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-   -   The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown (http://www.movieforums.com/community/showthread.php?t=69731)

Thief 03-06-24 10:48 AM

3lists36points
In the Heat of the Night
Director

Norman Jewison, 1967

Starring

Sidney Poitier, Rod Steiger, Warren Oates, Peter Whitney

Thief 03-06-24 10:49 AM

3lists36points
The Manchurian Candidate
Director

John Frankenheimer, 1962

Starring

Frank Sinatra, Laurence Harvey, Angela Lansbury, Janet Leigh

Thief 03-06-24 10:51 AM

TRAILERS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d15DhX_ltls

In the Heat of the Night - A black Philadelphia police detective, mistakenly suspected of a local murder while passing through a racially hostile Mississippi town, pairs up with the white police chief to investigate the case.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oc8LpuM5Bhs

The Manchurian Candidate - An American POW in the Korean War is brainwashed as an unwitting assassin for an international Communist conspiracy.

seanc 03-06-24 11:02 AM

Been a minute since I have seen either of these, and neither left much of an impression. But hey, I’m 4 for 4. That’s the only thing that matters, right? Getting those check marks.

Allaby 03-06-24 11:03 AM

Two great films. The Manchurian Candidate is my #13. *Somehow, In The Heat of The Night didn’t make my ballot, but probably should have.

Seen: 3/4

Thief 03-06-24 11:04 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I saw In the Heat of the Night fairly recent and I really liked it, but it's been a while since I've seen The Manchurian Candidate. Seen it a couple of times, though, and I'm a fan. Should probably revisit it one of these days.

Wyldesyde19 03-06-24 11:35 AM

Both great films, but neither were on my list.

2/4

Sedai 03-06-24 11:40 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Have seen both and both are great films. Looking over my list, I really leaned into the more contemporary neo-noirs, so neither of these made it onto my ballot. Both are totally deserving of a slot, but just missed the cut.

2/4 Seen

mrblond 03-06-24 11:42 AM

#98-97. Both are well known titles.
In the Heat of the Night been on my watch list for many years still not seen.
The other film somewhat smells too political to me that's why I've never planned to see it.

Thief 03-06-24 11:42 AM

WHAT DID YOU THINK OF... IN THE HEAT OF THE NIGHT


The Noir 'net said:

"In The Heat Of The Night is that rarest of films. Equal parts mystery, drama, and character study, it's a powerful crime thriller that succeeds on many levels." (read full review here)
Arun Starkey said:

"One of the most important films ever made. Whilst it might be a neo-noir mystery, it contains much more depth than this tag might suggest. The film remains one of the most damning visual indictments of America’s history with racism, bringing the themes of John Ball's novel into forensic focus." (read full review here)
@Gideon58 said:

"[Director Norman] Jewison creates an unerring tension that permeates the story throughout, creating that drippy, sweaty southern atmosphere that appropriately frames the story ... Grand entertainment that still packs a wallop." (read full review here)

Thief 03-06-24 11:47 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
WHAT DID YOU THINK OF... THE MANCHURIAN CANDIDATE?


Roger Ebert said:

"The Manchurian Candidate is inventive and frisky, takes enormous chances with the audience, and plays not like a 'classic' but as a work as alive and smart as when it was first released." (read full review here)
Jude Seymour wrote:

"The Manchurian Candidate incorporates most of the conventions of film noir. Besides its existentialist hero, it incorporates a femme fatale into its narrative structure ... The movie also employs a non-linear style to its narrative ... The last narrative technique that [it] employs that is similar to noir is that of 'free will versus fate'." (read full review here)
@mark f said:

"First off, let me discuss what 'genre' this film belongs to: political satire, thriller, science fiction, black comedy, film noir, tragedy, mystery, family drama, and that's just a start." (read full review here)

ScarletLion 03-06-24 11:55 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Gah, This thread will show my shameful lack of noir knowledge. I have seen neither. But both look good.

Holden Pike 03-06-24 12:01 PM

1 Attachment(s)


Both of these were on the MoFo Top 100 of the 1960s List. MISTER Tibbs and In the Heat of the Night (1967) were #76 while The Manchurian Candidate (1962) was passing the time with a game of solitaire at #34.

rauldc14 03-06-24 12:12 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Only saw In the Heat of the Night once. I didn't care for it back then. It should get another shot though someday.

Not seen Manchurian

John W Constantine 03-06-24 12:23 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
For a minute I was asking how I could have left Manchurian Candidate off my ballot since I hadn't checked in a few weeks, but alas I had it at #12. Watched it many moons ago but certain aspects stuck with me, would be nice to check it out again. IN the Heat of the Night needs another look.

Holden Pike 03-06-24 12:23 PM

Both are acknowledged classic films, for good reason. I did not have either on my ballot. The Manchurian Candidate, as brilliant as it is, doesn't fit my personal definition of Neo Noir enough to even warrant consideration. In the Heat of the Night has enough elements that I considered it, though ultimately I didn't even include it on my shortlist.

For those who have never gotten around to watching John Frankenheimer's The Manchurian Candidate or may only be familiar with Jonathan Demme's remake starring Denzel Washington, it really is a must-see. When put in the context of its day, post-McCarthy era and just before the assassination of JFK, it is a striking piece with Angela Lansbury perfectly cast as one of the greatest big screen villains.

As for a master class in editing, please see any of the brainwashing sequences.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1GUJMTmoMY&t=122s

Thief 03-06-24 12:38 PM

Originally Posted by Holden Pike (Post 2443762)
Both are acknowledged classic films, for good reason. I did not have either on my ballot. The Manchurian Candidate, as brilliant as it is, doesn't fit my personal definition of Neo Noir enough to even warrant consideration. In the Heat of the Night has enough elements that I considered it, though ultimately I didn't even include it on my shortlist.
This is more or less where I stand with both. They didn't even cross my mind when making my list. But putting my personal point of view aside, I included links to some reviews that do acknowledge those noir-ish traits in both, so everybody, feel free to check them out.

On that topic, this link is a very brief statement from noir expert Eddie Muller on whether he sees The Manchurian Candidate as a film noir or not.

Miss Vicky 03-06-24 12:48 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
0 for 4 seen on either countdown.

Citizen Rules 03-06-24 01:16 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I've seen both The Manchurian Candidate and In The Heat of The Night, but so long ago I can't really remember them....due for rewatches!

Thief 03-06-24 01:54 PM

AWARDS?


In the Heat of the Night was a critical darling, receiving many awards and even more nominations. Some notable wins:
  • Four (4) Academy Awards, including Best Picture
  • Two (2) BAFTA Awards
  • Three (3) Golden Globe Awards, including Best Drama
  • Rod Steiger won 8 of 9 awards he was nominated, including the Oscar
  • Sidney Poitier was nominated for three acting awards, but won none.
  • Stirling Silliphant won 3 of 4 awards he was nominated for the script, including the Oscar

Thief 03-06-24 02:00 PM

AWARDS?


