Matrix Revolutions

[quote=Redookie19] Problems with problems that have problems

Ok Emp this emp that. Lets step back and think about it. What do emps do. Destroy anything electronic. Thats right anything and everything electronic. Least thats what the discovery channel says.So you cant very well use an emp and have everything work right then and there can you.Not even in Matrix land the first movie proved that they used the emp right before squiddie killed them from the inside. So you mean to tell me that humans working barely above the stoneage can use and emp and their computers and ship will still work but an advanced race of bots and puters with AI no less cant figure out how to sheild themselves from it? The wheelbarrow thing was stupid only because it was a setup. A setup similar to the red shirt guys of star trek. You know someones bout to die. There are definate holes but remember......ITS JUST A FRICKIN SILLY MOVIE. And again this was a worldwide release so the Matrix box set WITH DIRECTORS COMMENTARY is but several months away. So chill everyone and stop taking the fun out of the last few original ideas moviemakers have.........SHEESH

Yes.

My feelings upon seeing Reloaded were mixed, but I wanted to give the whole shebang the benefit of the doubt and wait until I saw Revolutions to pass judgement.

My judgement is this: the first film accomplished everything it seemed that the Wachowskis wanted to accomplish, both story-wise and action-wise. The last two installments just prolonged the storyline rather than enhancing it, mucking it up with a lot of philoso-babble about choice (so much more subtle and thought-provoking as it was presented in the original) and then ending on the same basic note as the first movie.

Even the fight sequences were nothing new, as cool as they looked. Using so much CGI took away from the inventiveness and the impact. The only possible exception would be the invasion of Zion, but even that didn't affect me half so much as the Battle of Helm's Deep in The Two Towers.

I felt The Animatrix actually did a much better job of filling out the mythology and exploring the possibilities of the world of the Matrix.

__________________
You were a demon and a lawyer? Wow. Insert joke here."

To the first question......Open your mind to a different point of view. NEO is nothing more than an antivirus program. What does Norton do on your puter it keeps viruses(Agent Smith) from destroying your system and saves corrupted files (everyone that smith copied himself onto) So the Oracle the obscenely cute settings girl "I made that for Neo" go back to being alive. Thats one possibility.

Question number two I will say no he isnt dead cause they give you a point of view through his Night Bright vision just before "The Nano Head" takes him away.

i really dont know what to happened to neo, you can assume but it may not be what thebrothers meant, n its thier story, but as far as i can tell all the other scenes where you see the "machine energy", (since neo cant see his ship or trinity)he is a silouette, or basically jsut doesnt light up, but after he fights smith and the machine takes him away hes jsut a big ray of light, "Whoa!"

redookies comments on the emp were right, you could use mroe than one emp you jsut had to b sure that everything was off before you did it, but then ud have to reboot everything n then charge another emp, it jsut wouldnt work fast enough to be a good defense

Try to look at the matrix as a trilogy as a whole, sicne it is all one story and one main idea it can only blow ur mind so much, i dont understand what people were looking for in reloaded n revolutions, the 1st matrix was like the introduction to a paper, it blew ur mind because the whole idea of the matrix was jsut great,not to mention every other aspect of the movies(costumes,music,action,tone of conversation) but since the next two were about the same world, there was a limit to what they could do(thats why u need to look at the sotry as a whole), everyone says it could have been better, id like to c what others could have thought up, anywaz its the brothers story they made it not us, i personally see the next two movies as groundbreaking as the 1st one, but everyone hold the 1st one on such a high pedestal, to me reloaded did exactly what it should have done, it took the 1st groundbreaking/mindbolwing story and flipped it destroy all ur confidence that u know "what the matrix is?", that was one of the most popular adverstiment for the 1st one

im sorry that others dont feel the same, it seems like many people now a days dont have anything good to say, they wouldrather talk crap about the pieces of art other create, i mean theres people that dont like KILL BIll?? waht the helll??? anwaz sorry to those that think i have no clue what im talokin bout but "WHOA" the matrix is the best trilogy/story/movie EVER!!!!!!!!!!11111

