Gaming your Machine

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Registered User
Thought we had a thread on running & assembling gaming rigs, but seems not.

I'm a noob at this, but will have many a question over coming months, so thought I'd slap em here for the knowledgeable.

Here's some ongoing tittle tattle...

(About whether I can get some decent mileage out of a straight GPU upgrade)
I'm definitely not the best guy to ask, but if you're a complete noob - the basic things you need to run games on a PC are - enough RAM, a strong enough CPU, and a strong enough graphics card. There's a handy website called "Game Debate" which will tell you if a game is compatible with your system setup.

That's really the extent of my knowledge on it. I'd really recommend buying a console and sparing yourself the headache unless you're very into PC or online gaming. I don't own a console but I only play games on the same PC I use for work (meaning I just find games which meet my default system specs rather than spending the time and money on upgrades even if I miss out on all the latest games), so again not the best person to ask.



The People's Republic of Clogher
Golg's a bit further down the road than 'will I run it?' websites.

PC gaming's a strange one. The hardware is more expensive (although games are generally cheaper, even new releases, and online is free) but games will run and look better and backwards compatibility is increasingly becoming a thing of the past.
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"Critics are like eunuchs in a harem; they know how the Tatty 100 is done, they've seen it done every day, but they're unable to do it themselves." - Brendan Behan



there's a frog in my snake oil
Yeah I'm more looking to avoid having to spend on a next gen console - reckon I can get more for less this way. With PC you seem to get a wider spread of game releases, and the whole sweep of historical games like Tatty says. Plus mods . It is definitely more of a headache - there are some days when I'd like to just plug and play rather than go through the 'mini game' of getting it to run nice . On the whole though I"m digging PC gaming right now

*EDIT* Oh and it's worth mentioning the deals! Sure for consoles you can rent etc, but prices never seem to drop dramatically. Between sales, humble bundles & old games I keep picking up gems for around £2 quid. The main problem is finding time to play them all!
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Virtual Reality chatter on a movie site? Got endless amounts of it here. Reviews over here



The People's Republic of Clogher
Nice little vid with a selection of GPU benchmarks for GTAV:



The 960 seems pretty solid. I'd say your 7850 would be similar in power to the 750ti they tested, golg, with yours maybe being a sliver better.



Registered User
Golg's a bit further down the road than 'will I run it?' websites.

PC gaming's a strange one. The hardware is more expensive (although games are generally cheaper, even new releases, and online is free) but games will run and look better and backwards compatibility is increasingly becoming a thing of the past.
You're right about PC having a lot more variety - not to mention Steam has lots of great sales that you'd never be able to find with the consoles. There are also quite a lot of good free indie games out there that you can't get on consoles, like these for example:

http://www.blackmesasource.com/

http://www.soronline.net/sorr.htm



The People's Republic of Clogher
I've gone full on 'pimp my PC' recently.



Sadly it's only until I get a couple of resistors for the Noctua case fans I bought. They're a bit grey and boring compared to the Corsair ones (from an old case) I put in there in the mean time.



Almost silent though, and I'll take that over bling every time.

I had to take the photo, though. For posterity.



there's a frog in my snake oil
So, let's say I was hypothetically to go mad and buy a 970.....

The specs state it needs a 500W power supply. I've got 450W (Corsair VS series). Looking at walkthroughs on changing PSUs it looks a proper faff, but do-able. But ruffians like the Reddit Master Race lot, and about half of the TomsHardware crowd seem to think it's do-able at 450W if your set-up isn't too monstrous (My CPU draw is sub-100 at 65W for example, which helps. The card itself only requires 225W)

Craziness? Or thrifty sense? Should I just get stuck in and buy a simple £40 500W PSU?