The Manchurian Candidate gathered several wins and nominations. Some notable ones:
  • Two (2) Golden Globe Award nominations, including a win for Best Supporting Actress (Angela Lansbury)
  • Two (2) Academy Award nominations, including Best Supporting Actress (Lansbury)
  • Three (3) Laurel Award nominations, including Top Action Performance (Frank Sinatra)
  • One (1) BAFTA Award nomination for Best Film
  • One (1) National Board of Review Award for Best Supporting Actress (Lansbury)

John-Connor 03-06-24 02:10 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Love Frankenheimer! Seven Days in May, The Train, Ronin, Birdman of Alcatraz and even Reindeer Games ;), to name a few. Nevertheless The Manchurian Candidate did not make my ballot.


Powerful performances from Poitier and Steiger, skillful directing showing both lead character's view points. Excellent title sequence song by Grammy Lifetime Achievement Award recipient Ray Charles.
In the Heat of the Night was my #22.

SEEN 3/4
BALLOT 2/25
25. Mirage (1965) - DNP 1-pointer
22. In the Heat of the Night (1967)





Allaby 03-06-24 02:19 PM

I finally watched The Friends of Eddie Coyle today. I thought it was good, but not great. I have now seen all 4 of the films on the list so far.

Little Ash 03-06-24 03:01 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I have seen In the Heat of the Night. It has its strong moments. There are other films I prefer more. It does have its cultural significance for the time it was made though.

For whatever reason, I still have never seen The Manchurian Candidate. I would blindly guess, going into, it would read more like a political-thriller to me and wouldn't have guessed a connection to neo-noir. Don't know how much of that is misconception or just funginess of the genre (movement?). In terms of Frankenheimer, I still need to Seconds as well. That's probably higher up on my to watch list.
Oh, with Reindeer Games, I guess that makes it one entry and one one-pointer for him so far.

Thief 03-06-24 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by Little Ash (Post 2443811)
For whatever reason, I still have never seen The Manchurian Candidate. I would blindly guess, going into, it would read more like a political-thriller to me and wouldn't have guessed a connection to neo-noir. Don't know how much of that is misconception or just funginess of the genre (movement?). In terms of Frankenheimer, I still need to Seconds as well. That's probably higher up on my to watch list.
Like I said before, I really didn't think of it when making the list but I think there are some strong arguments in favor of it being considered noir in some of the articles I linked.

As for Frankenheimer, Seconds is indeed very good. Not sure if I would put it above Manchurian, but probably neck and neck. My favorite Frankenheimer is still The Train, though.

edarsenal 03-06-24 06:44 PM

Originally Posted by Thief (Post 2443734)
This is the list of one-pointers that have been picked up already.
  • The Chaser (2008) - CosmicRunaway
SERIOUS points for this one being yours, my dear! I was hard put NOT to make room for this one. When my roommate and I got into South Korean films, this was one of those first ones that blew us away.

And LOVIN the Awards/Reviews/And Layout!!! BRA-The F@CK-VO!!!

https://66.media.tumblr.com/c83b4fa5...2552088691.gif

This One-Pointer is mine:

[*] Things to Do in Denver When You're Dead (1995)

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/M/...2ODc@._V1_.jpg

Jimmy 'The Saint' Tosnia: You gave me your word!
The Man With The Plan: I'm a criminal; my word don't mean dick!


After Tarantino's Reservoir Dogs came out in '92, there was a deluge of clever dialogue, sh#t going sideways by colorful characters, and this one remained endeared for me. Andy Garcia plays the epitome of cool and style as a guy in debt with the nickname "The Saint". A gangster known as "The Man With The Plan (Christopher Walken) takes up the marker and insists on a "favor" to wipe it out. Enter the inevitable colossal screw-up, and sh#t just gets worse and worse by his crew: Franchise (William Forsyte), Critical Bill (Treat Williams), and Pieces (Christopher Lloyd). Topping the ensemble for Colorful Characters screwing up and making things worse.


I am finally on the board for films seen with In The Heat of the Night. A legitimate placement in this Countdown, though I found it more of a Police Thriller, which is the ONLY reason it did not make my list. Great, GREAT film.





Seen 1 out of 4 (25%)
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25. Things to do in Denver When You're Dead (1995) One-Pointer

Harry Lime 03-06-24 07:06 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
In the Heat of the Night is a good film. The Manchurian Candidate a great one. A neo noir though? Hm like others it didn't even cross my mind to include it. But if Mark F says it be, then so be it a noir!

SpelingError 03-06-24 08:00 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Both In the Heat of the Night and The Manchurian Candidate are really good, with the latter film being my favorite of the two. It might've had a shot of making my ballot had I rewatched it.

PHOENIX74 03-06-24 11:08 PM

Well, it would have been remiss of me to not have seen these two reveals :

98. In the Heat of the Night - Got this on Criterion and watched it again not too long back (about a year or so) - I wonder if anyone else wants to punch the air with delight when Police chief Bill Gillespie (Rod Steiger) and his deputies discover that the man they've accused of murder, racially profiled and insulted, Virgil Tibbs (Sidney Poitier) is a big-shot top homicide detective from Philadelphia. Talk about egg on your face! One of my favourite moments in movie history - but just because Tibbs is who he is doesn't mean he'll have an easy time of it in a town where racism is as natural as breakfast, lunch and dinner. He's ordered by his superior to help investigate the murder, and tries to do his job while constantly under threat from just about everyone. Poitier and Steiger are phenomenal - the friction and heat creating sparks that could blow a powder keg. 1970 sequel They Call Me Mister Tibbs! feels more like a TV pilot than feature film, and has been rightly forgotten (I think there was another one as well.) The first Best Picture winner on the Countdown (I wonder how many there will be.) No votes from me.

97. The Manchurian Candidate - I saw this quite a long time ago, so it isn't fresh in my memory. A tense, sweaty thriller that plays on the Cold War paranoia which was at it's absolute height at the time. Fear of Commies exerting mind control was running rampant, and this film gave literal voice to those concerns. Needs a rewatch for sure - I'll count it as seen, but when I watch it again it'll almost be like I'm seeing it for the first time.

Seen : 2/4
Heard of : 3/4

Thief - you are one extraordinarily hard working countdown host

ApexPredator 03-07-24 08:37 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Haven't seen Eddie Coyle or American Friend. I have seen Manchurian Candidate and In the Heat of the Night. Probably due for a re-watch on both...neither made the list.

Kill Me Again was my #25. The chemistry between Val Kilmer and then wife Joanne Whalley was off the charts. The twisty storyline which involves a game of who's crossing who between Jack (Kilmer), Fay (Whalley) and Vince (Michael Madsen) was another highlight.

My List:

25. Kill Me Again (1989)

Thief 03-07-24 08:53 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I have a lot of stuff going on today, so I will probably post my reveals very "early" (as in the next 20 minutes) or very "late" (as in the late afternoon). Stay tuned!

