Western Hall of Fame II

Registered User

01-01-20

The Great Silence

One helluva revisionist Western. Imagine John Wayne in this haha!

So, A pretty solid movie. I didn't love it or anything, but the main hero and villain were both fascinating characters. I loved the idea of the mute bounty hunter as the lead, it leads to more intimate moments between characters.

Direction and cinematography were great, but something didn't quite click that would make this a favorite.

I still recommend it for Westerns lovers.

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Zotis

BANNED

01-02-20

Don't worry, I'm still participating, was going to watch one tonight actually.

Zotis

BANNED

01-02-20

The Ox-Bow Incident

Overall a fairly decent movie. I nearly shed a tear at the end. What I liked about it was the powerful subject matter and representation of all of the characters and their arguments. It's a very moral movie. But I did take issue with one aspect, the poor portrayal of the effects of alcohol.

I'll describe a scene near the beginning of the movie and my issue with it.

View Spoilers

WARNING: "The Ox-Bow Incident" spoilers below

In the first scene, which takes place in a bar, two men are drinking whisky. One says of his friend that he's had five whiskys. He gets irritated easily and punches out another man before the bartender smashes a bottle over his head knocking him out. His friend then drags him into a chair and explains that he likes to fight when he's drunk and then splashes water on his face. He goes outside to puke, presumably from drinking too much, and then suddenly a commotion stirs. There are people discussing lynching a man and by this time he seems completely sober, though to be honest he never seemed like he had more than one beer aside from the poor attempts at seeming agitated easily as a result of being supposedly drunk.

Wyldesyde19

The trick is not minding

01-03-20

The Shooting

This was one of the 3 westerns I hadn�t heard of in this HOF (The Great Silence and The Salvation being the other 2). Considering it had Jack Nicholson in it, I�m surprised.
Reading up on it I saw it wasn�t released in American theatres, although it did get a release in France where it did well. I can see some good ideas here, but it doesn�t come together that well.

The acting is the best part of it, as is the tension between the 4 characters.
Nicholson is menacing as the hired gun, and Warren Oates is his usual gruff self. They both eye each other warily and size each other up throughout the film.
Millie Perkins was good, not great, as the women who ha shores Oates and his friend for a job. A job she won�t say.

The tension is palpable between them, and slowly builds to the climax, which I won�t spoil. It�s definitely worth watching. But the editing could be frustratiibg at times, with certain scenes cut away to another rather abruptly.
That includes the ending.
Still, there�s a good film here. Just not a great one.

Last edited by Wyldesyde19; 01-03-20 at 02:39 PM.

cricket

Msg

Registered User

01-03-20

Originally Posted by Zotis

The Ox-Bow Incident

View Spoilers

WARNING: "The Ox-Bow Incident" spoilers below

So I guess your issue is that someone who's drunk can suddenly be sober. I understand how it looks, but this happened to me many times in the past. It can certainly happen from throwing up, but it's not the only reason, and often times it's something suddenly happening. It's an odd thing but sometimes you just snap out of it.

Citizen Rules

Noir Time

01-03-20

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly (1966)

I'd seen this several times before but not for almost 20 years. Before this HoF started I was working on my Top 100 Western Countdown list and TGTBTU was a lock for the top of my list. But after watching this last night, I'm not even sure if it will make my Countdown list.

Don't get me wrong, I think this is a very important film. It has some very impressive camera work and the score by Ennio Morricone is the stuff of legend! The film is certainly ground breaking and clearly would shape Quentin Tarantino's future movie making. I was amazed at just how similar in tone and style TGTBTU was to some of Tarantino's films. And maybe that's why I didn't like this as much as I had expected to. The overtly obvious sound effects and stuff like flying hats that are shot, just seemed more silly than great and I'm not a fan of super close ups either.

But there's no denying there's greatness here. The cemetery scene when Tuco (Eli Wallach) goes running from grave to grave, then ends up in the center of the cemetery running circles, as the camera spins around...causing the background to fly by...OMG...that was a thing of genius! And the Civil War set on the hill side, amazing. The set was so big in scope and by using the three dimensional hill sides and the valley below, then brought the huge scale of war to the viewer.

You know I had always thought of TGTBTU as a Clint Eastwood film. But he's really not the draw here, it's Eli Wallach as Tuco the Rat who steals every scene he's in. For the record Eastwood is good here as the 'Good' and it's nice to see Lee Van Cleef the 'Bad' get to showcase his talents.

TGTBTU is an impressive film alright, but at 3 hours it's too long for it's basically simply story line. I felt the length in this film and checked the time remaining more than once...where as in The Cowboys at 2 hours 20 minutes, I never once checked the time and ended the movie wishing it had been longer. So ultimately TGTBTU felt like a film maker singing his own praises by making an epic, and yet the story couldn't support the epic run time, at least for me.

