The Heisman Trophy, Collegiate Rules, and Capitalism
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I think it's kind of like a placebo or something to pacify the masses. They go through the motions of free choice---even to the point of going all Walden on society's ass---but it is never unaccounted for by the market, I guess.
Originally Posted by John McClane
Originally Posted by Yoda
There are laws about the rights to one's own life story, but putting that aside for the moment, I'm not sure I see the problem. You can still live off the grid and farm and make your fight club soap, yadda yadda yadda, but yes, people are allowed to talk and write about it. My questions are 1) so what? and 2) in what kind of society is this not allowed?
You think you're free because you have all these limitless options and choices. Capitalism makes this possible. Yes, certainly true, but you're not free. You are sucked right back into the system because capitalism is dependent on your endless consumption. Your endless subjugation.
Am I missing something? This seems silly
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Originally Posted by Fiscal
Dude, you are free to not sell home made fight club soap, too.
Am I missing something? This seems silly
Am I missing something? This seems silly
Basically, the character of John the Savage at the end. No matter how far he runs, Capitalism will always find him and turn him into a commodity.
Originally Posted by Yoda
in what kind of society is this not allowed?
Originally Posted by Fiscal
Dude, you are free to not sell home made fight club soap, too.
Am I missing something? This seems silly
Am I missing something? This seems silly
Here's a new and better soap making machine, etc.
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Originally Posted by planet news
The better question is: in what kind of society is it not necessary to completely extricate yourself from mainstream society in order to be free?
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Fiscal kinda already beat me to it, but I'll reiterate it more specifically, anyway:
You're describing people offering you things, not people forcing you to do things. None of this interferes with the desires of the hypothetical soap-farmer guy we've posited.
Unless I'm forced to participate in a specific way, then yes, I am free. Having people really wanting to sell me things does not reduce my freedom in any meaningful way, unless you think that not having to sometimes hear a sales pitch is a basic human right. And even then, if you live in the mountains you're not going to get many door-to-door salesmen.
Originally Posted by John McClane
No, they want to buy the rights to his life and market it. You are missing the whole point! It's not that these things aren't allowed. It's the exact opposite, and in fact, they're encouraged! Sure, make your own soap, but have you ever thought about selling it? Sure, don't eat meat pumped full of vitamins and steroids, and I have just the thing for you: free-range cows! Sure, we'd love for you to quit using toxin cleaning chemicals, and we have this new line of plant based cleaners!
Originally Posted by John McClane
You think you're free because you have all these limitless options and choices. Capitalism makes this possible. Yes, certainly true, but you're not free.
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Then what's the point of continuing if you can't whittle away the problems, of which seem eternal...
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Originally Posted by planet news
The better question is: in what kind of society is it not necessary to completely extricate yourself from mainstream society in order to be free?
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Uh, dude, the whole point is you don't know you're not free. I'm trying to wake you up, man. This is the beauty of capitalism! It caters to everyone, and thus it controls everyone. How is this not painfully obvious?
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Originally Posted by planet news
So... Deleuze's conclusion is that society can not be fully overhauled EVER?
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You're only free if you live in the woods, but if you really want to be pessimistic, you're still a slave to human function. That's not the point however, since society has the ability to change, too bad it won't
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OK, nutshell time...
1. Freedom is not being forced to consume for survival (???).
2. People like ME would like to advocate an overthrow of the fascist establishment in order to form a non-consumerist society, but Deleuze warns that this will only lead to something worse, like the Third Reich.
3. Therefore... we can only ever escape from being forced to consume through "small lines of flight", because Capitalism is too pervasive and not capable of being overthrown without worse consequences.
4. The only way to even gain a semblance of freedom is to live in the frickin' mountains. COOL SOCIETY, BRO.
1. Freedom is not being forced to consume for survival (???).
2. People like ME would like to advocate an overthrow of the fascist establishment in order to form a non-consumerist society, but Deleuze warns that this will only lead to something worse, like the Third Reich.
3. Therefore... we can only ever escape from being forced to consume through "small lines of flight", because Capitalism is too pervasive and not capable of being overthrown without worse consequences.
4. The only way to even gain a semblance of freedom is to live in the frickin' mountains. COOL SOCIETY, BRO.
Originally Posted by John McClane
Uh, dude, the whole point is you don't know you're not free. I'm trying to wake you up, man. This is the beauty of capitalism! It caters to everyone, and thus it controls everyone. How is this not painfully obvious?
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Originally Posted by Yoda
It kinda sounds like you're joking.
You're free when you produce. Man is a producer, and that's his subjective nature. Capitalism, however, makes you a slave to consumption. The very opposite of the fabric of man!
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