The MoFo Movie Club Discussion: The Boy In The Striped Pyjamas

Ok folks, here we go with the discussion thread. I'll remind everyone that this is a spoiler free zone so if you've not seen the movie and don't want to know plot points, READ NO FURTHER!

The Boy In The Striped Pyjamas (2008, Mark Herman)

This is going to be a difficult film to discuss, I suspect (but hope it won't prove to be), but attempt to discuss it we shall.

In purely filmic terms, I wasn't overly impressed with this. The direction didn't have a lot of style and performances seemed strangely numb, almost as if the cast and crew were overwhelmed by the portent of it all.



I've not read the book on which The Boy In The Striped Pyjamas is based so can't really comment on similarities/differences. I wonder if anyone here has?

On paper the cast seemed intriguing:

David Thewlis is one of my favourite character actors (and a hero for managing to woo the delicious Anna Friel ), albeit one who frequently seems far too good for the roles he's required to play. Hmmm.

Vera Farmiga is probably best known as Matt and Leo's 2 dimensional love interest in The Departed and I wondered what kind of hausfrau she would make.

Richard Johnson has been appearing on TV since I was a kid, well, since my parents were kids, and Sheila Hancock is always good value so that's ok then...

The kids, I knew nothing about.

As it turned out, Thewlis was once again shoehorned into that uneasy-looking, flawed character that he could probably do in his sleep. He doesn't have much to work with, has Dave, but as he goes home to Anna I have little or no sympathy.

Sheila Hancock is criminally underused and Richard Johnson isn't required to do much more than look like everyone's grandfather. A Nazi grandfather, though...

Vera Farmiga is there, just about. How such a striking looking woman has so little presence is hard to fathom. Maybe she's just not very good at this acting lark?

Onwards, then, to the children. Of course, they've got the hardest job here -

Amber Beattie as Gretel makes the most of what she's given. Her lightning transformation from innocent 12 year old to icy Nazi-girl (plastering her bedroom with Hitler posters as if he were the latest heart throb pop star just plain grated) was the script's fault not hers.

Jack Scanlon makes for an unforgettable Shmeul, however. Ok, the whole film is set up for us to feel for the kid but the little guy's underplayed, simple performance won me over.



Not so much with Asa Butterfield, taking the lead as Bruno. I just didn't warm to the kid.

The story itself doesn't just let the plot unfold - it batters you over the head. I half expected the smoke that Bruno first sees to spell out the word 'DOOM' in big letters in the sky. Even so, I bet the drippy kid still wouldn't have clicked to what was going on.

Ok, I know I'm being harsh here and 8 year olds in the 1940s were much less worldly wise than 8 year olds today, but still...

The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas left me with a slightly sour taste in my mouth, all things considered. Yes, I know about the historical inaccuracies (8 year old children would have been gassed as soon as they entered camps such as this, horribly ) but this is a work of fiction and not a documentary. Another complaint I've read was that the film was merely a vehicle for a Nazi family to wallow in self-pity.

Well, yes it was but that's not the main reason why I disliked this plodding movie.

The Holocaust was the modern world's prime example of Man's inhumanity to Man and there are still millions who, even if they didn't directly experience it, were alive at the time. As such, I'm sure directors and actors approach films about that period of history with an even greater degree of seriousness than usual but thankfully they all don't turn out like The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas. Polanski's The Pianist is one which immediately springs to mind which, to my mind anyway, managed to get its point across without being didactic.

Of course, I may have got things totally arse-about-face! What did you all think?

I'd give it a because I believed in young Mr Scanlon and the sets looked nice...

__________________
"Critics are like eunuchs in a harem; they know how the Tatty 100 is done, they've seen it done every day, but they're unable to do it themselves." - Brendan Behan

I haven't read the book or seen the movie and likely never will because I just can't take holocaust films anymore. The premise of a young German kid finding out what's happening to Jewish kids his age sounds like it could be interesting. Except that I know what burning flesh smells like, and no one could have lived within a few miles of one of those death camps without recognizing the overpowering stench of disease, death, and cremation. Even an 8-year-old would know something didn't smell right. So that ol" "Gee, we never knew" after-war excuse of German civilians just doesn't cut any ice with me. The Germans cheered Hitler and gladly turned in their Jewish, gypsy, homosexual, and demented neighbors to be carried off and destroyed. It was only after the Germans themselves started burning in bombed cities that they finally decided it wasn't so much fun after all.

