God isn't real

Tools    





Originally posted by spudracer
How do you think you came to be?

Gases didn't create you, life created you. Life creates life. Rocks didn't bombard each other, gases didn't escape, and an explosion never happened.
I was born because my parents had sexual intercourse.
No gases didn't create me. And yes life did create me.
um...WTF is your point? If you are getting at the big bang theory being false that's fine. But you can't prove it, so you "think it didn't happen. Just like I think god doesn't exist. I really fale to catch your drift here. "Rocks didn't bombard each other, gases didn't escape"......um what does that have to do with God's existence? Seriously I've posted two essays. The least you can do is spend some time, and write something decent to prove your point.

Mecurdius: You are being sarcastic and attempting to mock me....right?

Thanks to toose and cereal port for throwing out some decent well developed ideas.



I ain't gettin' in no fryer!
Well, it's really not hard to believe in something you've never seen. You can't very well prove the Big Bang Theory either. There will always be a hole in what you think is truth. God wasn't created out of boredom or lack of entertainment. This was way back when before anything existed.

You then may ask, well who created God. How should I know. Like mecurdius said, God is a comfort zone. If you have nothing to look forward to after death, of course you won't think that your destination is already pre-chosen. You think you just die, and that's that. Well, it's a rude awakening for those of you who chose not to believe in a God or of a God, or a Heaven or Hell.
__________________
"I was walking down the street with my friend and he said, "I hear music", as if there is any other way you can take it in. You're not special, that's how I receive it too. I tried to taste it but it did not work." - Mitch Hedberg



Originally posted by spudracer
Well, it's a rude awakening for those of you who chose not to believe in a God or of a God, or a Heaven or Hell.
No actually it will be a smooth kind of dieing action. What's after that you nor I know. We can have our ideas. But when certain people don't realize that there ideas are just there ideas, that's when I lose abit of respect. Dude you sound like my religion teacher.

And thanks by the way to OG-.
And sorry mecurdious, didn't mean to dis what you posted.



My comment from before was missing out the thing that made it make SENSE. Therefore, you can go and recheck it if you want.

This thread seems so totally unnesicarry. Can't we PLEASE just go back to the religion thread and argue?
__________________
www.esotericrabbit.com



Guys
I'm not going to argue this with you. I've been on your side of the fence... now I'm not. There are just too many miracles that happen dialy that no one can explain. Call it coincidence, call it whatever you want to call it. Me? I spent years studying physics, quantum mechanics, mathematics, hell I make a living in computer science and I have realized over the years that the for every one lesson you TRULY learn it spurns ten more questions. Tyler, please don't accuse me of choosing to sit back and not think. I'm sure I'm much older than you are and I'm simply saying I've done my thinking on this subject. I have proven to myself all I need to prove. You don't like my use of the word "magic," I noticed as well. I'm not talking about card tricks and Harry Potter here. I'm talking about a deep appreciation for life. A life whose beginnings science will never explain. I totally understand the concepts of a God being developed because scientific explanations were unavailable. Makes sense. But realize that while science is amazing it still has NOT explained what the spark of life exactly is. Science cannot duplicate or understand this. I do not see God as a white robed, white bearded figure with his arms open up in the sky. To me, God is what is in your heart. I have simply chosen to stop asking why it is that I have these feelings and to just be open to it.

BTW... you said
BTW keep your light heart… I'll keep my pursuit of truth, and sense of reality.
How can you be so sure that what you are pursuing is the the truth... and that the science that you put all of your faith in isn't wrong?

Also, you mentioned that it's easy to believe in God and just not think. I propose that it's it's easier to believe in science as sometimes it does provide tangible proof. To believe in God is to have faith in something you cannot see and touch...

Peace, I'm out.



A day will come in which no more churches, and no more religion exists. A day in which we run our lives with realistic thoughts and explain things in a realistic ways.
Yeah, nice call. Oh wait, I forgot: Christianity has been around as long as everyone can remember. I don't agree that, right or wrong, it'll fade.