Thief 03-07-24 09:06 AM

2lists37points
The Talented Mr. Ripley
Director

Anthony Minghella, 1999

Starring

Matt Damon, Jude Law, Gwyneth Paltrow, Cate Blanchett

Thief 03-07-24 09:06 AM

3lists38points
Shallow Grave
Director

Danny Boyle, 1994

Starring

Kerry Fox, Christopher Eccleston, Ewan McGregor, Ken Stott

Thief 03-07-24 09:07 AM

TRAILERS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4e-Si4oGEw

The Talented Mr. Ripley - In late 1950s New York, a young con artist named Tom Ripley is sent to Italy to convince spoiled millionaire playboy Dickie Greenleaf to return home. But when the errand fails, Ripley takes extreme measures.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKrfUAho5as

Shallow Grave - Three flatmates in Edinburgh set off a chain of events after finding out their mysterious new flatmate dead in his room, with a bag full of money.

Thief 03-07-24 09:09 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I remember liking The Talented Mr. Ripley, but the truth is I haven't seen it since it came out. Should probably revisit it. Shallow Grave I saw for the Neo-noir Hall of Fame and I really liked it (read my review here). Didn't include it in my ballot, though.

Allaby 03-07-24 09:33 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I've seen and liked The Talented Mr. Ripley, but it didn't make my ballot. I haven't seen Shallow Grave.

Seen: 5/6

seanc 03-07-24 09:55 AM

I think Ripley started my love for PSH. I have seen it quite a few times but it had been a while now. Great Damon performance and the movie looks fantastic. I really love it but didn’t even think about it for my list. Which is weird actually, because I already voted for a Ripley tale that showed which I saw on tons of lists around the interwebs.

Shallow Grave is my first blind spot to show. I like Boyle fine, but just have never been in a hurry for it. Maybe this will give me a little push.

honeykid 03-07-24 10:35 AM

Well this is just annoyiing. I looked at both of yesterdays entries and couldn't see Neo Noir on either of them. I didn't have a complete list so I'd have definitely put both on. Especially The Manchurian Candidate as it might still be top 100 for me. :mad:

Not seen either of #100 or #99. Neither really look like I'd like them. Sometimes I think about The American Friend, but never actually watch it.

Shallow Grave is OK, but i was very underwhelmed by it. Maybe I was expecting too much? It was Boyle's breakthough here and quite popular. Mr Ripley I just never got around to and now Law and Paltrow put me off. :D I did record it about a month ago but deleted it a few days later as I just knew I wasn't going to get round to it.

Miss Vicky 03-07-24 10:59 AM

I blind bought The Talented Mr. Ripley on VHS ages ago, but I don't think I ever actually watched it.

I watched Shallow Grave for the 15th MoFo Hall of Fame and - according to my write up - I liked it, but I don't remember it at all and didn't vote for it.

Originally Posted by Miss Vicky (Post 1868450)
http://www.angelfire.com/music6/walt...allowgrave.gif

Shallow Grave (Danny Boyle, 1994)
Imdb

Date Watched: 02/15/18
Cinema or Home: Home
Reason For Watching:15th Hall of Fame, nominated by @edarsenal
Rewatch: No.


Well that was a good bit of morbid, violent fun.

I went into this movie knowing absolutely nothing about it. I think the only other Danny Boyle films I’ve see were 28 Days Later, which I barely remember at all having seen it only once many years ago, and The Beach, which I have mixed feelings about. But right away I was drawn in. The film’s main trio of characters are a**holes – and we learn this from the very start. They take pleasure in tormenting others for their own amusement and we never really see a redeeming side to any of them nor do we ever learn much about them as people.

And yet, their journey from a relatively carefree existence, to one of paranoia, fear, deceit and violence is a really fascinating watch. As they began to turn on each other I found myself a bit conflicted as to which a**hole – if any – I wanted to see walk away with the prize and ultimately I was happy with the outcome.

But, aside from an entertaining story, there’s not a whole lot to say about this one as I really didn’t notice anything else. I suppose the cinematography and score worked well enough; I have no complaints about either. The performances were fine, but I don’t feel like these were roles that really demanded much of the people playing them.

All in all a good way to spend 90 minutes, but not anything I would consider particularly memorable.

+

Holden Pike 03-07-24 11:24 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Interesting we already have two of the Tom Ripley movies in the bottom ten. Can Purple Noon be far behind (or is it ahead)?


Thief 03-07-24 12:53 PM

WHAT DID YOU THINK OF... THE TALENTED MR. RIPLEY


Roger Ebert said:

"The movie is an intelligent a thriller as you'll see this year. It is also insidious in the way it leads us to identify with Tom Ripley. He is the protagonist, we see everything through his eyes ... He's a monster, but we want him to get away with it." (read full review here)
Haley Mlotek said:

"Minghella keeps Highsmith’s thriller element, though loses the noir in favor of tortured love: A heist movie in slow motion, Ripley’s motives reveal themselves in the moment. But he comes to the melodrama genre honestly, with much coded commentary on unspoken assumptions." (read full review here)
@Gideon58 said:

"Minghella's intelligent screenplay is matched by his crisp and detailed direction that always raises questions for me every time I have watched this film, but the brilliant performances by Matt Damon and Jude Law, who received a Best Supporting Actor nomination are a primary selling point as well." (read full review here)

Thief 03-07-24 12:54 PM

WHAT DID YOU THINK OF... SHALLOW GRAVE

https://i.imgur.com/der44Mq.jpg
RT – 71%, IMDb – 7.3

Roger Ebert said:

"All of the materials are in place for a film that might have pleased [George] Orwell. But somehow they never come together. One of the problems, I think, is that all three conspirators are so unpleasant. Not evil - that would be fine, in material like this - but simply obnoxious in a boring way." (read full review here)
Mark Cunliffe said:

"It’s a dark yet deeply witty almost neo noir concerning three Edinburgh flatmates ... who are seeking a fourth flatmate at the start of the film ... Maybe it shouldn’t have worked so well, but it did. And it gets better with each viewing " (read full review here)
@Holden Pike said:

"Like many wonderful movies it defies easy classification, but the deceit, betrayals, and darkness qualify it enough as a Neo Noir in my book. Whatever one calls it, the ride is a fun one." (read full review here)

Holden Pike 03-07-24 12:59 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Shallow Grave was one of my picks.



In 1994 everybody was impressed with Tarantino’s Pulp Fiction and Luc Besson’s Léon, and rightly so. But there were two other crime movies, both directorial debuts, that I liked as much if not more. One was Boaz Yakin’s Fresh and the other was Danny Boyle’s Shallow Grave. Not even knowing it is a crime film is probably the best way to see it the first time, watching three smartass, gloriously smug roommates comically torturing prospective boarders for sport. But once there is a dead body and a suitcase full of cash, things take a turn. And then keep turning. The Treasure of the Sierra Madre-like lust for the cash brings out the worst in our three friends, some of them more quickly than others. Darkly comic touches plus some masterful suspense scenes had Shallow Grave favorably labeled Hitchcockian, and while most modern thrillers that get the tag fail to live up to it, for me Danny Boyle and company deliver in spades. And shovels.