Got my copy today; will watch it by the weekend at the absolute latest and I'll be back here to gab about it then. It'll likely set off a marathon of holocaust-themed films which I've been putting off a little, so I sould have plenty to compare it to, too.

It has the feel of a run-of-the-mill British kids' TV production (from the educational rather than the fun side of things) for the most part, but it's all just a bit off all the way through. The ending is one of the most jaw-dropping things I've seen in a movie, and in no way in a good way. You do not need an absurd stunt like that to make the holocaust a tragedy, and the idea that you do is thoroughly offensive. I thought the film was misconceived, shoddily handled, and nowhere near as powerful as it should have been; the ending (and the stupid failure to deal with the true nature of the holocaust that it encapsulates) is what takes the film from mediocre to flat out bad.

The only thing worth pondering in the film is the question of why the American Farmiga assumes such an arch English accent to play a German.

Another unsatisfied customer. Sigh... Why, oh why do people make movies like this? Don't answer that Ruffy, it was rhetorical and I already know the answer.

The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas (Mark Herman - 2008)




Did we really need this movie anymore than we could have used, say, half a dozen or more bad horror films? I suppose so. That doesn't mean it's good or even mediocre, which it isn't...

I know I took some rather large swipes (justifiably so in my ever so humble opinion) at The Reader a few months ago but I'm willing to admit that The Reader is a far superior film to this one. The Reader did have a heart beat after all and I just get irritated by double standards sometimes so a movie is as good a thing as any to lodge my complaints against.

OK, first gripe and it may seem silly but at first I didn't even know this was about a Nazi family. See, they were all speaking in English and many had English accents. Most of the cast didn't even try to speak with a German accent (as painful as that can be to listen to) so I really had no idea what was going on until after they had moved to the countryside. Sure, I found it rather strange when at the big party for the father everyone started shouting "Heil Hitler!" and the like but I really wasn't aware that this was supposed to be based around a German family because they weren't speaking German! Sorry, maybe that's stupid or maybe I'm just really smart.

OK, on to gripe number two. Why would the BBC or whoever it was in Britain make this movie? Are we getting low on holocaust films now? Have we gotten so progressive as a society that we now need to have more films from the English/German perspective so we can all REALLY know what it was like for the Germans too? I'm not Jewish, perhaps there is a small contingent of Jewish folks out there that cheered when the little German boy gets gassed at the end of the movie but I highly doubt it. Because lets remember, even if this were a true story (which I don't believe this is right?) it was only one little German boy that got gassed along with God knows how many Jews.

So what was this movie even about? Am I supposed to feel sorry for the Germans now? Did they have it tougher than the Jews? And when is the cut off date for wallowing in this disaster anyway? Is it a 100 years? 200? We had a little thing called slavery here in the states awhile back and apparently the date has passed on that tragic inhumane disaster becuase you rarely see a movie about that particular time period anymore. Personally I think what we as Americans did to the Native Americans is actually even worse than slavery and you next to never see a movie about how bad the American pioneers had it when they were out slaughtering injun's.

But I digress... I've gone completely sideways, movies that I find pointless tend to do this to me. It is what it is. I'll be mildly interested to hear my Dad's thoughts on the film as he was the one who actually brought it to my attention a few months ago. He enjoys flicks like this sometimes so we'll see if he has some thoughts about it afterwords. I suspect he won't be real excited about it either.

Anyway, I'll quit griping and let someone else have a turn.

__________________
We are both the source of the problem and the solution, yet we do not see ourselves in this light...

I don't see a rating, PW...

__________________
It's what you learn after you know it all that counts. - John Wooden
My IMDb page

Well that's weird, when I went to edit it, the rating text was there but its not showing up in my post. How do I fix that?


EDIT: Fixed! I am THE MAN!

For sure, you're like this guy...


Señor Dos Equis!

HA! You're exactly right!

