Vanilla Sky

As you properly said, Commish, you haven't seen the movie. The ending is not a "cop out", the entire film is constructed meticulously.

I wouldn't say that anyone who doesn't like Vanilla Sky didn't "get" it. But I would say people who yell out "What the Hell?!?" when the credits roll, no, they probably did not "get" it.


The flick explains itself very clearly at the end, I'm not sure why so many audiences are confounded by it.

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"Film is a disease. When it infects your bloodstream it takes over as the number one hormone. It bosses the enzymes, directs the pineal gland, plays Iago to your psyche. As with heroin, the antidote to Film is more Film." - Frank Capra

Well, I'm not going to fully judge "Vanilly Sky" if I haven't seen it, but if what I've heard is true, then it does, indeed, sound like a very frustrating ending. I wouldn't say that someone yelling "What the hell?" doesn't get it, either; they may not, but just as likely, I think, would be that they simply couldn't believe that they'd try to pass that off as an ending. Someone yelled "What the hell?" (or something similar...I forget the specifics) at the end of "Hannibal," even though I'm sure they "got it" well enough.

Again, you haven't seen it, so perhaps you don't really know what you're talking about?

The ending is NOT a cop-out. You're just going to have to trust me on that until you actually see it for yourself. This isn't Boxing Helena, this is more akin to Memento. That screen goes black at the end and many people not used to non-linear, complex narratives are gong to say "What the Hell?", especially if they came in expecting to see Jerry Maguire 2. The ending is the most satisfying part of the film, because it is intricately and specifically built to, emotionally, thematically and in the careful plotting.

But you can keep making guesses and assumptions about something you haven't seen if you like.

You're not listening. I said that, if what I've heard is CORRECT, then I don't think I'll like it. I am not issuing any kind of definitive judgement here. If what I've heard is true, and accurate, then I'm very likely to dislike this film. If not, well, then maybe I won't. Maybe, in your mind, I did actually accuse "Vanilla Sky" of having a "cop out" ending, but the fact of the matter is that, when talking about these things, I used a small, yet crucial word: if.

Don't know who or what these sources are for your "hearing" Vanilla Sky has a cop-out ending, but I'd say they are definitely INcorrect. Since you obviously don't care about having the ending spoiled for you at this point, ask these sources what specifically happens in the film, why they think it is a "cop-out". I can give you lots of specifics for why it isn't.

Even easier perhaps, read through this thread, including all the spoilers. The structure and many of the specifics are discussed. Read them all, not just that the word dream somehow goes with the ending, and make a little more informed judgement yourself.

But really, until you see it - either the original Spanish movie or Crowe's flick, you probably shouldn't say one way or the other what the ending is or isn't, even in speculation based on what you've "heard".

Again, you're not listening. No friend of mine said it was a cop-out: that's my opinion, IF their description is accurate. Since we last, uh, "discussed" the ending, I've talked to someone who's seen it, and let him spoil a few things for me. When I find the time, I'll probably go through the spoilers here in more detail.

I didn't say what the ending is, seeing as I haven't seen it. I've said that, if it's like what I've heard from those who have seen it, I doubt I'll like it. What part of that do you not understand? I'll repeat myself: I've passed no final or definitive judgement on this movie, BUT, unless I've been misinformed as to what its like, and how it ends, I don't think I'll enjoy it. It's a shame, too, because the trailers had me convinced that it'd be good. Hopefully that will prove to be the case, but I'm not holding my breath.

To put it bluntly, you've no idea what I've heard about the movie, or how informed I may or may not be. There is absolutely nothing wrong, illogical, or unfair about what I've said.

i dont think the ending was as important as the journey he made and what he learned on it. is the ending that important?

I agree with Holden that the movie probably could've been better had it ended when Holden was saying. We would've still got the explanation of what had happened (not exactly everything, but we get the gist of what has happened), but it having it be more vague. I think that would've made it a better movie, though I still wouldn't be that big of a fan of it.

Hi --
I liked this a lot while I was seeing it, but it sort of didn't
"travel well." Looking back, I didn't think is was as hot. Nice to
look at and interesting as it went along but when you got to
The ending, it was . . . okay, but . . . come on. Kind of a cop-out,
I thought.
Love,
Jozie

I think it's utterly hilarious, that an explanation that I personally think didn't need to be there [I would have given anything to see that film end in the lobby with "Good Vibrations" playing] was there for the purpose of helping people understand it -- and these are the same people are calling it a cop out ending.

And if they had left it ENTIRELY up to them to decide with no "Tech Support" ending, they would be complaining even more, calling it pretentious bull ***** or something.

Why can't people be satisfied with questions....

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Because people don't usually like paying $8 just to be asked a question. They also don't like being revved up to an ending that doesn't meet the level of hype beforehand. I'm not saying "Vanilla Sky" is like that...but I don't see why there's anything wrong with someone being upset with an ending that they don't like...be it a "cop-out" ending (in short, any ending that takes an easy way out...that isn't clever...though I wish I could explain it better), or one that just doesn't make much sense (like POTA).

I'm not saying there's wrong with disliking an ending -- I personally feel the ending to "Romeo and Juliet" was a bit sour [that was a joke, people.] and I hate POTA's ending.

It just gets me that such a large proportion of people don't like being asked a question and made to think. I think the reason "Vanilla Sky" has been lauded by critics is because people [critics included] have become so braindead in this world [not calling anyone here braindead] that "entertainment" is about hanging one's brains up as they enter a theatre, or cinema, or concert, or CD shop, or when one turns on the TV.

