Human Nature

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Human Nature: Good or Evil?
48.15%
13 votes
Evil
51.85%
14 votes
Good
27 votes. You may not vote on this poll




planet news's Avatar
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Naive, albeit rather fun, question:

Deep down, at our core, are we more good or more evil?

I think it's a little too obvious that humans are neither ever "good" or "evil" per se. You know, like, "it's more of a case by case basis at which our individual acts can be evaluated as such". And so on.

What I mean here is "deep down".

Depending on what happened to you today, this answer might change.
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planet news's Avatar
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For the golden mean ******** who want to say both.



What about those who want to vote "neither"?
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"Don't be so gloomy. After all it's not that awful. Like the fella says, in Italy for 30 years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance. In Switzerland they had brotherly love - they had 500 years of democracy and peace, and what did that produce? The cuckoo clock."



planet news's Avatar
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What about those who want to vote "neither"?
Those people should vote evil.



I voted evil because of this one ethics philosophy I forgot the name of but it had to deal with people doing things only for themselves, even when they trick themselves into thinking they do something for someone else.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
Wow! Evil is just Devil without the D, and Good is just God with another O inside. Plus Evil gets top billing here. Almost makes you think...
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\m/ Fade To Black \m/
I voted for Good as I think there is good in everyone and I like to think that aswell, even though there are some sick ba$tards out there im sure the majority is good deep down
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I'm going with good... it's just the evil sick bastards who make the evening news... but I've seen a lot of good things out of people...
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AiSv Nv wa do hi ya do...
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I don't love the dichotomy, or having to choose between these two specific words, but we're more bad than good. And I don't think it's close. I think the only way we can look at ourselves as good is if we use all sorts of common excuses wherein we compare ourselves to others, which isn't a useful comparison if we're all pretty bad to begin with.

And, of course, there are always lots of rationalizations about doing our best, or how hard it is to be good all the time, which really only underscores how bad we really are to begin with.

If we look at each thought and action really objectively, it's disturbing (but undeniable) how many of them are selfish at their core.

This doesn't mean people are not capable of good things, great things, or truly altruistic things. But the number of bad, selfish things we do overwhelms those moments of goodness with their sheer volume, and even when we do good we can find a way to turn it bad through pride, arrogance, or some other self-serving sentiment. I think the only way to believe we are good at our core is to regard those moments when we overcome it as far, far more important than the many instances in which we don't.

We can be made good, certainly, but not by any power on this earth. By ourselves, we're pretty bad.



planet news's Avatar
Registered User
I don't love the dichotomy, or having to choose between these two specific words, but we're more bad than good. And I don't think it's close.
You seem to have a clear view, so why would you hate choosing?

If we look at each thought and action really objectively, it's disturbing (but undeniable) how many of them are selfish at their core.
Some popular political and economic philosophies seem to think that selfishness is the key to a successful society. Unless you don't associate a successful society with the good (but rather with the bad or the middling???), it seems that these certain philosophies could then be called evil.

But the number of bad, selfish things we do overwhelms those moments of goodness with their sheer volume, and even when we do good we can find a way to turn it bad through pride, arrogance, or some other self-serving sentiment.
To me, we are victims of these "evil" emotions. They are like defense mechanisms that we desperately cling to in order to cope with our sad existence. Pride and arrogance apply the most here. We can't just be satisfied with doing good. We must be made to feel as if was truly good. That's why doing good when no one is watching is the most honorable of the good.

Also, selfishness is something you've mentioned several times, but what do you suggest? That it is possible to care for another, even ONE OTHER person, as much as you care for yourself? I mean, precisely as much? No matter how much you love that other person, you will always be trapped within your own existence, and see things from your point of view.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
Seeing things from your point of view is probably the bane of humanity. However, sometimes people give up things and become so successful at it that seeing things from "your own point of view" becomes putting others first. Now, whether it's an Eastern philosophy, "sell everything you have and give to the poor" Christianity or Gordon Geckoism, I suppose it's open to each person's interpretation and commitment how that could affect the world as a whole. Most things don't happen by accident though, so if you want to be good, I feel you have to work at it. I suppose that sticks me in the "evil" camp, but I haven't voted yet because I'm going to ponder this some more.



You seem to have a clear view, so why would you hate choosing?
It's more that I recognize the nuances of it, and think that the word "evil" carries a lot more weight than I'd like. I think some people use it to describe far more heinous things. I guess my hesitance has more to do with my disagreement about how people use words like "evil," then.

Some popular political and economic philosophies seem to think that selfishness is the key to a successful society. Unless you don't associate a successful society with the good (but rather with the bad or the middling???), it seems that these certain philosophies could then be called evil.
I don't think it's that selfishness is the key to a successful society, but rather, recognizing the inevitability of selfishness.

Anyway, I think bad things can be harnessed and turned to a greater good in all sorts of ways, but that doesn't always make the things good. I can do something selfish that inadvertantly helps someone else, and I'm not a better person because of it. If anything, it's just another level of rationalization.

To me, we are victims of these "evil" emotions. They are like defense mechanisms that we desperately cling to in order to cope with our sad existence. Pride and arrogance apply the most here. We can't just be satisfied with doing good. We must be made to feel as if was truly good. That's why doing good when no one is watching is the most honorable of the good.
I mostly agree. Though I do think goodness is a real thing that we can produce and engage in, and that the satisfaction we can feel from it can be a genuine motivator even without people telling us how good it was. A fine line, I suppose, but I do think goodness is a First Cause, and can stand alone. It has to, if it's to exist at all.

Also, selfishness is something you've mentioned several times, but what do you suggest? That it is possible to care for another, even ONE OTHER person, as much as you care for yourself? I mean, precisely as much?
Not on this earth, no. Not on our own. Yet that's what I believe is asked of us.



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
Of course, now that I've thought about it some, being a parent or loving someone unconditionally does go a long way towards making many people "do the right thing".



Judge Smails comes to mind...

I pretty much agree with everything Chris has said so far, only he can say it so much more eloquently than I can.

I think The Matrix had it right. The human race is a disease upon this planet. Can we change? Sure. Will we? Not a chance.
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We are both the source of the problem and the solution, yet we do not see ourselves in this light...



You ready? You look ready.
Chris, you would probably dig THIS book.
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"This is that human freedom, which all boast that they possess, and which consists solely in the fact, that men are conscious of their own desire, but are ignorant of the causes whereby that desire has been determined." -Baruch Spinoza