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All we have is this one reference point. You can turn it any way you like, but the fact still remains that a match between one of MMA top heavyweights at the time and an old washed up former boxing heavyweight world champion resulted in the MMA heavyweight being unconcious for a longer period of time than the match actually lasted.

About that video. First of all, good find. I enjoyed watching that (no sarcasm intended whatsoever). Lou DiBella talks in a pretty disdainful way about MMA, which is not really called for. Then again, Joe Rogan calls boxing a "limited form of fighting", which is also untrue as you need to use your entire body to practice boxing at a top level. Anyone who says it's limited because you can only throw punches, doesn't know what they're talking about.

Then DiBella says Joe Rogan is not a boxing fan, which is of course silly. As Rogan says, DiBella knows nothing about him. I like to believe that Rogan is a combat sports fan, much like myself.

But then Joe says the dumbest thing he can possibly say. Boxing is getting swallowed by MMA? Come again? Lets just look at today's situation. Some weeks ago, there was UFC114 which was hyped up to the max by Rampage and Rashad. The PPV numbers were 900,000. This means that this was the 4th biggest UFC event ever. Rashad Evans made $ 435,000.

A comparable event in boxing was the Mosely - Mayweather fight. The PPV numbers were 1.4 million. Mayweather pocketed a gueranteed $ 22,5 million plus a bonus for PPV subscriptions. Mosely pocketed about $ 7 million. So it's not even close compared to MMA.

MMA will always be a marginal sport compared to boxing. No one cares about MMA outside of the USA, except for a few thousand real fight fans like me. But boxing is a true global sport. The Klitschko's sell out football stadiums in germany every time they fight. Vitali Klitschko fought last month in Gelsenkirchen, Germany last month with over 45,000 people in attendance.

And as for boxing being harder and superior to MMA... Well, one of MMA's biggest legends says so himself:




Keep on Rockin in the Free World
Randy Couture won't stand in the centre of the octogan and trade with Toney, thats ridiculous. Its not a boxing match.

Couture will look to clinch, bring himto the cage and work the "dirty boxing" foot stomps, knees to the thighs and elbows comin out of the clinch.

The only chance Toney has is a punchers chance of catching Couture on the button early.

Which of course Coutures camp knows. The inside leg kick will be used a lot, to break down toneys ability to plant and push off.

a boxer without footwork isn't effective generally.

What rogan said that can't be denied, is the next generation of would be fighters, are training MMA .

Boxing has a shelf life of perhaps 15 years, tops.

round up 100 Average sports fans, and ask them to name as many boxers as they can, and then name as many UFC fighters.

Imo, a good number of the boxers mentioned will have long since retired (tyson sugar ray, ali, spinks and such), while,thanks largely to the UFC's exposure through spiketv the names will dwarf that of boxing.

Boxing the sport will continue on in Mexico and throughout Europe, but in the USA it will suffer as time marches on.
__________________
"The greatest danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it." - Michelangelo.



Randy Couture won't stand in the centre of the octogan and trade with Toney, thats ridiculous. Its not a boxing match.

Couture will look to clinch, bring himto the cage and work the "dirty boxing" foot stomps, knees to the thighs and elbows comin out of the clinch.
This is all true. Toney's boxing style is based on shoulder rolls, footwork and superior technique. Like I already said, he is not a big puncher either. Dana White probably handpicked him because he is marketable (his big mouth) and because his style is horrible for MMA.

The only chance Toney has is a punchers chance of catching Couture on the button early.
That is exactly what is going to happen. Like I said: Mercer - Sylvia. And let's even say that Couture beats Toney. What is the result of this victory? Zuffa pockets some PPV numbers. Couture wins his easiest match ever on paper. After all, he is fighting a 41-year-old, punch drunk, out of shape boxer who has never fought a single MMA match. It's an empty victory over a guy who can no longer cut it in the boxing ring.

But what if Toney wins? MMA's credibility will be down the drain, because if James Toney can beat one of MMA's top fighters without any experience, imagine what a guy like Vitali Klitschko would do to a guy like Brock Lesnar or Shane Carwin.

It's also funny how all these mindless MMA fanboys are jumping on Dana White's bandwagon. He was the one that ignited this discussion that MMA is a superior sport in comparison with boxing. And all he can get to "prove" his case is a James Toney that no decent boxing promotor wants any part of any longer. Toney is just looking for a pay day, that's the only reason why he is now settling for the petty wage (in comparison with boxing) that UFC can offer him.

