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It sticks out among the rest of the film for me which while very violent and gory, the violence is done in an over the top and almost comical manner, whereas this scene is much more realistic and horrific.
Natural Born Killers
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I thought it was pretty good. The only part of the movie I don't get is the character of Scagnetti.
SPOILER
During the arrest of the killers, Mick comes at the cops with a knife and tries to attack them and the cops feel like shooting of course, but Scagnetti constantly tells them to not fire. Later on, Mick is pointing a gun at Scagnetti and Scagnetti has a gun pointed him. Scagnetti tells Mick to put the gun down over and over again, instead of just shooting him, but Scagnetti, cannot bring himself to shoot Mick, and gets shot to death as a result.
Yet earlier in the movie, it's established that Scagnetti is a cold blooded murderer, of a helpless woman. So what I don't get is, how come he has the guts to commit cold blooded murder, of a helpless murder, yet he completely wimps out in a police self defense situation?
But that was the only part of the movie I didn't understand, was him, and the rest of the movie was good. Not Stone's best movie by any means, but a decent effort.
SPOILER
During the arrest of the killers, Mick comes at the cops with a knife and tries to attack them and the cops feel like shooting of course, but Scagnetti constantly tells them to not fire. Later on, Mick is pointing a gun at Scagnetti and Scagnetti has a gun pointed him. Scagnetti tells Mick to put the gun down over and over again, instead of just shooting him, but Scagnetti, cannot bring himself to shoot Mick, and gets shot to death as a result.
Yet earlier in the movie, it's established that Scagnetti is a cold blooded murderer, of a helpless woman. So what I don't get is, how come he has the guts to commit cold blooded murder, of a helpless murder, yet he completely wimps out in a police self defense situation?
But that was the only part of the movie I didn't understand, was him, and the rest of the movie was good. Not Stone's best movie by any means, but a decent effort.
Just one of a handful of films that tried to emulate Malick's 'Badlands', and mostly failed.
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Thinking back to this movie, does anyone else find the scene with the hostage in the motel room to be really disturbing? I'm not an easily disturbed person but something about that scene always gives me an uneasy feeling every time it comes up. Just the perverseness of it, I suppose.
I thought it was pretty good. The only part of the movie I don't get is the character of Scagnetti.
SPOILER
During the arrest of the killers, Mick comes at the cops with a knife and tries to attack them and the cops feel like shooting of course, but Scagnetti constantly tells them to not fire. Later on, Mick is pointing a gun at Scagnetti and Scagnetti has a gun pointed him. Scagnetti tells Mick to put the gun down over and over again, instead of just shooting him, but Scagnetti, cannot bring himself to shoot Mick, and gets shot to death as a result.
Yet earlier in the movie, it's established that Scagnetti is a cold blooded murderer, of a helpless woman. So what I don't get is, how come he has the guts to commit cold blooded murder, of a helpless murder, yet he completely wimps out in a police self defense situation?
But that was the only part of the movie I didn't understand, was him, and the rest of the movie was good. Not Stone's best movie by any means, but a decent effort.
SPOILER
During the arrest of the killers, Mick comes at the cops with a knife and tries to attack them and the cops feel like shooting of course, but Scagnetti constantly tells them to not fire. Later on, Mick is pointing a gun at Scagnetti and Scagnetti has a gun pointed him. Scagnetti tells Mick to put the gun down over and over again, instead of just shooting him, but Scagnetti, cannot bring himself to shoot Mick, and gets shot to death as a result.
Yet earlier in the movie, it's established that Scagnetti is a cold blooded murderer, of a helpless woman. So what I don't get is, how come he has the guts to commit cold blooded murder, of a helpless murder, yet he completely wimps out in a police self defense situation?
But that was the only part of the movie I didn't understand, was him, and the rest of the movie was good. Not Stone's best movie by any means, but a decent effort.
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I really just want you all angry and confused the whole time.
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It reminds me of the sub-plot in From Dusk 'Til Dawn where Seth and Richard take a woman hostage and keep her in a hotel room only for Richard to commit some off-screen act of (presumably fatal) violence against her that disturbs even a hardened crook like Seth. The main difference here is that Richard is treated as an evil character who ultimately gets punished while Mickey still gets to be the anti-hero because he's Not As Bad as characters like Scagnetti. It'd be one thing if they were just killing people who "deserved it" (which is still ambiguous enough to work), but leaving Mickey's treatment of the woman in the hotel room to the imagination is a bad move in a way that not even showing Mallory seducing and killing a mechanic in retaliation can justify.
One could also make the argument that the scene re-enforces that Mickey and Mallory are both terrible and shouldn't be given celebrity status, contrary to the way the media portrays them as. It's like the film is reminding the viewer if you like Mickey and Mallory, remember the innocent people they killed.
