'Intelligent Design' = 'Bad Religion'?

I would agree, but fortunately I have not seen evidence of that, at least locally. What we also have to realize is that at a young age children have yet to form their own solid opions about things, religion included. Oh they can be biased due to parents beliefs and how they have been raised, but as I said before it is human nature to ask for proof or to quetion what one cannot see. So I think these classes should be given at the High School level and not before. Just IMO anyway.

__________________

“The gladdest moment in human life, methinks, is a departure into unknown lands.” – Sir Richard Burton

Not a bad idea

__________________
Health is the greatest gift, contentment the greatest wealth, faithfulness the best relationship.
Buddha

Well, this particular discussion, about Inreducible Complexity, is probably too hard for young kids to understand before High School. But I don't see anything wrong with having education about Religion before that. Kids should know about different belief systems, and especially that there are more than one belief system.

__________________
The novelist does not long to see the lion eat grass. He realizes that one and the same God created the wolf and the lamb, then smiled, "seeing that his work was good".

--------

They had temporarily escaped the factories, the warehouses, the slaughterhouses, the car washes - they'd be back in captivity the next day but now they were out - they were wild with freedom. They weren't thinking about the slavery of poverty. Or the slavery of welfare and food stamps. The rest of us would be all right until the poor learned how to make atom bombs in their basements.

I guess one of the things 7 is saying is that once you introduce those religions to young kids they'll wanna know 'why' - They'll wanna know which is right etc. Which could be kinda problematic. You either go for relativism and say none is right (and a lot of parents wouldn't want ultimate relativism being taught - especially not about religion) - or you takes sides.

Personally, i'm happy that a teacher impressed upon me and my fellow class of 9-year-olds (on his leaving day) his belief that all religions were like people looking at the same mountain from different angles. I liked that one .

At my school RE classes didn't really start until we were 13 or so tho, i think. That could be about the right sort of age - a good time to start sliding into to taking responsibility for what you think.

__________________
Virtual Reality chatter on a movie site? Got endless amounts of it here. Reviews over here

Didn't read it like that at all. Reading the Bible doesn't teach one Faith, but as Shiny Boxers says, the nuts and bolts of how to find it. The Heavens were created, according to the Large Book, in 6 days by the big fella himself. To believe that requires a large degree of Faith.

Maybe he didn't read the intro and rushed straight through to all the 'begat-ing'. Saucy devil...

__________________
"Critics are like eunuchs in a harem; they know how the Tatty 100 is done, they've seen it done every day, but they're unable to do it themselves." - Brendan Behan

But that would be the absolutly wrong way of doing it. Look at it as you do with History, which is kind of what religion is anyway. History revisionists are at work constantly, for good and for worse. It's important for kids to understand where all kinds of traditions and values come from. And it's very important that they understand that Christianity, Judaism and Islam share the same foundations. There must be tons of kids wondering what the hell the difference is between Patrick who's a catholic and Liza who's a protestant and Jeff who's jewish and so on.... Why not teach them early on? If done the right way I don't see why religion is more problematic than history or any other class in school. On the contrary, I think it prevents future prejudice. I don't think that Religion class should be about "how to get close to God" but about the people, the traditions, the history and the heritage that all the different religions bring with themselves. I think kids are interested in that stuff. I certainly was when I was in school. Actually a lot more than I was in Science classes.

Well... yes, what it says is that God made the heavens and Earth and all that are in them in 7 days. It just gets a little fuzzy about whose days we're talking about, and if it's God's days, how long are those?

__________________
Review: Cabin in the Woods 8/10

However bloomin' well long he likes?

Are you sure about this? I am not sure if my thoughts are correct on this, but I do no say what I do without experience. More on this tommorow. I repect you opinion, but I am not so sure about it.

Science and religion will most likely never work out together. Just one of those things that just won't work out. Thanks to the Internet and it's infinite source of information, I've shaped a whole new outlook on everything. Of course, I've had to take a lot of crap on it lately. And people call em friends. Ha! I've got only a small idea of what it feels like to be the minority, and I don't like it.