alot of people have the opinion that there was alot of meaningless babble in reloaded and revolutions, but it is obvious that the W bros didnt leave anything up to chance, it is obvious that everyline,every prop, every conversation had a purpose and was meant to fuel the story
ex. in reloaded when trinity jumps off the motorcycle in the beginning and one of the cops says "OH MY GOD" he could have said a million things but it was meant for him to say that,
also alot of people dont like how religious reloaded n revolutions are, how much underlining christianity they have in them, but jsut go back and watch the 1st matrix, the word jesus christ must be used at least 7 times, and waht about the beginning when the guy comes to get that disk " your my savior man! my own personal jesus christ"

im sure u guys can come up with plenty counters so let me know what u think

im my opinion one of the reasons so many people dont liek this movie is because they dont like to think about things, they want a rambo movie that has a simple " im a strong ass guy and ill use my bravery/strength/courage to save the world", buttell me hasnt that been done so amny times before, and its still being done today
please inform me if im wrong but there has been no other movie that i know of that has such a diverse selection of themes on a philosophical lievel, of fate, destiny,hope, love, belief in the unknown and what makes us human

love-not to many people like it, either becasue of the acting, or the development between trinity and neo, but i do, the sex scene shows how much love they have for each other and how passionate they are, and the moves quesiton how powerful love is(like when trinity kisses neo n brings him back to life in the 1st one), not to mention the love of zee for fighting in zion willing to risk her life to see link

belief-the whole movie challenges yourself to think about what you believe in, do u beleive in destiniy, or free choice, are we all jsut doing things according to someones plan, or do we decide waht we do,
also do u beleive in miracles?
in the 1st matrix was it a miracle that cypher wasnt able to kill neo?, or was that jsut a lucky thing that tnak didnt die n instead came back to kill cypher,
do u believe in chance and accident?
there are other but im getting tired
sorry everyone,
and oh yea doesnt anyone like the editing in reloaded (when they are all sitting in the room tlkaing about what they have to domorpheus is taling bout destiny, and that night holding the very existence of thier meaning)
it flashes back and forth to before they start killing the electricity and then already in the act, and at the beginning its great how they forshadow with trinity woopin ewveryones ass, n breaking through the glass, it pulls u into the movie so much, then when its really happening your like "OOOOOOOO i get it" wow sorry ill stop

damn im sorry but im revolutions the idea of does our life have a purpose comes up
well does it? doesnt it? is the matrix trioliogy just meant for u to question what u tihnk or are the brothers trying to say waht they think, n have u chew on it for a while?
and all those things that smith says to neo at the end about all the things that we create to find purpose in life, is love real or not?
this is why matrix is incredible, not just casue all the badass action(not jsut physical but conversation action) but cause what it makes u quesiton, and another piece on editing, when neo is talking to the architct , it flashes back n forth to trinity fighting the agent, wow isnt that great ok thats it ill really done now, unless people talk to me, so if u jsut want me to shut up then i guess dont respond
sorry n thanx

my two cents:

it has been a great time filler to read up on what you guys thought of the matrix trilogy, some fascinating ideas out there. IMO reloaded was a great movie, there were holes yes, as with every other movie made. JUST like the star wars trilogy, people bashed the crap out of it, but a couple dacades later, 'star wars' is held with such esteem, that it should be in the movie hall of fame.

Nonetheless you must all remember that the Matrix trilogy is a movie, NOT the bible. It may cross refrence with the good book, but it is a story. Everyone out there wishin on how much better it could have been, because this shouldve happend or this shouldve happened has to step back out of they're egos and look at the big picture. The brothers W though creators of the movie, are also just two more opinions on how the movie shouldve been displayed, and thats the way it was displayed.

And everyone comparing it to ROTK has to remember one thing also... you can't say LOTR trilogy will succeed or fail like the Matrix trilogy because of one simple fact... the matrix was an original idea straight to movie. LOTR is and original idea translated first into a book, and the movie is going to follow those guidelines.

All in all I love the Matrix trilogy for what it is. A great movie, and a great discussion topic, bravo to everyone, keep the ideas rolling.

Next time, please use spoiler tags.

And if you want an answer to that question, read through this thread. It's been asked before. Your demand of "concrete evidence" also smacks of absurdity...if such obvious evidence existed, you probably would've noticed it on your own.

I have one question about this movie. I'd appreciate it if anyone could answer:

"Because I choose to."

Thanks! That answers a question that has been gnawing at my mind for some time!

