A scary thing happened on the way to the Movie Forums - Horrorcrammers

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I guess in keeping with the general conversation, what do you consider your horror "blindspots", if you have any?

The ones I hear about most often but haven't seen are:

Rosemary's Baby
King Kong
The Fly
Day of the Dead
The Wolf Man
Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer


And then a whole slew of 60s titles like Masque of the Red Death.
Dead of Night is the one that jumps first to mind.



Frozen Scream (Roach 1975) & The Slayer (Cardone, 1982)


“It is one of those works that has proceeded directly to the status of Great Movie without going through the intermediate stage of being a good movie.” Roger Ebert said this about Sergei Eisenstein’s Ivan the Terrible, and these words came to mind when I was watching Frank Roach’s Frozen Scream. It’s got a plot that’s total nonsense, seems to be slapped together with no grasp of normal filmmaking language and and is never less than completely fascinating. If I can describe the story, it involves the hero investigating a pair of mad scientists who are searching for the secret of immortality, which to them means enslaving people and turning them into braindead zombies. (The exact method involves freezing people to near death and then reviving them, hence the “frozen” scream in the title.) The hero narrates his quest in a robotic monotone that brings to mind Microsoft Sam, and calls out one of the villains’ “bad acting”, which is a bold claim to be making in this movie.

What follows is a mishmash of dreams drifted into and out of, visual non sequiturs that puncture the somnambulist ambience, a lot of the flat acting one associates with the marginal productions of regional horror but seems thematically appropriate here, and dissonant synthesizer music that serves as the score. I scrambled to jot down notes as I watched this in a desperate attempt to make sense of what I was seeing. A grim reaper in a dream with a scream, a fetching blonde, said blonde appearing topless in what might be another dream, a reflection of a character’s boyfriend turning out to be the blonde, the blonde choking her Paul Simon-ish date (okay, clearly I was a fan of the blonde), a character squawking as they were strangled, a really strange Southern accent, a reference to witches and goblins that seemed like an overreaction, and a cheerful line of dialogue (”I’m not going to guilt, I’m going to hell”). Yet it was no use, as these elements seemed to blend together into one surreal fever dream, assembled with a filmmaking sensibility that seems completely alien to our own.

The characters behave as if they are parodying human behaviour (I mentioned the flat acting earlier, which extends to some really robotic pillow talk), with the “star” (and producer) of the picture, Renee Harmon, shaking up the proceedings with her bizarre, left-field presence. I understand that Harmon has written several books about different aspects of filmmaking, yet if there is any conventional wisdom to be found in those books, none of that is seen on screen. On Harmon’s face is always the threat of a really out-of-place smile, one which never feels all that reassuring. Harmon produced this and other movies and seemed to place herself often in starring roles, yet for her lack of what most would call “talent”, I don’t find her presence egotistical but rather endearing in its strangeness. The violence is crude yet startling, and the ending manages to pierce through the strange fog cast by the film and tap into the genuine existential terror the material deserves.


I was similarly enthralled by The Slayer, which is much closer to what most people would define as a good movie, yet also operates on its own distinct wavelength. There isn’t a whole lot to the story. Four friends vacation on an island off the Atlantic coast while the heroine is taking some much needed rest from her emotionally draining work as an artist. One by one they start to get killed off. Who or what is doing the killing seems to be an afterthought, although a couple of explanations are offered by the ending (it seems to split the difference). The word “dreamlike” can be used to describe vastly different horror movies, from the gory non sequiturs of Lucio Fulci to the shifting menace of the original Nightmare on Elm Street to the low key ambience of Jean Rollin or Jess Franco, and I think this movie definitely feels like a dream in which the characters are adrift and the plot has dissolved. An almost abstract sense of menace hangs over the proceedings, one which sporadically becomes literal when the movie decides to deliver the slasher goods.

