Beheading of Nick Berg

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Lets put a smile on that block
I know ive always been pretty ignorant of the political events that go on in the world, and especially with all this war stuff. but reading about this poor Nick guy, it just sounds horrific. Who was he?
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Originally Posted by blibblobblib
Who was he?

Berg was a 26 year old Jewish American who apparently just wanted to help people… his family said he went to Ghana a few years ago and spent several months there teaching villagers how to make bricks… and that he went to Iraq because he wanted to help re-build the communications systems… One of his aunts married an Iraqi and Berg had visited his uncle’s family in Mosul which is probably why he was detained by the Iraqi police for suspicious behavior on the 24th of March … and may be where he drew the attention of the Islamic extremists who later murdered him...
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Lets put a smile on that block
Originally Posted by Caitlyn
Berg was a 26 year old Jewish American who apparently just wanted to help people… his family said he went to Ghana a few years ago and spent several months there teaching villagers how to make bricks… and that he went to Iraq because he wanted to help re-build the communications systems… One of his aunts married an Iraqi and Berg had visited his uncle’s family in Mosul which is probably why he was detained by the Iraqi police for suspicious behavior on the 24th of March … and may be where he drew the attention of the Islamic extremists who later murdered him...
God thats awful. How long ago did this happen? I take it the video has somehow got onot the net and now everyones donwloading it and watching it. Im not gonna watch it. thats so unfair to his family that his death is now spread al over the net for a bunch of people to satify their sick morbid curiosities. his poor family.



Originally Posted by Hondo333
I just believe the whole Nick Berg thing is a little to suss, the timing the stuff in the article I posted before, There is more evidence in the prison pictures. I just don't know how people could not believe that there government could kill one of there own for there own gain,
Caitlyn already responded to this in the ideal manner. Questioning is a very good thing, and you're right to do so, but questioning in just one direction is little more than veiled bias. Cait's point is a very strong one: did you put forward any theories to explain away the prison abuse when the story surfaced, or did you just assume that it was as it appeared to be?

Is it possible that our own government could kill one of our own for their gain? Yes. Is it probable? I don't think so. Do we have any particularly good reason to make such an incredible accusation? Not even close.

I mean, we're surrounded by insurgents, they appear to kill a man, and your only response is that it might have been the Israelis, or his own country? I'm sorry, but there's a difference between healthy skepticism and downright paranoia.



here's something interesting i found in the washington post...


FBI Questioned Berg on 9/11 Link
Suspect in Attacks Stole Computer ID From Iraq Victim
By Sewell Chan and Dan Eggen
Washington Post Foreign Service
Saturday, May 15, 2004; Page A17


BAGHDAD, May 14 -- Nicholas Berg, the American businessman who disappeared here last month and was later decapitated by Islamic guerrillas, was interviewed by FBI agents in the United States in 2002 because of a tangential connection to the case of alleged al Qaeda member Zacarias Moussaoui, U.S. officials said Friday.



The link between Berg, whom FBI agents in Iraq questioned three times shortly before he disappeared, and Moussaoui, who is accused of conspiracy in the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, was confirmed by Attorney General John D. Ashcroft.

Ashcroft emphasized that FBI agents had cleared Berg of any suspicious activity. "We did not develop any interest in Mr. Berg or determine in any way that he had any relationship to any activities of terror," Ashcroft said in Washington.

"The suggestion that Mr. Berg was in some way involved in terrorist activity . . . is a suggestion that we do not have any ability to support and we do not believe is a valid one."

Moussaoui and an acquaintance used an e-mail address or other computer identification traced to Berg, Justice Department officials said. The FBI concluded that Berg had been one of numerous victims of scam artists who were stealing e-mail addresses and passwords at the main campus of the University of Oklahoma, where Berg had been a student, several officials said.

Berg, 26, never met Moussaoui, who attended the school later, officials said.

Ashcroft said the theft of Berg's e-mail address was unremarkable. "It is not uncommon for individuals from time to time to allow . . . computer use by other individuals in university settings," Ashcroft said.

Iraqi police arrested Berg in the northern city of Mosul on March 24. Maj. Gen. Mohammed Barhawi, the police chief in Mosul, said Thursday that Berg aroused suspicion because he was not carrying identification, according to National Public Radio. Two associates of Berg said this week, however, that he told them he had been carrying his U.S. passport and that police became suspicious because the passport contained an Israeli stamp.

Barhawi said the FBI asked the police to keep Berg in custody while its agents reviewed the case.

FBI agents questioned Berg on March 25 and 26 and a third time about a week later. He later told a friend that he was asked about terrorism.

FBI officials said Friday that the timing of the March interviews was a coincidence and did not affect the length of Berg's stay in Iraqi custody. It remains unclear why he was held for 13 days.

On April 5, Berg's parents filed a petition in U.S. District Court in Philadelphia, asserting that the U.S. military was illegally detaining their son. They contended that his detention prevented him from returning to the United States on March 30, as he had planned.

