, it's a muzzle) that Max wears. I keep reading over and over about how he wears it for a "significant length of time" and it "obscures his expressions." This complaint just leaves me scratching my head.
Apparently I have a different definition of a significant length of time than others do. He is muzzled just before the chase into the dust storm, then removes the muzzle shortly after he joins Furiosa on the War Rig, which immediately follows that chase. Also there are big gaps in the muzzle that allow you to see what his mouth is doing and there is more to expression and body language than just a person's mouth anyway.
I also hear complaints about Max's lack of dialogue and the voice he uses. I didn't have a problem with this at all. His role is not one that requires a lot of dialogue and the grunts and gravelly voice he uses fits the character of someone who "runs from both the living and the dead." Max is a loner, not a social butterfly. Before aligning with Furiosa, he didn't have much opportunity or reason to speak, so likely hasn't spoken to anyone in quite some time. Furthermore, his past traumas and self-imposed isolation also mean his social skills are not what they should be. So IMO the resulting gruffness was appropriate to his situation.
Apparently I have a different definition of a significant length of time than others do. He is muzzled just before the chase into the dust storm, then removes the muzzle shortly after he joins Furiosa on the War Rig, which immediately follows that chase. Also there are big gaps in the muzzle that allow you to see what his mouth is doing and there is more to expression and body language than just a person's mouth anyway.
I also hear complaints about Max's lack of dialogue and the voice he uses. I didn't have a problem with this at all. His role is not one that requires a lot of dialogue and the grunts and gravelly voice he uses fits the character of someone who "runs from both the living and the dead." Max is a loner, not a social butterfly. Before aligning with Furiosa, he didn't have much opportunity or reason to speak, so likely hasn't spoken to anyone in quite some time. Furthermore, his past traumas and self-imposed isolation also mean his social skills are not what they should be. So IMO the resulting gruffness was appropriate to his situation.
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The mask was never an issue for me personally. I liked the idea of him tethered to the front of one of the war boy rigs too because it nodded back to commune escapees from The Road Warrior quite nicely. Of course the argument is Max hasn't been effectively re-introduced prior to this sequence, and so to further obscure the character's face only serves to prevent the audience from connecting with him. That's pretty big when you need the original Max fans (at least picky old fogies like me) to accept a new actor in the role. Doubly hard when the character is so emotionally detached to begin with.
Whilst I also agree on the nature of the character based on past experiences; I still think it's a mistake that ties in with the intro because Miller could have approached the pre-credits sequence a lot more effectively. Max makes a much bigger emotional transition between the first and second films (from family man to hate filled avenger to emotionally distant drifter) but the pre-credits sequence of The Road Warrior does a much better job of conveying this descent into the abyss. It feels grandiose and poetic whereas Fury Road simply feels uninspired and hackneyed - at least to me. So Max is as mad and emotionally scarred as everyone else in the wasteland? Tell me something I don't know. Give me something to root and hope for here. The Road Warrior had a very clear set moral dilemma for Max to bounce off. He was constantly challenged by decent supporting characters like Papagello, The Gyro Captain, and Feral child who lent the whole affair some weight. Let's face it characters like Max become uninteresting rather fast unless you, either flesh out their mental state, or give them an epiphanic backdrop of some sort.
The choice to leave Max in this mute, dehumanised state for the practically the whole of Fury Road just felt like a cop-out to me. It's been said elsewhere that one of the best parts of the movie is the scene in which Max finally utters his name. I personally needed more of this redemptive humanity gradually seeping through the character throughout the film. I wonder if Miller will address this in later installments (that is if he decides to direct one). He mentioned in one interview that he didn't see Max going in the direction of something like Eastwood's Unforgiven, which left me disappointed because that's exactly the kind of direction I think the franchise needs. I also wonder if those comments were simply PR surrounding Hardy's casting, and Miller's original vision was an older Max finding redemption in a similar way to Bill Munny.
) to accept a new actor in the role. Doubly hard when the character is so emotionally detached to begin with. Whilst I also agree on the nature of the character based on past experiences; I still think it's a mistake that ties in with the intro because Miller could have approached the pre-credits sequence a lot more effectively. Max makes a much bigger emotional transition between the first and second films (from family man to hate filled avenger to emotionally distant drifter) but the pre-credits sequence of The Road Warrior does a much better job of conveying this descent into the abyss. It feels grandiose and poetic whereas Fury Road simply feels uninspired and hackneyed - at least to me. So Max is as mad and emotionally scarred as everyone else in the wasteland? Tell me something I don't know. Give me something to root and hope for here. The Road Warrior had a very clear set moral dilemma for Max to bounce off. He was constantly challenged by decent supporting characters like Papagello, The Gyro Captain, and Feral child who lent the whole affair some weight. Let's face it characters like Max become uninteresting rather fast unless you, either flesh out their mental state, or give them an epiphanic backdrop of some sort.