The movie has a delicate, elusive atmosphere not unlike what you would find in the work of Rollin or Franco, yet makes it its own by imbuing it with the presence of its island setting. (Herzog’s “voodoo of location” comes to mind, and the inclement weather does wonders to cast a sense of doom over the action.) The proceedings are channeled through the frayed nerves of the heroine and grounded by the mature, lived-in performances of the cast, sliding occasionally into the surreal but never losing grasp of its distinct mood. The sense of isolation is palpable (as in a series of deft cuts after the heroine discovers another victim) and the bursts of violence (which are not all that explicit by the standards of the genre yet are nonetheless grisly) are genuinely jarring. The ending, which offers only ambiguity to conclude the mystery, might be called a cop-out by the less generous, but with its forgoing of easy answers and embrace of the irrational, I think it achieves a deeper unease than a clean denouement would have allowed. The strange spell cast by both these movies can’t be explained away.



The Hound of the Baskervilles - I don't know if this belongs in this thread but it's a Hammer studios production and stars Peter Cushing as Sherlock Holmes and Christopher Lee as Sir Henry Baskerville. Not really horror per se but in addition to the two horror icons there's a hell hound and fog and moors and a foreboding ancestral home. Most people are familiar with the story of the supposedly cursed Baskervilles and Lee plays the last of the line. His friend Doctor Mortimer travels to London to engage Holmes services after the previous heir, Sir Charles Baskerville, dies under mysterious circumstances. Cushing does a marvelous job as Holmes, imbuing the character with his own inimitable style. A very young looking Lee also acquits himself admirably in one of his rare good guy roles. This was a really enjoyable watch. 90/100



Also, sorry for the gratitious self-promotion, but I can't put links in my signature until I get 25 posts here, so if any former Corrie-ers (or anyone else here) is interested in keeping up with my movie reviews, just check out my Smusings thread on the Movie Review board here, please. Thank you!



I watched The Shed, about a teen who finds a vampire in his shed. It’s not written well and some actors are the wrong age but it’s otherwise competent and watchable.

I also watched Blood Quantum about a zombie apocalypse from the perspective of immune Native Americans. This was pretty good, a little Coen Bros.-esque. Some stuff was not made 100% clear and the third act doesn’t quite hit as hard as the movie wants it too but it’s worth a watch.



...does anyone else want to tell him, or should I?
Well, if the local orthodoxy insists it’s not a horror film or something along those lines, I really couldn’t agree. Been here long enough to find that sort of thing bizarrely prescriptive.



A system of cells interlinked

Couldn't agree with you more, man (although I do like Drive a lot, while I'm on the subject here).
To be fair, I enjoyed Drive, as well. That said, it's not anywhere close tot the level of quality that Unforgiven is.

OK, that's all I have on that Top 100 list, as I am pulling this thread off topic too much with my comments.

Back to horror films!
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Well, if the local orthodoxy insists it’s not a horror film or something along those lines, I really couldn’t agree. Been here long enough to find that sort of thing bizarrely prescriptive.
He's referring to the fact that he's the only person on God's green earth that didn't like it.
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He's referring to the fact that he's the only person on God's green earth that didn't like it.
I’m totally cool with people disagreeing with what I say - God knows, I sometimes spout absolute nonsense - not to mention film taste is subjective, but that just felt very condescending and clique-y.



Using the RT horror list posted upthread as a guide:

1) Psycho
2) A Nightmare on Elm Street
3) Poltergeist
4) Let the Right One In
5) Eyes Without a Face
6) Scream
7) The Wicker Man
8) The Omen
9) The Haunting
10) The Phantom of the Opera

Psycho and Poltergeist, however, are on my watchlist for this month though.
Psycho's great--my wife and I are going out to our first movie since lockdown started in March and it's a drive-in double feature of Psycho and The Birds.

Of the rest, The Wicker Man is an all-time favorite.



Now that I have The Curse of Frankenstein under my belt, I was thinking of watching Horror of Dracula and letting my kid ( who is 8) watch with me. He's a pretty hardy Brooklyn kid and I don't expect anything too intense from a 1950s film, but is there any reason I should not do this?



