Battlestar Galactica: Final Season (SPOILERS)

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OH, did you see the special, Yods? Because ...

WARNING: "BSG" spoilers below
]... They mentioned the "All this will happen again" stuff over and over again in the special....


Was just wondering if that's what set off some of the discussion....



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heh... oh god, I'm so tempted but if I'm going to be floored, I want it to be by the show on Friday. I'm going to try to hold out reading til then. In fact, I'm not sure I'll be in this thread much til Saturday morning, now. I'm starting to drive myself batty with trying to guess what's going to happen. I'm very excited about the marathon on Friday. Kinda glad I'm unemployed, for that day at least.
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Didn't see the special yet, but I recorded it.

Glad you read 'em. I love that feeling when you try to "test" a theory in your head, and in the middle of trying to find holes, it starts locking other things into place you weren't even thinking about. I keep thinking of new things it explains.

Anyway, regarding Kara...big news: Ron Moore's latest podcast has obliterated all our theories about her. Here's a quote someone transcribed for the SciFi.com boards:

"I should probably say as a side note, I know there's a tremendous amount of speculation out there in the internet that Kara is the daughter of Daniel, or that Daniel, Daniel being the Cylon model that was killed or destroyed or aborted or however you want to choose to define it, by Cavil, that there's a connection between Daniel and Kara and that's part of the revelations that we're going to reveal in the finale. I don't typically want to, like, put theories to rest because it kinda spoils the enjoyment and fun of people in the show. However I do think it's worth saying that that is not part of the plan. There is no connection between Kara and Daniel. And like I said I don't typically like to sort of quash rumors and theories because part of the fun of watching a series like this is coming up with your own theories and ideas. But in this particular case I don't want people to really be distracted through the finale by this other idea, which has gained a tremendous amount of currency on the internet and among fan circles. And that's probably my own fault because I don't think I realized the impact that the backstory of Daniel would have in No Exit, you know. I sort of thought that it was an interesting story about, that defined something about Brother Cavil, or John Cavil, and his backstory, and how he reacted to the threat of someone else being as beloved as he was. It was sort of a Cain and Abel type allegory. All those reasons, I thought it was an interesting piece of backstory. But in recent weeks I've realized that the cult of Daniel has grown, that there's a tremendous amount, there's a lot of people out there who are now investing a tremendous amount of time, energy and thought into the notion that Daniel is really a powerful figure in the show, and part of the mythos, and he's directly related to Kara. And, you know, I don't want anyone listening to this broadcast, podcast, I don't want you going into the finale having your Daniel hopes up too high, because that's really not part of the plan. And again I apologize if people think that was such a gigantic mislead or clue or something. That was not the intent. I don't think I anticipated how strongly that would be grabbed by people."
Wow. So much for that, then.

I don't know if I like this or not. On one hand, it's nice to know that, even if the primary theory posted earlier is correct (and really, it has to be, I think), there'll still be some surprises. On the other hand, having the Daniel/father/brother/Kara's a hybrid/whatever thing shot down makes it far more likely that the explanation we get will be mystical and unsatisfying.



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I *half* wish I hadn't read it, SD, so you go ahead and stay outta the thread. (Unsubscribe too -- those emails come with no spoiler tags!)

But ... I figured I'm going to be watching it with Yoda here, so it'd be tough not to have him talk about this stuff the whole two hours with me sitting right there! Might as well join in the fun. (He's a ton of fun to watch a show like this with -- we throw around theories and hit "pause" a lot, etc.)

Still ... let yourself be floored, assuming he's right. It'd be worth it.



Usually I'd regret knowing things like this (a little, at least), but for some reason, it doesn't really bother me this time. Probably because it's just a good theory, and not an actual spoiler. 'Course, I'll never know what it would have been like to have been blindsided by everything, but I think it'll still be a ton of fun watching things come together. Particularly given how many other little details still have to be explained by themselves.

But, diff'rent strokes. I'm biased, anyway, because I want to keep talking about it with as many people as possible.



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Yoda ... WOW, I'm stunned about the Kara/Daniel disconnection. That was one of those theories, frankly, that seemed to plug up far more holes than it left. And so, what? They bring up the idea of another model cylon this late in the series and it's just as backstory for Cavil? That seems like SUCH an odd thing to do, given the nature of the questions they had left unanswered at that point (namely, Kara). Then, to follow up with an entire episode regarding Kara and her father (being creative, playing piano, ties to cylon music) ... just seems like a HUGE jump backwards.

I'm curious if they just didn't realize the inadvertent connections they were making as they wrote this, or if they only meant it all to be only a minor distraction for us and not taken quite so seriously. (If that's true, they should have known better.)

Oh well ... it's funny that I just asked a few posts above, "What is Kara?" because my point was that your theory didn't account for her specifically and I'm still curious about that question. They are STILL showing her in the previews with the "What am I?" screaming bit ... it'd be REALLY rude if they don't answer that specific question. Or is it answered implicitly now with your theory? (trying not to need tags here)



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But, diff'rent strokes. I'm biased, anyway, because I want to keep talking about it with as many people as possible.
Oh, good. When you guys come over on Friday, we can talk talk talk till Wayne's head explodes.

I will have to start warning him now to ignore us. (Oddly he never got into this show, which I think he would LOVE as a tech geek and engineer. He loves Lost, but never took to this one.)



They'll definitely need to explain it either way, I think, and you're right, the theory being proposed here doesn't explain that. Then again, until Moore's comments, we didn't think we needed to explain it, because we thought we had it. Everyone did,; the theory was prevalent on some other forums, as well, from what I've read.

