Yet your actual response says otherwise.

You called it "quite insulting." That sounds like some level of offense, to me.

It's based on an ambiguous, vaguely suggestive statement. I wouldn't make an assumption based on it, but I don't think you've been wronged here. It's a pretty straightforward misunderstanding.

I bolded a sentence just to make sure.

@Miss Vicky
@Yoda

The quote above is my second reaction two pages ago.

I think I was being very clear about my intentions concerning the sidenote.
If I would suspect you of having shot a dog, because you tell me that it's a normal reaction to shoot a dog when he's jumping at you, that would be just as ridiculous as your statement.

Do I feel wronged? Absolutely not, although the accusation was completely unjustified, I don't really care, personally. It's not like I was genuinly hurt by that comment or anything. It might have hurt me if it was a friend who was making the accusation.

Why did I point it out? Because it felt like an unnecessary insinuation that came completely out of the blue (in my opinion) and because some other people might find her unsympathetic if she makes that kind of statements a lot.

Do you care? Apparently not. So let's just leave it at that then. :)

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Yes, you said that later. Earlier, you said it was "quite insulting." You keep defending things you said initially with clarifications you made later, but nobody's disputing that you've clarified your position since.

Also, you were never actually accused of anything. The totality of the "accusation" is Vicky asking you where the claim was "coming from." So I'm not sure what part of this was supposed to at all improper. You said something vague, someone asked you about it, and you did, indeed, express offense.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Guys, just shut up. This thread is about 1990s movies and waiting impatiently for Harry Lime to haul ass. Take it to PMs or something.

THE DOG WAS NOT JUST JUMPING AT THE MAN, HE WAS ATTEMPTING TO BITE. He was an 80 lb, unrestrained dog who was aggressively lunging at a police officer. Your wording makes it sound like that dog was just jumping up to say hello. It wasn't. I also never said it was a "normal reaction to shoot a dog" so DO NOT put words in my mouth. I said that a person has every right to defend his or herself against an attacking animal by whatever means they have available. THIS IS NOT THE SAME THING.

Also, I never said that my suspicion about you was a strong one. Only that it existed and that you - with your vague statement and lack of evidence - left that possibility open.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

There's actually no hijack issue this time because the countdown is presumably going to be in a new thread.

I suspect the discussion is basically over anyway, though.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Can't we talk about Budgies instead?

There is absolutely no doubt in the scientific community that animals feel and react to stress. Stress is not an emotion. To be heavily manhandled by a child is stressful for cats. The degree would depend on the cat.

Your examples a few posts ago are not based in science at all. Shouting at a dog can indeed stress a dog. How much depends on the dog.

Where did you read that about self-awareness having anything to do with how an animal reacts less negatively to stress?

We need a new thread.

I didn't read Yoda's post before I wrote that last sentence.

A question would have been:

What do you mean by 'trust me'?


An attempt at accusation is:

"I'm not sure I want to know where that trust me-BS is coming from."


Later she also confirmed that it was a kind of accusation and explained that she had experiences with other people, which was the reason why she suspected me in the first place.


Again, I'm NOT offended. You guys make me feel like a pussy who starts crying whenever someone is pointing a finger at me. I was just expressing some thoughts about Miss Vicky's particular reaction. It seems that I better shut my mouth the next time, as I've just wasted 2 hours of my life explaining my real intentions over and over again.

The part about 'insulting' may have seemed like I was offended by it, but what's the point of looking at the first reaction if I already clarified myself? Why would you use the 'insult'-part in your argument if you also read my second post?

These are rhetorical questions by the way. You already explained that you were referring to my initial reaction only and that I was trying to defend that, while I was just trying to defend my true intentions all the time.

Anyway, what do you personally think about the cat incident? Do you find it mistreatment?

Welcome to the internet.

Yoda already said he didn't intend to watch it. So unless he has done so since he made that statement, there's your answer.

Well, the point of looking at your first reaction is to determine if anyone was acting unreasonable in their response to it, since that's the thing you're saying was improper. As far as I can tell nobody's questioned your word since you clarified, but since you claim that people reacted out of the blue, your first reaction is the relevant thing to look at it to judge that.