Now that I have The Curse of Frankenstein under my belt, I was thinking of watching Horror of Dracula and letting my kid ( who is 8) watch with me. He's a pretty hardy Brooklyn kid and I don't expect anything too intense from a 1950s film, but is there any reason I should not do this?
From what I recall, while it is bloody for the time period, Curse of Frankenstein is more intense. But I'm no Hammer expert. Wooley or Capt Terror are probably the men for you here.




I remember cobwebs. Dangerous levels of cobwebs that seemed sure of encroaching on all of the inert performances. Everyone just seemed to stand about the castle, offering all manner of pregnant pauses between dialogue as if afraid they’ll get dust in their mouth. I remember my grandmother telling me how frightened she was watching it as a child and so I watched with great hope. I can remember first witnessing this European ham in a cape descending a staircase, and my only response being to laugh at my grandmother over her confession. As if anyone could be that frightened of a pair of eyebrows. Especially such an iron clad woman as this. It made such an impression I still make fun of her to this day, even though she has now retreated into denialism. She never found Tod Browning’s Dracula at all scary. Don’t be silly. Who possibly could?

In truth, I really don’t have that many concrete memories of the film. But my overall sense is that it felt like an under rehearsed stage production overwhelmed by the grandeur of its sets. While it has always historically shared equal stature with Whale’s Frankenstein, Dracula seemed more of a test run for that film’s gothic majesty. If it wasn’t so important, it seems like it should just be a footnote in horror history. It never actually seemed very.....good.

But eventually I got word that in some Bizarro Spanish universe, another version of Dracula existed. Performed on the same sets at the same time, with an eerily similar script, it was in fact the quintessential old time version of the story. It learned where Tod Browning failed. And now, having finally seen it, I don’t disagree with this sentiment. The movie has more life in it, whether it be the rollicking carriage ride towards Dracula’s castle, or with its considerably less undead supporting performances. It is a production that does not seem to have any need to feel threatened by the reach of the films ample cobweb supply. While still no Frankenstein, it no longer feels like some antiquated relic next to it.

What to make of the absence of Bela Lugosi though? As stilted as Browning’s film was, and as diluted by parody as Lugosi’s presence is, it can’t be denied that he is the entire gravitational pull of the original. So how does this bus driver, or substitute teacher, or random guy cast while found eating a sandwich on a parkbench, fare as his replacement? Would Lugosi’s performance have been as legendary if he too looked as if he was in desperate need of a pee as he whisks off set? Can Lugosi’s menacing finger wiggling compete with this guy’s seeming efforts to shake something sticky off of his hands as he leans towards a victim? Do we ever get any sense of Dracula’s otherness, when we aren’t impatiently waiting for him to piece together his lines phonetically as his eyebrows always struggle one step behind? Unfortunately, Carlos Villarias will prove to be no Bela Lugosi. Carlos Villarias is only Carlos Villarias. And only Bela Lugosi is Dracula. Regardless of what film is actually better.




Now that I have The Curse of Frankenstein under my belt, I was thinking of watching Horror of Dracula and letting my kid ( who is 8) watch with me. He's a pretty hardy Brooklyn kid and I don't expect anything too intense from a 1950s film, but is there any reason I should not do this?
I was about to say the same thing as Crumbsroom. In terms of blood 'n' guts the Frankenstein series is potentially too much, depending on the kid, but I think HoD is probably safe. And I tend to be overly-cautious about such things. Maybe check out a trailer to give you a sense of what you're in for. Also, I don't have a kid so factor that into my advice.



I guess in keeping with the general conversation, what do you consider your horror "blindspots", if you have any?

The ones I hear about most often but haven't seen are:

Rosemary's Baby
King Kong
The Fly
Day of the Dead
The Wolf Man
Henry: Portrait of a Serial Killer


And then a whole slew of 60s titles like Masque of the Red Death.
Hmm, let's see...