Heres an answer to everyones WHY and HOW? questions about the Matrix trilogy: Because. Im serious....Sometimes I think we need to step out of the role of nit picking and enjoy a movie for what its worth, not what we are expecting. I of course only means sometimes, nit picking and asking why and how is a normal thing, but sometimes it is cool to just enjoy what you get for what its worth. A movie is not bad just because it wasnt what you expected, it may disappoint you, but that in an of itself doesnt make it "Bad", just not as great as you wanted. I think I rate the trilogy as a whole in the 2 and a half star range.

__________________

“The gladdest moment in human life, methinks, is a departure into unknown lands.” – Sir Richard Burton

I don't mind getting something other than what I expected. I did not expect The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring to be what it was, but I liked it all the same. Getting something other than what we expect is not inherently a problem...unless what we were expecting was something which made sense.

More importantly, most of the things we were expecting were things the series CAUSED us to expect. The second film's job was, in essence, to ask questions. We can hardly be blamed, then, if we watch the third film with the expectation of answers. We were led to expect that, and then denied it. As such, I think the complaints are perfectly valid. They're also in line with what you're saying seeing as how virtually everyone acknowledges that, in terms of raw entertainment, the film stands up just fine.

I have been thinking ...Zion is not in the real world . Why? :


1. The Nebuchanezzer (the hovercraft) and all the other ships were made in the usa around the year 2100, which makes sense with the point that Morpheus believes that they are around the year 2199 but he's not sure. The architect (ref. to Reloaded)however says that there are 5 matrix's, before this version and they have destroyed zion 5 times before that. So that doesn't make sense with the fact that the materials, hovercrafts and APU's etc. , can't be remainders of the war just before the "first matrix" as the people of ZION seem to believe.

2. The architect refers to the people of ZION as the people as "the minority if unchecked would be an escalating probability of disaster"
(so what I conclude out of this or "machine like thinking" that they(machines) know about it and just added another level to the matrix like they refer in the code intro's in the 3 movies.)

3. The Matrix online (the upcoming video game written by the brothers) will have no gameplay in zion because there is no reason for zion anymore (peace in the 7th version of the matrix is like final day of creation of the world (ref.to the biblical story when god created the world in 6 days and the 7th day he rested because work was completed)

4. This perfectly explains why neo can hack into The Matrix without being jacked in, and Agent Smith getting into Bane.

5. The spoon that neo gets in Reloaded from the orphan by the kid, there is no spoon, even in the "real" world

6.The way Neo "sees" the real world (orange code)




Let me know what you think.

[quote=jrs]I have been thinking ...Zion is not in the real world . Why? :


1. The Nebuchanezzer (the hovercraft) and all the other ships were made in the usa around the year 2100, which makes sense with the point that Morpheus believes that they are around the year 2199 but he's not sure. The architect (ref. to Reloaded)however says that there are 5 matrix's, before this version and they have destroyed zion 5 times before that. So that doesn't make sense with the fact that the materials, hovercrafts and APU's etc. , can't be remainders of the war just before the "first matrix" as the people of ZION seem to believe

2. The architect refers to the people of ZION as the people as "the minority if unchecked would be an escalating probability of disaster"
(so what I conclude out of this or "machine like thinking" that they(machines) know about it and just added another level to the matrix like they refer in the code intro's in the 3 movies.)

3. The Matrix online (the upcoming video game written by the brothers) will have no gameplay in zion because there is no reason for zion anymore (peace in the 7th version of the matrix is like final day of creation of the world (ref.to the biblical story when god created the world in 6 days and the 7th day he rested because work was completed)

4. This perfectly explains why neo can hack into The Matrix without being jacked in, and Agent Smith getting into Bane.

5. The spoon that neo gets in Reloaded from the orphan by the kid, there is no spoon, even in the "real" world

6.The way Neo "sees" the real world (orange code)


I believe that Zion was the real world and ill get to why in a bit but first I have some theories.

1.You are right about the timeline. Because of the second movie we know that the current Zion is Version 6.0. We also know that its about 100 years old because of Morpheus' pre rave speech. He says that they all know that Zion has been there for one hundred years. But we also know that there were 5 versions before it. So does that mean that its been 600 years since the machines won the war? Possibly they never tell you how long each version lasted before it was wiped out. All they did tell you was that it was destroyed 5 times. But ill go ahaid and say I think the matrix is around 600 years old if not more remember the very first matrix failed due to the fact that they modelled it after UTAH hehehe. As for Zions hovercrafts and apus simple. They are the remnants of the last Zions war with the matrix,and the one before and so on and so on (VisaV) sorry couldnt resist the quote. Ya see each current version of Zion was started by the previous version of "the one" And the first people of whichever version of Zion had remnants of "the great war"(I mean the battle to the end between the previous versions Zion vs the matrix) before it to build off of or piece back together.