As for what I think; I don't know, because I haven't watched the video. Appropriately, I haven't issued an opinion on the central issue (just on all the stuff surrounding it). I'd rather have to reserve judgment than watch something which may make me feel awful.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Anyway, I guess everyone can agree that the point is now clarified and there's a simple impasse as to where the line on reasonable animal treatment is drawn?

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I skimmed the clip, it's not awful but totally unessecary.

I remember someone Said the full movie was on Youtube. Got a link?

Agreed.

@Godoggo: I already expressed the fact that the word 'scientific' wasn't used in the right way by me. I shouldn't have used it and should have stated that it was all about my perception. I'm not stupid. I know animals can have stress. I was just trying to set up some arguments that allowed me to explain my opinion about the whole matter. Some of them have rightfully been countered and I don't deny that.

-----------------------------------


To close my role in this discussion, I will put all my opinions about every matter of the past discussion out here very clearly:


- I still PERSONALLY think the 'stress' you are all referring to is way too overrated when it comes to the Satantango case. The cat may have had a little stress (you can clearly hear it as it meows), but it isn't of that amount that I, myself, me, Cobpyth, categorize it as mistreatment. I am completely alright with it and I would even buy a copy of the film if I had the chance, regardless of it having a cat taken firmly by a child and rolled around on the floor.

- I think the dog in the video shouldn't have been shot and that the policemen were acting completely wrong in every aspect. They shouldn't have arrested the man in the first place and they didn't handle the dog well. Therefore the dog, Max, should still live happily together with his boss.
(not sure what this statement is doing in this topic, but I randomly wanted to make this very clear too!)

- I think my reaction to Miss Vicky, concerning the so called suspicion, was not out of line. It was just a sidenote that exploded right in my own face (apparantly) and she didn't care. That's alright with me. No hard feelings. I respect that you want to remain true to your own feelings and that you want to be able to express them in an open way. Maybe I was too fast with critisizing that aspect of your personality.

- Goodfellas is the best film of the 90s I've seen yet.


If you think otherwise about any of this, that's completely fine by me, but I don't agree with what you're saying and you will probably never convince to change my mind.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_kwXNVCaxY

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

this thread blew up since I last saw. I'm with Vicky and Yoda though.

I wasn't implying you were stupid, I was pointing out that those wiki articles weren't relative to what was being discussed.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Good grief

You still haven't demonstrated any proof behind your assertion that animals can "handle" more trauma, whatever that means. You're not an animal behaviorist or a veterinarian, so where are you coming off with this, man?

And anyway, isn't the cat in the film what you would call a "normal" cat? Or does the cat cease to be a cat since it's in a film? Do you regard it as a prop?

So you're telling me your proof is nothing more than what you think is true? You can't cite any articles written by trained and respected animal behaviorists or veterinarians to back up your claim that animals "can handle more" stress than we think?

Listen, you don't know what you're talking about. You're projecting what you want to believe onto situations that you don't really understand. You want to believe the cat in the film was fine, so you tell yourself that the cat can handle it. You want to believe that yelling at your dog is okay, so you tell yourself that the dog shrugs it off. But you have NO basis for any of it.

See, this is what pisses me off about people who think being unkind to animals isn't a big deal. Your perspective is extremely dangerous. Because you haven't taken the time to read about or understand what we know about animals and how they respond to us, you're proceeding through life believing that animals can take what you dish out. There are scores of pet owners out there who do the same thing to extreme degrees. They beat their pets, they make them stay in crates for hours, they starve them, they scold them harshly for behaviors that are a direct result of their unhappiness. They're morons.

Don't be a moron. You need to stop believing something based on a very limited basis of experience and, essentially, your own blind belief. You need to recognize that humans are responsible for the care and protection of animals, particularly the ones we have domesticated. You owe them a little more understanding than this.

This comment is particularly unsettling. It tells me that you really don't understand these points you're trying to make. Yes, shouting at "a kid" is different, but I doubt very seriously that you really understand these complexities any further than simply knowing they are there.

In other words, you know not to yell at a kid because you're a human being. You were a kid once and you know what it feels like to be yelled at. But you can't tell me exactly why it's not a good thing to do. You don't know what it does to children because you're not a child psychologist.

So if you don't understand that, then why would you ever presume to understand how yelling at a dog or abusing a cat affects them psychologically, emotionally, and physically? Do you see yet why your apathy is dangerous?