In Noir terms their fates are sealed the moment they decide to keep the money, because like all Noir protagonists they foolishly believe they can outwit and outrun the trouble and encroaching darkness that comes with a bag full of loot one did not earn. I had Shallow Grave at number fifteen on my ballot, good for eleven of its thirty-eight points. Favorite quote: “You didn’t tell me this was for children. I hate children. I’d raise money to have the little fu*kers put down. I want my money back!”

HOLDEN'S BALLOT
15. Shallow Grave (#95)
25. Johnny Handsome (DNP)

Thief 03-07-24 01:01 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Even though it's linked on Holden's review above, our recent and fresh Neo-noir Hall of Fame thread is worth a visit where you can check out a bunch of thoughts and reviews on the film from some of us.

mrblond 03-07-24 01:10 PM

1 Attachment(s)
#96. The Talented Mr. Ripley (1999)

I've not considered this for the ballot only because of the great competition in the scope.
Saw it in the theatre when it came out and several more times since then (last time couple of months ago). That's a very watchable movie. Superb story and superb screenplay, amazing filming locations... but most of all, what a cast! Six stars of then emerging new generation (Jude Law, Damon, Paltrow, Blanchett, Hoffman, Jack Davenport), supported by James Rebhorn and Philip Baker Hall, Wow!
I've expected it a bit higher in this list. Anyway, I'm glad that the two voters regarded it high on their ballots.

Yeah, a monumental film for the generation of those days.
-
87/100

John-Connor 03-07-24 01:10 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Saw The Talented Mr. Ripley in the theater when it came out and loved it. *cough, Psychological Thriller, *cough.

I won’t go all Siddon on this film, so I’ll only say there are a couple of 1-pointers I deem way more worthy of top hundred placement than Shallow Grave.


^ (Christopher (not) Walken :p )

Things to Do in Denver When You're Dead is dope and was in consideration for my list briefly. Great cast, Garcia and especially Walken really killed it. It has a sort of Pulp Fiction vibe to it (like a lot of films from the mid to late 90’s) which took away a bit from the noir vibe for me, so I ultimately didn’t vote for it.

Citizen Rules 03-07-24 01:26 PM

Seen both of today's reveals. I liked The Talented Mr Ripley, but don't remember it well. In fact I don't remembering watching it, but I found an old post here that said I liked it, so I guess I did!

I didn't care much for Shallow Grave and seen it in the 15th HoF. Here's an excerpt of what I wrote.

I have to say the first 18 minutes were a drag...yes, I timed it. I quickly grew tired of the trendy, aka trying way to hard to be hip, film making vibe that those first 18 minutes gave off. I don't know if I was suppose to find the interviews of the prospective roommates funny, but I didn't, grating was more like it. Luckily after 18 minutes the movie settles down and I became interested in the story.

Did they have one nice apartment flat or what? Very cool looking decor, especially the 1950s Electroluxe refrigerator...very cool! It was odd though that the set designer took the nickle chrome finish off the fridge and redone it in gold plating. Then again, thinking about the early 1990s I remember gold plated looking faucets and light fixtures were a big deal then. I always liked nickel chrome better myself. Someone said the film really looks like the early 90s was a long time ago, yup and this film is like a time machine back to big glasses, blow dried hair, long sweaters and bulky computer monitors!

Kerry Fox and Christopher Eccleston were both OK in this. But could Ewan McGregor be anymore annoying? Ugh, just looking at that photo makes me want to slap his smug lil' face.
WARNING: "ending" spoilers below
Which then makes the movie's surprise ending all the more fun!

Wyldesyde19 03-07-24 01:52 PM

Seen both. Both are good, decent films. Didn’t think The Talented Mr Ripley was a Neo noir but it’s been a long time since I’ve seen it.

4/6.*
Good recovery after my 0-2 start.

*will be 5/6 once I watch The American Friend soon.

mrblond 03-07-24 02:58 PM

1 Attachment(s)
...and now, One of the most important films of the 90's for me:

#95. Shallow Grave (1994) got 18 pts from me landing at #8 on my ballot.

I've discovered this by chance in the early 2000's at the local VHS rental place. Seen it couple more times since then.
I'd say, next to Trainspotting, this is the other masterpiece by Danny Boyle. Amazing original story, superb cast - McGregor, Eccleston, Fox, all performed top level acting.
The interior scenes at the artistic apartment of the main characters (basically half of the screen time) are real film art. What a pleasure! I can watch them over and over again.
Alas, seeing it was well discussed during the preliminary period, I've had a hope it will be much higher on the countdown list. After all, nice that there were two more supporters for this film.
++
94/100

-----

My Ballot

...
8. Shallow Grave (1994) [#95]
...


-----

My Near Misses:

The Ninth Gate (1999)
The Talented Mr. Ripley (1999)

Thief 03-07-24 04:52 PM

AWARDS?


The Talented Mr. Ripley received a ton of nominations for numerous awards, but some of its most notable noms and wins were:
  • Five (5) Academy Award nominations, including Best Supporting Actor (Jude Law) and Best Adapted Screenplay (Anthony Minghella)
  • Seven (7) BAFTA nominations, winning Best Supporting Actor (Jude Law)
  • Five (5) Golden Globe nominations, including Best Drama Picture, Best Director (Minghella) and Best Performances (Matt Damon and Law)
  • Seven (7) Satellite Award nominations
  • Four (4) Blockbuster Entertainment Award nominations, including one win (Jude Law)
  • Three (3) National Board of Review Awards, including Best Director (Minghella) and Best Supporting Actor (Philip Seymour Hoffman)

Thief 03-07-24 04:52 PM

AWARDS?


Shallow Grave received the following awards and nominations:
  • BAFTA Award for Best British Film
  • Cognac Festival du Film Policier Grand Prix and Audience Award
  • Empire Award for Best British Film, Best Director (Danny Boyle), and Best British Actor (Ewan McGregor)
  • Angers European First Film Festival Award for Best Screenplay (Boyle) and Feature Film

CosmicRunaway 03-07-24 05:14 PM

I've seen both of today's reveals, but voted for neither. I originally quite liked Shallow Grave, but when I rewatched it for the 15th HoF, it dragged a little more than I had originally remembered and I haven't revisited it since. I didn't immediately consider it for my shortlist, but when I saw it was nominated for the Neo-noir HoF, I quickly added it in... though it didn't survive the first round of cuts.

The Talented Mr. Ripley is a film I kept catching various parts of on tv for years, without ever seeing it from start to finish. I eventually did sit down and watch the entire thing, though it was so long ago now that I don't recall many of the details. It didn't come to my mind at all when I was making my list, though if I had my time back I definitely would've added it to my rewatch list.

From yesterday's reveals, I only saw one of the films. I know I've seen both the older and newer versions of The Manchurian Candidate, though please don't ask any follow-up questions regarding either film, because that's about all I do remember haha.

Seen:
3/6

My List:
25. The Chaser (2008) - DNP 1-pointer

cricket 03-07-24 06:36 PM

I very much like The Talented Mr. Ripley and In the Heat of the Night, and I believe the latter may have squeezed onto my 60's ballot.

