When you binge on a specific director...

"Not a lot of time to ask" is fair, but that's moving the goalposts a bit, since the context is whether someone can comment meaningfully on a film they've stopped and resumed. You'll notice it was used as a pretext to completely end the discussion.

I think it's fair to question any opinions about a film posted before, well, seeing the whole thing, or perhaps seen in fragments...but it's not a magic "your opinion is invalid" card, either.

It doesn't sound like this is a good faith effort, tbh.


I think it matters if one understands the genre they're venturing into. "Slow" and "boring" could be reactions to a style and mood that was unorthodox to expectations. These are the elements that Minio and Crumbs were discussing. These films value mood over plot, so criticizing the lack of plot is a moot point. KC seems to be suggesting a disinterest (slight hostility even) to the films' sexual content even though this is an integral aspect of the genre as well. It isn't necessary to see those other directors first, I mentioned them because they tend to be better at this style of film. What's necessary is an openness to this style of film, and I have yet to see where KC has shown an interest or open mind. That's why I'm curious why the bother. Jesus Franco is a name among many. I think it's more important to understand the cultural milieu in which Franco works before attempting to appraise his work.

So I suppose there's an issue with a desire to check out a bad movie or two? There's a phenomenon problematic enough to publicly address? That all things in life need a deeper meaning than, "I feel like doing this"?


I'm on my sixth movie of Franco's in the last 48 hours. And a long-running conversation stemmed from it, as well as one of my more in-depth reviews, so I'd say my efforts were fruitful.

They wouldn’t be of any interest to you, that’s for sure. Although I’ve enjoyed Bava’s Giallo films so far, and aim to progress further into his filmography.

Of Fulci I’ve seen only two of films so far (Zombi, City of the Living Dead) and while they were both gory, I didn’t care for them too much. I will say I won’t forget them, however, as both have some really good scenes. Where else can you see a zombie fight a shark?

I’ve been meaning to watch Franco for a little while, I just haven’t gotten around to him yet.

I haven't made that argument. I do think that the distraction itself taxes attention and comprehension of what you're watching.


In fact, I think reading is very similar. If I'm reading something engrossing, like a book, there's a flow, a zone that locks in after a few minutes, that state where you're no longer cognizant that you're physically looking at black letters on a white page. Breaking up my concentration every few minutes keeps me out of the zone, makes it harder to get back into the flow. Similar to sleeping too. Imagine being awakened every 20 minutes, putting your dream on pause. There's a reason why such a practice is considered torture, the REM is disturbed. I honestly see immersion in watching a film to be comparable state of self-suspension, and I personally find this to be a valuable and desirable condition for passive attentiveness.


But none of this has anything to do with why someone who's watching a director who they only know for making the worst film ever is predetermined to not like their films. The constant interruptions only reinforce this seeming disregard.

Ok, so this is a better explanation that you’ve given, and I can agree with most of the above. I don’t think it’s necessary to watch the above mentioned directors to “appraise” his work alone, but I do think it would help to understand the genre itself. *

As to why the bother….it seems like he needs to defend himself here for choosing to watch Franco, and daring to not enjoy it. Does he really need to
Justify his decision? It seems silly to suggest he would, especially considering how often MST3K was brought up as some sort of argument against the decision.

Like I said above, you were expecting these to be bad films and, viola, you don't seem too impressed with them. But have you learned anything about these particular genres that I've mentioned? As I already asked, to little response, "what do you expect to get out this?" If you wanted to laugh at bad filmmaking, great. Franco's made a bunch of those. But do you have any curiosity about why he's making the kind of films that he made? Or those who may have made them better? Are you expanding your stylistic vocabulary? Were you intending to?

I'm only pointing out that from what I've read here, this doesn't seem like a good faith effort at understanding Franco as a director. And I guess I'm biased by the notion that it doesn't seem to be very useful to binge a director that you aren't interested in understanding. So, no, not justify exactly. Maybe just to admit what's obvious by now, but even that isn't really interesting at this point either.

Sure, and I haven't made the argument that you made that argument, either. That's why I included this next sentence, which you omitted from the quote for some reason:

You'll notice it was used as a pretext to completely end the discussion.

That's the context in which this came up, even though it's branched off a tad since.

Eh, maybe. For some films, as was suggested earlier, it can maybe help. I don't think there's a rule. But either way, I said I think it's fair to raise the issue.

Ideally the whole conversation would center on the film itself, and not the circumstances under which something saw something, or our guesses as to their motives when they did.

I would definitely suggest Bava, even if Franco isn’t all that interesting to you, Keyser. I think his films are far more accessible, and interesting.

Serious question: have the responses been a good faith attempt to explain Franco as a director? I see a lot of vague references to "what he's trying to do" and "understanding the genre," but that seems more like a dismissal than an attempt to elucidate.

Now, if you strongly suspect someone's not interested in being elucidated (assuming there's anything to elucidate--I have no firm opinion there) and don't want to bother, that's fine, of course.

When I've binged Ed Wood or Neil Breen, I was absolutely fascinated by what they were doing.

Don't assume I'm immediately influenced by the ratings. You will NOT discount me so cheaply. I expected Vampyros Lesbos and Dr. Z to be decent, and they weren't. If you had bothered to PAY ATTENTIOM TO ANYTHING I SAID, you'd figure that out.

I can only go off of what information is provided. It is telling the lack of discussion on the actual films and filmmaking being done here. I think that's the problem. None of the things I've mentioned pertaining to the genre and filmmaking style of this particular film and director have been responded to.

I've mentioned some specifics - the mood>plot, the dream-logic, the sensuality, in both atmosphere and sexuality. I think I've been clear in what I believe both the director and the genre are "trying to do", and I don't think that either Minio or Crumbs was far off before they bailed.


That's how it appears to me.

If your first impression of a film is based on ratings or popularity, then I would call that an "immediate influence".

He never said he was influenced by the rating or popularity in determining the films impression, but rather that he was using that as a reference point on which films to watch first. There’s a difference.

You don't get to decide that for me based on an assumption from one conversation. You just want that to be the case to justify whatever argument you're trying to make. The only thing it influences is whether or not I'll check it out, and once again, if you paid attention you'd already figure that out. Wyldesyde understood it perfectly, but you don't. Obviously, you aren't reading the conversation properly, which begs the question, do you even know what the people here are talking about?

I'm dome with people accusing me of such low-level first grader bull**** like being hypnotized by ratings and not knowing what a movie is about if I pause after ten minutes.

Unfortunately, this isn't a conversation. I've asked a number of sincere questions which you've ignored. I don't take it personally that you've chosen not to engage with the subject at hand, though the absence of a response means I'll have to fill in some of the blanks myself.

How about a nap?

tl;dr

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