Another assumption. My brother used to yell at his cat for peeing in the house because he assumed she was just "being bad." I told him time after time to take her to the vet. When he finally did, guess what? She had a urinary tract infection. Moral of the story: don't assume.

I'm not watching the scene. And it doesn't matter that the filmmaker adopted the cat afterward.

I would like to comment to your post with a lot of quotes and stuff, but I just don't think it will matter. I don't really want to, actually, because deep in my heart I really don't care. It was my humanity taking over, that wanted me to be right so badly and wanted me to discuss and tried to show Vicky that I was right. The truth is that I don't know anything at all about anything at all.

I will tell you this in all honesty:

I acknowledge the fact that practically everything of what I said, was own perception. I certainly have not studied the subject and honestly everything I said in the whole discussion was probably complete BS objectively. I was so much into my own opinion that I was trying to convince myself that what I was saying was completely true and nothing else is. I was narrowing my own mind to make my point come over as believable as possible. It is something a lot of people do and I notice it a lot. Probably you people now have the same reaction to my former statements as I sometimes have in other situations where I tend to actually know something about (not that I really know something about anything). I'm just a simple person who sometimes thinks he's more than that, but it's this kind of discussions that make me realize that I'm actually just one of the many stupid others out there.
This is probably the weakest thing a person can do in a discussion, but I just wanted to say this. I'm sick of defending my own stupidity and my own fake morality.

The truth is:

I really don't care about the cat in the picture. I have no inner feeling telling me that it's wrong. I'm a very indifferent person. Can you judge me? Of course you can. You can even hate me for it. I'm saying it as it is:
I don't care about the cat at all. I also don't care about seeing someone getting killed in a video. I don't feel anything and I can't do anything about it. Actually, to be honest, I never felt anything about anything in my whole life. It's quite depressing really. I would NEVER kill anyone myself, but I just don't care about it when it happens and it doesn't affect me. The only thing I actually care about is my own world and what affects me. It's extremely rotten to say this and my god, I don't really know why I'm saying this here, but it's just true. Excuse me for what I actually feel. I can't help it, I wish I could.

I admire people who are not like me and who can feel more for people/animals that they don't know.

Why was I defending the dog then? Simply because I like dogs and because I imagined myself in the situation of the dog's boss. There's nothing rational about it. My own person really doesn't care what happened. I just don't want it to happen to me ever and that's why I'm saying it is wrong. Do I really care myself? Na-ah.

Probably you've read my post until now, because what I wrote is so shocking and because it's so unbelievable, but it's all true.

You might describe me as egocentric. That would probably be the right word to describe me. I'm indifferent to pretty much everything else. Is it dangerous? I don't think so. In my opinion the universe is indifferent (that's what I think, not hope), so my indifference won't make a lot of difference.

I want to believe there is something more than just all this indifference and I hope one day I really believe in it, but right now, in this phase of my life, I just can't see the light. There is no overruling morality, there is just nothing. It makes me cynical, it makes me not care about anything. It's just me right now. Is it insanity? I don't know.

I'm 19 years old and most of you are a lot older than me. I'm happy to see that you are all thinking differently than me now. I hope I will someday reach your level of awareness. It might add some color to my very gray existence that I have right now.

I don't even know why the hell I'm typing this all out on a movie forum that I really enjoy, but it's 5:53 AM and I just don't care anymore. Most of you will probably think I'm crazy now. Maybe I am.

It's funny how a small, moral discussion about a cat makes me realize my own inner emptiness and rotenness. I actually realized it already but I just wanted to out it, because Sleezy made some very valid condemnations.

I'm not going to read back what I just wrote. I hope I didn't offend anyone and there are probably some very shocking and controversial things in it that I wish I hadn't said, but this are my really honest thoughts right at this moment.

I guess this whole text could be seen as looking for attention. It's actually really really sad what I'm doing here, because people should keep their thoughts to themselves, but this is just an internet forum and nobody knows who I am, so what the hell. I'm already judging myself for all this.
Unnecessary.