Dunno if you're old enough to remember their dramatisation of Robert Westall's The Machine gunners (my favourite book when I was c.10) but I think that was The Beeb telling a WWII story through children's eyes very well. Of course, The Machine Gunners was told through children's eyes and intended for children to watch.

The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas was told through children's eyes and intended for adults to say "Oh, wasn't the war terrible?" about. Probably.

Germans with British accents? Blame George Lucas...

I'm guessing that it was quite deliberate to announce the family's Nazi-ness in such an abrupt way. They're, up until that point, just a happy middle class family from somewhere in Europe who's dad is off to a new job.

The transition of Thewlis to concentration camp commander was to be all the more shocking, I suppose they thought. My problem here is that we never know what Big Dave really thinks, apart from his ultimate obvious grief at having lost a son. Yes, he follows orders and snitches on the young officer (but that could be seen as saving his 12 year old from an inappropriate crush, I suppose) but I never got a heartfelt conviction here. He knows what happens to people who question what is going on...

Then again, we don't get any real sense that he disagrees with the job he's been given. Yet another 2D role for a 3D actor.

Seeing as the cast was largly British then I don't have a problem with them using their own accents (or middle class versions thereof) for the production. I guess Vera was told to adopt one for the sake of continuity.

Surely we're beyond the days of comedy German accents? I can see the need in some films for differentiation to be made between opposing factions through the way they speak but I don't think it's at all necessary here.

I can't imagine the film raking in the $£€s using a German cast speaking their native tongue. If it was a German production (a la Downfall) then fine, but it's not so why should they?

I'm guessing that it was a book the producers felt could be filmed satisfactorally, no more and no less. That they failed (in our eyes anyway) to make a satisfactory film is beside the point.

Attempted genocide and it's spin-offs aren't an unusual thing, sadly, when world history is addressed. We've had it most recently in the Balkans, Rwanda and Iraq. Then there was WWII, Native Americans and Australians and the most personal to me - Oliver Cromwell. Some have been covered more completely than others but I don't think it's the fault of the people who decided to adapt The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas, whoever hard it is for me to defend it.

I think there's a valid story there, and one that needs to be told and retold until the world fully wakes up. It's just that I think they told this particular story badly.

Sorry, but when I read this, the thought that immediately flashed in my mind was the scene in Monty Python's The Life of Brian in which the Romans are taking out a group of prisoners to be crucified, each carrying his cross. But one doomed man asks a bystander to hold his cross while he ties his sandal, then slips away, leaving the helpful bystander trying to tell the Roman guard he's not a doomed prisoner but is just holding the cross for someone else!

Goes to show, sometimes you've got to be very, very careful which line you get in!

Just three people (out of 21 votes) have commented so far.

I count 6 (it's awfully hard to keep up a count when people keep posting ahead ). Five, really, since I never voted for any of the candidate movies.

Well, by commented I mean expressed an opinion. Much as I'd love to include you (and you're the best person I know for talking eloquently about something he ain't actually seen, I'm gonna get tough here) I can only see PW, Stevo and me.

Have you ever considered a career in politics?

My apologies Tatty. I've been so busy with trips back and fourth to the hospital to see my son, I haven't even had a chance to watch my Netflix movies. The good news is, he might be out this week, so I might have some time to watch it before the month is over with.

__________________
"I was walking down the street with my friend and he said, "I hear music", as if there is any other way you can take it in. You're not special, that's how I receive it too. I tried to taste it but it did not work." - Mitch Hedberg

No problem, bud.

I really really hate putting any sort of pressure on people because you've all got your own lives. I just feel that this movie is ripe for dissection.

Indeed it is, and I've been wanting to see it for some time now.

I've got my copy right next to me and am going to try to pop it in more or less as soon as I get home today. Certainly no later than tomorrow, Wanted to watch it over the weekend but there was a bit too much going on.

Well, it's always nice to have one's accomplishments recognized by one's peers. On the other hand, like the old boy once said after being ridden out of town on a rail, "If not for the honor, I'd just as soon have walked." As for politics, I have the same outlook as the frontier editor portrayed by Edmond O'Brien in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, "Politicians are my meat!"

This the first I've heard of your son being hospitalized. Having a child sick or hurt is a living hell for parents. I wish your son a full and quick recovery.