It's a Trans, Trans, Trans, Trans World

I might just shoot myself if Hillary becomes President.

I live in Texas. That will not change anytime soon.

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This "Trans Bathroom" debate.......lets be honest. No woman that dresses like a guy wants to use the Mens bathroom. Hell, Im a guy and I know the Mens bathrooms more disgusting than the womens. This "push" has to be trangender men that dont want to use the Mens room anymore, and be looked at oddly, etc... So I say if the women have no problem with it, then thats that.

Use whatever bathroom you want, just clean up after yourself and don't piss on the damn seat.

Right, but that's another argument that goes both ways (or is it multiple ways?)
As foster pointed out earlier.

Would you be comfortable at a urinal when a gorgeous, six foot tall blond woman in a mini-skirt steps up next to you, whips out her member and starts peeing. After all, she's just another guy? (Or maybe he should go in the ladies room and confine himself to a stall?)

Would women be comfortable when a guy who looks like Grizzly Adams walks in just because he happens to be female underneath?

It's something of a difficult issue no matter what solution you adhere to based on the variables.

There are some places in the UK that have gender neutral toilets, I stayed at Durham uni once, and the building had gender indicated and gender neutral loos.

I kind of agree what Sexy and Steel say, too. I don't want to become a woman, but I have wondered how much easier my life would be if I was a woman attracted to men. I agree that trans issues aren't identical to gay specific issues either. I think they're struggling more than we are, so they need our support and therefore are more comfortable lumping together with the LGBT label. Just a thought anyway

I have no problem with gender neutral toilets as it is, I'd probably choose them over gender specific ones, drunken men aren't particularly pleasing to deal with when you only need a wee

This might interest you CiCi. Rutgers University in NJ has what is called the LGBTQ organization. http://lgbt.newark.rutgers.edu/

This came up back around the suicide of student Tyler Clementi.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_of_Tyler_Clementi

So I asked a friend "what's the Q for?"
He said, "It's for queer." At first I didn't believe him.
My next question was why would they put that in there. And if the group's goal was to help people of alternate orientations why would they put what's now considered a slur in their name? Isn't "queer" considered an offensive term.
My friend said, "Only if you straights use it, it's perfectly acceptable among gays - it's like the N-word in the black community!"
Then I had to know why it was in there since all the variations were covered? Male & female homosexuals, bi-sexuals and transgendered... why is "queer" put in there?

I still don't get why this potentially offensive term is there.

Because there are more variations of sexuality and gender identity than you listed. It's an umbrella term for non-heterosexuals and can also refer to "genderqueer." But yes, it is an in-term and does have the possibility of causing offense.

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Since such is the case, it seems strange to use it rather than a term that might be less potentially distasteful. (Perhaps something like "Alternate Lifestyles" or "Diverse Orientations" or even "Variable.)

At least as far as cinema goes, based on the number of film festivals which identify themselves as "queer" and the study of those films, I don't think it's offensive, but like everything else, I guess it all depends on who's doing the caling and who's offended by it.

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I don't either, I personally consider it an offensive term, I'd probably be quite hurt if someone identified me as queer.

Luckily, when I go to uni, I get a room to myself, so sharing rooms with people of the same gender won't be an issue for me. That being said, I like the idea of gender neutral housing for North Americans and countries who insist on shared accommodation, I'd be terrified of sharing a room with a man in fear of discrimination etc. I think it's a mature approach to it, I mean, there's even a uni over here (Liverpool Hope? It rings a bell) that won't allow boys to enter girls rooms and vice versa... despite the fact they're adults... and the age of consent is 16 here

It's a tricky one. I think some people think it'll solve all of their self hatred and people will start treating them better because they're conforming more etc. when in reality, trans people are regarded far less favourably than LGB people are.

I agree in cases of androgyny, where they're born with essentially both parts but ending up being raised in one gender when they eventually grow up into developing the opposite characteristics, although that's not really the same thing as you describe. I think it's mainly people wanting to find a way to be accepted and feel better about themselves, and I think there are safer routes in dealing with such problems than putting yourself through horrendous procedures that may or many not eventuate into the desired results. I think a lot of them just need better advice.
I fully admit that I could be talking out my arse here, mind. I have no experience on the subject and I know no one who identifies as trans gender either.

Sexy, I like how you made the title of this thread movie-related!