Only seen The Manchurian Candidate once, and it was solid but didn't leave a big impression. I owe it another watch.

Seen Shallow Grave twice and I don't care for it.

There's already been multiple films that never had a chance at my ballot because I don't personally view them as noir, and I'm sure there will be many more. It's probably not worth mentioning again unless a big time favorite shows up.

Kaplan 03-07-24 07:20 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I absolutely loved The Talented Mr. Ripley, enough that it prompted me to look up the book. And lucky for me the success of the movie brought about a revival of Patricia Highsmith’s work. I have since read all five of the Ripley books three times each, and all her other novels at least twice. So yeah, I became a big fan. I, however, never thought to include it on my list, which is funny because I did not forget about the other adaptation of the novel, which should also show up on the countdown, making for three Ripley movies in the top 100.

SpelingError 03-07-24 08:03 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I haven't seen either film.

beelzebubble 03-07-24 08:20 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I liked Shallow Grave especially the scene where they are interviewing roommates. But it is not on my list.


But TA DAAAA!

11. The Talented Mr. Ripley (1999)
is on my list. This is a favorite of mine. The cast is fabulous. Lovely supporting role by Cate Blanchett and great supporting role by Phillip Seymour Hoffman. Jude Law is so beautiful. It just kills me how good looking he is. Damon quietly holds it all together. Isn't this by the director of The English Patient? I have seen this movie many times and I have it to thank for introducing me to Chet Baker.

GulfportDoc 03-07-24 08:32 PM

Originally Posted by Thief (Post 2444001)
...
Shallow Grave - Three flatmates in Edinburgh set off a chain of events after finding out their mysterious new flatmate dead in his room, with a bag full of money.
Some commentary:
Shallow Grave(1994)

Being a black comedy, the film has neither the mood nor the look of a noir. But it does contain a familiar noir trope: a person or persons are enticed by something that they know is wrong or illegal, but they do it anyway, and in the end suffer the consequences.

A trio of flatmates in Edinburgh are looking for an additional boarder to help with the rent. After auditioning several who didn’t fit the bill they finally accept a good candidate. But soon the new tenant dies of a drug overdose, after which the others discover a suitcase full of money left by the deceased. Following some deliberation they decide to dispose of the body in grisly fashion and keep the money. But presently they are shocked to realize that two criminals, having some relationship to the origin of the cash, are viciously in the hunt for the money filled suitcase. How those criminals discover the flatmates, along with the interaction of the trio of renters forms the rest of the action.

The chief feature of the production is the fine acting by a young Ewan McGregor, along with Christopher Eccelston and Kerry Fox. The quirky but uneven screenplay was from John Hodge (Trainspotting), directed by Danny Boyle (Slumdog Millionaire). Based on the look of the film and its offbeat nature the producers were likely inspired by the Coen Brothers.

Harry Lime 03-07-24 09:10 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Both are decent films but I never really cared for either beyond that. Don't have much else to say there so carry on.

Siddon 03-07-24 09:16 PM

Shallow Grave isn't bad on the first watch....but it's rough to revisit that one. It's very 90's and if it wasn't done by an Oscar winner I think it would be forgotten.


Talented Mr Ripley is the best adaptation of the story but still not for me.

Thief 03-07-24 09:36 PM

Originally Posted by GulfportDoc (Post 2444136)
Some commentary:
Shallow Grave(1994)

Being a black comedy, the film has neither the mood nor the look of a noir. But it does contain a familiar noir trope: a person or persons are enticed by something that they know is wrong or illegal, but they do it anyway, and in the end suffer the consequences.
I agree it's probably in the outer rims of neo-noir, but I do think it has more noir elements to it than just that. You have three leads whose morals are questionable (to put it mildly), there is the element of paranoia in one of them, betrayal among all of them, a pessimistic feel to it, a bleak ending, the lighting is very striking, especially during the digging/burying scenes.

https://filmobsessive.com/wp-content...esite-shot.jpg

I think the fact that it leans more towards dark comedy is what keeps it in those outer rims.

PHOENIX74 03-07-24 11:05 PM

Another two films I think are quite good - neither made my ballot :

96. The Talented Mr. Ripley - What I like most about The Talented Mr. Ripley is the fact that although Tom Ripley (Matt Damon) was born to be a con-man, megalomaniac and liar, he's just starting out in this film and is often moved to panic. His frantic attempts at covering up crimes and finding the right lie when put on the spot makes the film so tense and exciting. He kills on the spur of the moment, and is often called out for not being the high society person he so desperately wants to be. Matt Damon, Gwyneth Paltrow, Jude Law and Cate Blanchett shine - all four performers in their prime and young. The last time I watched it I noted that I "Loved Jude Law, who I'm enjoying more and more these days, and I miss Philip Seymour Hoffman very much. I have some sympathy for Tom Ripley - it's easy to forget he's a murderer, for his crimes come at the expense of a wealthy elite who hardly deserve the advantages they have." Good inclusion - I can't tell if it's neo-noir or not, but I'm sure that will be tossed about here.

95. Shallow Grave - Saw this back when it came out, and probably one other time before catching up with it on the neo-noir Hall of Fame a little while ago. It's one of those films that starts with a really light tone which gets progressively darker and darker until it's three characters are basically in hell and trying to kill each other. A word of mouth movie that kind of helped to usher in the period of British crime/gangster films the likes of Guy Ritchie would make - one of those "what would you do if you found a suitcase full of cash" movies like A Simple Plan (we could perhaps see that film here later.) I like it's energetic score, fast pace and eccentric characters who are pretty much horrible people from the moment we meet them belittling potential flat-mates. Just so you know - they had it coming. Very good British crime film.

Seen : 4/6
Heard of : 5/6

John W Constantine 03-07-24 11:32 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Talented Mr. Ripley is a slow burn, almost overly meticulous tale, but like other films with these qualities that ultimately win me over, in the end it has something that resonates with me and keeps me thinking about it. Not easy to sit through but worth the ride.

Need to see Shallow Grave as like Boyle's work well enough.

Iroquois 03-08-24 01:04 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
no votes. mostly think these are good, but didn't care for talented mr. ripley.

CosmicRunaway 03-08-24 04:58 AM

Originally Posted by cricket (Post 2444113)
There's already been multiple films that never had a chance at my ballot because I don't personally view them as noir, and I'm sure there will be many more.
While I can see that happening for me as well, I also have a feeling that there's going to be a few films on the Countdown that I would have voted for had I thought about them when making my shortlist. Films I wouldn't immediately say are neo-noir myself, but once I see them come up and think about them a little harder, the justification is there. And I'm looking forward to discovering what those films are going to be.

Thief 03-08-24 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by cricket (Post 2444113)
There's already been multiple films that never had a chance at my ballot because I don't personally view them as noir, and I'm sure there will be many more. It's probably not worth mentioning again unless a big time favorite shows up.
It's such a vaguely defined style that it was unavoidable, I guess. And I suppose that has been the biggest challenge for everyone. For the hosts, in terms of setting up boundaries and eligibility requirements, and for everybody, in terms of selecting from such a vaguely defined pool of films.

