Girl Problem (cont.)

Tools    





[edited]
__________________
Δύο άτομα. Μια μάχη. Κανένας συμβιβασμός.



In the Beginning...
You're thinking too much.

If you and this girl really feel deeply and genuinely for one another, chances are you got there by being yourself. So just do the same now. That's the best you can do for her; that's what she wants and expects, I imagine. Of course she's going to have doubts, having dated this other guy for so long. I know it's agonizing, but it's probably no picnic for her either: she's got the feelings of two guys she cares about on the line.

Like I said, just be yourself. Be the rock for her, no matter what. At some point, she's going to make a choice, and I'd be willing to bet she'll choose the guy who was patient and considerate and honest the whole time. And that's what you should be anyway.

Just don't play any games with her. Don't cut off contact to see if she starts ringing your phone off the hook. Just be there for her, step back when she needs you to, and all should be okay.

And if it isn't, and she goes with the other guy, well... it'll hurt, but as long as you be all the things I mentioned above, then you'll know you did all you could.

Good luck, man. Keep us posted.



I wipe my ass with your feelings
Women are ****ing ****s.

All you need to do is **** them and leave. Words are troublesome.
__________________
We're soldiers. Soldiers don't go to hell. It's war. Soldiers, they kill other soldiers. We're in a situation where everybody involved knows the stakes. And if you're gonna accept those stakes... You gotta do certain things. It's business, we're soldiers. We follow codes... Orders.



In the Beginning...
Originally Posted by Godsend
Women are ****ing ****s.

All you need to do is **** them and leave. Words are troublesome.
Whatever it was that made you want to say that, it still doesn't give you the right to talk about women like that.

You should apologize.



Putting Godsend's dumbass remark aside for a minute; I think you will be miserable either way. What if she chooses you...then leaves you when something better (in her eyes) comes along. It just sounds like she is holding onto you in case she loses this other guy. Why does she have such a hold on you buddy? She obviously doesn't feel the same way for you or else she would be with you right now. You have been aching over this woman for how long now, and she still won't come back? It's time to be honest and tell her that you have too strong of feelings for her and if she can't be with you, then you are going to have to get past her. It's not an altimatum. Heartache is a killer bud!



Wait until he leaves, don't see her in the meantime. Give her time to process things. You can talk to her but seeing her too soon would be very very bad. Give it a little time, give yourself time to prepare for either possibility. If things are going to work between the two of you, some baggage must be disposed of and that sometimes takes a while.

Coming out of any long term relationship, regardless of distance, is difficult. The last thing you want to be is a rebound. Regardless of your feelings for her, and hers for you, jumping right in is a bad idea.

Best of luck, give yourself time and space and remember there can and always will be another "her", but there is only one you.
__________________
"You have to believe in God before you can say there are things that man was not meant to know. I don't think there's anything man wasn't meant to know. There are just some stupid things that people shouldn't do." -David Cronenberg



I sense that the only answer you are looking for is one that places you in her arms and "they all lived happily ever after". You have two choices and it is for you (and her) to decide which course to take:

1. You have to go all out and put everything you have into making this girl realize that you are hers, heart and soul, No holds barred.!!

2. Walk away, only you know if this is the right choice, but if you do not choose choice number one, you have to choose this option. It will hurt, it will sting, but one day you will see that it may have been the right answer.

No more indecision; you are either meant for each other or you are not, do not hurt yourself mentally by prolonging your desires.
And remember; If you do go all out and do not win her over then by God you learned early on that it was not meant to be and you saved a lot of years, or you go all out and it pays off and you two live a long time in each others arms and share many things. Either way, you need to (for lack of better metaphor) cut bait or fish my man. Good Luck.
__________________
“The gladdest moment in human life, methinks, is a departure into unknown lands.” – Sir Richard Burton



rhymes with Goebbels
Originally Posted by Godsend
Women are ****ing ****s.

All you need to do is **** them and leave. Words are troublesome.
Aah, a romantic. I love it.

While I'll happily agree most people are rather crap, there's no need to get all barky about it. And morals for the win, Godsend. All that ****ing and leaving is a bit rude.

Originally Posted by Gummo
What if she chooses you...then leaves you when something better (in her eyes) comes along.
Ehh, idunno. I think that implies that she has slightly malicious tendencies. Mind you, as much as I'm not a fan of the idea, I'm a pretty firm believer that love is who is the best possible fit for you at the moment. So right now I'm going to believe that it's a fact that the girl loves him, legitamitely, and that it is something that is not worth giving up on.

The entire situation just seems like a bit of a waiting game, though. So, honestly, I wouldn't worry right now. Just wait a few days until he goes back home, and let all of the confusion marinate with her, and THEN let yourself worry. I'll agree with whomever it was who said that you should act exactly as you have before the boyfriend came over. The last thing you want is to give her any impression of either excessive neediness or standoffishness. Make it clear that you're giving her time to think this over and that you support her, and then back away and act normally.
__________________
A devilish combination of slightly bored and quite hungry



rhymes with Goebbels
I genuinely think things are looking good for you, if that means anything. It sounds like this is the first time she has even thought of being with someone other than her boyfriend of x-number of years, so clearly she thinks you offer something that no one else has yet to. I would probably say that it is more a problem of guilt towards the other guy than it is anything else. And guilt is not synonymous with proper love.