I think the intellectual stimulation and the way the film forces people to think again didn't go down well, and that's sad, I think that we've come to needing nothing but fodder.

As stated, why can't people be satisfied with questions....

I can't believe this film is being so poorly received!

A number of the viewers actually didn't get it

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...702327-9109566

It's so much better than is given credit for. I guess some people are scared to think in a film or watch something besides the usual 'She's All That"

I resent that: why is it that anyone who doesn't dig a film with an odd ending, or a weird storyline in general, just doesn't "get it"? Who's fault is it that they didn't get it; theirs, for being stupid to some degree, or the film's, for making a film that so many people do not "get"? Why is it that anyone who doesn't like things like that just "doesn't like to think" or "wants it spoonfed to them"? I really hate that general attitude.

I've read most of the details of the plot of the movie, and I don't think I'd like it. Does that mean I don't like to think? Does that mean I don't like films that leave me with questions? Hell no. If "A.I." had ended 20 minutes earlier, I would've hailed it as a very good movie...even though it would've left me with plenty of questions, and plenty to think about.

You like it? Great. Others don't? That should be great, too. It doesn't mean they're stupid, don't get it, or don't like to think. Maybe they just have different taste...or maybe the movie is at fault. Oh, and very few people liked "She's All That," especially if we're talking about movie critics.

I'm unsure if most of that was aimed at me or not; I tried extremley hard to write a fair thing about the majority of people, an attitude [not the mainstream one, either] that the ENTIRE world is beginning to take, that entertainment has to be nothingness.

I think you're write in a respect though, Chris. It's very hard not to be hypocritical. The thing is, people who don't like movies go and say a heap of stuff, and usually try to convince others likewise -- when people disagree [and you've done this yourself defending LOTR:FOTR] people who like the movie seem to come out as just as bad. There lies the rub -- in defending something, and especially in telling others not to force their views upon others, we are forcing ours upon them. I think the REAL problem is, no one can seem to understand any more that their opinion is THEIRS. They may share it, but it's theirs. Everyone should be like, "really you didn't like that, I liked it. Oh well." But we're not, we feel we have to convince a be right -- therein lies the biggest attitude problem that belongs to absoloutley everyone -- I have to be right, people must agree with me. My opinion is right, and we're all wrong in thinking that, it's just ours.

Does that make sense, Chris, if not just tell me and I'll try again.

yeah, you're right. I was talking about some of those reviewers on amazon.com who said 'i saw this with my girlfriend, it sucked, worst movie ever. way too confusing', things like that. I agree that you can get a film and not like it.

Here's some excerpts from the reviews from different people (yeah, I'm bored so sue me )

"you tell a tale so ridiculus that no one can really explain it to someone else. Vanilla Sky is an abomination. "

"This movie just got too confusing"

"This movie is impossible to explain, let alone understand. "

"The plot was all over the place and it made no sense. "

Yo.

Silver: actually, my little rant was spurred by Guy's post. My bad..I should've quoted him. That would've made it clear. I do think you're right, for the most part: we all act a little hypocritical...though I honestly don't mind someone disagreeing with me. There are times, however, where a person's opinion borders on being factually incorrect...like if they criticize a movie for not explaining something, when in fact it did explain it, and they weren't paying attention.

Those are the types of opinions I usually end up arguing with. They don't get too far, really, because they are a mix of logic/fact (you can logically show someone, in some cases, that their reasons for not liking a movie don't make sense), and emotion/opinion. And yes, it is difficult to see something from another person's perspective sometimes. 99% of the time it's a cinch for me, I think...but now and then a movie like POTA, or LOTR: FOTR comes along, and I can't even fathom anyone disagreeing with me concerning it.

Guy: yeah, some of the reviews were short, and didn't explain the gripe much. Maybe they're busy...or lazy.

Hmm...Sounds familiar

Anyway, TWT, it wasn't 'all a dream.' And the ending is in no way a cop-out...It works on the level everyone has been talking about, but it also illustrates one of the bigger 'points' the movie had to make: the things you own end up owning you (Thank you, Chuck Palahniuk, Tyler, and David Fincher. ).



I don't think that made much sense, since I'm wicked tired. But tell me what you think, of what I think. I wanna know if I missed anything, if i'm completely f--king wrong.

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Sound familiar? Wha? I don't remember criticizing a movie just because I missed something crucial, though naturally, if the movie makes it something that's far too easy to miss, that's one thing. Anyway, you may be right about the movie's true message -- I don't really know. Could be...but even if that is the case, I don't think it's any excuse to have a story that may not make sense (again, I'm speaking hypothetically here). That's not an excuse for it.

"My dreams are a cruel joke. They taunt me. Even in my dreams I'm an idiot who knows he's about to wake up to reality. If I could only avoid sleep. But I can't. I try to tell myself what to dream. I try to dream that I am flying. Something free. It never works..."


I've seen this film several times now. As a fan of Tom Cruise's work, I truly enjoy it. I think it's a very unique, satisfying and moody movie. There are some true moments of brilliance in it, as well as some minor slip-ups. I just gave it a third viewing, so I wanted to reply to a thread about it.


-This unconventional, dreamlike film experience grabbed me from beginning to heartbreaking finish. Brave, inventive and very moving, Crowe's experimental science-fiction venture benefits from terrific performances and a memorable, moody soundtrack. Totally riveting.-

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