Old Fashioned

Oh, how lovely. I have a few questions for you. What color of skin did Adam and Eve have? Did Jonah live in a whale? Did Noah put 2 of every non-marine species of animal in a boat? Just curious.

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One of the biggest myths told is that being intelligent is the absence of the ability to do stupid things.

Firegod, what relivance do these questions have to my comment?

I agree; look at the nations that try to exclude religion, basing their system on what they believe to be reason and logic. Many Communist nations are like this. Societies that operate completely outside of God do not last. An individual may be able to live what would be considered by most to be a moral life outside of the belief of objective morality/God, but on the whole it simply doesn't work.

If you don't believe in God, you have no basis for unalienable rights...which is why states that ignore God tend to fall. Whether or not you believe in God, I think it's abundantly clear that the concept is crucial in some ways.

I was just interested in knowing a little something about how far you take what is in the holey bible... If you don't want to answer, don't.

Yoda,

Show me 3 cases where a lack of religion caused a country to fall and I'll show you about 100 examples of one falling because of their religion. But I don't think you can find 3.

I think that all you doG fearing people should go to Hell!!!

Oh wait, I don't believe in Hell....Does not compute, does not compute...


DOH!!!

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"Today, war is too important to be left to politicians. They have neither the time, the training, nor the inclination for strategic thought. I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration, Communist indoctrination, Communist subversion and the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids."

I think I could probably find three (Mao Zedong's Communist China is the first to come to mind), but really, the fact that there aren't many is beside the point. It's not even ATTEMPTED usually, but when it has been, it's failed. All the great empires in world history have had some kind of religion. The reason that you can find more failed countries based on religion than Atheism is simply because it's been attempted more often with religion. You can find more white criminals than black criminals in America; it's not because white people, on average, tend to engage in more criminal behavior...it's because there are more white people than black people in America.

You and I both know that America is what it is because of it's freedoms...and those freedoms are implanted in the belief that we are ENDOWED with unalienable rights. It's crucial that claims like that be rooted in something. Picture a constitution that granted alienable rights simply because they were judged most beneficial to people on the whole.

The concept of being endowed with unalienable rights is a very potent one...and one that necessitates a Creator. It's no coincidence that the US is where it is. Those words really mean something. Though I have no way of proving it to you, I don't doubt for a second that America wouldn't be the great country you and I know it to be if not for the concept of God in general. The American way of life is based on it.

Well Firegod, I think since you put it that way, its a fair question to ask. I believe that the "Holy Bible" is the word of God period. Your comment to Yoda, you do know I believe your right, you could show where many nation's have simply lead themselves to distruction due to the religon, and what it was based upon. While we are on that subject let's address that a little, if you do or don't agree religon is man made. We say it is a word that depicts a way or what we believe. I say I believe in God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit, I believe that Jesus gave us an example with his teachings and life on how to live. Being a Christian doesnt mean, how many time's a week I go to church, or do I give to the poor. It simply means that we are attempting to be Christ like. We know that religon more or less becomes an anchor about someones neck, so they are compelled to do works to enter into heaven, I know this is not truth as I believe it. So I say Im not a religous person, but Iam a person who is attempting to be more like Christ each day, outside of the rules and regulations or what you call religon.

Omega, you ignorant slut!

Is it just me, or does whenever Firegod or Yoda, or Silver make a thread that has to do with opinion or religion, it always ends up being a "Yoda-Firegod-And-Silver-Aguing-Thread"? I mean, it's the exact same thing with Abortion, Faith, Aetheism, and Cloning, etc, etc. Anyone else notice this?

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"I bet one legend that keeps reoccurring throughout history, in every culture, is the story of Popeye."

Gracie, I'm new so I'm sorry don't really have an opinion yet on your comment. However you must admit they dare to talk about things that other people don't like to discuss. The old saying two deadly things to not talk about at parties or on dates, politics and religon. As far as I'm concerned I like the fact that people have opinions, be they one's I agree with or not, as long as they are responsible with those opinions.

