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Sit Ubu Sit.... Good Dog
You said that your daughter had to cut a lot out of the film, is there any chance she can put the uncut version on that site. If that is a stupid question then just completely ignore this post.

Sorry to hear about all the health stuff, hope you are doing better
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28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
I did mention she had a vision, most directors do and I don't know any director that wouldn't sit in on the editing process. To say the editor is just taking directions and is the technical aspect of it is a bit low in my opinion. It's a collaborative effort. How many times do you see films that are poorly edited? Batman Begins is a great film, with mediocre editing.

I'm not taking any credit away from Sarah, but I'm also giving it where *I* think it's due.

As I'm currently prepping for my horror flick, it's a big hassle. So again, Sarah, get in here and receive mucho congrats.
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"A laugh can be a very powerful thing. Why, sometimes in life, it's the only weapon we have."

Suspect's Reviews



To start, the story alone is good. It has the potential to work very nicely, and it was mostly shot well, aside from the fact that there were MANY times where the focus needed to be used to make one things stand out more than another.

Aside from that, there were a lot of problems. First, as others have said, the editing is poor; poorly paced and whoever's job it was should have cut a few specific extra shots. I can go into detail if need be. Also, half of the score was was not at all fitting. The actors were bad. I would do a quick rewrite, recast, get a new editor, and try again because it could be really cool.

That said, I know how much effort goes into these projects and I don't want or mean to take away from that.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
You said that your daughter had to cut a lot out of the film, is there any chance she can put the uncut version on that site. If that is a stupid question then just completely ignore this post.
That will probably not happen since those "adjustments" were made because there weren't enough people to film the scenes properly. Therefore the scenes were never shot as intended. That happened a few times -- at the concert (remember, the band never even showed up and Sarah could only use the venue on one specific evening) and in the forest which was way out in the middle of nowhere. Each director has use of the camera for four weeks. Now, that may seem a long time, but with going fulltime to college and working, it narrows down how much time you have to actually film. You have to fit in with people's schedules concerning the locations and the actors. Just so you're clear, the lead actors all basically act as a profession. These aren't students or people you get off the street. Most all the people Sarah and Alex see during casting all have TV and film credits and many are SAG. There were lots of friends and students who were extras in the party scene and at the concert though. Anyway, the way it broke down was that almost all the shooting was done between Friday nights through Sunday nights. The weekdays were for school/work and the weeknights were spent in editing the film, sound and music. Sarah (and everybody else who made their movies) were basically exhausted for a month, and it's about to start up all over again.

By the way, I think the last time I checked the vimeo site, one could enter comments.
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It's what you learn after you know it all that counts. - John Wooden
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Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
To start, the story alone is good. It has the potential to work very nicely, and it was mostly shot well, aside from the fact that there were MANY times where the focus needed to be used to make one things stand out more than another.

Aside from that, there were a lot of problems. First, as others have said, the editing is poor; poorly paced and whoever's job it was should have cut a few specific extra shots. I can go into detail if need be. Also, half of the score was was not at all fitting. The actors were bad. I would do a quick rewrite, recast, get a new editor, and try again because it could be really cool.

That said, I know how much effort goes into these projects and I don't want or mean to take away from that.
Thanks for commenting, but yes, please be more specific about the editing and the music.

About some of the actors...

I hated the guy that played "the hallucination guy" as I call him - the shaggy haired, bearded guy who said Jethro was destined for greatness. His attitude came off very "jokey" and spirited in a humorous way -- it's in his voice and his eyes. It rubbed me the wrong way. I would have liked him to have been more serious. He did almost the kind of delivery that I would imagine an actor like Jack Black would do -- the "everything's silly" attitude. It didn't mesh well with Jethro, who was so quiet.

As for Jethro... I've gotta rush off of here real quick, but, there was a moment in the film where he smiled and I didn't like it. But that's probably a silly comment. I might get into more later.
Intersting ideas, Sexy. Let me address these. You do realize that "guy" is a Knight and he never "talks" - does his mouth move? And no, you're not supposed to know that but they didn't use his voice. It was added later and was supposed to have a booming voice to imply he's sent from "God" or at least very important. Jethro "hears" the Knight in his mind. I didn't see the actor as being jokey at all but your reaction is your own. Also, earlier you said that guy looked like me. Am I supposed to draw some conclusion about your hating me? (Just a Sexy-type "joke"; I'm not Serious.)