*EDIT* So I stuck some basic stats into this calculator. Couldn't figure how to factor in things like the CPU cooler, but a very minimalist build I put in, including the 970, reckoned I'd only need 352W. So.... maybe? Anyone know of any way to measure current W usage? (Bit worried the PSU's 'total amperage available' might not be up to it too, as that seems to be key, but can't seem to figure it out from their specs).



The People's Republic of Clogher
Heh, I spent this afternoon rebuilding a PSU. First time I'd ever done it.

The latest Nvidia GPUs are extremely power efficient but I'd go for at least a 500W 80 Plus Bronze PSU - You never know when you need the headroom and a failing PSU can destroy your motherboard and everything attached to it.



there's a frog in my snake oil
Heh, I spent this afternoon rebuilding a PSU. First time I'd ever done it.

The latest Nvidia GPUs are extremely power efficient but I'd go for at least a 500W 80 Plus Bronze PSU - You never know when you need the headroom and a failing PSU can destroy your motherboard and everything attached to it.
Aha, those are exactly the sorta things I was worried about

Cool, think I'll make the move when the time comes. No harm having the headroom, and I do seem to have an ever-increasing number of peripherals plugged in. Cheers man



The People's Republic of Clogher
I spent a while yesterday cleaning out the spare PC, which is less than 5 years old now - I built it in prep for Skyrim. One can of compressed air later I was happy ... until I booted the thing up.

The PSU was making a noise like a garden strimmer so, with a heavy heart, I ventured on to Amazon to look about a new one. Was about to buy a Fractal Design Edison M 750W when I thought "What the heck, I'll strip the old one down and replace the fan".

Turns out that I'd managed to remove the dust from the case, CPU cooler and GPU but only succeeded in clogging up one entire corner of the inside of the PSU. Lint porn...

Anyway, it's now quieter than it has been in years and still has the original fan.

I'll buy a new PSU (and stick it in my main PC, the OCZ 750W from it will go in the spare) next month.



The People's Republic of Clogher
Currys has some good PSU prices if you've got one near you. I regularly check Currys/PC World before buying online because they sometimes have great prices - I got my PSU for £59.99 from there when it was nearly £80 on Amazon.

They're WAY off usually for GPUs, however.

Here's the Corsair Builder 500W and for 99p more a Coolermaster 550W semi-modular PSU.

Corsair's a known quantity for PSUs but Coolermaster is a respected component brand too and the 550W gets good reviews on Scan, which is where I've found myself buying my PC gear from recently.

I'd plump for the Coolermaster personally because of its semi-modular design. You'll be able to keep cables you don't need out of your system which is great for airflow and general cable management. My PSU isn't modular (whereas the one I took apart yesterday was) and it's a bit of a pain re-routing stuff. Semi modular means that the motherboard, CPU and GPU cables are hard wired - makes sense as you're always going to need those.

I'm looking at Fractal Design PSUs because the cables are not only modular, but flat.



there's a frog in my snake oil
Well I've gone and done it. I've let my inheritance cash erode my moral fibre, and have now got a 600W Corsair Bronze PSU (came in cheaper than 500s etc elsewhere weirdly) and.. may the lords of frugal living forgive me... a GTX 970 on the way

I thiiiink I've done my due diligence. Finally opened up the beasty today and, aside from marvelling at the sheer chunk of the CPU cooler, I reckon I've got the space and connections all set.



I've moved the hardrive (far right) down to accommodate the extra 7cms of 970-ness. (Lord knows figuring out the dimensions of everything was perplexing at times. Didn't help that I used Amazon's specs at one point, which was talking about the box size . And 'dual width' GPUs? Shouldn't that be depth?? Why must they **** with me so )

Anyways, yeah, I still have to prep for the power installation, and I've got em on cheapy free delivery so will be a while, but I'm looking forward to not ****ing this up

*EDIT* Oh and because the new PSU is modular does that mean I won't need the neat little wiring netting that's been used here? Or is that still a good idea? (And how do you figure out which airflows you shouldn't be blocking? Does that just mean keep wires away from any/all fans? Ta for any knowledge transfer )



The People's Republic of Clogher
Nice one! You're talking about the black cable sleeving? That's pretty standard on good PSUs now - Looks better (if you've got a windowed case) and should protect wires a bit more.