Your argument is logical, but proves nothing. Your logical explaination only holds true for physical manifestations, not thoughts or unmanifested entities, which god could be, no way of proving it.
Exactly. There is no conclusive proof one way or the other. It's rather naive to assume that we can necessarily prove or dissprove such a thing on our own here. Wanna talk about realism? Face up to it: you have no clue as to whether or not God exists, because if he does, He's God, and the physical and conceptual rules of this universe don't necessarily apply.

The idea of God was spawned in a time when scientific theory was non existent.
And now science abounds...and well over 90% of all people still believe in SOME kind of Higher Power. Here's just one of the reasons why: science is constantly screwing up and then fixing itself. It's trial and error, which means at any given moment science as a whole is supporting incorrect notions...we just don't know it yet.

But I ask, why would god have a gender?
He doesn't. WE have a gender. If there were only men, there would be no such thing as gender. God was here first, and as such, had no gender. He then created Man in his image, and women thereafter. You're looking at it backwards.

And who would not desire the existence of an all knowing superior being.
Ha! You think it's nice and easy to believe such a thing? I believe it, and I'm constantly struggling with sin. It's very difficult. You, on the other hand, are bound to no such thing. As far as you are concerned, right and wrong do not exist: the only thing that you need to worry about you, and what happens to you. Believing in God is no easier than not believ in God. That seems just as convienent to me, just in a different way.

In fact, God’s perfect creatures are and have destroyed many species, and the perfect world on which we live. We are not a miracle, we are a curse. We destroy, and consume, and then relocate and do it all over again. There is another organism that carries the same habit. A virus. We are no different. Just bigger, and wear cloths. We have no more a soul than a tree or a cat.
Nice Matrix-esque rant.

Perfect world? You think our world is perfect, eh? And yet you think this PERFECT world came about through, what, a random explosion? Sounds more convienent than the existence of a God, IMO. FYI: Christianity doesn't claim we are God's perfect creatures. Where did you get that from? Being made in His image does not make us perfect. The Bible rants on and on about us having all kinds of problems we need to deal with.

I'll give you a differenece between humans and viruses: a virus consumes to live. That's just the way it is. It isn't even capable of thinking about what it is doing. We, on the other hand, debate over it. Many of us try to point out the mistakes we as a race, or species, or nation are making as a whole. In short: many of us are TRYING to be better...to improve.

What if Adolf Hitler read the Bible, and praised Christ everyday of his life? Would he go to heaven? If God is as allknowing as said to be such a process for fate determination would not take place. What would happen to an unbabtised baby is it were to die from birth complications. Would God send a baby to burn forever? Simple questions like these are danced around by the Catholic church. They refuse to take a position on anything.
I'm getting the vibe here that you associate the Catholic Church with God directly, or with all forms of religion. I don't answer to the Catholic Church...and if their shortcomings and beliefs are your basis for these opinions, you'd better re-think things, because there's no good reason to believe they know what God thinks. I will not be bound to them...they are men. Flawed, just as the rest of us are.

Homosexuality in theory is wrong and intrinsically evil. This is yet another example of the puritan idealism that still remains in our Church. Hating a homosexual for being what they are, is just as bad as hating a black man for his skin tone.
I'd say it's more akin to hating an alcoholic for what they are: flawed. They may be born with it, but that doesn't make it good, or right.

A position like this not only makes the Catholic church hypocritical, but a hate group. Like it or not the church is an indirect hate group, and until they once again revise their status on something like this, that’s how they shall remain.
First, see my above paragraph on the connection of the Catholic Church with God and religion. Aside from that, it's not hypocritical. Is it hypocritical to tell your child not to lie? After all, surely you have lied, and probably will do so again. Hypocriscy is doing such things, but not realizing it, or admitting to it, or accounting for it, or making any attempt to fight it.

How could god have created the earth in 7 days, if a day is based on how long it takes the earth to rotate completely? And when god said let there be light, what language did he speak that in? And who was he speaking to.
I doubt you're dumb enough to expect an answer from that. It's probably meant symbolically.

It is my idea that your teen years are your only years for true enlightenment.
It is my idea that anyone who thinks that true enlightenment stops when you turn 20 is just setting themselves up for ignorance. If you value truth so much, there's no reason to ever stop enlightening yourself, and no good reason whatsoever to believe that your teenage years are the best to figure things out. They may be some of the worst: you're inexperienced, usually rebellious, your fluctuating emotions may get in the way, and your body isn't finished growing yet.