Originally Posted by shirble
I genuinely think things are looking good for you, if that means anything. It sounds like this is the first time she has even thought of being with someone other than her boyfriend of x-number of years, so clearly she thinks you offer something that no one else has yet to. I would probably say that it is more a problem of guilt towards the other guy than it is anything else. And guilt is not synonymous with proper love.

This is true, and she has mentioned her guilt several times so I do think it has more to do with guilt than anything else.

Lets hope you're right shirble.



A system of cells interlinked
I don't know... How about you be the big man and put a stop to all of this. The chick is with someone. I know if I had been with someone fore 7 (or, say, 10) years, I wouldn't want some sly dude trying to slide in with my girl, attempting to court her while she was committed to someone else, even if she instigated it... People get feelings for one another all the time, but, committment is a choice, a decision. Also, girls get confused, a lot.

Sorry if I sound harsh, but, There aren't many people I disrespect more than people that pursue interests with people who are already in a relationship. It's weak, big time. I mean, can people stand up and try to meet someone that is actually available? Attempting to court a vulnerable confused girl seems sort of predatory, to me.

This is seven years of people's lives you are playing with. Think about it.

She is attempting to fill holes that have formed in their relationship. Fill them with you. You are being used. She wants to have her cake and eat it to. It's unfair to him. It's unfair to you. I would much rather pursue someone that knows who they are, at least somewhat, can stand on their own two feet, and won't attempt to have the best of both worlds by acting all wishy washy with two different dudes.

Nah. Played that game, it's no fun, and people get hurt. Think about the motives at work here.
__________________
“It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance.” ― Thomas Sowell



Hey Eq. Sorry to hear you're having trouble, man. Anyway, I dunno if my advice is useful, or even particularly welcome, but in case you find it helpful at all, here it is:

All of us here know you as a very intelligent and very emotional person; I'm guessing you'd probably agree on both counts. Because you're intelligent, I have no doubt that you know how dangerous this entire situation must sound to someone on the outside. But because you're emotional as well, I realize it may not do much good to say so.

Twice in my (admittedly short) adult life, I've found myself in a situation like yours in that I was trying to make someone who had interest in me want me more. I even wondered, just as you're wondering now, whether or not I should drop all contact and let them come to me. I know now, however, that once someone finds themselves asking that question, the relationship is probably already lost. The "should I play it cool?" question only comes up when the relationship is failing to develop properly on its own. I think it's usually an act of desperation, and I say that more as a critique of my behavior than yours.

Also, I think that anyone who is willing to leave a long-term relationship on your account is surely going to be willing to leave you the next time someone new (and therefore exciting) comes along.

And as harsh as this may sound (and I don't mean for it to), you've described yourself as being hopelessly in love with several girls over the course of just a couple of years, and each time, you explained, vividly and convincingly, that you simply could not see yourself getting over said girl. But obviously, in the past, you have. So while it's hard to see past the situation you're in now, but I think you'll probably get past this one, too,

A friend of mine had a girlfriend awhile back who was determined to move their relationship along at warp speed. When they eventually broke up (after several years), she rushed headlong into another relationship. And then again. Each time, within weeks, she was adorning her MySpace profile with declarations of love. Words like "eternity" and talk of her unending happiness and dedication took months, rather than years, to appear. It was like wanting to construct the world's tallest building in record time and not caring where it was built or what the foundation was made of.

I'm not a pyschologist, but I don't think this is all explained by the fact that she, like some people, simply fell in love very easily. I think it stems from a failure to distinguish between love, and being in love, and a need to duplicate the steadidness of the genuine long-term relationship that she'd lost. I don't think you can artificially speed up that sort of affection, though. If you do, it seems to me that you end up giving yourself over to someone who does not realize you're doing so, does not appreciate the fact that you're doing so, doesn't feel as intensely towards you as you do them, or who may simply not be the person you think they are. You have to know and see someone for a long time, I think, before you can give them that kind of influence over you.

I wish you nothing but the best. In the past, I've had numerous people, whose judgement I trusted entirely, warn me about things like this. And even when everything they said aligned perfectly with the suspicions I already had, I couldn't bring myself to listen to them. I had to learn the hard way. And I did. I hope you can avoid that, at least in this instance, but if not, well, I certainly won't be judging you.

Best of luck, man. I hope this helped in some small way.



Originally Posted by Yoda
Hey Eq. Sorry to hear you're having trouble, man. Anyway, I dunno if my advice is useful, or even particularly welcome, but in case you find it helpful at all, here it is:

All of us here know you as a very intelligent and very emotional person; I'm guessing you'd probably agree on both counts. Because you're intelligent, I have no doubt that you know how dangerous this entire situation must sound to someone on the outside. But because you're emotional as well, I realize it may not do much good to say so.