The trick is to tuck and route as much cabling behind the motherboard (ie - open up the other side of the case, not actually underneath the mobo) which will help greatly with airflow and access. I'll grab my camera and show you.



The People's Republic of Clogher
The theory is to have as much clear air between the front and the back of the case as possible:



It doesn't really matter about the other side as no one will ever see it ... until now.



I've done some tinkering again recently - Bought one of those Corsair hybrid coolers. It was awful with the stock fan - barely cooler than the air cooler and far noisier - but I'm now running it with a Nonoxia Deep Silence 120mm on the radiator and a Noctua 120mm as an exhaust at the back, both speeds are linked to CPU temp.

The whole thing is practically silent now.

PS - Zip ties are your friends for life now.



there's a frog in my snake oil
Ahh ok, nice one

Yeah cable ties for sure . Gonna catch up on some installation vids over the next few days, but I imagine the main other issues = plug correct power cables into correct devices / uninstall graphics drivers before GPU swap (I'm assuming you then launch in safe mode or something to install the new).

I'm properly salivating at the thought of seeing GTA V clipping along in nigh-full pomp . And I noticed that Witcher 2 had me down on very sparse settings - hopefully can top that up a bit

Will see if my slightly paltry CPU is still an issue, but I guess Dying Light (higher min spec for CPU) will be a good test of that



The People's Republic of Clogher
Your GPU is of a similar power to mine and, since the last patch, I'm struggling to get Witcher 3 below 70fps with nearly everything on Ultra.

Yep, uninstall the old GPU's drivers before removing it, then use a cleaner like CCleaner to get rid of any left over junk. I wouldn't just delete all your AMD folders though, as you've got an AMD CPU. They might be kinda important.

No need to boot into safe mode with the new card. The Windows legacy drivers will give you display of some kind (probably not 1080p display but enough to see what you're doing) before you install the Nvidia ones. Also, and I've done this before, make sure the GPU's power points are connected before booting up for the first time.

I was briefly going nuts when that happened.



there's a frog in my snake oil
By power points you mean make sure it's plugged in to the power supply?

(I am so capable of this and will not mock until I've messed up in my own personal fashion )



The People's Republic of Clogher
By power points you mean make sure it's plugged in to the power supply?
Yep.

I first ventured down this damnable rabbit hole by swapping my PSU and GPU as you're about to do, and look at the state of me now...

First time I built a PC, it wouldn't boot. I'd not connected the motherboard headers correctly so it wasn't recognising the power switch.

Took me about three hours to figure things out.

My original PC's motherboard USB and PS/2 connections had failed so, like most ordinary normal people, I went down to PC World and bought a completely new system. When I was there I noticed cases, motherboards, fans etc and wondered how hard it would be just to transplant the innards of my old rig to a new mobo.

Turns out it was pretty easy and within a day I had two perfectly functional PCs and only one of me. That was the last time I bought a complete unit.

Here's the best build-a-PC guide I know of.



WARNING: "." spoilers below
Not really, but it cheers me up



there's a frog in my snake oil
WARNING: "I'm not watching all the way to the end" spoilers below
In case everyone ends up spread across a table and oiled


Yeah I'm now fearful that one day I'll have to change out my motherboard, as the current one won't accept much fancier CPU than what it's got. (Not to mention decoupling that Borg-like cooling block in the process). I'm not sure I'm ready for that...



The People's Republic of Clogher
It looks like you've got a Micro ATX mobo which isn't the best for access.

I'll probably go down that route next time I build a PC. Now that I know the small water coolers aren't just gimmicks and the current GPU gen aren't power hungry monsters I think I can get away with a much smaller form factor.