Now, enough of this: if you do not believe in God, Tyler, tell me what you do believe in. How did this world come to be? How did we come to be? How did all the things we know come to be? Ponder this, however: if you believe in no Higher Power, the emotion called "love" that you know is fake. It doesn't exist. It might as well be a chemistry experiment. Furthermore, right and wrong cannot exist...meaning that rape and murder are not wrong; just unacceptable to most. Are you preparded to accept such things?

Are you also prepared to believe (if you are an evolutionist) that we are one of at LEAST thousands of humanoid mutants and similar creatures who lived on this earth and died out over time? Scratch that, make it millions. Furthermore, you'd have to, reasonably, believe that a species superior to us lived here some time ago and "made it" farther than we did...and that we, as a species, will die out over time, too.

And yes, listen to Toose: disagree all you want, but it's beyond ignorant to imply that people who believe in God do not think. I write computer code, and my father's (if I do say so myself), a fine economist of sorts. Albert Einstein believed in God. Logic and God are not exclusive. They do no conflict.

What does conflict, however, is going on and on about how you value truth and science, without, it seems, coming to the realization that placing your faith in MAN (the flawed man that you went on for at least a couple paragraphs about as being a screwup of sorts), and what we call science, means placing your faith (yes, faith...we all have faith, no matter what you say) in something that is all about trying something, screwing up, and then trying something else. As a result, if you follow science, plenty of what you believe will either be incorrect, or a half-truth...but you'll die before you have the benefit of learning this.



Lol. You.

I wasn't going to elaborate on everything you just said.
I would have argued otherwise.



I ain't gettin' in no fryer!
This debate will never die. Even if it does on this site, those who think this outside of the site will forever keep this debate alive.



Originally posted by TWTCommish





I'd say it's more akin to hating an alcoholic for what they are: flawed. They may be born with it, but that doesn't make it good, or right.



I doubt you're dumb enough to expect an answer from that. It's probably meant symbolically.




Now, enough of this: if you do not believe in God, Tyler, tell me what you do believe in. How did this world come to be? How did we come to be? How did all the things we know come to be? Ponder this, however: if you believe in no Higher Power, the emotion called "love" that you know is fake. It doesn't exist. It might as well be a chemistry experiment. Furthermore, right and wrong cannot exist...meaning that rape and murder are not wrong; just unacceptable to most. Are you preparded to accept such things?

Are you also prepared to believe (if you are an evolutionist) that we are one of at LEAST thousands of humanoid mutants and similar creatures who lived on this earth and died out over time? Scratch that, make it millions. Furthermore, you'd have to, reasonably, believe that a species superior to us lived here some time ago and "made it" farther than we did...and that we, as a species, will die out over time, too.

And yes, listen to Toose: disagree all you want, but it's beyond ignorant to imply that people who believe in God do not think. I write computer code, and my father's (if I do say so myself), a fine economist of sorts. Albert Einstein believed in God. Logic and God are not exclusive. They do no conflict.

What does conflict, however, is going on and on about how you value truth and science, without, it seems, coming to the realization that placing your faith in MAN (the flawed man that you went on for at least a couple paragraphs about as being a screwup of sorts), and what we call science, means placing your faith (yes, faith...we all have faith, no matter what you say) in something that is all about trying something, screwing up, and then trying something else. As a result, if you follow science, plenty of what you believe will either be incorrect, or a half-truth...but you'll die before you have the benefit of learning this.

Sir you are really out to get me. And you think homosexuals are flawed? So then you're better than somone because they're inclinations are diferent from the majority's. What if we're the flawed ones? Gay people aren't flawed anymore than you or I. So tell that to the rest of the clan.

Dumd, by the way means that you can not speak.

What do I believe in? Well...nothing. I have alot of ideas. But that's all they are. I will not get to sure of anything to call it a belief. Because nothing is that certain. I however like to base my ideas, on what is proven. And what is probable. I don't know how we or this world came to be. But saying that God did it isn't explaining anything. It's simply giving an excuse for not having an explanation. Love, is as Al pacino put it "over-rated. Bio-chemicaly no different than eating large amounts of chocolate." It's a good thing, but only an emotion.