__________________
"This is that human freedom, which all boast that they possess, and which consists solely in the fact, that men are conscious of their own desire, but are ignorant of the causes whereby that desire has been determined." -Baruch Spinoza

I think Science and Religion MUST work things out. Yes, it's the ultimate romantic conflict: head vs heart and all that. But the undeniable fact is: we're here. And the other undeniable fact is: we want a purpose for being here. So... try as they might to undo each other, eventually, marriage is inevitable.

God I love you................but not in that icckkyy way, more so in that respectable way

hee!

I didn't mean that kids waiting until high school with all this religion business is absolutely wrong. What I meant was that either taking a stand for one side or saying that none is right was the wrong thing to do.

'Intelligent Design' = 'Bad Religion' vs. 'I don't give a chit.'

Jesus doesn't pay the mortgage, aliens don't do the yardwork, and quantum mechanics don't help me at my job.

Sorry, I got to much real life going on to worry about things that don't exist or aren't helping me.



Bad Religion
Hooray For Me...


I can see my teenage father standing straight on a desolate corner,
in the shadow of tentacled towers by the red light of America,
I imagine how his mother felt when she heard that her husband was dying,
and that underground heroes of the tarmac shooting smack were blowing up worlds
and damned out loud, hey, can you tell me how does it feel?

yeah, tell me, can you imagine, for a second,
doing anything that you don't have to?
well, that's what I'm accustomed to so hooray for me
and **** you

when I slept with stony faces on the riverbank,
my angeldevil reveller shook me desperately in dying,
I don't exactly want to apologize for anything, and now
we're all mad and tangled in secret rooms with roman candles,
on an endless graveyard train

yeah, tell me, can you imagine, for a second, doing
anything just 'cuz you want to?
well, that's just what I do so hooray for me
and **** you

yeah, I was dreaming through the "howzlife", yawning,
car black, when she told me "mad and meaningless as ever..",
and a song came on my radio like a cemetery rhyme,
for a million crying corpses in their tragedy of respectable existence

oh, yeah, I'm not respectable, and never sensible,
I've been incredible so damned irascible
and I like the things I do so hooray for me
and **** you

Hey man, quantum theory led to computers, religion can help you when you're down, and what happens now affects how the future will be.

Oh yeah, and God gave rock and roll to you

That makes a lot of my life a waste of time, damn I knew I should have worshipped the biscuit God, least you can eat it.

Maybe science would take religion more seriously if it stoped contridicting itself, and stop thinking evolution is impossible yet believe a god made 2 people out of mud and a rib bone which spawned millions of people, earth got flooded and everybody died then got repopulated by incest and dinosours were on the ark, but also fossils were put on earth to test our faith at the same time?
Secondly if differnt religions can't even get on how can science and religion?
Thirdly who made this new version of evolution? Is it purely christians or did all religious groups come together? Or scientists of various faith?
I'll stick to science and facts thanks.

Well, certainly, it's fact-denying Creationist-style beliefs that wind scientist up the most. (Personally i really can't believe those surveys that suggest over 50% of Americans believe in Creationism. At least, i don't want to believe them... )

It's a small minority of Christians i believe [and an even smaller minority of scientists ]. And it's not even a new 'version' - that's its problem. Intelligent Design is really just an unprovable assertion that God made everything. (The 'Irreducible Complexity' theory has got a bit of science about it, but really starts to unravel when used to try and prove the existence of a Creator etc)

From what I've heard, Islam teaches that sections in the Koran like the creation stories should be taken as analogy not fact. That's why there's been no real anti-Evolution movement amongst Muslims.

If you wanna hint about how this type of science-ignoring Christianity is by no means the majority-view, check this quote out:

"Intelligent design isn't science even though it pretends to be."
--The Vatican's chief astronomer George Coyne (ABCNews.go.com, 18 November)

Firstly, you might be surprised to learn that I don't support teaching ID as a science.

Secondly, I think the theory of evolution says a lot less than people actually ascribe to it.

Lastly, hi Golgot.