Your favourite war film?

It would only take few nukes to make sure that you wouldn't be left standing. Unacceptable losses, according to one of your Secretary of Defense (I'll use the corrupted spelling ) during the Cold War was 1/3 of the popn. and 2/3 of the industry. That wouldn't take many nukes.

Hey, I'm not saying you couldn't wipe out ther rest of the world too, just that you are not invincible! There's no shame in that!

Yes, but would that have been a victory? Against the Japanese it was acceptable because they were attacking US civilians - Vietnam was, really, none of your business. Ho Chi Minh wasn't even a commie, he was nationalist! And I think that the USSR might have had something to say about it too. Besides, using that argument, you could say that Soviets could have won the Cuban missile crisis just with a push of a button.

That's because they haven't made a film about the Bay of Pigs, Somalia etc. yet .

I would probably say Platoon is a good example - they take some heavy losses in the final scene. Mind you, they still win and live to fight another day. I think you are right - all the wars they lost, they just tend to make films about the battles that they won.

What about the Great Escape? That had some yanks in it!

It is getting quite OT but let me give my 2 cents.

The Golf war was NOT won by the Americans but rather by the UN Force...I don't remember how many countries were implicated but it's in the 50's or so. We even lost a pilot in the war and our CF-18 were there to bomb Saddam along the French, German, British and others.

As for Vietnam there is no way the US could have won...the ratio was not on their side as the Korea, Russia and China were providing Vietnam with military equipment.

The Vietnam is to the US what was Afghanistan (and Tchetchenia) was to Russia (USSR back then).

Oh! and I know that 50 000 canadians fought with the North during the American Civil War...I wonder how many remembers that.

All this to say that the US is not alone in the many victories that it has and will never be; every country that is active military (in any way) can testify it was there in War #X.

Cheers!

p.s. the UK and France along with China are as powerful as the US even if they are outnumbered by Nukes...it just takes a few bullseyes to get a whole country shaken no matter how big or small.

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We'd better have help now and then, what with all the assistance we tend to give to others!

Ollie: the Cuban Missile Crises was not a war - they can't "win" the Cuban Missile Crises. If they had killed 80 million Americans, we would've bombed them into the next world immedietly.

I am not claiming invincibility - just that any one country (two in some cases I'm sure) can only take some of us down before we destroy them - IE: we can win any straightforward war.

And yes, bombing the Vietnemese, whether or not it was our business, would have been a victory, because we would have accomplished our objective. I'm not saying I would support it, but it would be a victory.

I will also say that America gets a bad rap. America is one of the few countries willing to go around and police some of these terrorists around the world - we put a lot of time, effort, and finance into it and then people tell us it's none of our business. Anywhere unjust things are going on ought to be our business: we could be next.

No one would win in a Nuclear War because we would all be toasted hehe so it's not an option.

As for the bad rap it's part of the game and making the world police is not the best thing to do in some cases...and the US is not the only country participating in the UN/NATO; all industrialized countries participate in it too.

In a sense Saddam won the war as no one marched on Baghdad and he's still in power while in the US there has been 3 (or 4 hehe) presidents since the War. You can't claim victory over the ennemy if you aren't in his castle and especially when the ennemy is building new weapons while you think he's all dead.

Cheers!

This is incorrect. The whole principle of MAD is that the missile silos are second-strike, that is, they won't be destroyed by nuclear weapons - they will just keep firing until they've run out.

What was your objective? To stop the spread of communism (containment), based on the domino theory. Do you think that all these rogue states that could have gone either way (capitalist and free world or commie) would have come to the US's side if the US wiped out an entire civillian population? You would have been as bad as HCM and any government that oppresses civillians then. You also would have violated not only the Geneva Convention but the Just War tradition. It would not have been a victory.

Totally agreed. And the rest of the world will appreciate it eventually. Don't forget, of course, that the UK also sends people here, there, and everywhere - over half of our forces are currently deployed abroad. The first people into Kosovo on the ground were the British Parachute Regiment.