I hope they shock us with something cool there...if it's just something nebulous and spiritual, I'll be pretty let down. I know there's going to be a little of that in the finale, which I can deal with...but hopefully not too much.

I'm optimistic, though, if only because they really are hyping the living daylights out of the "What is Kara Thrace?" thing, as you mentioned. Hard to imagine them ramping it up like this if they didn't feel they had something satisfying to conclude with there. I guess we'll see.



Oh, good. When you guys come over on Friday, we can talk talk talk till Wayne's head explodes.

I will have to start warning him now to ignore us. (Oddly he never got into this show, which I think he would LOVE as a tech geek and engineer. He loves Lost, but never took to this one.)
Aye. Dunno what time we're coming over yet, but I figure if we get there within the first 40 minutes of the episode, the simple act of fast-forwarding through most of the commercials will have us finishing at nearly the same time as everyone else. We should be up there before it even starts, though. I'll keep you posted.



A system of cells interlinked
WARNING: "THE THEORY" spoilers below
Music = Math = Formula for navigating a black hole/formula for opening time gate/formula for successfully calculating a path through it?
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WARNING: "The BSG Finale Theory" spoilers below
My old man suggested that it'll end up being jump coordinates.



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So, why are we still using spoiler tags? We're the only three people in here. LOL...

I wish I had mental down time right now to think all this through. Sadly, work is calling to me, with a Friday deadline and I can't concentrate.

You guys rock, though -- doing all the heavy lifting for me.



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Great Theory Yoda! The only thing off the top of my head is I can't tie it into how it explains Kara's charred remains on the nuked planet? And based on this theory, whom would you guess the 12 Lords of Kobol are based on? I'm going over as much back-story as I can to see how well this fits into the over-all series and hope to have it either closer to 99.9% confirmed or totally dismissed by Fridays finale.
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I don't know if it explains that, but then again, I don't think any one theory has to pull everything together. We're going to need several revelations/twists to cover everything, I think.

No idea about spoiler tags. I'd say Piledriver's post is right on the line, though I guess we're only worried about Sam and anyone who reads but doesn't post, at this point...? Dunno. I'd still err on the side of caution.



A system of cells interlinked
I put Petey on the case, as he has an uncanny ability for analyzing stuff like this.

As for Kara's charred remains:

WARNING: "THE THEORY" spoilers below
The Lords of Kobol go back in time, far before the holocaust takes place. Our intrepid adventurers (re)start the journey of the 13th tribe. They will fulfill various legends and at some point, Kara will lead them to their end, which takes place on earth via nuclear holocaust. Rinse - Repeat. Or something along those lines.



Interesting. For that to happen...

WARNING: "BSG Series Finale Theory" spoilers below
...they'd have to jump forward in time quite a bit in the finale. Not that this is unheard of, as they obviously did it for New Caprica. Or, I suppose they could find a way to convey that it would happen.

One thing that'd still be left dangling, however, is Kara's initial disappearance and return. Though I wonder...

WARNING: "BSG Series Finale Theory" spoilers below
...if maybe she's already traveled through time. She was near some crazy nebula thing in Malestrom. Though I guess this is a stretch, as they'd probably have realized if it was a naked singularity, etc.

Man...now that the Daniel connection's been ruled out, it's amazing to think of how many things they have to explain in the finale, even after taking this theory into account. And most of them have to do with Kara.



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WARNING: "Kara" spoilers below
Yeah, I'm unsure of the Kara thing because if SHE jumped back in time, she remembers a GOOD earth. She seems eager to lead everyone there, and if it were a nuked mess, she would have told them.

And yet we see her charred remains on the nuked earth. Soooo ... she must have been nuked too? But yet, everyone else's remains are now bones, and hers seemed, well, "fresher." (Eww.)

So how do we explain the fact that she seems to have crash-landed on this nuked planet, DIED, and yet somehow gotten back OUT of whatever nebula she zapped into and back into her original time period intact and alive?


That IS the dilemma we're facing with these answers coming, right?



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WARNING: "Kara Part 2" spoilers below
In other words, without the option of her being SOME kind of cylon with resurrection capabilities, how do we explain this? Gotta be some sort of time travel issue ... but the timeline doesn't seem to match up with what info we already have.



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Okay, I thought about one question I have if Yoda's posted theory is true:

WARNING: "Final Five question" spoilers below
If everyone is time traveling, that MIGHT explain that 2,000-year gap of time regarding the Final Five. But ... why wouldn't they REMEMBER any of the time traveling if they've done this before? In every other time-travel thing I've seen in various shows and movies, they always remember everything. Or would that have something to do with Cavil? And if so, does HE know more than he's letting on then? If he knew to wipe their memories, would that be because he knows what's going on?



A system of cells interlinked
Cavil erased their memories. This has been stated.

As for the other issue:

WARNING: "The Kara Conundrum" spoilers below
Kara has simply found a later version of herself, a version which had traveled back in time and died in some way. This can really happen at any time, and can double back on itself until she is actually killed. She can pop about in time until she eventually takes a trip to just after the nukes go off, at which time she will die due to a radioactive disturbance in the atmosphere causing her to crash.


The above is complete poppycock, directly from my bum.

I have posted this illustrate exactly why Ron Moore is a famous and revered sci-fi writer, and I am a skinny goon from Massachusetts that designs brochures for a living.

My version almost works. Ron's totally will work.

Just think about the structure of Star Trek:TNGs "All Good Things" and how he ramped up the time travel trips by the end of the episode in order to quickly explain many things.

I think we are in for some of the same treatment, Battlestar style.