I've heard/read people saying it is a mental disorder and people saying it is a real thing that much that it all just disgusts me so much (the arguments not trans people) that i haven't looked into it myself and came to my own inclusion. Certain people on both sides in my experience have been so awful i just wouldn't want to agree with any of them. Still from what i've heard/read (correct me if i'm wrong anyone more knowledgable about it correct me because i'm not in the slightest) that the scientific community is pretty split on it and that nothing is conclusive yet. So i think there should be more research to learn more about it before either side starts making laws.

The toilet thing is a non issue for me too though, Agreed with all of the reasons given and the predator argument seems pretty ridiculous to me. Why would a paedophile/rapist risk getting caught abusing someone in a public toilet? I don't think it is impossible but i also don't see it becoming a common occurrence, i think anyone who would take that sort of risk would have to be even more unhinged than the average rapist and i think that sort of person in most cases would be a risk of attacking a woman/child regardless of the location or if he was dressed as a woman or not.

One thing i completely agree with is that young children should not be educated on this, i've heard suggestions for this to be taught to children as young as 5 in some cases and i think that is absurd. 5 year olds shouldn't be taught about any sort of sex or sexual identity, it shouldn't be something someone that age is concerned with. I know this isn't something that is actually going to happen and that it is only small amounts of people suggesting this but it is still ridiculous.

I don't really have an opinion on the matter, except that I think it's far more complicated than people think. I don't know the science, and I'm pretty sure the science is not conclusive right now anyway.

But I'm a schitzo, so when I think about the current transgender debate, my first thought is the sad thought that there are most definitely people out there dealing with undiagnosed schizophrenia who have delusions that they are the opposite gender, and that the people around them might be embracing and supporting their transformation.

I'm not saying they're all like that, or that that's the only reason someone might think they're the opposite gender. And I'm not saying there aren't genuine cases where someone was born the wrong gender. I don't know, and I think it's a bit silly to believe you do know at this current time. Then again, I think it's a bit weird that so many people feel the need to have a set opinion and be confident in it. I'm okay not knowing things.

One issue that Sexy Celeb brought up & Camo mentioned was the treatment of children who seem to exhibit some kind of gender confusion.
There was a show I saw a few years ago that was hosted by Chaz Bono. Don't remember what it was called, but it was about this issue.

It seemed innocuous at first, just about helping kids figure out their gender identity, but then I became horrified when I learned that the group running the program was coercing the children's parents into having them injected with various hormone concoctions to try to alter their biological sexual development before it even began!

This kind of chemical abuse can have horrible, irreversible, detrimental health effects on full grown adults - what it can do to children who haven't even begun puberty yet is unknown. The practice was unconscionable - turning children into transgender guinea pigs. It was like some kind of modern eugenics experiment by Dr. Mengele!

And the thought process was sickening - because little Jimmy likes to play with dolls, his parents, who feel they have to sacrifice every iota of common sense about their child's health to the ideals of political correctness, are convinced by some liberal agenda group to start injecting him with hormones to try to turn him into a chemically-induced female all because he can't decide, at age 10, if he wants to be a Fireman or a Ballet Dancer when he grows up.

Man, i know i don't have a clue what any of this is like but that is just wrong. I don't think children should be transitioned, ugh, i think it should only start once someone has legally became an adult and has made their own choice same with driving or drinking or whatever.

100% agree. Thats sickening.

Did Tongo just agree with Camo?!

Some stuff shouldnt even have to be agreed on. Thats political correctness taken to a destructive degree. Right on par with those "faith healers" that wont give themselves or their kids medicine because of their beliefs. Make TONGO pissed.

Yeah, it's been a while since I saw that program. They're not injecting them with hormones but with hormone blockers. Either way it's horrifying. Would you inject a child with growth blockers? Or an immunity system blocker? Or a brain development blocker? Or anything that disrupts their natural chemistry & growth? Because that may be exactly what the sick parents & doctors using these "treatments" may be doing. There's no way of telling what kind of detrimental effects they may be inflicting on these children.

Also, statistics indicate that the majority of children who exhibit gender confusion or a desire to become transgendered, outgrow, reconsider, reverse or just forget about the idea after puberty. (One study says only 12% still wish to be transgendered.)

The same way little Tommy wants to be a Kindergarten teacher and have a baby when he's 10, wants to be an astronaut when he's 12, wants to be a famous basketball player like Michael Jordan when he's 14 (even though he's short & white), wants to be a magazine publisher like Hugh Hefner when he's 15, decides to become a doctor when he's 16, goes to college, switches his pre-med major to art history at age 20, and ends up a construction worker with three kids at age 40. Point is - Children don't really know who they are or what they want - they're not supposed to! That's the purpose of childhood - it's all about changing attitudes, opinions, understanding & feelings - it's learning, it's discovering, it's growing.