That scene where Jethro smiles was one that Sarah wanted to at least cut down a bit and maybe cut the whole thing out. I'm probably responsible for that being in there because it was the first time he actually showed some positive emotion in the film since he was happy he had a clue to the "Tree of Life".

EDIT - My comment about Jethro's smile is completely wrong. Sarah was referring to another shot which did get replaced by the smile in her film. That's one of Sarah's and her teacher's fave scenes.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
You completely lost me in your rant about guys trying to act funny. I don't see anything like that in the film at all. As far as Jethro goes, he was mostly a downer, yes, but the whole point is to have him get on with the business of life, and there's only six minutes to his brief life so what's wrong with a flash of joy along the way. Even Travis Bickle smiled in Taxi Driver.



Ok first sequence is the dude running between black cuts and forest sounds. If she's going for a suspensefully paced thing (which I think she is), I would just slightly blur the picture, leave the black cuts running for a bit longer, and add moody music to replace the chirping birds. Also, instead of the same shot setup each time I would change positions to the side of him for one time and then an extreme close-up of half his face.

Next part, the party. I'm just going to focus on the main guy because the rest of the actors are pawns. He needs to do a lot less with his hands and more with his face, a lot of subtle acting would do this character justice, especially if he didn't look like he had a hangover every sequence. Question, why is he filming/photographing? In the shot where he's in-between the two faces, I would focus on the main character instead of having the whole shot in focus. Second question, why is it a knight who is the messenger? Also, at this point, the party music should turn down, but still be present, to make way for a moody score section.

Don't have another problem until the library. The scripting of that scene is just wacky, I don't know why he would be researching something starting with a question on graph paper. I also find it odd that his face still looks drunk and not curious. The cut to the "hallucination" page is unnecessary as well.

Next section, when he is walking down the sidewalk with the posters, there's a long shot of him walking away with a poster in focus. The problem with this is that this is cut next to a "revealing shot" of sorts of the poster which we already saw 2 seconds ago, it's redundant. His smile is super awkward btw.

The sudden interjection of dialogue is fine, but something about it is off I'm not sure what. Also there's another part where the main dude is between two faces, I mentioned the focus idea before.

Next part; for an emerald forest, the music is kinda wimpy. Replace with some good score stuff. The part between the asian and black guy is too fast, dialogue-wise and pacing-wise with the camera. The music playing when the black guy gets shot makes no sense, not even in an ironic way. Actually I like the asian guy's acting.

Ok he's running and stuff. I would add more of the dude stopping at different trees seeing these people, giving his own finding more intrigue.

The music he fronts is questionable considering his mindset.

And there we go



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
I have some responses but I'm going to watch Game 7 of the World Series. Sarah is coming home tonight. Maybe this post will get her in here to answer the questions because I enjoy responding but I don't know ALL the answers. I haven't even been able to watch the film since I saw it on the big screen last Saturday.

I'm just wondering winter, how many films have you made and can we see them?



I'm just wondering winter, how many films have you made and can we see them?
I've made about 6 shorts of my own, helped on a bunch of others. This may sound like a cop out but it's literally impossible to see them because my hard drive crashed and I have yet to get money for data recovery. Plus the last one I did I never even got a hard copy of somehow. I can see if I can get some of my scripts from a couple people if you want?

Also tell Sarah if she reads that I'm not trying to put her down at all please



I think I would have preferred more visual information. Costume is a great shorthand into character. I think the two band mates (they are already in their band costumes!) and the spiritual forest people accomplished this, but the others seemed kind of generic.

For instance, if the billionaire character was a baddie, was there a visual way to establish that? Hokey (an eye patch) a little less hokey (a facial scar) a little subtle (an asthma pump) even more subtle (all his minions do all the dirty work) Why did he want the tree of life? Did he want to exploit spirituality for his own benefit?

I didn't think there was any real confrontation between the protagonist (Jethro) and the villain. Jethro sees him murder of one of his henchmen, and he himself is shot in a nightmare, but that's about it.

