A scary thing happened on the way to the Movie Forums - Horrorcrammers

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Is there anything (horror) that you do have pacing issues with? I think it'd be interesting to see if I felt differently about what you feel is slow. That would be a hard one to disagree on. I think pacing is a very obvious function.

I'm struggling to think of an example specifically from horror. I think when I made the comment, it was usually experiences with dramas where things are done at an intentionally slower speed and historically were known for a longer runtime (now everything's long, apparently) often result in an experience where the pacing can feel like a challenge in the sense that one often isn't in the mood for them when they're tired. i.e. Not something you'd start late at night. e.g. I often try to watch 2001 on New Year's Eve, trying to end it around midnight. I've seen it enough times, it practically flies by. But as a teen encountering it for the first five or six times, I would have conked out during the On the Beautiful Blue Danube soundtrack (I know because I did).


That's always the experience that jumps to my mind when issues of pacing in serious-minded movies comes up.



I'm trying to think if The Phantom Carriage qualifies as horror. I think it does and it's been a while, but it's kind of in that category of horror that for some I don't quite register the horror elements as being horror.


That might be an early example of... whatever type of artistic horror you lot are contemplating. Saying this mostly as remembering it coming across as a dramatic, moral story. But my memory is admittedly now vague at this point.


If you're going with, "consciously interacting with the notion of what horror is," then Haxan was probably a good example.


I think I shy away from the phrase of "elevated" horror when describing art house horror, since I feel like that's being applied to modern arthouse horror in a way that implies a lesser-ness to horror movies that aren't in that category (e.g. working with self conscious interaction with and separation from the genre, I don't think there's anything elevated about The Texas Chainsaw Massacre or The Thing).

However, I do have to admit, I can see how one would want a phrase to capture that sense with the example of cat people. I once heard the definition of neo-noir being somewhat similar (which is what separates a neo-noir from a modern noir).



Victim of The Night
I thought the 1928 version of The Fall of the House of Usher was pretty elevated.
I agree and I would also say that Bride Of Frankenstein ('34) is pure, multi-layered cinematic genius and deserves its reputation as not only one of the best Horror movies ever made but also one of the best films, period.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
It isn’t so much those things but how those things are accomplished. The technical achievements were amazing for the time. Now, I can’t accurately compare it to Caligari as I haven’t seen Caligari in over a decade, although I remember being very impressed. I have the benefit of owning Nosferatu, and have watched it a few times and more recently. I’m not sure which I would give the edge to, or I’m being fair. *

As for Haxan….. Not yet! It’s definitely on my watchlist, and saved on Criterion for a later date. Which I hope is soon, of course. You’d be surprised at the amount of classics I have yet to get around to, but the amount of lesser seen films (especially Italian and Asian films of the 70’s and 80’s) I have seen might surprise one as well.

*eyes Umberto Lenzi’s and Sergio Martino’s filmographies I recently started up*. 👀
I would love to hear your thoughts on Caligari after you rewatch it.

I've got a feeling you're going to be as impressed with Haxan as you are with Nosferatu. Ah, we've all got holes in our fandom.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
I'm struggling to think of an example specifically from horror. I think when I made the comment, it was usually experiences with dramas where things are done at an intentionally slower speed and historically were known for a longer runtime (now everything's long, apparently) often result in an experience where the pacing can feel like a challenge in the sense that one often isn't in the mood for them when they're tired. i.e. Not something you'd start late at night. e.g. I often try to watch 2001 on New Year's Eve, trying to end it around midnight. I've seen it enough times, it practically flies by. But as a teen encountering it for the first five or six times, I would have conked out during the On the Beautiful Blue Danube soundtrack (I know because I did).


That's always the experience that jumps to my mind when issues of pacing in serious-minded movies comes up.
Yeah, that's a tough one for me too. I feel like I should be really high when I'm watching it. Maybe that's the way it was intended.



What’s a modern horror film that’s been labeled as “elevated horror” that isn’t actually about psychological trauma/grief?



Really disappointed with Skinamarink. It's fun to vibe out to for a while but after a half hour or so I just felt like the movie ran out of ideas and didn't seem to have a sense of direction. Most of the horror can from a few jump scares that just felt cheap and unearned.