What rogan said that can't be denied, is the next generation of would be fighters, are training MMA.

Boxing has a shelf life of perhaps 15 years, tops.
Boxing has been around for well over 100 years. Rogan is just talking for his shop. These so-called undeniable "facts" are based on nothing. The UFC's biggest draw is a freakshow WWE product. Boxing's main attraction is Manny Pacquiao, an elected congressman in the Philippines, and Floyd Mayweather, whose salary for a single fight is equal to the amount that all UFC main card fighters combined earn in an entire year haha.

MMA will never outgrow boxing in any continent because mainstream media ignore it. It's too "violent" and UFC only gets negative mainstream attention, i.e. Lesnar's post fight interview after his match with Mir and the Strikeforce brawl.


round up 100 Average sports fans, and ask them to name as many boxers as they can, and then name as many UFC fighters.

Imo, a good number of the boxers mentioned will have long since retired (tyson sugar ray, ali, spinks and such), while,thanks largely to the UFC's exposure through spiketv the names will dwarf that of boxing.

Boxing the sport will continue on in Mexico and throughout Europe, but in the USA it will suffer as time marches on.
Boxing will suffer in the USA? Because of spiketv's coverage? You have no evidence whatsoever to back up this claim. Boxing is covered extensively in all mainstream media. Boxing is very important to HBO and Showtime. Mainstream media love boxing. As soon as Pacquiao and Mayweather retire, they will be replaced by others. This has been the case for over 100 years.

MMA will always remain a marginal sport. It's not even legitimite in some states in the USA lol. That being said, I love watching MMA and to me, it's a legit sport that certainly has its merit in the world of combat sports. But boxing was, is and always will be THE global combat sport and the SUPERIOR combat sport.

This says it all :
&playnext_from=TL&videos=c3FOV6cPwg0



ufc 116 prediction.




who do you guys think will win at ufc 116. ime going with shane carwin knock out i wanna say first round but ime going to go with second.



winner: carwin



Fedor vs. Werdum

well he can be beaten, maybe now he will go in the ufc.



Of course he can be beaten. Everyone can be beaten. I just did not expect it to be Werdum to do it. This was a big upset. It's comparable to Money Mayweather losing to a guy like Ricky Hatton.

Fedor made the mistake of diving into the guard of probably the best heavyweight BJJ practitioner who still had all his wits about him. That's a recipe for disaster, especially early in the fight when you're not sweating, which makes escaping from submissions much harder.

Fedor thought he had hurt Werdum, but this was an error of judgement. He should have clearly stood back up after he escaped Werdum's first armbar attempt, but he didn't. As a result, Werdum sunk in his triangle choke that made Fedor tap. Also, I lol'd the 2nd time I watched him tap. He just tapped once instead of all the other fighters who continually tap to make sure the ref sees it.

Fedor will be back for his final fight on his Strikeforce's contract. It's uncertain though who he will face. I thought that Overeem would be the one to finally defeat Fedor, but now, I don't see that match-up happening. Werdum beat the GOAT, he should get a title shot against Ubereem. But that's just me talking, perhaps Coker will have a rematch between Fedor and Werdum. Maybe he'll even have Fedor face Antonio Silva.

One thing is certain though, Fedor is as gracious in defeat as he is in winning. He remains my favourite MMA fighter and the GOAT. I also believe that he would easily defeat Werdum in a rematch. He would never make the mistake again of diving into Werdum's guard. And as we saw in the brief exchange at the beginning of the fight, Fedor's speed and punching accuracy is still the best of the entire HW division.

I doubt though that we will ever see Fedor in the UFC. He's certainly not going to go to the UFC because he got beaten now. He may even retire after his Strikeforce contract imo.

I'll come back with my predictions for UFC 116 later, out of time now.



Keep on Rockin in the Free World
Chael flappin his jaws again! He must get a PPV percentage....

not to be outdone Anderson Silva brought in Steven Segal to train with.



i agree with Nico, chael is an easy fight for spider.



Yeah, this is just a way of selling the fight. I bet Dana loves guys like Chael Sonnen and Rampage who run their mouth on their opponents.

However, the end result is going to be Sonnen ending up unconcious on the floor. No need for any dancing or taunting, Anderson Silva is going to ridicule this guy.