As for the best case scenarios, the same budgetary and time constraints will never ever go away. One has to learn to work around them. DVD commentaries are filled with shooting calamities and horror stories.

Also, Jethro's dilemma to be or not to be a rich and famous rock star, isn't a spiritual quest, it's a merely a career choice. You become a rock star, first of all ... by looking like one, and secondly, by acting like one. It has nothing to do with music. The music and movie business are factory systems with a series of interchangeable clogs, the first thing to go, is originality and uniqueness. The idea he'll only make deeply personal and spiritual art within a commercial entity is a delusion.

With the short film, there's just no time for the plot and characterization, what really makes one film stand out from the rest of the pack is the surprise or zinger ending. My two cents.



Chappie doesn't like the real world
So I finally got around to watching Quest for Life. Sorry it took me so long, Mark. I've had lots of company in and out of the house the past few days and in the course of 6 minutes I probably would have been interrupted at least 5 times.

I was surprised at how much story Sarah was able to put into six minutes and make it coherent to boot. If someone told me I had to make a movie in that time frame I'd probably have someone walking down the hallway and finding a penny or something.

The acting wasn't great, but I expected that to be the case before I watched it though. Just wondering if there was any specific reason for not having Jethro speak?

I'm a little confused about the knight and why there was a knight. What's the symbolism?

I might have more comments later, but I'm being bothered again.



Just watched it mark. It looks good, very good in the forrest and I like the lighting choices throughout. However, the stand out feature (for me) was the editing. Not just the match shots and the more eye catching stuff, but the rhythm of it. It works really well.

Right, now I'm off to read what everyone else has said and, probably go "oh yeah", a lot.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
Thanks, everybody. Sarah may well eventually show in here, but right now she says she feels way too behind, even though I told her to just pick a particular post and respond, even if it's old. I will be trying to catch up myself tomorrow. One thing Sarah clarified for me was that she only had three weeks to shoot, not four. For some reason I thought she shot during part of another weekend. That makes the results even more impressive in my book.



You better stop telling him what to do, my little Veda.



28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
Thanks, everybody. Sarah may well eventually show in here, but right now she says she feels way too behind, even though I told her to just pick a particular post and respond, even if it's old. I will be trying to catch up myself tomorrow. One thing Sarah clarified for me was that she only had three weeks to shoot, not four. For some reason I thought she shot during part of another weekend. That makes the results even more impressive in my book.
3 weeks for production? Or 3 weeks all together (pre/post as well)



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
They had a weekend of casting and location scouting and finalizing. Remember, these are students who are taking a full course load during the day and also working a part-time job. They shot on three consecutive weekends and used the evening time in between to do film editing. They had an additional week after shooting wrapped before picture lock which had to include the final visual edit including credits. Then there was a little over another week to finish up all the sound and music editing.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
To start, the story alone is good. It has the potential to work very nicely, and it was mostly shot well, aside from the fact that there were MANY times where the focus needed to be used to make one things stand out more than another.

Aside from that, there were a lot of problems. First, as others have said, the editing is poor; poorly paced and whoever's job it was should have cut a few specific extra shots. I can go into detail if need be. Also, half of the score was was not at all fitting. The actors were bad. I would do a quick rewrite, recast, get a new editor, and try again because it could be really cool.

That said, I know how much effort goes into these projects and I don't want or mean to take away from that.
I try to respond to most of these within the later Quote, but who do you think thought the editing was bad? There were a couple of comments about a specific scene (TUS about the opening) and UF (about the library transition), but overall, there has been high praise for the editing. Your comment about redoing the whole movie seems quite harsh and that's all I'll say about that, except if that were true, then there are lot of happy filmmakers at USC right now who are deluded and have thrown away lots of time and money -- not that it couldn't be a possibilty.

Ok first sequence is the dude running between black cuts and forest sounds. If she's going for a suspensefully paced thing (which I think she is), I would just slightly blur the picture, leave the black cuts running for a bit longer, and add moody music to replace the chirping birds. Also, instead of the same shot setup each time I would change positions to the side of him for one time and then an extreme close-up of half his face.
These comments are interesting, however the one about changing the camera positions is weird because the camera positions are changed during that scene. You want to blur the image and slightly extend the black screen as well as redo the sound by putting "moody" music in. Well, that's fine, but I don't inherently understand what makes it better. Just by trying to imagine it doesn't make me understand why it should be done that way. It seems like a personal preference without connoting any value judgment concerning quality. What does "moody" music mean? It seems like it could mean almost anything. Do you think those scenes in the forest ever really happened or only in Jethro's mind? It seems the way you want to do it would imply it's all fantasy from the beginning.