Berg was freed April 6 and returned to Baghdad that day. He vanished April 10 after leaving his hotel. His body was found Saturday, and a video depicting his slaying was posted on the Internet on Tuesday. He was buried Friday in a family plot in Jenkintown, Pa., near Philadelphia.

The Internet video attributed Berg's killing to Abu Musab Zarqawi, a Jordanian who U.S. officials believe is linked to al Qaeda. CIA officials said Thursday that they had performed a technical analysis of the video and concluded "with high probability" that the speaker on the video was Zarqawi, and that Zarqawi was the person shown decapitating Berg.



Lets me set things straight, at least from my point of view. We will never, ever, ever know the whole true story behind what led up to the beheading of Nick Berg. This story like so many others is full of lies and misdirection by the media and paranoia. Rumors are spreading like wildfire as they do with something of this nature. What I truly believe however is that he was murdered by terrorists and that they filmed it to cause outrage and paranoia and to also show that they are willing to do anything to achieve whatever sick goals they have. As far as viewing the video goes: It is really a tough call. I of course think it is wrong to look at this to satisfy some morbid curiosity some thrill seeker may have, but I also think that responsible adults should have the option to do so without ridicule. How many of us watched in shock as the towers fell, and as people leapt to their deaths? How many of us stopped watching? Some may have turned off their TV, but I think that a good majority of us watched even after we saw the horrible deaths. We did not watch because we enjoyed it, or at least nobody I know did. We watched because of concern, or maybe we were too shocked to not watch. True, the video of Nick Berg was not live and we know what it shows. I for one have not and will not watch it, but I do not judge those who decide to do so. I have seen first hand what humans can do to one another in the name of some cause so I have no need to see it again, but maybe it would not hurt for people to experience it for themselves. Please do not take this either as me condoning this action in anyway, or condoning the posting of the video, but by God it is there. How we react to it is totally up to us. This was horrible, video or not, but I guarantee you that if this was not on videotape we would not be discussing it to this degree.
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Originally Posted by 7thson
...but I also think that responsible adults should have the option to do so without ridicule.
I agree with that, "It's a free country" speech, but my main argument is that as long as people are downloading it, the demand will remain high, and none of the people who admitted to downloading it on this forum are actually, "responsible adults"; they're teen-age males. That, as a responsible adult who saw his fair share of death much like you have, pisses me off. I can't help it, I don't care if people don't like it, and I'll say what I want to kids who download it to get their kicks.

I'm not angry with you 7thson, don't get me wrong, but this subject is a sensitive issue with me.
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Originally Posted by LordSlaytan
I agree with that, "It's a free country" speech, but my main argument is that as long as people are downloading it, the demand will remain high, and none of the people who admitted to downloading it on this forum are actually, "responsible adults"; they're teen-age males. That, as a responsible adult who saw his fair share of death much like you have, pisses me off. I can't help it, I don't care if people don't like it, and I'll say what I want to kids who download it to get their kicks.

I'm not angry with you 7thson, don't get me wrong, but this subject is a sensitive issue with me.
Well said. Thanks for honesty.



Originally Posted by 7thson
Well said. Thanks for honesty.
I respect you.



One of the problems I have with people viewing this video is that the original source was a website that has known terrorist connections… And I do not mean this in anyway to be disrespectful, but Nick Berg is not the first American civilian to be murdered in Iraq… but he has definitely become the most talked about… which is just what the terrorists wanted… the other murdered civilians were only mentioned a few times in the media and therefore did not have the impact on the public the terrorist were hoping for… so they took it up another level… Berg’s butchering was a calling card so to speak… on 9/11 we had 19 ******** highjack 4 planes and use them as weapons… now we have 4 ******** hold down one restrained guy and use him as a ‘weapon’ ….



Iraqi police have arrested four men in connection with Berg’s murder… all of them were former members of Saddam Hussein's Fedayeen paramilitary organization….



Originally Posted by Caitlyn
Iraqi police have arrested four men in connection with Berg’s murder… all of them were former members of Saddam Hussein's Fedayeen paramilitary organization….
thanks for the info...i heard this this morning at work...



I really want everyone out there to understand the nature of events that are hapening everyday in the middle east and iraq. reading Mr Sam Hamod's article really shocked me of how much he was misinformed , especially when its coming from a person who claims he is experienced in the middle east and was a Former Director of The Islamic Center of Washington .Im gona try to make things simple to understand for everyone on the forum , first im an iraqi and i come from an iraqi family from baghdad who fled iraq since the first gulf war...i lived in several arabic states , the last was in Saudi Arabia for 4 years ,i speak thier languages and understand thier accents, you really have to live there to understand how things are related or you can get easily lost like everyone else including arabs.

first about the orange jump suit subject , i read all the public releases from the terrorists in thier original language and theres nothing really special bout them besides plain simple burberic language......"we want the infidels out of islamic countries and we want our brotheres in guantanamo bay to be released"....i guess one can see that theyr message is to horrify ppl and show revenge for thier detainees at the same time, the orange jump suit is just to symbolize the suffering of theyr fellow detained terrorists in guantanamo, and i see no point why thier cant be tall ppl in iraq as mr Sam suggested., besides the accents and the names of the the kidnapers refer gratly to a saudi background , not some "agents" or some secret operation run by the "mosad" .