The choice to leave Max in this mute, dehumanised state for the practically the whole of Fury Road just felt like a cop-out to me. It's been said elsewhere that one of the best parts of the movie is the scene in which Max finally utters his name. I personally needed more of this redemptive humanity gradually seeping through the character throughout the film. I wonder if Miller will address this in later installments (that is if he decides to direct one). He mentioned in one interview that he didn't see Max going in the direction of something like Eastwood's Unforgiven, which left me disappointed because that's exactly the kind of direction I think the franchise needs. I also wonder if those comments were simply PR surrounding Hardy's casting, and Miller's original vision was an older Max finding redemption in a similar way to Bill Munny.
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I had a long response all typed up and ready to send and then I accidentally closed the tab. Ugh.
Anyway, how much of a backstory do we really need? Fury Road spells out what we need to know: Max's family is dead and he feels like he failed them. As a result, he's isolated himself from other people and now his only urge is to survive.
Like Gibson's Max of The Road Warrior and Beyond Thunderdome, this Max is compelled to interact with other people in order to regain what was taken from him. The only difference here is that he is quite literally forced to be around people and one of the things that was stolen was his freedom.
And I don't see this Max as being dehumanized at all. Hardy's Max is certainly more solemn and his actions and emotions more subtle than the cocky Gibson, but his humanity seeps out all over the place, not just when he finally reveals his name. He overpowers Furiosa and the wives when he could have just killed them to get the rig. He shows concern when he thinks Splendid was struck by the rock and relief when he sees that she is okay (even if only momentarily okay). He urges the women not to come looking for him if he doesn't return and to move on without him. He convinces them to turn back when they attempt to cross the salt, when he could have simply turned away and just saved himself. You can see the concern in his eyes when he sees that Furiosa has been hurt and the worry when he acts to save her. To me, Hardy's Max actually seemed more human and believable than Gibson's. He's terribly damaged, yes, but he still finds it in him to do what must be done to save himself and the others.
And I say that as someone who grew up loving The Road Warrior.
Anyway, how much of a backstory do we really need? Fury Road spells out what we need to know: Max's family is dead and he feels like he failed them. As a result, he's isolated himself from other people and now his only urge is to survive.
Like Gibson's Max of The Road Warrior and Beyond Thunderdome, this Max is compelled to interact with other people in order to regain what was taken from him. The only difference here is that he is quite literally forced to be around people and one of the things that was stolen was his freedom.
And I don't see this Max as being dehumanized at all. Hardy's Max is certainly more solemn and his actions and emotions more subtle than the cocky Gibson, but his humanity seeps out all over the place, not just when he finally reveals his name. He overpowers Furiosa and the wives when he could have just killed them to get the rig. He shows concern when he thinks Splendid was struck by the rock and relief when he sees that she is okay (even if only momentarily okay). He urges the women not to come looking for him if he doesn't return and to move on without him. He convinces them to turn back when they attempt to cross the salt, when he could have simply turned away and just saved himself. You can see the concern in his eyes when he sees that Furiosa has been hurt and the worry when he acts to save her. To me, Hardy's Max actually seemed more human and believable than Gibson's. He's terribly damaged, yes, but he still finds it in him to do what must be done to save himself and the others.
And I say that as someone who grew up loving The Road Warrior.
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OKAY.... Can I just say....
*I* was the one who first talked trash about Mad Max: Fury Road.
Yes.
In that big old Mad Max: Fury Road thread.
You may remember how everyone ganged up on me, like bouncingbrick and others. Because I was the first who DARED to say stuff like this:
This is OUTRAGEOUS.
JayDee and Used Future are being seen as heroes for speaking negatively about Mad Max: Fury Road WHEN I DID IT FIRST!
I SUFFERED.
I suffered worse than that Asian woman who got raped and murdered in Casualties of War. At least she got a little action -- I didn't! They TORE ME APART in there. Miss Vicky ripped one of my arms off and now has it mounted on a wall as a souvenir!