I mentioned it before, but for what it's worth, part of what I'm trying to include in the mini-reviews I'm linking, are articles and reviews of people that saw each film as neo-noir and their reasonings for it. So I suppose it's a way to try to put ourselves in their perspective and see what they saw.

Sedai 03-08-24 10:35 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I've seen both of the two latest entries. Never considered Ripley for my ballot, but Shallow Grave was on and off my ballot a couple of times as I finalized it, but ultimately didn't make the cut. If I had re-watched it recently, it probably would have made it.

4/6 seen so far.

Thief 03-08-24 10:51 AM

3lists38points
Purple Noon
Director

René Clément, 1960

Starring

Alain Delon, Marie Laforêt, Maurice Ronet, Erno Crisa

Thief 03-08-24 10:52 AM

2lists39points
The Hustler
Director

Robert Rossen, 1961

Starring

Paul Newman, Jackie Gleason, Piper Laurie, George C. Scott

Thief 03-08-24 10:52 AM

TRAILERS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hdQZXUOHGMs

Purple Noon - In late 1950s San Francisco, a young con artist named Tom Ripley is sent to Italy to convince spoiled millionaire playboy Philippe Greenleaf to return home. But when the errand fails, Ripley takes extreme measures.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KND8JCBtkbY

The Hustler - The story of small-time, up-and-coming pool hustler "Fast Eddie" Felson, as he challenges a legendary, long-time champion in a high stakes game.

Thief 03-08-24 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by Holden Pike (Post 2444020)
Interesting we already have two of the Tom Ripley movies in the bottom ten. Can Purple Noon be far behind (or is it ahead)?

What are the odds, man??? What are the odds??? :laugh:

Allaby 03-08-24 10:54 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Seen both and liked them, but neither made my ballot. Both are very good films, but not personal favourites. I rated both of them an 8/10.

Seen: 7/8

Holden Pike 03-08-24 11:07 AM

1 Attachment(s)


The Hustler was #26 on the MoFo Top 100 of the 1960s.

seanc 03-08-24 11:16 AM

Two four star movies for me. I owe Purple Noon another watch. The Hustler will be on my sports list when it comes, but not ahead of Color Of Money.

mrblond 03-08-24 11:20 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Three Ripley movies in a row at the bottom of the list. What does it mean?
1. It means that only a very limited number of users have a high appreciation of this story.
2. It means that only a very limited number of users are familiar with it.
3. Most of the users don't see it as noir.
:tsk:

Miss Vicky 03-08-24 11:21 AM

I've seen both, but voted for neither.

I watched Plein Soleil for the 5th MoFo Hall of Fame in 2015. I did actually consider it while making my ballot, but ultimately didn't put it on my shortlist. I vaguely recalled liking it, but the only specific thing I remembered liking about it was how good Alain Delon looked and I decided that wasn't enough for a vote. Had I rewatched it prior to voting, things might be different. I tried digging around the 5th HOF thread for my write-up, but couldn't find it for whatever reason.

I watched The Hustler for the 7th HOF, but I didn't like it, so never considered it.

Holden Pike 03-08-24 11:24 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Originally Posted by Thief (Post 2444249)
What are the odds, man??? What are the odds??? :laugh:
So three MoFos voted for The American Friend, two voted for The Talented Mr. Ripley, and three voted for Purple Noon. Out of curiosity, was there any overlap? Did some MoFo vote for two or even all three of the major Tom Ripley adaptations, or did eight separate voters somehow land these flicks at #100, #96, and #94 and almost exactly and evenly split the support?

Thief 03-08-24 11:29 AM

WHAT DID YOU THINK OF... PURPLE NOON


Roger Ebert said:

"The best thing about the film is the way the plot devises a way for Ripley to create a perfect cover-up, a substitution of bodies (for which a second corpse comes in handy). Ripley's meticulous timing, quick thinking and brilliant invention snatch victory out of the hands of danger." (read full review here)
Brice Ezell said:

"The success of Purple Noon is that underneath a beautiful film lies a film noir. Director René Clément, much like Delon’s Ripley, turns on the 'full sun' of the title to obscure the things going on under the surface. Instead of the shadow-painted alleways of the noir, Clément films the confidence game of Ripley in its inverse: scalding daylight. Visually, Purple Noon may be an 'anti-noir', but in every other way it lives up to the noir genre’s tropes: it turns sunlight into shadow, the obvious into the unknown." (read full review here)
@Takoma11 said:

"I think that Delon does a better job of capturing the character of Tom Ripley from the books, namely the way that he is very seductive and magnetic, but then can turn on a dime when threatened. Purple Noon is a really good film and well worth seeing." (read full review here)

Thief 03-08-24 11:29 AM

WHAT DID YOU THINK OF... THE HUSTLER


Roger Ebert said:

"The Hustler is one of those films where scenes have such psychic weight that they grow in our memories." (read full review here)
Andrew Davies said:

"Stylistically, The Hustler is positioned where film noir and neo-realism meet. Eugen Scufftan's Oscar winning cinematography envelops us in the smoky atmosphere of pool halls, where night can lead in to day without notice." (read full review here)
@Citizen Rules said:

"The Hustler is like a classic Greek tragedy where the protagonist rise to glory only to be destroyed by their own character flaws. It's a study of two very dysfunctional people, with pool as the driving force that causes their flaws to come into play." (read full review here)

Thief 03-08-24 11:33 AM

Originally Posted by Holden Pike (Post 2444258)
So three MoFos voted for The American Friend, two voted for The Talented Mr. Ripley, and three voted for Purple Noon. Out of curiosity, was there any overlap? Did some MoFo vote for two or even all three of the major Tom Ripley adaptations, or did eight separate voters somehow land these flicks at #100, #96, and #94 and almost exactly evenly splitting the support?
There was just one overlap in voters between two of the three films.

Thief 03-08-24 11:35 AM

Originally Posted by mrblond (Post 2444256)
Three Ripley movies in a row at the bottom of the list. What does it mean?
1. It means that only a very limited number of users have a high appreciation of this story.
2. It means that only a very limited number of users are familiar with it.
3. Most of the users don't see it as noir.
:tsk:
Those are interesting questions. I think it's a mixture of 2 and 3, but mostly 2. Personally, I've only seen The Talented Mr. Ripley, and it's been a very long time since.

Thief 03-08-24 11:37 AM

Anyway, these are two that I haven't seen, although I've had The Hustler in my radar for a long time. This is where I'm at so far...

SEEN: 4/8
MY BALLOT: 0/25

Citizen Rules 03-08-24 11:41 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Yahoo! Finally one from my ballot!:) I had The Hustler as my #3 choice. Love that movie, especially the relationship dynamic between Paul Newman and Piper Laurie...I rated it 5/5.