Nothing is right or wrong, or good or evil. Just interpratated either way. To the rapist it's not evil, or wrong. To me it is. And yes I'm prepared to except this.

I do not "believe" that there was a more advanced species than us to roam the planet, because there is no evidence of such a thing. But yes we will die out. And make a dandy index fossil!

People who believe in God are not stupid, and I never said that.

Listen, don't try to back me into a corner on what I think. I think most everyone is upholding there ideas or beliefs nicely. And think that maybe you should respect mine, post your own, and get of my back.



Before I go and quote you several times, replying to each block (don't mind me...it's just the way I do things, as anyone else here can vouch for), I'd like to say this: I'm not "on your back." If you speak firmly in an argument, I'm going to do the same. Don't mistake it as hatred, or some personal grudge. This is just me stating my case as firmly as you do yours.

Sir you are really out to get me. And you think homosexuals are flawed? So then you're better than somone because they're inclinations are diferent from the majority's. What if we're the flawed ones? Gay people aren't flawed anymore than you or I. So tell that to the rest of the clan.
I never said I was better than them, I said I thought they were flawed. We all are...for various reason. IMO, homosexuality is a sin...a vice. An erosive act. It doesn't make homosexuals bad people anymore than a person who eats too much is a bad person. It's just an imperfection. Is it worse than some others? I don't know, I'm not God. I never said I was better than anyone, and even if I had, it wouldn't be because they were in the minority. Intelligent people are in the minority, after all. I also don't know what clan you're referring to.

Dumd, by the way means that you can not speak.
What, we're getting all technical now?

What do I believe in? Well...nothing. I have alot of ideas. But that's all they are. I will not get to sure of anything to call it a belief. Because nothing is that certain. I however like to base my ideas, on what is proven. And what is probable. I don't know how we or this world came to be. But saying that God did it isn't explaining anything. It's simply giving an excuse for not having an explanation. Love, is as Al pacino put it "over-rated. Bio-chemicaly no different than eating large amounts of chocolate." It's a good thing, but only an emotion.
Since we're being technical, I think the phrase is "eating large quantities of chocolate." But I digress: sure, love is, bio-chemically, quite similar, I believe. I think love exists on another, less tangible level, however. Just as you don't claim to know how we got here, neither do I. I don't claim to KNOW. I BELIEVE. I will not state it as undeniable fact, but I will say, until the day I die, that common sense dictates a creator.

Saying God created the world is not a cop-out answer. You say you don't know how we got here, yet you do say how we DIDN'T. How can you know. Either you do have beliefs on the subject of creation, or, like you said, you really don't have any, because there is no conclusive proof. In some of your other posts here, however, you talk as if you do indeed have a belief: the belief that, however we got here, it WASN'T from any God.

Saying that God did it, if He did, is definitely explaining it. The only reason you say that it's not explaining anything is because, to you, it isn't.

Nothing is right or wrong, or good or evil. Just interpratated either way. To the rapist it's not evil, or wrong. To me it is. And yes I'm prepared to except this.
It's "accept," and I'm not sure whether to be glad, or mildly horrified at the fact that you accept that. Part of me is glad you're at least willing to face that. The other part is sad that you, and some others, believe themselves to live in a world where things like rape and genocide are not TRULY wrong.

I do not "believe" that there was a more advanced species than us to roam the planet, because there is no evidence of such a thing. But yes we will die out. And make a dandy index fossil!
Ok, then I suppose you do not believe in macro-evolution?

People who believe in God are not stupid, and I never said that.
You implied that following God and following logic and reason conflict with each other...which is really just a nice way of saying that people who believe in God are fooling themselves, and only believe in Him because they're not thinking about the situation correctly.

Listen, don't try to back me into a corner on what I think. I think most everyone is upholding there ideas or beliefs nicely. And think that maybe you should respect mine, post your own, and get of my back.
The only thing I'm trying to do is make my point against some of the things you're saying. However I can do this without being rude or wasting large amounts of time, I will. I have a basic respect for all views, meaning that I'm not going to press an argument on someone who doesn't want to argue about it...but, seeing as how you started this thread, and have done quite a lot of typing already on the subject, I think it's safe to say you've invited debate; now you have it.