Wyldesyde19

The trick is not minding

01-03-20

I keep going back to the ending of The Shooting and I�m torn on it. I liked it, but i think the issue I had was the freeze frames.

Citizen Rules

Noir Time

01-03-20

Originally Posted by Wyldesyde19

I keep going back to the ending of The Shooting and I�m torn on it. I liked it, but i think the issue I had was the freeze frames.

I hate freeze frames in general...but they were in style in the later 60s and early 70s. So I guess at that time they were like their today's CG.

Wyldesyde19

The trick is not minding

01-03-20

Originally Posted by Citizen Rules

Originally Posted by Wyldesyde19

I keep going back to the ending of The Shooting and I�m torn on it. I liked it, but i think the issue I had was the freeze frames.

I hate freeze frames in general...but they were in style in the later 60s and early 70s. So I guess at that time they were like their today's CG.

Freeze frames can be ok when done right, like with Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. As an ending it�s more impactful.
With The Shooting and The stepmother (early 1970�s film). It was jarring and interrupted the flow of the film.

ahwell

Registered User

01-03-20

The freeze frame at the end of the 400 Blows is the culprit/inspiration for most of them I think. It�s probably the best freeze frame ever, one of my favorite endings to a movie period. But damn, why it have to inspire so many bad ones?

cricket

Msg

Registered User

01-03-20

My favorite freeze frame is at the end of Joe (1970)

Wyldesyde19

The trick is not minding

01-03-20

Originally Posted by cricket

My favorite freeze frame is at the end of Joe (1970)

I forgot about that!

edarsenal

Women will be your undoing, P�p�

01-03-20

Originally Posted by cricket

My favorite freeze frame is at the end of Joe (1970)

I remember that one. That WAS a good freeze frame ending

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edarsenal

Women will be your undoing, P�p�

01-03-20

Who Shot Liberty Valance

Ransom Stoddard: You're not going to use the story, Mr. Scott?
Maxwell Scott: No, sir. This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend.

With the usual "Line in the Sand" morality that I've come to acknowledge in a John Ford film, or rather in the small, but upper echelon, list of films I've seen, we watch as a "young" lawyer (Jimmy Stewart) with an idealistic believe in civilized justice aka the law clashes with the violent, lawless ruffian Liberty Valance played with a slimy repugnance befitting a John Ford villain with the brilliance that Lee Marvin brings. The only true shield (whether Stewarts' Stoddard wants it or not) is John Wayne playing the dour Doniphon.

Backing them and the story is a strong cast that includes Vera Miles, Andy Devine, Edmond O'Brien, Strother Martin, Lee Van Cleef, Woody Strode and a cameo by John Carradine done with Shakespearean gusto.

While the film appears to follow the inevitable duel between Stoddard and Valance it is more about the "legends" that become the preference to the actual "truth" of a well known incident. Kind of makes you wonder about so many western legends and what was the actual true occurrence in many of them.
It only comments on those that rise to prominence due to the legend and how it leaves others behind.

A stout morality tale and a very worthwhile Western I'll be revisiting.

Citizen Rules

Noir Time

01-03-20

I'm a big fan of Lee Marvin's. I can think of a few of his films that I might nominate in some future HoF.

edarsenal

Women will be your undoing, P�p�

01-03-20

Originally Posted by Citizen Rules

I'm a big fan of Lee Marvin's. I can think of a few of his films that I might nominate in some future HoF.

I can't help but think of the irony in how that reminds me of:

with you not caring for Tarrantino lol

I am the same way. While it's hard to pick a favorite, I do especially enjoy him in The Dirty Dozen

Wyldesyde19

The trick is not minding

01-03-20

Originally Posted by edarsenal

Kind of makes you wonder about so many western legends and what was the actual true occurrence in many of them.

Like Wyatt Earp, for example, who was greatly responsible for creating his myth while exaggerating certain experiences or, in a lot of cases, outright lied about them.
The legend and the truth of Earp�s life is something I think of when I watch Liberty Valance.

edarsenal

Women will be your undoing, P�p�

01-03-20

Originally Posted by Wyldesyde19

Very true. As well as the newspapers that would glamorize them time and time again.

Zotis

BANNED

01-04-20

Originally Posted by cricket

That's not quite my issue. A drunk person can have a moment of sobriety when something important demands their attention, and puking the alcohol out of your system can help you come down a lot, but not to the extent in that scene. Even when they're sitting at the bar drinking and talking they aren't slurring at all, they don't have that glazed look in their eyes, they aren't stumbling, they just don't even seem like they've had 3 or 4 beers let alone 5 whiskies.

Citizen Rules