Keep on Rockin in the Free World
I just hope chael engages and its somewhat entertaining.

It was one think when Silva walked thru Leben when nobody knew who he was, quite another to annihilate Rich Franklin twice.

I'd like to see him vacate the title and move up to 205. lots of interesting matchups there.


as to this weekend, i've gone back and forth, and i think I'm going with Lesnar.

I know the "knock" on brock is he's never had his chin tested, however I submit. its is impossible to grow up in Rural Minnesota and not have that happen.

To hedge somewhat, If it ends in the 1st round, Carwin is probably victorious. The deeper it goes advantage lesnar imo.



well brock deserved it last night good fight i really cnt see anyone beating him at the moment.



Yeah after he survived that early onslaught from Carwin, I thought he had a good chance of winning it. I didn't expect him to submit Crawin the way he did, but I read that Carwin was hyperventilating from fatigue after the fight. Your boy really gassed out, Lud.

We've now learned that Lesnar has a good chin. If that was Frank Mir laying on the ground with Carwin teeing off, the fight would've ended in the first round. But it's clear that Lesnar has no stand up skills whatsoever.

Cain Velasquez will be Lesnar's next opponent. I reckon that will be a good fight. Cain has a chance of winning it, because he's got fast hands and wrestling skills. He might be too small though. And he'll need to put everything in his punches, because Lesnar is a beast that appears to be very hard to ko, as Carwin found out last night.

I can see Carwin taking on Junior Dos Santos for the # 1 contendership, provided that JDS beats that fat Nelson, which shouldn't be a problem. I'd like to see a rematch between Carwin and Lesnar or if that doesn't happen, I'd love to see JDS vs Lesnar.

I don't think that Lesnar is unbeatable. Cain Velsquez will give him a run for his money for sure and then it'll probably be a fight against Carwin or JDS, which won't be easy either.



Sorry Harmonica.......I got to stay here.
Brock is a gorilla, but in all fairness he deserved the win last night for weathering the 1st round punishment from Carwin. Even so, I can't help but think he's some kind of physical freak. His 106-5 or whatever wrestling record deserves respect of course. But's he's so humungous and powerful that finding equal partners (physically) for him would seem to me like a pretty difficult task. I don't think he's about the sport of MMA all that much. His presence in the UFC to me seems more like some ancient Roman gladiator hype. They bring in the lions, they bring in the bears, and they bring in the Brock. For the sport aspect, I enjoyed the Leben/Akiyama fight much more. Gotta admit though, I did get suckered by the hype -- wanted to see the main event pretty bad too.



Keep on Rockin in the Free World
well brock deserved it last night good fight i really cnt see anyone beating him at the moment.
The only one currenly in the UFC stabel is Cain Velasquez, though look to see both overeem and werdum to be snapped up by the end of the year.

heavyweight division is finally shaping up.

Carwin vs anyone in his next fight will be a bloodbath.

He's gotta take cardio training seriously though.



Cain Velasquez i really think is to small as brod said. Brock has to drop weight to get to 265 but cane only weighs like 240 if you want another beast to fight brock get bobby lashley in there haha



I genuinely believe that Overeem is the strongest and most fierce MMA fighter there currently is. He has got K1-level striking, killer knees and great muay thai. Did you guys see how he just tossed Bret Rogers to the ground with ease? That was a 265 pound guy he just threw to the ground like he was nothing. It wasn't even a takedown.

I've said it before on this forum, Ubereem is imo the biggest thread to Fedor out of all the heavyweights. Ok, he lost to Werdum, but that's mainly because he made a bad decision during the fight. Not to take anything away from Werdum, that was a terrific win, but if a rematch is finalized, Fedor is going to maul this guy.

That being said, I think Overeem is the only guy who could beat Fedor right now even if Fedor makes no mistakes whatsoever. And yes, that includes guys like Lesnar, Carwin, Velasquez and Junior Dos Santos. I know it's a bold statement, perhaps you guys will disagree...

Oh, and Dexter: Werdum signed a 3 fight extension to his Strikeforce contract so he's not going anywhere soon. I also think that Overeem has some fights left on his contract. Besides, the UFC only signs guys that fight in their organisation. Overeem will always want to fight in DREAM and perhaps also K1, so I doubt we'll see him in the UFC anytime soon, unless Dana offers him a big contract, which is unlikely seeing as he's not really got a big fanbase in the USA