A scary thing happened on the way to the Movie Forums - Horrorcrammers

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Blue Sunshine, 1977 (B+)

A good horror/thriller about a bunch of Stanford graduates turning bald and violent.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
I often find movies that feel like their pacing were a challenge to get through often start to pick up the pace after a few rewatches. Just a phenomenon I've observed. I don't know why. I suspect it has something to do with familiarity or maybe expectation, but it does seem to happen. Which is to say, I find myself having no issues with the pacing in the Herzog version these days (I think the first watch or so left me a bit cold).
Is there anything (horror) that you do have pacing issues with? I think it'd be interesting to see if I felt differently about what you feel is slow. That would be a hard one to disagree on. I think pacing is a very obvious function.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
On a separate note, do you guys think that Val Lewton's Cat People was the first elevated horror movie? Since Lewton deliberately made a horror movie that was like The Wolf Man but stripped of its effects and made to be thought-provoking and more reliant on imagination.

Quote: "We tossed away the horror formula right from the start. No mask-like faces hardly human, with gnashing teeth and hair standing on end."



On a separate note, do you guys think that Val Lewton's Cat People was the first elevated horror movie? Since Lewton deliberately made a horror movie that was like The Wolf Man but stripped of its effects and made to be thought-provoking and more reliant on imagination.

Quote: "We tossed away the horror formula right from the start. No mask-like faces hardly human, with gnashing teeth and hair standing on end."
"Elevated" Horror? What's that?



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
I thought the 1928 version of The Fall of the House of Usher was pretty elevated.
Why?

I’d say Nosferatu was probably the first.
What was it elevating above? Was there even a horror movie standard in the 1920s?



The trick is not minding
What was it elevating above? Was there even a horror movie standard in the 1920s?
Elevated horror was essentially artistic horror. Or art house horror. The original Nosferatu clearly qualifies as such given it’s artistic qualities and given its importance in the German Expressionism film movement.
I’m not sure you’re using “elevated horror” in the same sense of it’s actual definition.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
Elevated horror was essentially artistic horror. Or art house horror. The original Nosferatu clearly qualifies as such given it’s artistic qualities and given its importance in the German Expressionism film movement.
I’m not sure you’re using “elevated horror” in the same sense of it’s actual definition.
So let me get this straight, in order for something to be considered artistic, it has to meet a subgenre guideline? So horror that doesn't meet this standard of "art house" would be considered what? Unartistic?

I believe that elevated horror is a movement away from the present standard within the genre. It's a ripple in the pond, it's not some segregated stagnate idea. It's alive, brother.



The trick is not minding
So let me get this straight, in order for something to be considered artistic, it has to meet a subgenre guideline? So horror that doesn't meet this standard of "art house" would be considered what? Unartistic?

I believe that elevated horror is a movement away from the present standard within the genre. It's a ripple in the pond, it's not some segregated stagnate idea. It's alive, brother.
That’s not what I suggested at all. I’m merely explaining what the term actually means, as well as films that legitimately fit under that description.
You asked about early horror films would be considered as such, and I, along with Takoma, answered.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
That’s not what I suggested at all. I’m merely explaining what the term actually means, as well as films that legitimately fit under that description.
You asked about early horror films would be considered as such, and I, along with Takoma, answered.
You legitimately feel that a plagiarized version of Dracula (and not The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari and its surrealistic production design) was the first elevated horror film ever created?



The trick is not minding
You legitimately feel that a plagiarized version of Dracula (and not The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari and its surrealistic production design) was the first elevated horror film ever created?
Cabinet of Caligari would be have been first, yes, but I don’t think I ever argued it wasn’t.
When I first posted, I was merely going off the first film that came to my memory without using google (as evidenced by my inclusion of the word “probably”), but it shifted more towards a discussion of earlier elevated horror films anyways, and which would fit under that definition, and so never felt compelled to bring it up as being the first.
The point still remains, Nosferatu, although not being the first, clearly meets the requirements of your earlier question, despite being “plagiarism”, which is irrelevant to the question you posted anyways.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
Cabinet of Caligari would be have been first, yes, but I don’t think I ever argued it wasn’t.
When I first posted, I was merely going off the first film that came to my memory without using google (as evidenced by my inclusion of the word “probably”), but it shifted more towards a discussion of earlier elevated horror films anyways, and which would fit under that definition, and so never felt compelled to bring it up as being the first.
The point still remains, Nosferatu, although not being the first, clearly meets the requirements of your earlier question, despite being “plagiarism”, which is irrelevant to the question you posted anyways.
Well, it's nice to meet ya.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
Nosferatu, although not being the first, clearly meets the requirements of your earlier question, despite being “plagiarism”, which is irrelevant to the question you posted anyways.
Just out of curiosity, what requirements are met with selecting Nosferatu? I mean, what sets it apart from other horror movies of the 1920s? Why choose Nosferatu? Expound on the film for me if you would.



The trick is not minding
Just out of curiosity, what requirements are met with selecting Nosferatu? I mean, what sets it apart from other horror movies of the 1920s? Why choose Nosferatu? Expound on the film for me if you would.
I already had when I mentioned its artistic qualities and German expressionism. To explain further, I would say The use of shadows, of its frightening images and haunting atmosphere, all achieved on a level of perfection on a technical level unheard of for the time.



I thought elevated horror was horror involving elevators, like Devil or that movie about the killer lift.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
I already had when I mentioned its artistic qualities and German expressionism. To explain further, I would say The use of shadows, of its frightening images and haunting atmosphere, all achieved on a level of perfection on a technical level unheard of for the time.
Yeah, you're very good at categorizing, but what I was looking for was more of an explanation, which you now appear to have provided. So shadows, frightening images and a haunting atmosphere. These are the things that elevated it from other horror films of the time?

Just to further go down this road of curiosity, have you seen Häxan?



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
I thought elevated horror was horror involving elevators, like Devil or that movie about the killer lift.
The Shining for the win!



The trick is not minding
Yeah, you're very good at categorizing, but what I was looking for was more of an explanation, which you now appear to have provided. So shadows, frightening images and a haunting atmosphere. These are the things that elevated it from other horror films of the time?

Just to further go down this road of curiosity, have you seen Häxan?
It isn’t so much those things but how those things are accomplished. The technical achievements were amazing for the time. Now, I can’t accurately compare it to Caligari as I haven’t seen Caligari in over a decade, although I remember being very impressed. I have the benefit of owning Nosferatu, and have watched it a few times and more recently. I’m not sure which I would give the edge to, or I’m being fair. *

As for Haxan….. Not yet! It’s definitely on my watchlist, and saved on Criterion for a later date. Which I hope is soon, of course. You’d be surprised at the amount of classics I have yet to get around to, but the amount of lesser seen films (especially Italian and Asian films of the 70’s and 80’s) I have seen might surprise one as well.

*eyes Umberto Lenzi’s and Sergio Martino’s filmographies I recently started up*. 👀