And you guys are just acting like JayDee and Used Future paved the way for the future of bashing popular American movies. (or is it technically an Australian movie? They didn't actually film it in Australia, you know.)
Nobody's even mentioning my sacrifices.
*I* was the one who first talked trash about Mad Max: Fury Road.
Yes.
In that big old Mad Max: Fury Road thread.
You may remember how everyone ganged up on me, like bouncingbrick and others. Because I was the first who DARED to say stuff like this:
Originally Posted by Sexy Celebrity
You know, I wasn't gonna say anything, but I might as well speak up.
If what I'm hearing about this movie -- that it's basically a feminist movie and the Charlize Theron character is really the real lead instead of Max -- I'm annoyed. And I feel I have every right to be annoyed because if this was a franchise that had always been about a female character, and suddenly a male character took over, you know women everywhere would be complaining about it and nobody would tell them to shut up.
If what I'm hearing about this movie -- that it's basically a feminist movie and the Charlize Theron character is really the real lead instead of Max -- I'm annoyed. And I feel I have every right to be annoyed because if this was a franchise that had always been about a female character, and suddenly a male character took over, you know women everywhere would be complaining about it and nobody would tell them to shut up.
Originally Posted by Sexy Celebrity
Let me start with the good..... The atmosphere. The visuals. The feeling that it was indeed a Mad Max movie. The freakish characters. Loved most of this. It's very impressive how much it felt like a sequel to Beyond Thunderdome. This wasn't some shoddy job at trying to reboot the Mad Max franchise -- VISUALLY, at least. This was like a time machine to the 1980's.
Unfortunately... the WRONG passengers went in the time machine.
All except for the guy who played Immortan Joe. I liked Immortan Joe. He was played by the guy (don't know his name) who played the villain in the original Mad Max movie. LOVED him. My favorite scenes were those that involved him.
My biggest complaint: Yes. This was a woman's movie. I totally see what people are saying about this film having a feminist agenda. The woman who created The Vagina Monologues worked on this movie -- and it shows. I felt that the male characters were largely treated like second class pigs and that all these ridiculous women characters were the stars -- much more than Tom Hardy's Mad Max. It wasn't just Furiosa who was the problem -- it was also her female backseat drivers and especially those old motorcycle lesbians who showed up near the end. But mainly... Max just didn't seem like much of a star. They could easily forget about his character if they make another one of these movies. It was Furiosa who absolutely felt like the Mad Max character of this film. Max felt more like a distant, observing trainer to her.
And every time you turned around, they shoved a woman's pregnant belly in your face!
But you know what I hated even more than all of that stuff, though?
Max's hallucinations. Especially that obnoxious, curly haired girl who kept appearing. Max's hallucinations were the worst thing to suffer through. I could handle the women to an extent -- but every time Max appeared, he suffered another hallucination! There was hardly anything to him -- even during his own moments, a little obnoxious girl appeared and stole his scenes.
But I knew early on that this movie was going to suck, even before we really got into the meat of the whole thing, with Max joining Furiosa and her gal pals on the road. I really hated that first big scene where they're driving through the desert and Max was strapped to a vehicle, as prisoner. As they went through storm clouds and all that and the guy says, "OH, WHAT A LOVELY DAY!!!!"
I sat through this movie bored out of my skull, dying for it to be over. I wanted to walk out. This could have been a movie I actually walked out on, but I didn't want people here telling me, "You didn't even watch the whole thing!!!" So I stayed. But I thought this was a two hour, ear pounding headache. I thought it was one of the worst movies I had ever seen. Definitely the worst Mad Max movie by far.
It's possible it could have been better with Mel Gibson. I think Mel Gibson MADE those movies. I could see myself tolerating it a lot more if only Mel Gibson was playing Max. Tom Hardy... just seems like Tom Hardy. It's a decent Mad Max impression, but it didn't drive everything home. I kinda wonder if Charlize Theron's Furiosa character was pushed more forwards just in case nobody liked Tom Hardy's Mad Max. Like, I think she might have been a backup, just-in-case, safety kind of thing. That's what went through my mind as I was watching the film.
Anyway, I was hoping to like it, but I just didn't. I'm really kinda utterly shocked at the positive reception it's getting.
Unfortunately... the WRONG passengers went in the time machine.
All except for the guy who played Immortan Joe. I liked Immortan Joe. He was played by the guy (don't know his name) who played the villain in the original Mad Max movie. LOVED him. My favorite scenes were those that involved him.