Question for you: what would you think if you were stranded on a desert island (sorry, I'm in this frame of mine...just saw from of "Cast Away") and, while exploring it, you found, say, 10 logs laid on the ground in what was a big, unmistakable circle (albeit a crude one)?



Question for you: what would you think if you were stranded on a desert island (sorry, I'm in this frame of mine...just saw from of "Cast Away") and, while exploring it, you found, say, 10 logs laid on the ground in what was a big, unmistakable circle (albeit a crude one)?
I am sorry, since we are all being technical I believe it is frame of mind

And if I were asked that question the answer would most obviously be that some idiot got bored and felt like making a circle of logs!!!

What would you think TWT? That god made it as a sign for a person that might have gotten stranded there and might have happened to found it, that is of no apparent significance?

I r 1337, phear my 1337N355



Just to keep on releiving the tension a bit, but maybe not so:

Are you crazy people just going to let Tyler's spelling of dumb with two d's slide?! I cannot believe this!




what whats wrong w/ typing dumd, maybe it his L337 sty13 yO!
__________________
"Who comes at 12:00 on a Sunday night to rent Butch Cassady and the Sundance Kid?"
-Hollywood Video rental guy to me



Ya know I was thinking.... and I think that we got god mixed up with Santa. I mean think about it. They both know if we are bad or good and both decide if we are happy ( presents or heaven ) or sad ( Coal or Hell ) Which makes sense because Coal is used to keep fire burning ( IN HELL! ).

(1337 flawless argument)

Don't **** with my 1337N355!



Originally posted by CerealPort
[b]I am sorry, since we are all being technical I believe it is frame of mind
Ok, and, to remain technical, "might have gotten stranded there and might have happened to found it" is grammatically incorrect.

And if I were asked that question the answer would most obviously be that some idiot got bored and felt like making a circle of logs!!!

What would you think TWT? That god made it as a sign for a person that might have gotten stranded there and might have happened to found it, that is of no apparent significance?
No, I would not think that God put it there. I have to ask you, though: why would you assume that someone arranged them that way? What makes you think it wouldn't just be coincidence?

As for the Santa thing: we got Santa mixed up with God, not the other way around. Jesus (or the concept of Jesus, I suppose, to some of you) has been around far longer than St. Nick. Christmas IS a religious holiday after all; maybe it mutated a bit into a more secularized version, where good and bad lead to only presents and coal. It's God, only dumded down (misspelling intentional. ).



OK FINE! If god is an explanation than allow me to make yet another explanation. One day bill the bunny rabbit had to sneeze. He sneezed so fuc*ing hard that he created outer space. Then somewhere in the deepest recesses of his snot, there was earth. Bill said look what I made! and he decided to make cats and bunny rabbits the superior beings. And they were so, until he demoted humans and made technology the new superior race. "LOOK!" said bill the bunny "Those stupid humans can't recognize that they suck compared to technology!" Bill the bunny had a good laugh at how humans were the lords of all in there own minds. He also found it humorous how they could prate on and on, about what they thought, not realizing that they were so damn small and stupid, and totally ignorant, that they may be wrong. Bill the bunny sat up late many nights listening to the banter of the ridicules humans. He found it humorous that everything they did not know, they made up, then believed. He laughed at how they destroyed everything around themselves, and called themselves "God's superior creation". I wonder if they mean me when they say god" Bill thought. No" I'm a bunny, and they kill eat and stuff my kind on earth. The only thing that could possibly have made them is something as "great" as them. "Oh you humans! You are so fuc*ing stupid! Can't you just die or something? " " I mean seriously! You are alive, but that doesn’t mean I made a plan for all 6 billion of you asholes! I only did that for the bunnies and cats. You just play a small role in there destinies”. But the humans were so loud bantering about ****, that they never heard Bill's questions and comments. And so the humans continued to live out there trite ,meaningless existence until they died off. And when they did Bill had a good chuckle remembering the humans and all of there ****. Oh thank Bunny! He said "Now the rest of the earth can finally relax!" Then Bill flushed his tissue.