Politics Continued...

Speaks for itself.

[red]Warning[/red]
[red]Strong opinions below[/red]

How I PERCEIVE that Bill Clinton hurt our country:

Bill Clinton, the man who said, 'I loathe the military,' savaged our military. He cut military spending from $303 billion in 1989 to $258 billion in 1999 even as total U.S. spending rose from $1.143 trillion to $2.099 trillion during that same period. Clinton was and remains the Leftist darling for the ages. A liar. A sexual predator. A glib con artist without peer in American politics, and Democrats loved him, defended his every act, enabled his every act.

"The Federalist wrote: 'The real legacy of Bill Clinton was sketched in graphic images yesterday, across the skyline of Manhattan, before the eyes of the entire world. Clinton's DNC Chairman Terry McAuliffe said, "There are no partisans today, only patriots." But, to be sure, the partisans of yesterday have patriot blood on their hands today.'

IMHO Bill Clinton undermined the honor and the dignity of the office of the president. During the Clinton Era I could not look at my son and say "I hope you grow up to be like him".

I don't think I need to tell you I agree. You know what I find amazing? Having a President I respect. It's such a surreal feeling. I'm young enough that Clinton was the only President in office while I was old enough to pay any attention to politics. But now, for the first time (as far as I can remember) in my life, I respect and honor my President. It's a wonderful feeling to WANT to hear him speak and address the nation. It's a new kind of happiness I had never known before.

Mr. Bush is doing such a fantastic job. I am really proud of him and I thank God he was willing to take the job. I truly respect the man. I have been through a number of presidents. I voted for Ronald Reagan (my first vote) who I deeply respected. I voted for Bush Sr. as well. I think it is important to have an honorable captain at the helm... both for the sake of Americans having someone to look up to as well as for the respect of other countries.

Is that to say what Bill Clinton did in office resulted in what happened yesterday? If so, frankly that is a huge crock of ****.

I'm going to say it again, as I've said it many times before. This is no one persons fault. This is not because the US government is a emocratic one. This is because the US is a country that allows its citizens to sin without repent. It has nothing to do with Bill Clinton, and I feel whomever wrote that has extreme tunnel vision.

Chris, I'd still like you to respond to what I said in the Life thread.

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I think it points to the collective responsibility that we all share for letting our guard down. A president is unable to do anything without the support of the people. If we allowed demilitarization to occur then we are responsible for whatever the consequences are. I did not mean to point out that Clinton is solely responsible... only that we all share a responsibility for what happened.

Do you think any amount of military force would have stopped this?? ALL of the US' money could of gone to the military and this would of happened just the same.

I'm getting to it, Peter. You'll have to chill a bit longer...I do have work you know. I had very little to do on the weekend, but now it's come down on me hard. You know me well enough to know there's no way I'm avoiding an argument with you.

Clinton harrassed the CIA constantly...they gather intelligence, which is the kind of work that would've stopped that disaster. So yes, Clinton at least plays a role here.

Lol, your just phearing my 1337 intelamigent posting skillz in my novel!!

Nothing could have stopped this. Thats what terrorism is. Anyone commited enough to their cause that would kill themselves for that cause would ensure whatever they were doing would be carried out.

The CIA would have no idea this was going to happen. They didn't put out any clues on the matter. They didn't give them any hints. Nothing. The CIA is a powerful orginization, but it couldn't of stopped this even if it knew before hand that the US was in danger. Regardless of how much funding they have, it would of happened simply because of the dedicationt these people had to what they were doing. They were willing to give their lives for their cause, nothing was going to stop them.

Not military force but intelligence. Intelligence is paid for out of the same bucket as the military (defense). If we had more "spooks" out there doing what they do then this could not have happened. At one time this country had hundreds of operatives turning over stones, rousting suspects etc.

Unfortunately these were the first people to get whacked in the defense cuts because the perception was that America had no enemies.

I'm sure that some of the billions of dollars that were cut from the defense funds were put into the economy to feed the Clinton legacy of a great and prosperous economy.

Frankly, I'd rather be safe and poor than rich with a target on my back.

I guess thats just one point where we differ.

These same people have been stopped in their tracks many times.

2 years ago they tried to hijack 5 747's and crash them into the oceans. Their plot was discovered and foiled.

Last year they tried to come in through Canada and "cancel" the celebration of the millenium. They were able to infiltrate the celebrations in the middle east and Bush cancelled his appearance at the pyramids in Giza.

I am positive there are many other examples... remember they don't tell us if we don't need to know.

Do you care to name "these same people", how do you know its the same people if the government isn't sure?

But what you said is also part of my point. They are determined. This is their life. They are dedicated and they will do whatever it takes to carry out their will. They may have been stopped before, but they are bound to get away with it at somepoint. And they did. No matter what the funding is, they can't stop them everytime. Which is why I don't see how this is one of Clinton's faults. It was bound to happen at some point, and it did.

It was bound to happen because someone was bound to make a mistake. And yeah, it is sort of the same people. Did you know Bin Laden has tried to assassinate both The Pope and Bill Clinton? The majority of his attacks have failed. Even the attack of September 11th was MUCH smaller than they had planned for. Ditto for the WTC bombing in 1993.

No, they can't stop them everytime, but the FACT remains that one of the very few groups than can stop them, the CIA (it's their job, man...that's one of the reasons they're in existence), was constantly badgered by Clinton. He also cut their funding. That much cannot be denied.

Would it have happened anyway? Who knows. But I wouldn't be comfortable saying it definitely would have. And the fact that they're willing to die for it is irrelevant -- the CIA may have been able to make them die for it somewhere other than in a plane. Just because they're willing to die, it doesn't mean they cannot be stopped.

Rest assured that the government knows for sure. Let's just say for now that I hear things. I will eat P-Lites shorts if we do not hear that it is without a doubt Bin Laden and his group Al Quaida. I will go one step further and bet that I will eat a Samoaza if Iraqi funds are not involved in this.

I will concur that terrorists cannot be stopped at every turn but if we had the proper people in place an event of this magnitude could not have happened.

Just curious... if you are so dead set against it being Bin Laden who do you think it is?

Bin Laden denies it, but he may be TECHNICALLY correct. For all we know he could be saying "Boy, I hope someone knocks those powers down," while at the same time giving money to (seemingly) random terrorists, thus not officially ordering such an attack, but knowing full well what was going on, while aiding those responsible. That's just as bad...I have very little doubt that Bin Laden helped to make it possible.

I'm not set against it being Bin Laden, and I'm sure he had something to do with it, but it wasn't only him. I wouldn't be surprised if he just supplied another oraganization with his funds and resources.