My biggest complaint: Yes. This was a woman's movie. I totally see what people are saying about this film having a feminist agenda. The woman who created The Vagina Monologues worked on this movie -- and it shows. I felt that the male characters were largely treated like second class pigs and that all these ridiculous women characters were the stars -- much more than Tom Hardy's Mad Max. It wasn't just Furiosa who was the problem -- it was also her female backseat drivers and especially those old motorcycle lesbians who showed up near the end. But mainly... Max just didn't seem like much of a star. They could easily forget about his character if they make another one of these movies. It was Furiosa who absolutely felt like the Mad Max character of this film. Max felt more like a distant, observing trainer to her.
And every time you turned around, they shoved a woman's pregnant belly in your face!
But you know what I hated even more than all of that stuff, though?
Max's hallucinations. Especially that obnoxious, curly haired girl who kept appearing. Max's hallucinations were the worst thing to suffer through. I could handle the women to an extent -- but every time Max appeared, he suffered another hallucination! There was hardly anything to him -- even during his own moments, a little obnoxious girl appeared and stole his scenes.
But I knew early on that this movie was going to suck, even before we really got into the meat of the whole thing, with Max joining Furiosa and her gal pals on the road. I really hated that first big scene where they're driving through the desert and Max was strapped to a vehicle, as prisoner. As they went through storm clouds and all that and the guy says, "OH, WHAT A LOVELY DAY!!!!"
I sat through this movie bored out of my skull, dying for it to be over. I wanted to walk out. This could have been a movie I actually walked out on, but I didn't want people here telling me, "You didn't even watch the whole thing!!!" So I stayed. But I thought this was a two hour, ear pounding headache. I thought it was one of the worst movies I had ever seen. Definitely the worst Mad Max movie by far.
It's possible it could have been better with Mel Gibson. I think Mel Gibson MADE those movies. I could see myself tolerating it a lot more if only Mel Gibson was playing Max. Tom Hardy... just seems like Tom Hardy. It's a decent Mad Max impression, but it didn't drive everything home. I kinda wonder if Charlize Theron's Furiosa character was pushed more forwards just in case nobody liked Tom Hardy's Mad Max. Like, I think she might have been a backup, just-in-case, safety kind of thing. That's what went through my mind as I was watching the film.
Anyway, I was hoping to like it, but I just didn't. I'm really kinda utterly shocked at the positive reception it's getting.
JayDee and Used Future are being seen as heroes for speaking negatively about Mad Max: Fury Road WHEN I DID IT FIRST!
I SUFFERED.
I suffered worse than that Asian woman who got raped and murdered in Casualties of War. At least she got a little action -- I didn't! They TORE ME APART in there. Miss Vicky ripped one of my arms off and now has it mounted on a wall as a souvenir!
And you guys are just acting like JayDee and Used Future paved the way for the future of bashing popular American movies. (or is it technically an Australian movie? They didn't actually film it in Australia, you know.)
Nobody's even mentioning my sacrifices.
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Anyway, how much of a backstory do we really need? Fury Road spells out what we need to know: Max's family is dead and he feels like he failed them. As a result, he's isolated himself from other people and now his only urge is to survive.
And I don't see this Max as being dehumanized at all. Hardy's Max is certainly more solemn and his actions and emotions more subtle than the cocky Gibson, but his humanity seeps out all over the place
With his shotgun in the Gyro Captain's face
Max:The deal was I wouldn't kill you...I think you got a bargain
Miller also directs with a more personal touch, and gives us well drawn support characters to counteract and question Max's emotional detachment. Sometimes through quirky eccentricity leading to comedy, but also more challenging dialogue...
Pappagallo: What is it with you, huh? What are you looking for? C'mon, Max, everybody's looking for something. You're happy out there, are you? Eh? Wandering? One day blurring into another? You're a scavenger, Max. You're a maggot. Did you know that? You're living off the corpse of the old world. Tell me your story, Max. C'mon. Tell me your story. What burned you out, huh? Kill one man too many? See too many people die? Lose some family?
Fury Road has nothing like that. No-one to grab Hardy by the lapels and shake him up. He's got nothing to do. There's no-one to beat Max's face to a pulp (something that would happen in a Clint Eastwood flick as JD alluded to) and get under the skin of the character. Hardy is simply lost in the spectacle. It's all mouth and no trousers because the players are so one dimensional, and the story even more basic than the originals which have far more depth.