My MoFo review:

The Hustler (1961)

Fast Eddie (Paul Newman) is a two-bit pool hustler who's a real wiz at the game but his self destructive narcissistic streak keeps him from being the champ. He takes on the legendary "Minnesota Fats" in an all night, high stakes pool game. A game which takes more than shooting skills to win. Fast Eddie also meets Sarah (Piper Laura) setting alone in a train station. Laure is a girl with low self esteem and a lame leg, she uses sex as an escape. The two strike up a relationship based on booze and self destructive behaviors.


The Hustler
is like a classic Greek tragedy where the protagonist rise to glory only to be destroyed by their own character flaws.
It's a study of two very dysfunctional people, with pool as the driving force that causes their flaws to come into play.

Fast Eddie is not likeable, he's not suppose to be. He has an inflated sense of his own importance, a deep need for admiration and a lack of empathy for others. But behind this mask of ultra confidence lies a fragile self-esteem that's vulnerable to the slightest criticism.

Sarah is a manic depressive, she's more sad than likable. Drowning her self pity in alcohol and in sex with strangers. She's the enabler that keeps Fast Eddie going. She makes the mistake of tying herself to Eddie, as if he was an anchor that would keep her stable. But Eddie has no empathy for her, his only need is to be important at any cost. The Hustler shows us a very real and very dysfunctional relationship.

Jackie Gleason is Minnesota Fats, and owns the role. Gleason was known for doing outlandish physical comedy on The Honeymooners. Here he keeps his body movements to a minimum and with just a slight nod of his head or a raised eyebrow he can convey more than most actors can do with their whole bodies.

Gerorge C. Scott is the cold, conniving financier of the illicit pool games. He's one of those truly slimy bad guys you love to hate. He's good at being bad and being believable while doing it.

In the pool scenes many of the camera angles were done low, looking up at the players. A few shots were done from a high angle, like is done in televised pool tournaments. Both added a tension to the pool scenes. Maybe most impressive is that all those pool halls are real. They actually shot in the pool halls in New York. This gave this hard hitting story a grimy reality that matches the dark reality of the characters plights.


Thief 03-08-24 11:47 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
For those interested, I just edited the second post of the thread with the full list so far. Thanks to @Miss Vicky for slapping me on the back of the head to remind me!

Thursday Next 03-08-24 01:49 PM

I had Purple Noon at #4 (and The American Friend was my #5). I didn't have The Talented Mr Ripley, though, which is the same story as Purple Noon but with Matt Damon instead of Alain Delon (a poor substitute).


Not only is Tom Ripley a fascinating character, Purple Noon and The American Friend are both really well shot, interesting films.

Harry Lime 03-08-24 02:07 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Holden's a witch!

https://img.gifglobe.com/grabs/monty...UdzJEiwfue.gif

Or I guess he's a warlock!


I've never actually seen Purple Noon. One of those movies that has been on my watchlist forever but never gotten to it yet. The Hustler is a good film but I don't love it.

Holden Pike 03-08-24 02:29 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
I hope all seven of you Ripley voters are stoked for the upcoming Netflix series starring "The Hot Priest" himself, Andrew Scott. Love that Steven Zaillian (Searching for Bobby Fischer, "The Night Of...") was able to shoot in black & white, lensed by Oscar-winning cinematographer Robert Elswit (There Will Be Blood, Nightcrawler, Good Night and Good Luck). I mean, we don't really need another adaptation of this story, but there are certainly top-flight people involved in front of and behind the camera. We'll see if the longer format of a series allows further shading or simply feels like it is dragging things out?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ri2biYLeaI

rauldc14 03-08-24 02:47 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Seen both!

The Hustler is the one I prefer of the two, but I didn't vote for either of them.

WHITBISSELL! 03-08-24 02:54 PM

I'm certainly having better luck with these one pointers than I did with the Noir ones. I had only watched two of those.

Affliction
The Chaser
Johnny Handsome
The Little Things
The Ninth Gate
Pulp
Reindeer Games
Things to Do in Denver When You're Dead

WHITBISSELL! 03-08-24 03:01 PM

Doing better with these too. Only had one (Mystery Street) so far in the Noir countdown.

The Friends of Eddie Coyle
In the Heat of the Night (my #4 pick)
The Manchurian Candidate
The Hustler

mrblond 03-08-24 03:12 PM

1 Attachment(s)
What two days in this countdown...

#94. Plein soleil [Purple Noon] (1960) is my #14 for 12 pts from me.

Beautiful early-colour cinematography featuring Alain Delon and Maurice Ronet, in the great story directed by René Clément. What more needs one who loves the art of cinema...

Interesting enough, Although I've been non-stop into most of the Delon's stuff since my childhood, it was the film of 1999 which presented the character of Tom Ripley to me. After that, it was the version with Malkovich and finally, I've reached to this one in the late 2000's.

+
92/100

-----

My Ballot

...
8. Shallow Grave (1994) [#95]
...
14. Purple Noon (1960) [#94]
...


-----

My Near Misses:

The Ninth Gate (1999) [one-pointers]
The Talented Mr. Ripley (1999) [#96]

Kaplan 03-08-24 05:02 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Purple Noon I had at #22. The first time Patricia Highsmith saw Alain Delon she thought he was the perfect Tom Ripley, and he pretty much was. But Matt Damon's performance was exceptional too, while Dennis Hopper's was quite bizarre, but I don't mind it as a different kind of take. I'm pleased to see all three of these show up, even at their low spots.

Sedai 03-08-24 05:43 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
5/8 seen for me.

Still no votes!

Frightened Inmate No. 2 03-08-24 05:59 PM

i love the hustler but it didn’t cross my mind as neo-noir while i was making my list. it would’ve been #8 if it had. purple noon also slipped my mind but had i thought of it, it likely would’ve missed out by a few spots. still very good.

i watched both shallow grave and the talented mr. ripley this december just a week apart. both good movies, although i preferred the former.

SpelingError 03-08-24 08:35 PM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
Both Purple Noon and The Hustler are really good, but they didn't make my ballot.

GulfportDoc 03-08-24 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by Citizen Rules (Post 2444267)
Yahoo! Finally one from my ballot!:) I had The Hustler as my #3 choice. Love that movie, especially the relationship dynamic between Paul Newman and Piper Laurie...I rated it 5/5.

My MoFo review:

The Hustler (1961)

Fast Eddie (Paul Newman) is a two-bit pool hustler who's a real wiz at the game but his self destructive narcissistic streak keeps him from being the champ. He takes on the legendary "Minnesota Fats" in an all night, high stakes pool game. A game which takes more than shooting skills to win. Fast Eddie also meets Sarah (Piper Laura) setting alone in a train station. Laure is a girl with low self esteem and a lame leg, she uses sex as an escape. The two strike up a relationship based on booze and self destructive behaviors.

The Hustler is like a classic Greek tragedy where the protagonist rise to glory only to be destroyed by their own character flaws. It's a study of two very dysfunctional people, with pool as the driving force that causes their flaws to come into play.