Next part, the party. I'm just going to focus on the main guy because the rest of the actors are pawns. He needs to do a lot less with his hands and more with his face, a lot of subtle acting would do this character justice, especially if he didn't look like he had a hangover every sequence. Question, why is he filming/photographing? In the shot where he's in-between the two faces, I would focus on the main character instead of having the whole shot in focus. Second question, why is it a knight who is the messenger? Also, at this point, the party music should turn down, but still be present, to make way for a moody score section.
You believe the Jethro character needs to be subtler, so how would acting with his face make him subtler in the party? He's photographing because he finds the party just as boring and pointless as the rest of his life, but at least he's got an artistic temperament and is trying to do something creative. Besides, it does highlight the fact that something weird is going on since he's actually recording "reality". The reason a knight shows up is because Jethro has seen Monty Python and the Holy Grail, Excalibur and the other films where someone goes on a quest and he associates it with knights. It's not for a religious reason unless you somehow believe those films are religious even though they aren't. The music in and surrounding the knight scene seems good the way it is to me.

Don't have another problem until the library. The scripting of that scene is just wacky, I don't know why he would be researching something starting with a question on graph paper. I also find it odd that his face still looks drunk and not curious. The cut to the "hallucination" page is unnecessary as well.
The actor brought his own graph paper notepad and wrote those words on there himself. If that's the way he'd do it, I don't get the problem. The key to that scene was to convey visual info from books. Sarah thought that using a computer and the internet would be far less-cinematic and she loves the look and feel of that library. As far as the guy looking drunk, he's not supposed to be drunk, but he is supposed to be having trouble sleeping and going through something bordering on an existential, if not an actual, life-threatening crisis, even though he's not that concerned about living at this point. Also, for all we know, maybe he does spend his free time running from some menacing danger and therefore looks sweaty and dishevelled. This is just my personal attempt to respond to such concrete complaints which I don't especially understand. It's a movie, and it's up to you to interpret what it means although the info is there for all to see. Actually, I forgot to mention above that Jethro's band name is the Drunken Souls. That should explain him "being drunk" all the time.

Next section, when he is walking down the sidewalk with the posters, there's a long shot of him walking away with a poster in focus. The problem with this is that this is cut next to a "revealing shot" of sorts of the poster which we already saw 2 seconds ago, it's redundant. His smile is super awkward btw.
You really seem to miss the point of that shot. Yes, the audience sees the poster from the beginning, but Jethro does not. He walks by it several times never noticing it, but then his eye catches sight of it. Therefore we have the audience in on it before the "reveal" to Jethro. The reason that shot is in the movie for a few seconds is because both Sarah and Alex are very proud of it. Besides, the audience already saw a glimpse of that poster in the opening of the film although it didn't have any clear meaning at that point. As I edited in back at an earlier post, Sarah and her lead professor both love the smile, so it doesn't matter that you don't. I mean, sure it matters to you but not to them.

The sudden interjection of dialogue is fine, but something about it is off I'm not sure what. Also there's another part where the main dude is between two faces, I mentioned the focus idea before.
I've got nothing here because I don't see anything to comment on.

Next part; for an emerald forest, the music is kinda wimpy. Replace with some good score stuff. The part between the asian and black guy is too fast, dialogue-wise and pacing-wise with the camera. The music playing when the black guy gets shot makes no sense, not even in an ironic way. Actually I like the asian guy's acting.
You still have a difficult time explainihg what you mean regarding the music. I know you're a musician and a composer, so you probably hear it in your head. Using terms such as "wimpy", "Good score stuff" and "ironic way" don't make it clear what you mean. Maybe if you link to examples of what you mean, then I could understand your point. Sarah loves all the music there though, but I'd still like to hear what you're trying to get at. As far as the scene with the billionaire and his "minion", I agree that scene could have been improved with another line of dialogue and another character or two to bounce those lines off (as was originally intended). However, that scene also has some of the strongest acting the way it is. I mentioned before that the forest was remote and there was no cell coverage, so there was no way to communicate with potential extras or to even talk to me about possible additional dialogue ideas due to lack of cast members since I wasn't on set. The bottom line is that there was no time or way to film another scene once that location wrapped based on the time available for shooting and turning in the picture lock (the visual version of the film which MUST be used).