No, Hardy's Max isn't completely dehumanised through his actions, but he comes across a lot more distant, and doesn't have the same type of charisma Gibson's does. Whilst his behavior verges on noble (again out of necessity rather than choice) mere facial expressions are not enough to compensate for everything else that's missing - especially when the actor looks dazed and out of his depth. This is why Fury Road lacks the impact of the first two films, because Miller and co are too busy paying fan service with large action sequences. They forgot to give us some emotional investment with a better script, and that for me is the difference between an OK action film, and a great action film. It's certainly a poor way to introduce a new actor to an iconic character.
I was also hugely disappointed by the further loss of the Australian identity (which began with the casting of Tina Turner in Thunderdome). Miller says he never really saw the films as Australian, which feels like a total cop-out to me. Surely Mad Max is quintessentially Australian - it was certainly one of the first Aussie films I saw in my youth. Miller's comments strike me as unbelievable PR because of the new shooting location and larger international cast - who by acting standards should have employed Australian accents. I'm aware many Americans only saw the original Mad Max in the wake of The Road Warrior, and that initial version was re-dubbed with American voice actors for fear people wouldn't understand Australian. YUCK. I really hope US fans don't still watch that version and revert to the Australian audio track instead. I remember buying the Warner VHS and taking it back because of the American voices. Thank god the BBC used to screen the film 'in Australian'.
I know we could all go on and dispute the merits of Fury Road until the end of time with individual opinions unlikely to change. I don't hate the movie which I will watch again, and no doubt purchase on blu ray. I'm genuinely glad it's done well and further installments are on the horizon. I know Hardy can grow into the role, and want him to succeed even though I'm not overjoyed with the direction this new film has taken. No doubt there will be comebacks to this post, and that's fine, but I'm pretty much done on the subject to be honest.
...
JayDee and Used Future are being seen as heroes for speaking negatively about Mad Max: Fury Road WHEN I DID IT FIRST!
Sexy Celebrity you are indeed the trailblazer of all things seminal. Though I did make the the following post in the Rate the last movie you saw thread around the same time (not sure on the exact dates) that you started world war three in the Fury Road thread - which I deliberately avoided.
This is going to be unpopular, but I need to rant...
Mad Max: Fury Road
I love Mad Max and enjoyed this as a mindless action spectacle, but it's definitely the most overrated movie of the year so far, and doesn't begin to touch the first two films (which were far from mindless and not gratuitously violent as some have stated elsewhere). The script here is practically non existent. It's like Miller sat there with the suits and they said, Hey George! People love that tanker chase in The Road Warrior so lets make the whole movie like that. Forget about the personal touch the original films had, just throw an endless series of stunts and twisted metal at the screen and people will flock to see it. I find it hard to believe there wasn't major studio tampering with such a big budget on the table. Let's throw in a logic defying faux-twist to ensure the protagonists meet head on again for yet another mind numbing chase sequence. Is this really the best script Miller and co could source after a thirty year hiatus from Max? I doubt it.
There's virtually no character development (save for Nux who has the only thing resembling a redemptive arc) and thus I experienced no sense of excitement or tension because I didn't care about any of said characters. Tom Hardy is so vacant and lacking in charisma as Max; he looks like a startled rabbit caught in the proverbial headlights - what a shame they couldn't take a leap of faith and stick with Mel Gibson who was still only mid fifties when they shot this. Theron is great in a Ripley-esque kind of way and the (hardly original) feminist undertones are fitting considering the origins of the genre, but why the hell is she talking with an American accent? Surely an actress of her caliber could have given it some ocker passion. I know it wasn't shot in Oz, but a huge part of Mad Max for me is the Australian identity and this incarnation seems to toss much of that aside. It just doesn't have that strange, crow cawing atmosphere the first films had and as such merely looks like the world of Max on steroids.
Thankfully those looks are fantastically realised and repetitive as they may be, the action scenes are impeccably staged with a minimum of CGI tampering (save for that horrible dust storm sequence, and understandably Immortan Joe's impressive looking citadel) The costume and vehicle designs hold an admirable level of steam punk detail that would make Terry Gilliam proud, and for brief stretches I almost forgot about the complete lack of soul the movie has. Despite this it's highly watchable on the level of Costner's Waterword (odd to think that very similar Max inspired movie got luke warm notices whilst this has received raves) and perhaps more importantly seems to have successfully rebooted (though it isn't one) the Mad Max franchise. I just hope Miller has the moxy to re-cast Gibbo (or anyone but Hardy) in a more personal and restrained sequel. Wishful thinking perhaps, but I sincerely believe that less is more, George...less is more.
