President Trump

Why is every Trump supporter's go to:

But OBAMA did this....But OBAMA did that....just give it a rest.

I don't care about Obama, I'm talking about TRUMP.

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Senate Democratic Leader Charles Schumer (N.Y.) on Tuesday dismissed a legislative proposal backed by Republican leaders to keep immigrant families together at the border, arguing that President Trump could fix the problem more easily with a flick of his pen.

http://thehill.com/homenews/senate/3...-border-crisis

Democrats want to keep the pressure on Trump instead of having Congress assume responsibility for the growing crisis.

Maintaining problems to ensure maximum anti-Trump hatred for desired political advantage is far more important to the left than enacting solutions.

That is what is labeled as "Whataboutism", isn't it? You turn on FOX (a propaganda channel IMO, not a news channel), all you hear is "What about this..", "What about that..." its like they committed a murder, we should be allowed to do so as well. MSNBC is no better either.

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That is politics for you. If it was the other way around, it would have been the same. The end goal is to get back as the ruling party. But if Trump can really do it with a signature, why doesn't he? Win a few swing voters over maybe in the process.

Because they think it's some kind of clever gotcha that exposes the absolute hypocrisy of the left as if somehow Obama being unable or unwilling to solve a problem gives Trump carte blanche to either perpetuate or exacerbate it.

Meanwhile, exaggerating or even fabricating problems in order to justify disturbingly extreme "solutions" is way too important to the right.

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Whataboutism is, indeed, not an excuse for anything. But it also can't be brushed off. You can't ignore what someone is doing while they're doing it, and then when it's over say "well, that's done, so I don't have to account for my support (or tacit/silent approval) of it at the time."

Whataboutism is not a defense of what's happening, but it also can't be ignored just because it's not a defense of what's happening.

Part of the reason is because the left operates on double standards as its regular tactic.

Some people would like the public to know the level of hypocrisy these folks engage in, so they use comparisons of how they behaved when their champion was in office and how their behavior suddenly does a 180 when someone they don't like is in the same position.

We're seeing it in this current "crisis" which, for the same people up in arms, was a complete non-issue before Trump took office. But now that they've seen how using the emotional impact (which they themselves were somehow devoid of when Obama was in office) can serve them as a weapon, they are suddenly activists for those they are now designating as victims of this President whom they are now comparing to a Nazi on a daily basis.

Border-crossers have been treated poorly for years and years. The main reason I see people getting angry about it now is because the TV is telling them to be angry. Just the latest edition of The Morning Hate, IMO.

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The interesting thing is that ignoring an argument because it's whataboutism is, itself, operating on the exact same logic as whataboutism: you're not being consistent, therefore I don't have to address the problem you're presenting.

For a Trump defender, it's "Obama/Clinton did this, so I don't have to defend Trump for it."

For the person they're arguing with, it's "you're not offering a defense of Trump, so I never have to reconcile this contradiction."

I can be both critical of pre-Trump liberal complacency and Trump himself for making things so much worse that said complacency has been considerably disrupted as a result.

This all makes me think of the wizards first rule:

“People are stupid. They will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true.” “Sometimes, making the wrong choice is better than making no choice."

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"Can be" is distinct from "was," and possibly from "will be in the future."

The implied argument here is that this stuff only happens after the fact, when there's nothing at stake and no political sacrifice in admitting something. It's reasonable to expect that, while a politician still holds power or has the potential to gain power, they'll benefit from all the same rationalizations and circle-the-wagons special pleading as before.

I hope I'm wrong. But tribalism is a helluva drug.

Probably - I guess I'd have to do some digging to prove "I am" or whatever. In any case, it'd be fine if it meant that various left-wing sub-groups actually did self-reflectively unify and evolve into something better than their current states rather than stay divided enough to be defeated by a right wing that created a significant enough unity through some genuinely toxic ideals - still would've been a lot better to not have to bear witness to this level of government-ordained callousness first, though.

This is akin to holding a child hostage with a gun because you can, then the hostage taker blaming the democrats for not tackling him and stopping him but instead just shouting "put the gun down!". How about put the gun down... Or dont take the kid hostage to begin with.

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Exposed: the Dems LOVE having these children suffer.

It's their latest weapon against Trump and they absolutely REFUSE to give it up.

It is Congress' job to create laws (not the President's)... so what happens?...


1. The Dems claim what's happening is horrible (despite their completely ignoring it in past administrations, but okay...)

2. Republicans agree and almost immediately (since the Dems turned this long running policy into a sudden "crisis") present a bill to stop it.

3. Dems refuse to sign it because they openly admit they want to "keep the pressure on Trump."

(Again, passing laws is the Congress's job!)

They outright refuse to stop the very thing they say is horrible because it would mean they couldn't use it against one single individual. They'll allow thousands of children to suffer just to try to hurt one single person.


They want to horror to continue. Their hatred for Trump trumps everything else, even their own double standards of morality. They prefer little children to suffer and keep on suffering if it means they can daily & nightly barrage the public with some false blame placed on one man.

It is unbelievable. The left are not Nazis as they now accuse anyone who respects the U.S. rule of law as being - they're worse.

i do agree with this, but it's also annoying when it's clearly a deflection tactic and nothing more and the person doing it doesn't actually care.

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This analogy fails on a couple pretty basic levels. Laws are not (or shouldn't be) elective the way taking a hostage clearly is. And even ignoring that, Democrats clearly aren't being asked to make some herculean or heroic effort akin to tackling a shooter: they're being asked to vote yes on a bill that does exactly the thing they say must be done. As far as I can tell it's a "clean" bill, so why wouldn't they vote for it?

Yes, it is very annoying! It also feels like you're letting a thoughtless person off the hook, to address their contradiction when they so clearly refuse to address their own.

Best option, I think, is to call their bluff by admitting things when necessary and putting it on them to do the same. They usually don't, which condemns them more than most of what I would say to them, anyway.

Clean? It insists on $25 billion for funding in his silly wall. Thats absolutely holding the kids hostage. And honestly, ALL he has to do is STOP ripping kids away from their families. He can do that ALL by himself. Thus the analogy. So I JUST dont understand ANY level of arguing about how this is all on the democrats to make things stop. How about telling Trump to stop! And anyway, there is grumbling from the extreme wing of the republican party that this "compromise" might not be draconian enough for them so may not end up being the democrats "fault" either way.