Here is a song that expresses my feelings very well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-E4FRtrD9aQ

Yours truly,

Cobpyth


PS: this is probably the wrongest topic ever for a deep confession about the inner feelings, but I just went for it. You only live once.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I really appreciate it and think it's a brave step. I cherish honesty combined with humility.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

It is a very brave thing to say and I appreciate you doing it.

I think we all have feelings of apathy in situations where we shouldn't and we all feel more strongly about issues that either affect us directly or that we can relate to on some level.

I often find myself feeling apathy to a lot of instances of human suffering. Especially when it's overseas or it's something accidental. Not that I'd feel the same if I were an actual witness to the suffering - seeing it with my own eyes instead of through a television or computer screen - but if it's not happening at home and it's not a deliberate act of terrorism or cruelty, it can be hard for me to muster emotion about it.

I think plenty of us also fall into that trap of defending an opinion to the bitter end because we want to be right even when we see that the evidence suggests otherwise. I don't doubt or deny that I've done that too from time to time.

It's very big of you to say all this and hope that someday you'll find a way to break through the apathy and care about issues that don't affect you directly. But then, you're only 19, you've got plenty of time for that to happen.

P.S. The +rep I just gave you was not an accident.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Do you feel any strong emotion for characters in your favorite movies? What I mean is do you ever cry or even get sad during a film you're watching.

Cobpyth, shut the hell up and quit your crying on a public forum with that deranged Beach Boys song at the end of your post. Good lord, it's like American Psycho all up in here. And so early, too - right before the start of the Nineties Countdown. Cobpyth, only I am allowed to get this kind of crazy attention, okay? You don't wanna end up like me so shut the hell up.

Yes, I can. It' like Miss Vicky says in the beginning of her post:

"I think we all have feelings of apathy in situations where we shouldn't and we all feel more strongly about issues that either affect us directly or that we can relate to on some level."

My favorite films all have characters that I relate to on some level or that reflect a certain absence of morality and a strong presence of weakness. Not because I like that or want it to be like that, but because I can relate to it.

Casablanca - Rick Blaine is probably my favorite movie character of all time. He is one of those characters I look up to, because at the end of the film he does something so big and pure that I can't help but be emotional about it. I guess his situation is quite relatable for most people at some time in their lives, but the way he handles it is so perfect and enlightening to me that he has become some sort of symbol to me. In the beginning we see his cynical self and his lack of morality, which is probably most of the times me and my thoughts right now, but in the end he is what I actually want to be one day. He reaches 'the point'.

Chinatown - J.J. Gittes is a whole different kind of character. He actually gets confronted with the dishonesty and the immorality of his surroundings (and himself). He's a character that suffers because of it and discovers his own incapacity to do something about it, which I very much can relate with.

Citizen Kane - Charles Foster Kane is on a superficial level probably the model of the 'American Dream'. Still he misses purity and something 'higher' during his whole life, despite having the biggest castle and a lot of power. It's again very relatable to me how frustrated he gets with reality. At the end of his life he wants to go back to his carefree youth ('Rosebud' is the perfect symbol for that) where he didn't realise the nihilism of everything there is and of who he has become.


I could go on about my other favorite films and how the characters in those films affect me because of some other relatable reasons, but I guess this pretty much explains why I love certain films and stories so much. It's nice to know that other people have the same struggles as I have and if it's portrayed in a beautiful and believable atmosphere like some of my very favorites, it can have a very big effect on me. In the case of Casablanca even a certain feeling of 'hope'.

To stay with the 90s:
The fact that I really like films like, for example The Player or Crimes and Misdemeanors (I know that's an 80s film), is because they look at life from a whole new, maybe forbidden, cynical point of view. They actually show some sort of advantages of the immorality of life, while still criticizing it in a way I very much enjoy. I don't particularly like the characters in those films, but in some twisted way they reach something in a very forbidden way without being judged by it by some sort of higher force. It's frightening and intriguing at the same time for me. That kind of stuff, if done properly, can tickle me very deeply.

Thanks, by the way, Mark F and Miss Vicky for your very kind reactions. It gives me a very nice feeling on this sunny afternoon to see that some people actually read my incoherent personal outings at night and are telling me it's alright to feel that way sometimes, even if it's not 'right' (quite a paradox, but I hope you know what I mean). I really appreciate that a lot.