Twice in my (admittedly short) adult life, I've found myself in a situation like yours in that I was trying to make someone who had interest in me want me more. I even wondered, just as you're wondering now, whether or not I should drop all contact and let them come to me. I know now, however, that once someone finds themselves asking that question, the relationship is probably already lost. The "should I play it cool?" question only comes up when the relationship is failing to develop properly on its own. I think it's usually an act of desperation, and I say that more as a critique of my behavior than yours.

Also, I think that anyone who is willing to leave a long-term relationship on your account is surely going to be willing to leave you the next time someone new (and therefore exciting) comes along.

And as harsh as this may sound (and I don't mean for it to), you've described yourself as being hopelessly in love with several girls over the course of just a couple of years, and each time, you explained, vividly and convincingly, that you simply could not see yourself getting over said girl. But obviously, in the past, you have. So while it's hard to see past the situation you're in now, but I think you'll probably get past this one, too,

A friend of mine had a girlfriend awhile back who was determined to move their relationship along at warp speed. When they eventually broke up (after several years), she rushed headlong into another relationship. And then again. Each time, within weeks, she was adorning her MySpace profile with declarations of love. Words like "eternity" and talk of her unending happiness and dedication took months, rather than years, to appear. It was like wanting to construct the world's tallest building in record time and not caring where it was built or what the foundation was made of.

I'm not a pyschologist, but I don't think this is all explained by the fact that she, like some people, simply fell in love very easily. I think it stems from a failure to distinguish between love, and being in love, and a need to duplicate the steadidness of the genuine long-term relationship that she'd lost. I don't think you can artificially speed up that sort of affection, though. If you do, it seems to me that you end up giving yourself over to someone who does not realize you're doing so, does not appreciate the fact that you're doing so, doesn't feel as intensely towards you as you do them, or who may simply not be the person you think they are. You have to know and see someone for a long time, I think, before you can give them that kind of influence over you.

I wish you nothing but the best. In the past, I've had numerous people, whose judgement I trusted entirely, warn me about things like this. And even when everything they said aligned perfectly with the suspicions I already had, I couldn't bring myself to listen to them. I had to learn the hard way. And I did. I hope you can avoid that, at least in this instance, but if not, well, I certainly won't be judging you.

Best of luck, man. I hope this helped in some small way.

Wow Chris. I'm really grateful for the time and effort you spent on your response. It not only has helped me, but also will be something that will be on my mind when I must make a decision about what I do.

I agree with alot of what you said and believe me, i am under no delusions about my serial monogamy. Every girl I fall for does seem like "the one" even though I know its merely a relationship. I have no quarells with saying this situation is just the same.

Its nice to get advice from people who have never met me physically but who have at least an understanding about the way I think and feel about things, and I'm glad that was part of your assessment.

In the end what all of you are saying is right. i'm in a lose-lose situation. My best bet is to get up and leave now while I still have the power and the choice to do so. Otherwise I'm lending myself to eventual emotional despair.

Its just a bit hard to walk away at the moment, it feels as though I'm burying something alive? And its hard to walk away from something that you feel isn't done yet, and still has life and hope for success.

I'll wait a few days, hear her out, then do what I have to do from there.



Yeah, just as there's certain things people online will never be able to do for you or help you with, I think there are some things they're even better for than real-life friends. They can be harsher, and blunter, and judge you without the types of bias that might result from knowing you in real life. I'm with you there...some people might think it's silly to ask for advice online, but for some situations, it's far better.

Originally Posted by Equilibrium
Its just a bit hard to walk away at the moment, it feels as though I'm burying something alive?
I think that's probably the best description of this kind of situation that I've ever heard. Very well put.

I really hope this works out for you, however it should.



A system of cells interlinked
Eq, I don't mean to sound harsh. Sorry if it came across that way. I am just a tiny bit bitter about this subject at the mo... Take what I say with a grain of salt...but, you knew that anyway



Originally Posted by Sedai
Eq, I don't mean to sound harsh. Sorry if it came across that way. I am just a tiny bit bitter about this subject at the mo... Take what I say with a grain of salt...but, you knew that anyway
No I understand. Believe me I don't like being the ******* who copped a feel from a girl who had a seven year relationship going, Even if she was the one who instigated everything. So I understand the harshness and I do embrace it, you know we've both been here a long time so there won't be any hard feelings.

On the other hand, maybe we can chat sometime..or something..got aim or a telephone number if you're in the states?

No matter, all I ask is for some interesting reads at this forum to keep me busy. Lol, what happened to Golgot, he was good at dishing out obscenely interesting links.



Ok so he left. And she called me. But its been 25 minutes and its been just CHIT CHAT. i DONT WANT TO *ASK* about what sort of conclusion she came to. What should I do??? Or is it okay to ask her "so, whats going on with..."

etc.



rhymes with Goebbels
Hah, yeah, I would say it's beyond okay to ask. She possibly feels a bit awkward bringing up her boyfriend in front of you. I think you definitely need to make it clear how important all of this stuff is to you, if you already haven't.



wow. I can't believe what is coming out of her mouth....more on that when this convo ends.