Hausu
Onibaba
It (remake)
Possession
Eyes Without a Face
It Follows
Poltergeist?
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Frozen Scream (Roach 1975) & The Slayer (Cardone, 1982)


“It is one of those works that has proceeded directly to the status of Great Movie without going through the intermediate stage of being a good movie.” Roger Ebert said this about Sergei Eisenstein’s Ivan the Terrible, and these words came to mind when I was watching Frank Roach’s Frozen Scream. It’s got a plot that’s total nonsense, seems to be slapped together with no grasp of normal filmmaking language and and is never less than completely fascinating. If I can describe the story, it involves the hero investigating a pair of mad scientists who are searching for the secret of immortality, which to them means enslaving people and turning them into braindead zombies. (The exact method involves freezing people to near death and then reviving them, hence the “frozen” scream in the title.) The hero narrates his quest in a robotic monotone that brings to mind Microsoft Sam, and calls out one of the villains’ “bad acting”, which is a bold claim to be making in this movie.

What follows is a mishmash of dreams drifted into and out of, visual non sequiturs that puncture the somnambulist ambience, a lot of the flat acting one associates with the marginal productions of regional horror but seems thematically appropriate here, and dissonant synthesizer music that serves as the score. I scrambled to jot down notes as I watched this in a desperate attempt to make sense of what I was seeing. A grim reaper in a dream with a scream, a fetching blonde, said blonde appearing topless in what might be another dream, a reflection of a character’s boyfriend turning out to be the blonde, the blonde choking her Paul Simon-ish date (okay, clearly I was a fan of the blonde), a character squawking as they were strangled, a really strange Southern accent, a reference to witches and goblins that seemed like an overreaction, and a cheerful line of dialogue (”I’m not going to guilt, I’m going to hell”). Yet it was no use, as these elements seemed to blend together into one surreal fever dream, assembled with a filmmaking sensibility that seems completely alien to our own.

The characters behave as if they are parodying human behaviour (I mentioned the flat acting earlier, which extends to some really robotic pillow talk), with the “star” (and producer) of the picture, Renee Harmon, shaking up the proceedings with her bizarre, left-field presence. I understand that Harmon has written several books about different aspects of filmmaking, yet if there is any conventional wisdom to be found in those books, none of that is seen on screen. On Harmon’s face is always the threat of a really out-of-place smile, one which never feels all that reassuring. Harmon produced this and other movies and seemed to place herself often in starring roles, yet for her lack of what most would call “talent”, I don’t find her presence egotistical but rather endearing in its strangeness. The violence is crude yet startling, and the ending manages to pierce through the strange fog cast by the film and tap into the genuine existential terror the material deserves.
I tried to watch this movie two nights in a row at the beginning of the pandemic, and still was stymied even how to begin writing about it.

I know I really loved it, but like everything I love about junk films, my brain refused to keep hold of it for future reference. It caused it some kind of logical distress. It was immediately evacuated.

I have never even heard of The Slayer........



I guess in keeping with the general conversation, what do you consider your horror "blindspots", if you have any?
I suppose the most obvious ones are Hausu and The Haunting (which I'm planning to rectify soonish). I'm also pretty sure I've never seen Martin. Other than those, I can't immediately think of anything that I'd count as a blindspot.



I was about to say the same thing as Crumbsroom. In terms of blood 'n' guts the Frankenstein series is potentially too much, depending on the kid, but I think HoD is probably safe. And I tend to be overly-cautious about such things. Maybe check out a trailer to give you a sense of what you're in for. Also, I don't have a kid so factor that into my advice.
Thanks man (crumbs too). I’ll give the trailer a look. He’s interested in trying a horror movie so I’m looking for something in the sweet spot of a little scary but not too scary. And preferably on streaming, which this is. My impression from reading up is that Lee’s Dracula is more on the sexy/erotic side than scary, and I figure a lot of that will go over his head anyway.




But my overall sense is that it felt like an under rehearsed stage production overwhelmed by the grandeur of its sets.
I think that's the crux of the matter. Browning filmed a play while Melford made a movie. My Universal Fanboy status means that I still love it, I just wish he'd gone full Browning. His other films have such an energy to them, it's a shame he couldn't have brought that to a vampire story. Although his other vampire movie (Mark of...) was just about as stodgy, so maybe that's just what he thought vampires should act like.

Sure would be nice to compare Chaney's vampire in London After Midnight to Lugosi's, eh?