Mad Max: Fury Road
I love Mad Max and enjoyed this as a mindless action spectacle, but it's definitely the most overrated movie of the year so far, and doesn't begin to touch the first two films (which were far from mindless and not gratuitously violent as some have stated elsewhere). The script here is practically non existent. It's like Miller sat there with the suits and they said, Hey George! People love that tanker chase in The Road Warrior so lets make the whole movie like that. Forget about the personal touch the original films had, just throw an endless series of stunts and twisted metal at the screen and people will flock to see it. I find it hard to believe there wasn't major studio tampering with such a big budget on the table. Let's throw in a logic defying faux-twist to ensure the protagonists meet head on again for yet another mind numbing chase sequence. Is this really the best script Miller and co could source after a thirty year hiatus from Max? I doubt it.
There's virtually no character development (save for Nux who has the only thing resembling a redemptive arc) and thus I experienced no sense of excitement or tension because I didn't care about any of said characters. Tom Hardy is so vacant and lacking in charisma as Max; he looks like a startled rabbit caught in the proverbial headlights - what a shame they couldn't take a leap of faith and stick with Mel Gibson who was still only mid fifties when they shot this. Theron is great in a Ripley-esque kind of way and the (hardly original) feminist undertones are fitting considering the origins of the genre, but why the hell is she talking with an American accent? Surely an actress of her caliber could have given it some ocker passion. I know it wasn't shot in Oz, but a huge part of Mad Max for me is the Australian identity and this incarnation seems to toss much of that aside. It just doesn't have that strange, crow cawing atmosphere the first films had and as such merely looks like the world of Max on steroids.
Thankfully those looks are fantastically realised and repetitive as they may be, the action scenes are impeccably staged with a minimum of CGI tampering (save for that horrible dust storm sequence, and understandably Immortan Joe's impressive looking citadel) The costume and vehicle designs hold an admirable level of steam punk detail that would make Terry Gilliam proud, and for brief stretches I almost forgot about the complete lack of soul the movie has. Despite this it's highly watchable on the level of Costner's Waterword (odd to think that very similar Max inspired movie got luke warm notices whilst this has received raves) and perhaps more importantly seems to have successfully rebooted (though it isn't one) the Mad Max franchise. I just hope Miller has the moxy to re-cast Gibbo (or anyone but Hardy) in a more personal and restrained sequel. Wishful thinking perhaps, but I sincerely believe that less is more, George...less is more.
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I was referring more to the visual style and narration of the intro rather than the absence of a protracted and unnecessary recap. Miller could have had a gravelly narrator say something a bit more poetic about the rise of Immortan Joe, the increased depravity of the wasteland and Max's further mental decline.
Gibson acts the part with a subtle hint of swagger that compensates for much of the character's coldness.
Miller also directs with a more personal touch, and gives us well drawn support characters to counteract and question Max's emotional detachment. Sometimes through quirky eccentricity leading to comedy, but also more challenging dialogue...
He's got nothing to do.
No, Hardy's Max isn't completely dehumanised through his actions, but he comes across a lot more distant, and doesn't have the same type of charisma Gibson's does. Whilst his behavior verges on noble (again out of necessity rather than choice) mere facial expressions are not enough to compensate for everything else that's missing - especially when the actor looks dazed and out of his depth.
And, again, I felt that Hardy's performance was fitting to the character and the situation he found himself in. I felt that even more strongly on the second and third viewing than on the first. Cocky swagger may be fun, but I also find it less believable and don't see how much of that could have been pulled off within the confines of the particular story being told.
This is why Fury Road lacks the impact of the first two films, because Miller and co are too busy paying fan service with large action sequences. They forgot to give us some emotional investment with a better script, and that for me is the difference between an OK action film, and a great action film. It's certainly a poor way to introduce a new actor to an iconic character.
I was also hugely disappointed by the further loss of the Australian identity (which began with the casting of Tina Turner in Thunderdome). Miller says he never really saw the films as Australian, which feels like a total cop-out to me. Surely Mad Max is quintessentially Australian - it was certainly one of the first Aussie films I saw in my youth. Miller's comments strike me as unbelievable PR because of the new shooting location and larger international cast - who by acting standards should have employed Australian accents.