Elevated horror seems like one of those terms that assumes a distance needs to be place between the horror genre and serious works of art. Or that it is a given that in their natural state they don't measure up to more importa t works.Which would of course be nonsense. The original Universal monster pictures,.cheapo sci fi hybrids, Grindhouse....it has always had as much to say about the human condition as any other more supposedly serious or artful genres. Tacking on an obvious social issue or dealing with the reality of human emotions such as trauma or grief are, first of all,hardly new to the genre, but are also completely unnecessary to make a horror film 'elevated'. Horror has always been smarter than most things out there. It's always had it's finger on the pulse of humanism. It's always been deeply receptive to cinematic experiments and style.


Horror doesn't need to elevate shit to be better than most things. Next to the straight up art films up there, it is ground zero for much of what is important about film.



Elevated horror seems like one of those terms that assumes a distance needs to be place between the horror genre and serious works of art. Or that it is a given that in their natural state they don't measure up to more importa t works.
I guess my working definition of the term is a bit different. I tend to think of "elevated horror" as horror that goes the opposite direction of "freak show"/"LOOK AT THIS" horror and focuses more explicitly on allegorical imagery and has the characters' stories as the centerpiece.

But even as I'm typing that out I realize how nebulous that is.



I guess my working definition of the term is a bit different. I tend to think of "elevated horror" as horror that goes the opposite direction of "freak show"/"LOOK AT THIS" horror and focuses more explicitly on allegorical imagery and has the characters' stories as the centerpiece.

But even as I'm typing that out I realize how nebulous that is.

I had to look up the term because, even though I've vaguely heard of it before, I didn't know it was a thing. And nebulous is right, because I don't think freak show necessarily should be de-elevating something. Even Hereditary, as based in human emotion and character as it is, aggrandizes it's approach to grief in an almost Freakshow manner by the end.


And then, if you look at something like Frankenstein...I'm sure this should be considered elevated as it deals with all manner of human emotions and folly and both the Dr and his monster are characters worthy of serious reflection.


I just find the term a real backhanded kinda compliment.



I just find the term a real backhanded kinda compliment.
Like many attempts to sub-classify genres, I think that you run immediately into seeming contradictions.

I suppose in terms of useful mental categorizations I distinguish between "artier" horror (like The Strings) and more blood-and-guts fare (like Evil Dead). But I don't have notions of one being superior to the other.



My point (bait) earlier was going to be that “elevated horror” is a term created by patronizing film critics by trying to act like horror that tries to take psychological trauma and grief seriously somehow transcend the perceived lowliness of the genre. I suppose it’s a step up from insisting that they’re actually thrillers but yeah, it’s a pretty garbage term.

I’ve heard arthouse horror thrown around and while it still has issues, no one would expect a James Wan joint to be playing at an arthouse cinema, whereas Ari Aster, Robert Eggers or Julia Decournau definitely could, so it’s delineation is more effective without quite the same level of condescension.



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
Anybody watching del Toro's Cabinet of Curiosities? I really enjoyed them.

My ranking

#8. The Murmuring
#7. Graveyard Rats
#6. The Viewing
#5. Dreams in the Witch House
#4. The Outside
#3. Lot 36
#2. The Autopsy
#1. Pickman's Model



Victim of The Night
I think I think of "Elevated Horror" as a horror movie with an actually good script.



Victim of The Night
Anybody watching del Toro's Cabinet of Curiosities? I really enjoyed them.

My ranking

#8. The Murmuring
#7. Graveyard Rats
#6. The Viewing
#5. Dreams in the Witch House
#4. The Outside
#3. Lot 36
#2. The Autopsy
#1. Pickman's Model
Oh man, they did "Pickman's Model"?!
Sold!



Anybody watching del Toro's Cabinet of Curiosities? I really enjoyed them.

My ranking

#8. The Murmuring
#7. Graveyard Rats
#6. The Viewing
#5. Dreams in the Witch House
#4. The Outside
#3. Lot 36
#2. The Autopsy
#1. Pickman's Model
How much do the stories add pointless character interactions versus staying true to what's written and not adding new material?



"Tell Me. Do You Bleed? You Will."
How much do the stories add pointless character interactions versus staying true to what's written and not adding new material?
I'm not much of a reader.



Oh man, they did "Pickman's Model"?!
Sold!
Our pal DaMU had been working on a script based on the story for some time and boy was this adaptation a blow to the soul. We both agreed to focus on original projects and avoid public domain adaptations afterwards.



Oh man, they did "Pickman's Model"?!
Sold!

I was aware of this from reading this thread earlier. I'm pretty sure Captain Terror brought it up back in October.