Sexy, somehow I was also pretty happy to read your reaction. In some weird kind of way I deduced from it that I could get away with this kind of emotional post this one single time.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I'll echo that; it was a brave thing to post.

I think the fact that you can sit outside yourself and disapprove, and want to be different, is significant. There's an old observation that even when we despise ourselves we respect ourselves as one who despises. As long as we retain the capacity to be dissatisfied with ourselves, there's hope.

Being a little indifferent isn't the end of the world. *****, there's hundreds of people dying on a daily basis every day in Syria, and I'm positive lots and lots of members here - including myself - don't even pause a great deal of times to think about the horrors going on over there. Just as long as you're not indifferent to your loved ones and friends. It's one thing not caring about some cat (it's an animal for christ's sakes); another thing entirely to just go 'meh' when your grandmother dies.

Lighten up, pal. Go get smashed and hit on some girls. Or whatever that floats your boat.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

When my grandmother died when I was 11 I laughed because my aunts were crying in a rather melodramatic style that felt funny to my 11 year old self.

Anyway, I tend to identify the most with very moral characters in movies (I identify the most with politically correct characters). I tend to not identify very much characters that don't respect the rights of others (like Joe Pesci's character in Goodfellas).

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Brod's in trouble. Here we go again. :)

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I wanna hear more from Cobpyth the Psychopath. Tell us more about your lack of feelings. Make it lengthy and include more Beach Boys songs. Forget what I said about shutting up -- that was another person talking.

Oh God now I feel your pain. I hope enough of you lot voted for Eyes Wide Shut to get it on here.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Tell us what #100 is.

Um, no.

It's gonna be top 50 for sure, top 25 might be a strech, but it's possible.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I gave about 10 points to Eyes Wide Shut. A movie needs about 40 points to make into the top 100. I guess it might make even 100 points or more.

Eyes Wide Shut will be on the list. I promise.

I sure hope so.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Is there going to be a new thread for the countdown? I think there should.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Agreed. We've filled this thread up with a bunch of junk.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

It's always in a new thread. Try not to fill that one with junk. Ha! :)

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I'm a MoFo list virgin...so I didn't know!

This cat discussion was extremely disturbing to read. I skimmed a few parts because people were repeating themselves, not that their points were unfair. I am a bit pissed off now because I decided to man up and watch the cat clip and decide for myself, since honestly I will certainly never watch Satantango.

What I saw was clearly mistreatment bordering on outright torture. I know cats; I've been around them all my life and owned some of my own. That cat was upset and afraid. It was certainly in emotional pain and at least some physical pain.

Just because the cat wasn't very obviously being damaged, like burned or cut, does not make it okay.

The most disturbing part was Cob's confession post. I don't even know how to begin to tackle that post and express lucidly the thoughts and feelings it elicited. I feel dirty now.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

This thread is awesome.

It's because of threads like this that this forum is so interesting.

Thank you for admitting this. You probably know more than you think, actually, but it's definitely very easy to get caught up in the argument. You try to make points that seem sound enough to "win" the argument, but really it's always best to stick to factual information.

You're not stupid. That much is obvious by the films you've seen and the way you express yourself.

This might be off-base, because obviously I don't know you or your experiences thus far, but I'm going to say it anyway.

You're 19 years old. My estimation is that you're a bored, apathetic, and somewhat lost teenager. You're on the cusp of adulthood and that probably scares you a little bit. You can feel yourself leaving earlier stages of your life that maybe seemed more fun, more colorful, more meaningful. You might not have as many friends as you would like. You probably don't know what you're supposed to do or how to go about doing it. You might be asking yourself questions like "Is this it?" because you don't feel that there's much to get excited over.

You're obviously more sophisticated than some because you're into films that most other teens wouldn't bother seeing. But you're also desensitized to violence. This doesn't really surprise me. We have made violence such a staple of our regular entertainment—and for most of us, real violence is not something we see or experience enough to really understand—that we're losing our ability to react to violent images. I'm a bit desensitized myself, but I can still remember seeing violent stuff in Rated-R films as a kid and feeling shocked and horrified. The kids I know today don't seem to be affected in the same way.

Nevertheless, I really believe you've reached a very formative and awkward part of life. To you, the world is yourself, and you're starting to feel a bit like adult life and everything about it is just meaningless grey autopilot, and you realize you don't understand or feel any excitement about any of it. We've all experienced this unusual change in reality.