I'm aware many Americans only saw the original Mad Max in the wake of The Road Warrior, and that initial version was re-dubbed with American voice actors for fear people wouldn't understand Australian. YUCK. I really hope US fans don't still watch that version and revert to the Australian audio track instead. I remember buying the Warner VHS and taking it back because of the American voices. Thank god the BBC used to screen the film 'in Australian'.
But there's really not much point in going round and round, especially in this thread. Although this film seems to be particularly divisive, there are always going to be detractors for every film released, ever. There are plenty of "classics" and "masterpieces" that I find incredibly dull - actually quite a lot of them - and have watched with a certain emotional disconnect, but this isn't one of them and you won't ever convince me that it should be. I can only hope that you'll find more of a connection when you rewatch it, because only the film itself can convince you of its merit.
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I know we could all go on and dispute the merits of Fury Road until the end of time with individual opinions unlikely to change....
...I'm pretty much done on the subject to be honest.
...I'm pretty much done on the subject to be honest.
But there's really not much point in going round and round, especially in this thread. Although this film seems to be particularly divisive...
...I can only hope that you'll find more of a connection when you rewatch it
...I can only hope that you'll find more of a connection when you rewatch it
Agreed.
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Originally Posted by Used Future
By whom and where? I don't feel much love on these boards.
Sexy Celebrity you are indeed the trailblazer of all things seminal. Though I did make the the following post in the Rate the last movie you saw thread around the same time (not sure on the exact dates) that you started world war three in the Fury Road thread - which I deliberately avoided.
Sexy Celebrity you are indeed the trailblazer of all things seminal. Though I did make the the following post in the Rate the last movie you saw thread around the same time (not sure on the exact dates) that you started world war three in the Fury Road thread - which I deliberately avoided.
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Holy crap. I disappear for a few days and my thread explodes! We've got arguments over the merits of not just Fury Road but of Bronson, discussions about whether Fury Road is a feminist film or not and a tirade from Sexy Celeb.
I've got a lot to catch up on but until then
I've got a lot to catch up on but until then
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JayDee's Movie Musings (Reviews - Frailty / Total Recall / Lone Ranger / Nightcrawler / Whiplash / Imitation Game / Birdman / Avengers: Age of Ultron / Mad Max: Fury Road)
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Oh no, how will I ever survive without the patronage of someone who has never before posted in this thread and never repped any of my reviews? 
Oh wait, I think I'll manage
Oh wait, I think I'll manage
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Wow JayDee.. you are getting a bit of crap here.. I dont read all your reviews but I respect your taste in films. To each their own... You enjoy what you do and thats all that matters to you...
Keep it up hun, you're doing great!
Keep it up hun, you're doing great!
Oh Wolfsbane, you're back! Happy days. I was so worried when you said you were done with my reviews that I'd never see you again.
^ May not have been entirely genuine.
Um...ok? I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything but whatever. And for the substantial majority of the time my 'complaints' about rep are tongue in cheek and just playing up to the personality that people associate with me.
Although I suppose I should be touched that you actually know who I am because I literally have no clue who you are. Until a couple of days ago if someone had asked me if we had a MoFo named Wolfsbane I would have said that I didn't think so. As such I'm not exactly going to be overly concerned with what you have to say. Feel free to make your next hiatus from my thread of essay reviews longer than about 3 days.
^ May not have been entirely genuine.
I don't think anyone else on this site bitches and complains as much as you about not getting enough rep points. Just because you write novels, doesn't mean it's worth a rep point.
I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything but whatever. And for the substantial majority of the time my 'complaints' about rep are tongue in cheek and just playing up to the personality that people associate with me.Although I suppose I should be touched that you actually know who I am because I literally have no clue who you are. Until a couple of days ago if someone had asked me if we had a MoFo named Wolfsbane I would have said that I didn't think so. As such I'm not exactly going to be overly concerned with what you have to say. Feel free to make your next hiatus from my thread of essay reviews longer than about 3 days.
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Oh Wolfsbane, you're back! Happy days. I was so worried when you said you were done with my reviews that I'd never see you again.
^ May not have been entirely genuine.
Um...ok? I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything but whatever. And for the substantial majority of the time my 'complaints' about rep are tongue in cheek and just playing up to the personality that people associate with me.
Although I suppose I should be touched that you actually know who I am because I literally have no clue who you are. Until a couple of days ago if someone had asked me if we had a MoFo named Wolfsbane I would have said that I didn't think so. As such I'm not exactly going to be overly concerned with what you have to say. Feel free to make your next hiatus from my thread of essay reviews longer than about 3 days.