Ok he's running and stuff. I would add more of the dude stopping at different trees seeing these people, giving his own finding more intrigue.

The music he fronts is questionable considering his mindset.

And there we go
The basic part of the film (without credits) was supposed to be five minutes. Some of your ideas work better in a film with a little more time, but there wasn't the time and your ideas aren't Sarah's, so that's another reason why they're not there. The song used at the end is the same song playing at the party, just done with the full band. What is his mindset at the end? Has he eaten from the Tree of Life and been rejuvenated or is he still "drunk" and unengaged? This may explain why the music seems so different at the end.

Anyway, your comments are interesting but many are difficult to "answer" because your concept is different than Sarah's and even if people may be unclear what to take from it, I need to know why you think your changes would clarify what HER point is. I hope this doen't make me come off as some kind of defensive jerk.

To other people who have posted in here, I'll try to respond later on, but that took a long time and I'm busy now.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
What was the significance of that picture of the knights? Has Sarah seen Raising Cain (I'm thinking of the extended dream sequence)? I also don't see what the problem with young people using (showing off?) old cameras is. I always used to play with my great grandfather's original Rolleiflex (which we still have) whenever I visited. Anyway it's a little obvious (my comment, that is) but the scene with the camera just adds another layer of ambiguity to the "what/how are we seeing?" question implied by/about the movie. Lastly, nice lighting in the bedroom scene, really creates an ambiguous mood.
No, Sarah has not seen Raising Cain. The knights were included to add more visual info in the library and to add a tie-in to the quest at the end. Sarah did include many of her own things in the film, and the camera is one such object. We have a few of those cameras but that specific one Sarah bought for herself.

One thing I didn't like is that some of the film appears to have been shot on campus (correct me if I'm wrong) but I'd have prefered an exterior shot before the library scene, even though the rest of the editing was flawless...
I always think shooting anything other than discrete exteriors on campus detracts from authenticity...but I'm nitpicking...

I particularly liked the zoom into the dictionary entry 'halucination' which gave it (at least for me) an exploratory B movie feel, and I can honestly say the whole thing was entertaining. Thank god you're taste has rubbed off, because it didn't play like some detatched abstract art project...at least for me...
The library is the only on-campus location in the film. To me, it looks like it could pass for a traditional library though, but your radar detection got it. However, the scenes before and after the library scene do not contain the campus at all.

As I mentioned earlier, the point of the library was to include as much visual info from books as possible, I also enjoyed all the shots into the books.

Not a fan of how it opens, the transitions seem very quick with the fade ins and outs.

I had no connection problems, it played fine for me, which tells me there is some audio issues. ADR is very evident for me, when they spoke I could tell the audio was recorded in a sound booth somewhere, as it's not synched up PERFECTLY and sounds very out of place with the environment. The most obvious part is when the two "hippies" talk to Jethro at the beginning. This goes hand in hand with the foley work: footsteps, drawers opening, papers shuffling, etc. To me it all seemed artificial. If it was done on purpose, it's a tricky thing to pull off because it will just take the audience out of the experience. Just in my opinion, of course.
The sound problems may well mostly exist in the original film, but Sarah did say that she had to upload the video and the audio separately to the vimeo site, so she thought that might have added some additional flaws when watching from that site. I watched it on her computer at home last weekend and could hear some artificiality but didn't especially see any, at least until the concert scene.

I like seeing the world through the lens of the camera, it immediately sets an "age" to the setting.

The camera work is good, I liked the zoom in on the Tree of Life words in the book.
Thanks.

Not a fan of the lead, it's hard to portray a character with no dialogue, but he really seemed unnatural to me. I liked the billionaire Asian man, he came off as an experienced actor, or one that takes it seriously.
How is a "mute" someone who's having visions and nightmares exactly supposed to act? I would think "unnatural" would probably be appropriate, but I can understand it being a block to some people.