Not sure if anyone here saw the alternate ending, but Oliver Stone has said he prefers it and I sort of do as well although I do like the ambiguous ending we have. It's like if you wanted to see Mickey and Mallory get what was coming to them it does just that, reminding the viewer even if they aren't as bad as some of the other characters like Scagnetti they're still villains to be hated.
Absolutely. When I first saw it I was slightly disappointed with the 'lack' of violence. As you say, it's almost (is) comical at points, but that scene really stood out the first time I saw it.
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The movie definitely feels like it makes something of a tonal shift during that scene. Like it's reminding the viewer of how horrific that sort of thing is in real-life and that Mickey and Mallory despite their abusive upbringing are still killers who should be hated and feared.
Early script draft
Close to final script draft.
Thought I'd share these with any fellow fans of the film. The final draft is fairly close to the film albeit with some differences here and there which is expected. The earlier draft is very different and I recall there's another early draft of the script before Stone came along and re-wrote it. I recall reading bits of it online. I remember one part of it had additional dialogue from Duncan Homolka (the crying hostage prison guard Mickey tapes the shotgun to near the end in the bloody prison washroom), where he mentioned his family's names.
Early script draft
Close to final script draft.
Thought I'd share these with any fellow fans of the film. The final draft is fairly close to the film albeit with some differences here and there which is expected. The earlier draft is very different and I recall there's another early draft of the script before Stone came along and re-wrote it. I recall reading bits of it online. I remember one part of it had additional dialogue from Duncan Homolka (the crying hostage prison guard Mickey tapes the shotgun to near the end in the bloody prison washroom), where he mentioned his family's names.
Dang I guess I need to watch this one. Based on the first 10 posts on Page 1, I expect that I will be in the "fan" section once I am done viewing. I will let you all know! 
EDIT: Whoops! I had no idea they did this with the movie. Had to bail after about 30 mins.
EDIT: Whoops! I had no idea they did this with the movie. Had to bail after about 30 mins.
Last edited by Reyth; 01-28-18 at 11:31 AM.
I'd give it another chance someday, it's not an easy movie to take in the first time you see it. The first time I saw it I was thinking "WTF is this?" the whole time.
It's a shame the music video for Nine Inch Nails' song Burn wasn't on any DVD or Blu-ray release of the film, it was on VHS and LaserDisc ones. Always liked that song and felt it suited the film perfectly. That was actually the one change of the Director's Cut I disliked, changing the music during the pre-end credits montage of the angry faces. I felt Burn went along perfectly with the imagery and mood. Wish they'd kept it the same.
It's a shame the music video for Nine Inch Nails' song Burn wasn't on any DVD or Blu-ray release of the film, it was on VHS and LaserDisc ones. Always liked that song and felt it suited the film perfectly. That was actually the one change of the Director's Cut I disliked, changing the music during the pre-end credits montage of the angry faces. I felt Burn went along perfectly with the imagery and mood. Wish they'd kept it the same.
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As am I 
It's always interesting to bring this film up and see the differing reception you're bound to get from all sorts of people. As I said in the original post, it's a film that firmly splits people.
It's always interesting to bring this film up and see the differing reception you're bound to get from all sorts of people. As I said in the original post, it's a film that firmly splits people.
Greetings. I have never heard of Natural Born Killers before. Thanks for this post, it makes me curious to have a look at this movie. The story seems quite interesting and deep as well. I am going to watch it tonight, hope it will be good. Have a nice day!
A much better approach that I wish NBK was like:
Psychopaths (2017)
Granted, I am not a huge fan of this one but I think they did a much, much better job. This one is what I was hoping NBK would have been like.
Psychopaths (2017)
Granted, I am not a huge fan of this one but I think they did a much, much better job. This one is what I was hoping NBK would have been like.
I think you answered your own question there - it's easier to murder a helpless woman than take on someone whose capability for murder matches or even exceeds your own so it makes sense that Scagnetti would have to play dirty in order to beat Mickey (and check me if I'm wrong on this but doesn't he have some reason to keep Mickey alive, like it's part of his own journey to fame and fortune that he managed to be the one to capture Mickey?).
In fact, a lot of the climax is really far fetched, as I did not by that the warden would let Mickey and Mallory escape with hostages, rather than just keeping his guns on them, waiting for more of a calvary to arrive.
But it's still a good movie, just wouldn't say it's a great one perhaps. I also am surprised that to read that Tarantino did not approve of the way Oliver Stone directed it, which also really surprises, me cause this movie feels so much like a Tarantino movie, that I never would have guessed that Stone would have directed it, unless it was for his name in the credits.
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