2.The code intros start off in the MATRIX not in Zion least im sure of the first two. Episode one starts off with Trinity IN THE MATRIX having a conversation with Morpheus about having found Neo. Episode two starts off with Neo dreaming about Trinity dying IN THE MATRIX and Three started out with a review of the the second episodes ending. As for what the Architect says remember hes part of a yin and yang thing. His Yang being the oracle. In every version she was responsible for humans rebelling because she was responsible for making the programing accepting to humans in the matrix. Remember if the Achitect is the father "Then she would undoubtedly be its mother" And what has she done help the humans each time.

3.There were 8 "days" in the matrix the first Version failed.

4. I have a theory about this point brought to me by my roomate saying he thinks Neo is a program too. In the animatrix in the Aeon flux look alike story. The sentry asassin that was taken prisoner. They in a way reprogrammed its A/I To protect humans instead of kill. Whos to say that wasnt the first version of the one. Maybe over time and alot of time we are talking about, its absorbing all aspects of humanity and then figured out how to get into the mind and take control of the body. Agent Smith did it with Bane. Its like taping over a copy of Barney with Dark Angel. He took over Banes mind therefore he also to control of Banes matrix self as well as Banes real body.

5. The spoon kid from the first movie was with a bunch of kids in the first movie that the Oracles assistant at the time called "The hopefulls". Could she have been meaning hopefull that they were possibly Neo? I think so, just random children that at a young age were evolving out of the matrix's programing. And more than likely after Neo was discovered to be the one,was freed from the matrix himself.

6.ill go with you on this one because I think Neo is another program.

Please everyone dont bite my head off this is only my theory

disney, your long posts need to stop... Get them more to the point because first off I hate your name (I work at Toys R' Us which is in very close with Disney) and second off I get lost in ur post after "I think the Matrix is..."

I appologize to everyone I will never post a novel again.
But as for Disney,they are milkin the lifeblood out of the
country. Oh and dont take yourself seriously its sad.

Ah, that was barely a chapter. But interesting. As for disney, well, Walt's history ain't pretty (hiring ex-nazi death-camp orchestrators to run kiddie-advertising science-progs for a start), and their slant on kiddie-culture has always been a bit too dumbed down, merchandising orientated (and even plagueristic) for my liking.

But, back on topic....

Why oh why oh why couldn't the bros have attempted a conscious-instinctive cross-over construct? Eh? That's what i wanted. A great big theory of everything. String theory tied in a bow. Some way of incorporating instinct's flow into our analytical rows of data and get-up-and-go instigators.

Something practical amongst the tactical vaguery. That would've been a sight to see.

...

As it is - there are still loads of things to debate about the nature of this world it's true. i.e.:

-the idea that Neo is an uncontrolled (uncontrollable, only guidable) emergant program. That fits with the oracle sifting thru the kiddie-hopefuls too - and with all the other stuff, like the Archi saying the One is made, and the machine city being his "source" etc.

-What the hell was the spikey-head-machine thing's role in Neo's death?? (and did that view, apparently thru Neo's POV, really mean he was just resting, and not dead? Did it mean his flesh was dead but this computer-"soul" lives on?)

-The idea of life being about the journey not the arrival (i.e. Neo's continuation of the fight, even tho Smith see's it's outcome as clear. He chooses to keep fighting. I got this overall impression of means over ends anyway)

-Can anyone remember what the quote above the Oracle's kitchen door meant? They referred to it again in Rev in a kind of "there's your answer" way.

And on and on.

__________________
Virtual Reality chatter on a movie site? Got endless amounts of it here. Reviews over here

Do you honestly thing Return of the Jedi is a great film? I don't. It is a lackluster muppet show with sporadic good acting. The final battle in space is some of the best action on film to date, but I felt this film was when the corruption of George Lucas by cute fuzzy characters began. Also, saying that effects and action should never matter, only story, flies in the face of what film is at it's heart. If story is the ONLY concern, books are almost invariably better in my mind. As Hitchcock stated, "Going to the cinema one should experience cinema, not filmed conversations."

-S