^ May not have been entirely genuine.
Um...ok?
I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything but whatever. And for the substantial majority of the time my 'complaints' about rep are tongue in cheek and just playing up to the personality that people associate with me.Although I suppose I should be touched that you actually know who I am because I literally have no clue who you are. Until a couple of days ago if someone had asked me if we had a MoFo named Wolfsbane I would have said that I didn't think so. As such I'm not exactly going to be overly concerned with what you have to say. Feel free to make your next hiatus from my thread of essay reviews longer than about 3 days.
I brought up the rep....because you did. I didn't realize I needed to spell it out for you. You can "claim" it's all tongue in cheek, but that's BS. You think you deserve more because of the amount of time you put into them. Don't hide the fact.
Also, do I care if you know who I am? Not in the slightest. I think I'll be able to move on in the world without the almighty JayDee not knowing who I am. Get off your high horse. basically you're saying people who don't post here a dozen times a day, their opinions are invalid.
Also, sorry again (I seem to be apologizing a lot) that my 'hiatus' was so long, I'll make sure to sit by the computer and eagerly await what you have to say. Making sure not to leave it until I see a response so I can IMMEDIATELY respond with my own opinions. Oh wait, I have a life.
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Just because you write novels, doesn't mean it's worth a rep point.
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I didn't realize you were dense, sorry.
I brought up the rep....because you did. I didn't realize I needed to spell it out for you. You can "claim" it's all tongue in cheek, but that's BS. You think you deserve more because of the amount of time you put into them. Don't hide the fact.
Also, do I care if you know who I am? Not in the slightest. I think I'll be able to move on in the world without the almighty JayDee not knowing who I am. Get off your high horse. basically you're saying people who don't post here a dozen times a day, their opinions are invalid.
Also, sorry again (I seem to be apologizing a lot) that my 'hiatus' was so long, I'll make sure to sit by the computer and eagerly await what you have to say. Making sure not to leave it until I see a response so I can IMMEDIATELY respond with my own opinions. Oh wait, I have a life.
I brought up the rep....because you did. I didn't realize I needed to spell it out for you. You can "claim" it's all tongue in cheek, but that's BS. You think you deserve more because of the amount of time you put into them. Don't hide the fact.
Also, do I care if you know who I am? Not in the slightest. I think I'll be able to move on in the world without the almighty JayDee not knowing who I am. Get off your high horse. basically you're saying people who don't post here a dozen times a day, their opinions are invalid.
Also, sorry again (I seem to be apologizing a lot) that my 'hiatus' was so long, I'll make sure to sit by the computer and eagerly await what you have to say. Making sure not to leave it until I see a response so I can IMMEDIATELY respond with my own opinions. Oh wait, I have a life.
Well no I didn't really bring up rep as an issue. I was merely pointing out that as you had never posted in the thread before or repped any of my reviews I had no clue of your existence, particularly in regards to my thread. As such, your big proclamation about being done with my reviews didn't exactly mean a great deal to me. In fact I'd say it pretty much meant the square root of jack *****.
But you know what Wolfy, you're right. How silly of me to think that I know what I mean with my posts more than you do. Quite clearly if anyone knows the intent of my words it would of course be you!
I should thank you however. Thanks to you I now understand that old phrase that goes along the lines of 'when you assume something you make an ass out of u”Nope you're wrong again. Boy you really kind of suck with these assumptions don't you? How little I value your opinion has nothing to do with how many posts you've made. In fact if the amount of posts determined the value of a person's opinion that wouldn't be all that great for me. There are people here who probably post almost as much in a month as I have in my entire time on this forum. The reason I have no respect for your opinion is that the very first post of yours I was ever aware of was you popping in here and straight up insulting me. Around here people tend to be a lot friendlier and a lot more courteous to others, and actually attempt to engage in a discussion rather than just saying “hey you're sh!t” like a little troll.
And another swing and miss. Three assumptions - three strikes. I can assure you that I most certainly was not just sitting here, waiting with baited breath to see what the mighty Wolfsbane had to say. Oh and just to check, you have nothing better to do than hang around an internet forum and insult people? Oh yeah, it sound like you have a very full life.
Oh and as I said you do have three strikes so you're out. But don't worry, we have a lovely parting gift for you
Last edited by JayDee; 06-16-15 at 09:27 PM.
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