Originally Posted by Karl Childers
You don't "draw the line" on an object that can be used to defend one's life and property. That doesn't make much sense.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
Believe it or not, many Americans don't have a problem with using lethal force to stop an aggressor, to thwart an act of aggression. It is really a natural, inherent right to defend one's self by any means necessary. It is an animal-right and a natural urge locked away in our brain stems.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
No one has any reason to presume what any one gun might be used for-- especially mine. No one has any right to prohibit or restrict the private ownership and operation of firearms because one feels uncomfortable or threatened by their existence. Get over it.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
There is no amendment in the Bill of Rights which states that "the people have a right to feel safe." It doesn't exist. Kong, Pidzilla, Golgot, and everyone else: when you are in this country, you have NO right to feel safe.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
I have a hard time understanding why some people seem so afraid of my gun. Do you think I'm going to shoot you with it? You have a much better chance of dying in an automobile accident then you do by a firearm.
This comparison, and all the others you mention in a big list, are pointless. So what? Things that increase possibility of death (guns) - if they can be shown to have less of a postive threat-reduction-effect than you're suggesting - are distinct from things with an over-all more-positive effect than the deaths they cause. Your evidence still isn't that convincing i.e using NY to represent America, using inappropriate state-comparisons etc) Just pointing out the flaws - still not saying your wrong "per se" about gun's threat-reduction-effect.
[quote=Karl Childers]Kong's statement about "drawing the line" is a specious and arbitrary approach that even the gun-grabbers abandoned years ago.[quote=Karl Childers]
Yes, yes, it's all out or nothing. So you've said.
Since Golgot enjoyed Pidzilla's sparse and disconnected stats so much, here are some REAL STATS to chew on.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
Let's start with accidents at the hands of recklessness, which seems to be such a source of distress for the anti-gunners here.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
The Truth About the Kellermann Study claiming firearms increase your chances of being murdered by a factor of 43
Arthur L. Kellermann is an anti-self defense lobbyist with an axe to grind. The "study" was designed to produce a pre-determined result. The "study" is pure "junk science."
Specifically, Kellermann claimed that "for every case of self-protection homicide involving a firearm kept in the home, there were 1.3 accidental deaths, 4.6 criminal homicides and 37 suicides involving firearms." (That adds up to 43.) Did you spot the gimmick?
At the end of his report, Kellermann stated his study did "not include cases in which burglars or intruders are wounded or frightened away by the use or display of a firearm." Kellermann considered only homicides. The "study" conveniently ignored all instances of home defense in which an intruder was not killed.
Arthur L. Kellermann is an anti-self defense lobbyist with an axe to grind. The "study" was designed to produce a pre-determined result. The "study" is pure "junk science."
Specifically, Kellermann claimed that "for every case of self-protection homicide involving a firearm kept in the home, there were 1.3 accidental deaths, 4.6 criminal homicides and 37 suicides involving firearms." (That adds up to 43.) Did you spot the gimmick?
At the end of his report, Kellermann stated his study did "not include cases in which burglars or intruders are wounded or frightened away by the use or display of a firearm." Kellermann considered only homicides. The "study" conveniently ignored all instances of home defense in which an intruder was not killed.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
Further, 37 of the 43 deaths noted in the "study" were suicides. As the data above show (regarding the suicide rate in Japan, where firearms are virtually non-existent), a person who is intent on killing him- or herself will do it, with or without firearms.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
[from guntruths.com]
Gun Ownership and Violent Crime
Research from the U.S. Department of Justice confirms that responsible gun ownership by boys leads to lower crime rates. Specifically, the Dept. of Justice found that boys who who own legal firearms have much lower rates of delinquency and drug use than do boys who own "illegal" guns, and are even slightly less delinquent than non-owners of guns.
Here are the data:
Status Street Crime Gun Crimes Drug Abuse
No guns owned 24 1 15
"Illegal" guns only 74 24 14
Guns Legally Owned 14 0 13
Note: these figures represent the percentage of each category's involvement in street crime, gun crimes and drug abuse.
Gun Ownership and Violent Crime
Research from the U.S. Department of Justice confirms that responsible gun ownership by boys leads to lower crime rates. Specifically, the Dept. of Justice found that boys who who own legal firearms have much lower rates of delinquency and drug use than do boys who own "illegal" guns, and are even slightly less delinquent than non-owners of guns.
Here are the data:
Status Street Crime Gun Crimes Drug Abuse
No guns owned 24 1 15
"Illegal" guns only 74 24 14
Guns Legally Owned 14 0 13
Note: these figures represent the percentage of each category's involvement in street crime, gun crimes and drug abuse.
Not ONE legal gun owner has ever commited a crime of the types mentioned? I find this most unlikely. What's the sample here?
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
Murder Rate Highest in Anti-Gun Metropolitan Areas
Baltimore, Detroit, Los Angeles, New York, Philadelphia and Washington, D.C. have perhaps the most repressive laws regarding firearm ownership and possession by citizens. Not surprisingly, in 1998, these areas also had some of the highest murder rates:
Baltimore, Detroit, Los Angeles, New York, Philadelphia and Washington, D.C. have perhaps the most repressive laws regarding firearm ownership and possession by citizens. Not surprisingly, in 1998, these areas also had some of the highest murder rates:
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
U.S. Murder Rate Since 1900
Whatever the changes over-time and with relation to law change, you stil currently have a higher death rate than other more "repressive"ly gun-controlled countries. Make of it what you will.
And i'm not sure you're taking into account how long some things take to ripple out in some of your analysis.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
So, when Golgot and Pidzilla and others proclaim their "freedom" from a society that does not recognize the right to private ownership of firearms, that's okay. Hey, it's your culture. I certainly don't want it.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
Because the United States possesses the right to keep and bear arms for its tax-paying civilians, we are automatically the freest nation on earth. And I don't expect most Europeans to understand why.
Originally Posted by Karl Childers
The Soviet Union established gun control in 1929. From 1929 to 1953, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Turkey established gun control in 1911. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938. From 1939 to 1945, 13 million Jews, Gypsies, homosexuals, mentally ill people, and other "mongrelized peoples," unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, 1 million "educated people", unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Turkey established gun control in 1911. From 1915 to 1917, 1.5 million Armenians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Germany established gun control in 1938. From 1939 to 1945, 13 million Jews, Gypsies, homosexuals, mentally ill people, and other "mongrelized peoples," unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
China established gun control in 1935. From 1948 to 1952, 20 million political dissidents, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Guatemala established gun control in 1964. From 1964 to 1981, 100,000 Mayan Indians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Uganda established gun control in 1970. From 1971 to 1979, 300,000 Christians, unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
Cambodia established gun control in 1956. From 1975 to 1977, 1 million "educated people", unable to defend themselves, were rounded up and exterminated.
__________________
Virtual Reality chatter on a movie site? Got endless amounts of it here. Reviews over here
Virtual Reality chatter on a movie site? Got endless amounts of it here. Reviews over here
Last edited by Golgot; 08-23-03 at 01:58 AM.