I'm not that serious, and no matter how new you are, you can always have an opinion. Hey, Silver and I don't agree on some things, but I'm always complimenting him on how high-quality his funny is! You don't need to have the same opinion on things. I quote Deep Thoughts:

I've always loved that quote. I proboly didn't get it right on, but that's about it.

That really was not my meaning wheather or not you are deep or have an opinion, I was simply commenting to what you said, and as far as being new and having an opinion, thats a given that new or not all of us have one.

Ya' know, you sound kinda' fun. What's your real name? As I'm sure you already guessed, mine's Grace. Just so you know, I'm the sister of Yoda. And no, the pointy ears do not run in the family, thank God!

Well Grace, thanks for the compliment, well lets say for now you can call me JP if you want. You sound fun as well.

No it doesn't There's no good reason why that concept necessitates a creator. Us all having certain rights just makes sense whether there is a god or not.

In my opinion, an atheist country would do just fine. I'd say the main reason it couldn't happen in the past is that theistic countries simply wouldn't have put up with it. After all, in world history, being guilty of not having a belief in a god has often resulted in the dealth penalty.

I'm kind of surprised you didn't mention Hitler. Most people seem to think he was an atheist, but there is no evidence of that. He talked about and wrote about God all the time, and I've never seen one atheist quote from him at all.

Many countries are becoming more atheist all the time. I believe some of them will have an atheist majority eventually, and won't fall off the face of the earth as a result. Maybe not in my lifetime, though.

Well Firegod, it seems we do agree on one point, this world as much as we would like to think it is headed on a path of greatness, is not. I believe we will see more and more seperation between those who serve God, and those who don't. I'm also sure the god of the underworld or also known as Lucifer, would be more then happy to see nation's turn into godless one's, this of course would give him that warm fuzzy feeling that he has a toe hold on the very foundations of the Christian faith as we know it. However you must remember this, though we will continue to see the digress of man, and his godless nature will come out we will see more and more intolerance on this planet, and more and more seperation from our morals and man will do that which is right in his own eyes, in other words he will create his own morals and live by those, and we know the end is distruction.

Nah. Destruction is what we've been doing all this time, and something we've done less and less the more we've gotten away from religion.

Eh? Care to elaborate?

Let me guess Firegod you have your head in the sand right. What do you call the Middle East, when Saddum started a war against Kuwait it was a blood war, or a religous war. Yes we understand some of the reason's why the war was started, but through the annuls of time every war in the Middle East has been based on religon. To say we have seen less and less is a sign of your age and the fact that you simply are spouting off at the mouth with nothing in which to base your opinion. Bin Laden himself said the attack against America was against the Christian belief which we say this nation was founded upon. Time to have an origianl thought, tell me what you think rather then what you have read. From the gut.

The argument of, "show me 3 cases..." is kind of humorous. Every single empire in history has already fallen, with the exception of the current empires, with or without religion. Entropy happens more because of political problems and attrition, than religious problems. Actually, I think the longest lived Empire may be the Roman Catholic Church. That argument has no merit as far as I'm concerned. I'm not a religious person, though I used to be, and I believe that there are benifits with having a culture that does have faith, but there are also some negative aspects to it as well. Why must every idea for freedom have it's double edged sword? I respect people who believe in doG, if it helps them. If they become better people because of it, then I have much respect. But I tire of the a-typical hypocrite that spends their energies trying to convert me, when all I feel is contempt for them as individuals. My step-mother is a christian, and I have never met anyone more judgemental in all my life. I don't think religion is dying, and I don't think it will. It is now an instict to have faith for most people. I see digression in attitudes in our young, that was not rampart in the 1950's. But in the 50s, kids did not have unalienable rights, now they do. No matter what choices we make, there will always be reprocussions. And Omega, most religions have been founded with the blood of the unbelievers. Catholics and Christians, and Moslems have all had their holy wars throughout history. I think that a lot of people have gained more rights because the hold that religion has had in the government has slowly eroded. It's far from gone, obviously, but it is less.