the situation is really simple to understand if you know the facts , first all arab states follow a didtatorship kind of government systems so theres absoloutly no freedom of speech or expression , only opression in different ways , some governments employe intellegince tactics *tourture , killing , ppl dissappearing * to control its citizins like syria, iraq , libya and many more.....and some employ religion to serve it pourpses like in Saudi Arabia , the country is simply "owned" by one family "AL-Saud" the royals and they control every aspect of life. think king and a princees can have all the fourtunes , drink and women but citizens cant cuz they have to obey religion...very simple formula similar to what the church did in what christians call it "dark ages". besides the opression in Saudi Arabia the royal family had close ties with a specific cult of extreme muslims *i dont really call them muslems but butchers* called "Wahabies" , these ppl r extreme to the full limit to the point of cutting hands and holding "Public BEHEADINGS" to punish people , the reason this kind of religious islamic belief is everywhere in the world today is the saudi money that help it spread through building mousques and send whabi scholars to preach thier "jihadi" messages etc, especially in indinesia and asia. If u watch the movie F 9/11 by michael moore you will understand how the saudi royals are related with the american adminitration and protected by them and how they all strives to benifit from the dictatorship scenario.

back to iraq , everyone knows it was ruled by a guersome regime and no one really cared up till now , in the eighties it was the american govt who supplied this maniac with all the chemical and bio weapon technolegy to help with the 8 year war on iran , he was called an "allie" because he was serving american purpuse with the iran war , same thing with binladen and the cia's support for him against the soviet a while ago. american citizens dont realize how these facts affect politics in the middle east. as the american forces attacked iraq in march everyone condemned them for doing so , i agree , its obvious the bush administration tryna take advantage of the whole 911 incident for control on oil , otherwise since when nations wage wars out of moral and humanity to save the iraqis as Blair was suggesting neways , whats important for now is that theres no sucha thing as "Iraqi Opposition" to this war unless ur someone loyal to saddam or an arab who came from a nieghboring country to "KILL the Infidels" that sort of wahabi mentality ,these r the only ppl who are fighting against the allied forces ,even the opposing shia's realized its best to calm down now cuz its time to build no not time to revolt against someone who freed you from a dictator. , and it reached a disgusting level of televized beheading innocents who came to help and build in humanitarian missions for the iraqi's.

the last subject i wana mention is the huge misinformation between the arab masses , they cant relize that they are bieng betrayed by theyr own governments and media everyday and every second even before the case of Israel ever existed ,
they are simply brainwashed into "people from the west want to steal our oil" and adding the extremist formula of religion into thier heads plus stripping thier freedoms of speech , u get a very deadly formula of poor people runin around thinking theyr ripped off by the west and that theyr enemy is israel and the united states , forgeting the real ones which are theyr own people and gov's (which the american govt supports for its won interest). they all endup in blaming the Mosad and the States for every little problem they have (excluding the palestinian case) and put it in a "conspiracy theory" scenario. they get enraged by the photos released from abu ghraib and guantanamo but forget about the massacres saddam and theyr own gov's did to them, theyr just ppl who r brainwashed to "hate". and "all" the arab media including al jazeera theyr only intersted in stirring things up to serve theyr gov's and keep theyr people brainwashed and angry , otherwise youl never see a program that talks about how the royals became the richest people on earth possibly , theyr unimaginable lavish lifestyles and the contrast to the saudi population {*till now theyr estimating 60% unemployment and 30% living below poverty line*} thats for the richest country in the world. and the people who get the blame always are the jews and the americans because of the palestine conflict {*which has a lota secrets and betrayals on behalf of the arabs that will never be aired on aljazeera*}
but for now theyr intersted in airing a beberics groups beheading of innocents and portray them as iraqi opposition for the sake of.....well u guess...chaos....so the they keep the ppl angry at americans till it reaches a point like the one in sept 11 , the real victimes here r the american people and the brainwashed arabs.

to every young american who thinks that joining the marines and going ona killing spree is only gona make it worse , u have to understand the complex details involved be4 going to sacrafice ur self.

As an iraqi im really disgusted with what the terrorists and the arab media are doing just as americans, justifying them with nationalism and religion just makes it worse , we all understand that the americans are victimes of the bush administration and its war for oil and all the losses and chaos it created , but since it got us all to this level i only can hope that people from the middle east appriciate what the american r doing for the sake of our freedom for now , and for the future we will be more than happy to see a dimocratic civilization emerge out of the lost brainwashed society's in the middle east , even if it costs all the oil iraq has {*2nd largest reserve* }

i apologize for the poor writtin text but i really had to write this and let it out to everyone asap



Great debate guys.

I am with you LordyLord, I will not see the video or view any of the pictures, never, ever.
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