I don't think it's shocking and unbelievable. I think it's typical. And I think a part of you wishes it was shocking because, on some level you probably don't understand, you want your life to be shaken up. You want it to become more interesting than it is.

And to that, I say: it will. It's just a matter of perception and understanding. You'll get older and start to put things together in your mind. You'll slowly begin to figure out what adult life is and how you can make it work for you. You'll feel more comfortable, and happier.

Like I said, you're egocentric in the sense that your world is currently you, and right now you're not very jazzed about that world. You've essentially replaced your confusion and disappointment with indifference, because you feel like that's easier or more meaningful, but you know that the confusion and disappointment are still there. This is so very common among teens, I can't even tell you.

Either way, I think it's still about perception. It might not seem this way now, but your life will become more colorful, more interesting, more fulfilling. But you can't be indifferent. Indifference is emotional and social inaction that you've sanctioned for yourself because it seems too hard to figure out what you can do to be happier about your life. Or maybe you've already convinced yourself that living an unhappy life is inevitable. I genuinely hope not because, on that point, you'd be flat wrong.

Feeling more aware, more connected, more interested—that stuff will come with time and experience. Trust me. But you can't just resign yourself to indifference. You choose to be a part of the world and care about things. It's not just a natural gene that we all have and you don't. It might feel comforting to withdraw, but you're only retreating into an increasingly deeper hole. Don't accept that. Make yourself be better than that.

You're not crazy. You're a teenager who's experiencing all the same thoughts and feelings that countless other teenagers have experienced and will continue to experience. Just make sure you give yourself the time to wise up, get a little experience under your belt, and start seeing the world in all its wonderful color. Just like all you silly kids are saying these days... "you only live once." :)

Eyes Wide Shut was in my top five. It will make the list, and seeing how much support it has, it will probably be rather high up.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I gave it about 10 points too.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

I think you guys can tell how many points I gave it.

Oh, hell yes :cool:

I think it has a chance of making the top 10. :cool:

It also made my top 10.

It will probably make the top 20 or even higher.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Wow, I knew Eyes Wide Shut had its devoted followers but I had no idea it was so beloved here. I can't wait to see how high up it is.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Well, it's a Stanley Kubrick movie. He is probably the director who has the greatest combination of admiration and popularity in this forum (he or Hitchcock). There are directors who are respected by those who know their movies (like Ozu) and there are directors who are well known but not very respected (like Michael Bay), Stanley Kubrick is both.

Pretty much why I thought it might not make it in. Clearly I was way off the mark.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Full Metal Jacket will also certainly make the top 20 of the 1980's movies MoFO top 100 of the 1980's.

I didn't have any idea the animal abuse topic will go so far. I was quite ironic in my posts starting the whole discussion.
You say that like the cat was wounded or killed. I'm curious about the 'living thing' thingy. How far does it go? Would you pity a mouse killed or wounded on the screen? A fly or mosquito, maybe? Or is it only for cats, dogs and apes? Humans are animals too! I'm quite sensitive and tender to human suffering, but was indifferent to this scene, as well as I was indifferent to many fictional death scenes in many films. Some of them moved me, but not all of them. The thing the cat was abused (or not) in real life as well is quite different, but I don't feel sympathy. There's too much people suffering all around the world to rumble about such things. A lot of people imprison hundreds of dogs or cats in locked cages standing horizontally, so solid waste of animals in the upper cages pours down on the ones in the cages below, which drown in it!

To end the topic: If you don't care about the cat in this scene, it's OK. It doesn't even mean you're emotionless, because you may be a very good person. It's OK to dislike the scene or say it was an abuse. It's all subjective, because you can't be 100% sure how the cat felt. All in all, it's all up to you. Watch Satantango if you like or don't watch it. Maybe the two or three films you watch instead will be a better choice for you. If you're interested in Tarr, watch Werckmeister Harmonies first to find out whether his style clicks for you.

Re: The MoFo Top 100 of the Nineties
 

Weird - could have sworn I compiled a list and sent it over, but I don't see my name here. What happened?

Then again, I could be thinking of an entirely different list I put together and sent for another event altogether! :P