I find it interesting that she used a Dutch Angle for what I thought was reality, which makes me question which reality was real.
For most of the film, in Jethro's mind, the scenes without strange things happening would seem more bizarre. He's basically lost contact with day-to-day normal life.

Despite the short not being clear with whatever she had intended, she clearly had a vision. A short like this is meant to make people debate about what the message is. With my personal experience with schools telling people what type of films to make...f*ck em. They are, in my opinion, trying to make their success off the minds who put their time and money into a passion project. They want something that will appeal to all and throw their name behind it. At least in my experience.

Congrats Sarah and starting out with literally NOTHING and then having a finished film on your hands that people watch and talk about. The highest compliment I can give you is that you sparked discussion.
Thanks again. I hope she comes in here too.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
I think I would have preferred more visual information. Costume is a great shorthand into character. I think the two band mates (they are already in their band costumes!) and the spiritual forest people accomplished this, but the others seemed kind of generic.
Just to clarify, those two band members are in a different band than Jethro's. They do tell him though that Jethro's band, the Drunken Souls, are one of their faves. In reference to wintertriangles, maybe Jethro is indeed a "drunken soul".

For instance, if the billionaire character was a baddie, was there a visual way to establish that? Hokey (an eye patch) a little less hokey (a facial scar) a little subtle (an asthma pump) even more subtle (all his minions do all the dirty work) Why did he want the tree of life? Did he want to exploit spirituality for his own benefit?

I didn't think there was any real confrontation between the protagonist (Jethro) and the villain. Jethro sees him murder of one of his henchmen, and he himself is shot in a nightmare, but that's about it.
I believe the billionaire doesn't need a costume gimmick. An extra scene and/or line of dialogue would have helped define him and show how he was also looking for the Tree of Life. The billionaire wanted to eat the fruit of the tree to be able to live forever.

As for the best case scenarios, the same budgetary and time constraints will never ever go away. One has to learn to work around them. DVD commentaries are filled with shooting calamities and horror stories.

Also, Jethro's dilemma to be or not to be a rich and famous rock star, isn't a spiritual quest, it's a merely a career choice. You become a rock star, first of all ... by looking like one, and secondly, by acting like one. It has nothing to do with music. The music and movie business are factory systems with a series of interchangeable clogs, the first thing to go, is originality and uniqueness. The idea he'll only make deeply personal and spiritual art within a commercial entity is a delusion.

With the short film, there's just no time for the plot and characterization, what really makes one film stand out from the rest of the pack is the surprise or zinger ending. My two cents.
It's true that there will always be constraints and compromises, and that's what this type of film is supposed to prepare one for. There are deadlines and there is a lot of required paperwork. There are also a few palms to grease because you have to pay for certain permits which seem unfair and expensive but are still a legal part of the process.

Your use of the word "delusion" is quite telling since Jethro is indeed delusional, or so it seems. Are you saying that Sarah's film is devoid of originality and uniqueness because she's already in the system or that it isn't because she's not actually in the system yet? Whatever the response, how can you tell? I'd also like to know what you think happens at the end. Did Jethro really get shot or didn't he? Is the ending a downer or an upper? Why does he "find his voice" at the end?

The acting wasn't great, but I expected that to be the case before I watched it though. Just wondering if there was any specific reason for not having Jethro speak?

I'm a little confused about the knight and why there was a knight. What's the symbolism?
I don't know the original reason why Sarah chose for him to be mute, but as the character and script progressed, it was a way to show that he's going through some serious communication problems and is in need of a drastic overhaul of his physical and spiritual being. When I say spiritual, I don't mean "religious" but I do mean looking for a way to find some meaning in the context of this world and what it does and doesn't have to offer.

I interpret the knight in one of two ways. Either Jethro's mind created it to get him more involved with life by confronting him with something he can culturally relate to or the knight was indeed sent by "God" to give Jethro a quest which he doesn't truly understand. In the latter case, it may well be similar to what happens in Star Trek V when Capt. Kirk asks "Why does God need a starship?" In Sarah's original script, Jethro did actually speak and say, "Why does God need me to find the Tree of Life?" To which the Knight communicates, "Because He bloody well asked you!"

I hope you get some more free time to relax, Godoggo.