Fast Eddie is not likeable, he's not suppose to be. He has an inflated sense of his own importance, a deep need for admiration and a lack of empathy for others. But behind this mask of ultra confidence lies a fragile self-esteem that's vulnerable to the slightest criticism.

Sarah is a manic depressive, she's more sad than likable. Drowning her self pity in alcohol and in sex with strangers. She's the enabler that keeps Fast Eddie going. She makes the mistake of tying herself to Eddie, as if he was an anchor that would keep her stable. But Eddie has no empathy for her, his only need is to be important at any cost. The Hustler shows us a very real and very dysfunctional relationship.

Jackie Gleason is Minnesota Fats, and owns the role. Gleason was known for doing outlandish physical comedy on The Honeymooners. Here he keeps his body movements to a minimum and with just a slight nod of his head or a raised eyebrow he can convey more than most actors can do with their whole bodies.

Gerorge C. Scott is the cold, conniving financier of the illicit pool games. He's one of those truly slimy bad guys you love to hate. He's good at being bad and being believable while doing it.

In the pool scenes many of the camera angles were done low, looking up at the players. A few shots were done from a high angle, like is done in televised pool tournaments. Both added a tension to the pool scenes. Maybe most impressive is that all those pool halls are real. They actually shot in the pool halls in New York. This gave this hard hitting story a grimy reality that matches the dark reality of the characters plights.

Great review, CR. I don't believe The Hustler to be a noir, but it's in my personal favorite top 10 movies of all time. Here's a review from years back:
The Hustler (1961)

The Hustler was a life changing film for me. As an impressionable 17-year-old who fancied himself a budding pool hustler, I first saw the film upon its release in 1961. The effect that the experience had on me was monumental, and it's still possible to recall a shadow feel of it's emotional impact.

It's subject matter was unusual for its day, and was a seminal film in many ways. There had been movies about golfers, baseball players, tennis players, etc.; but never a film about a seedy pool hustler. The public was not even aware that this type of activity existed. It was based on the 1959 book of the same name by Walter Tevis, himself a pool devotee. The excellent screenplay by Sidney Carroll was fairly faithful to the novel, with a major exception regarding the denouement of Fast Eddie's girlfriend, Sarah. There was fine direction by Robert Rosen who was also a frequent customer of the New York pool rooms, and was aware of Gleason's above average abilities with the pool cue. Rosen was able to guide the production into a sense of authenticity.


The acting couldn't have been any better. It's as if everyone was born to play their respective parts. George C. Scott carried on his cut-throat, abrasive, dominant character acting that was introduced two years earlier in
Anatomy of a Murder. Piper Laurie was perfect as the crippled alcoholic intellectual who was trying to find herself. Jackie Gleason fit his role perfectly with class and style. Paul Newman stated that he had over-acted his part, and in hindsight would have liked to tone it down a little. But that type of performance is always appreciated and remembered by the public.


Newman established himself as an expert at playing handsome, devilish rogues, which he was to hone in many more pictures, most notably Hud, Harper, Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, and The Sting.

The film score by Kenyon Hopkins written in the jazz idiom was tasteful, but exciting. Few scores --another similarity to
Anatomy of a Murder-- had used jazz exclusively up to that time, and here it was a perfect match. I can still hear the strummed major 9th chord underlying the ending of the film.

The movie seemed so real and so familiar. I fell in love with Sarah, and to this day am a fan of Piper Laurie's. I spent several years looking for a girl like Sarah, but to be honest, when I finally found one, it didn't play out too well. I even traveled to Ames' Pool Room in NYC on 46th St. west of Broadway. I got into a game of rotation with the off duty cook for $2 a pop, and he almost busted me. Had enough jack left for one more trip to Geenwich Village, then onto a Trailways outta town.

A word about the subject matter. Its pool/hustling portions were very authentic because several involved in the production had real life experience with gambling and pool. However the character "Minnesota Fats", along with all the other characters,
was pure fiction, as attested by Walter Tevis. Shortly after the movie came out, Rudolph Wanderone, aka New York Fats, was given a suggestion by Paulie Jansco (of the Johnston City World's Pocket Billiards tournaments) to go down to the local theater, set up a card table, and represent yourself as the "real" Minnesota Fats. Wanderone was a tremendous self promoter, excellent pool player, story teller, and B.S. artist. He parlayed the hoax into a fortune.

The Hustler was one of a small group of films from the late '50s and early '60s that ushered in a new type of realism-- both in action and in personal relationships. The love interest was complicated but alluring. Eddie didn't realize what he had in him, both emotionally and in his pool playing fortitude. In the end he found out just what those facets were, and became a better man because of it. The book develops those characteristics very well, but Carroll's screenplay pushed the story further, and arguably made a better tale because of it.

Doc's rating: 9/10

GulfportDoc 03-08-24 09:03 PM

Originally Posted by Holden Pike (Post 2444333)
I hope all seven of you Ripley voters are stoked for the upcoming Netflix series starring "The Hot Priest" himself, Andrew Scott. Love that Steven Zaillian (Searching for Bobby Fischer, "The Night Of...") was able to shoot in black & white, lensed by Oscar-winning cinematographer Robert Elswit (There Will Be Blood, Nightcrawler, Good Night and Good Luck). I mean, we don't really need another adaptation of this story, but there are certainly top-flight people involved in front of and behind the camera. We'll see if the longer format of a series allows further shading or simply feels like it is dragging things out?
If the series is as good as the trailer indicates, I'll surely be looking forward to it on April 4th!

PHOENIX74 03-08-24 10:12 PM

94. Purple Noon - Never seen this, but it had immediately made it into my watchlist when Holden mentioned it earlier. I mean, I love Alain Delon and Tom Ripley adaptations so I didn't have to think twice.

93. The Hustler - Great movie. I saw it for the first time not too long ago. At the time I called it a "Very heavy film - raw and honest, like a Tennessee Williams play." Paul Newman's performance is breathtaking, and he's matched by Piper Laurie - it's a very performance-driven film that digs deep into it's protagonist's psyche. Through great pain, main character Eddie Felson grows a little, but at a price - as always. Jackie Gleason and George C. Scott are great to watch as well, especially the latter in an early film for him. I can't fathom some of the pool shots I see in the movie - the players put spin on the ball which can make it travel in the opposite direction to which it's hit. Crazy stuff. The Hustler wasn't on my ballot, but it's more than worthy of making an appearance here.

Seen : 5/8
Heard of : 7/8 (technically)

Iroquois 03-09-24 06:37 AM

Re: The MoFo Top 100 Neo-noir Countdown
 
no votes. purple noon emphatically superior to talented mr. ripley. have been meaning to revisit the hustler.

Little Ash 03-09-24 07:49 AM

Seen both, voted for neither. The Ripley films I've seen, I always keep meaning to revisit because I remember liking them, but they keep falling to the back of the queue.


The Hustler has been a while. Also one I remember liking a lot. Not sure it would have crossed my mind as being noir, but some of that is due to how long ago it was.

cricket 03-09-24 09:02 AM

Both great movies with The Hustler being more of a personal favorite. I did not/would not consider voting for them here.


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