The debate about nuclear war could go either side, but I think a song called "Russians" by Sting sums it up pretty well...if you haven't heard it here are the lyrics:

In Europe and America,
There's a growing feeling of hysteria
Conditioned to respond to all the threats
In the rhetorical speaches of the Soviets
Mr. Krushchev said "We will bury you."
I don't subscribe to this point of view
It would be such an ignorant thing to do,
If the Russians love their children too.

How can I save my little boy
From Oppenheimer's deadly toy
There is no monopoly of common sense
On either side of the political fence
We share the same biology
Regardless of ideology
Believe me when I say to you
I hope the Russians love their children too

There is no historical precedent
To put words in the mouth of the president
There's no such thing as a winnable war
It's a lie we dont't believe anymore
Mr. Reagan says "We will protect you."
I don't subscribe to this point of view
Believe me when I say to you
I hope the Russians love their children too.

We share the same biology
Regardless of ideology
What might save us me and you
Is that the Russians love their children too.
Sting

Victory, in that context, is simply a matter of military strength. I'm simply stating that we're the most powerful military in the world and should be able to take anybody on one-on-one.

Interesting song - I'll have to read it in more detail when I have more time. Gotta run!

Strongest doesn't necessarely mean best...they are quite different.

If the US and even the UN/NATO were the best armies in the world they would have defeated Saddam and Bosnia much faster...today's wars aren't necessarely technological like most thinks; you still need to get your infantry and artillery moving. After such a number of bombs dropped on both Bosnia and Iraq none of them were totally defeated; they both have their same ruling person.

Cheers!

Yo yo yo, its just a matter of national pride. Chris, an American is defending America. Ollie, the brit, isn't really defending the British, hes just saying the deserve a better rap.

This conversation is gonna go nowhere.

But I'm gonna be a hypocrite and say that I agree with Ollie.

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LOL and as a Canadian I will be left on the side...as usual! ;+)

It's true that national pride is strong even when we dislike our governments.

Cheers!

I think you guys kind of strayed from the topic...

How about The Deer Hunter? Erm, brilliant, stunning, a little rambling at times, but still, it's on the top 100.

Or even the amazing La Vita e Bella? (Life is Beautiful) I've seen it three times already and I still adore it. It's a reminder as to why movies are magical.

And then, going along with the Holocaust, Schindler's List...

Did I read above someone said "Golf war?" Giggle. Was Tiger Woods on the front line for that one?

LOL...I just noticed my "Golf" mistake...does it show I ain't a great golfer?

You are right La Vita E Bella was magnificent.

Cheers!

Deerhunter!

What a film!

You're a fine American, Fly, a fine American.

LOL crash...I am not an American yet!

I am a Canadian that is moving in Florida for winter and back here for summer.

Cheers!

Florida? Good luck. I'd avoid using cash if at all possible...they might mess up when counting out your change. It could take them a few tries to get it right.

As Jay Leno says, we can count every person in America, but we can't figure out how many votes Gore got in Florida.

Wouldn't this election make a great film? How about Two Idiots Flew Over the Ballot Box? Or A Few Good Recounters? Or even, Killing Miss Harris. The possibilities are endless.

that one would be hell to cast...

Jack Nicholson could make a pretty good Bush, would have to think a while to get past that.

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LOL...or the movie could simply be called Dumb And Dumber!

There might be a copyright infringement but it's worth using the name again!

Cheers!

I don't think Adam Sandler would be too bent out of shape about it.

How about the SNL actors, Ferrell and Hammond? May as well make it look real. We DO have a surplus this time around, Bush certainly isn't going to use it on anything useful -- sorry Republicans -- so let's make a movie.

I think he is, crash :P

But yes, the SNL impersonations were totally brilliant. I'm a Bush supporter, but it doesn't mean Ferrell acting like an idiot isn't funny as heck - it's over done and over the top, and makes me laugh every time.

Hammond is one of the best in the business: no one compares to his impersonations: Jesse Jackson, Bill Clinton, Al Gore, Sean Connery, Ted Koppel, and that A&E biography guy, just to name a few.