Overrated movies & what to see instead

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I feel like you'd have to make new arguments for why those are better alternatives because I remember Hardcore Henry being some extremely vapid and gimmicky nonsense that was barely worth watching once. On that note...Hardcore Henry is overrated, watch Universal Soldier: Day of Reckoning instead.

I would also contend that Team America and Anchorman are on roughly equal footing in terms of quality.
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I feel like you'd have to make new arguments for why those are better alternatives because I remember Hardcore Henry being some extremely vapid and gimmicky nonsense that was barely worth watching once. On that note...Hardcore Henry is overrated, watch Universal Soldier: Day of Reckoning instead.

I would also contend that Team America and Anchorman are on roughly equal footing in terms of quality.
Team America is a good alternative because its intended style of humour is exactly the same (loud, verbal, blunt), but Anchorman wound up obnoxious and randumb. It was like modern Spongebob. Brick yelling ''Loud noises!'' is family guy-tier comedy. Team America feels more cohesive in both plot and dialogue. Its jokes are timed better, and don't break the pace of the movie.

Replace Family Guy with Anchorman and you get my point

Both Henry and fury road are shallow nonsense. You're not here for the story, but for the spectacle. They're both equally good in that regard, as is Kolovrat, but Henry is the only one that isn't drenched in propaganda. Eastern or western propaganda is propaganda all the same, and propaganda movies are never good. That's also the reason I didn't bring up Hero (2002).
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May l say something?
Just because you don't appreciate something more than others, doesn't mean it is overrated.
For example, l didn't like Pulp Fiction at all, but l don't say it is overrated because critics and other people love it and l respect it. It just wasn't my cup of tea.
I just find the question... unappropriate.
''Overrated'' and ''not my cup of tea'' are two completely different things. If a movie's not for you, how can you tell if it's good or bad?
I call movies overrated, disappointing or outright bad if they failed to hit a spot they were recommended to me for. I wouldn't watch the wizard of oz when in a mood for a dark and depressing movie, but I would watch Pan's Labyrinth, provided it didn't already disappoint me so much.



Movie Forums Squirrel Jumper
Regarding possible alternatives to Taxi Driver, I would arguably suggest other films that were scripted by Paul Schrader. The main one I'd suggest would be Bringing Out the Dead, which is also about an insomniac whose job involves driving around the streets of New York at night - however, the fact that he's a paramedic who is desperately trying to save people's lives no matter how flawed they may be makes it an interesting counterpoint to the misanthropy of Taxi Driver. Otherwise, you could try Schrader's more obvious variations on Taxi Driver like Hardcore or Rolling Thunder, which both contain similar elements (the former is about rescuing a young girl from depraved scumbags, the latter is about a troubled Vietnam veteran returning to his violent ways) but are distinct enough in their approaches (the latter is a borderline action movie).
Oh okay, I saw Hardcore too, and it's good, but I think Taxi Driver is better, and Hardcore had a weak ending I thought but still good up until then. Haven't seen Bringing out the Dead or Rolling Thunder, but will check them out. Thanks!



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Team America is a good alternative because its intended style of humour is exactly the same (loud, verbal, blunt), but Anchorman wound up obnoxious and randumb. It was like modern Spongebob. Brick yelling ''Loud noises!'' is family guy-tier comedy. Team America feels more cohesive in both plot and dialogue. Its jokes are timed better, and don't break the pace of the movie.
I used to love Team America but for me it hasn't aged too well because of its shallow both-sidesing of American interventionism and the War on Terror (which could also fit your definition of "Western propaganda" since it does ultimately come down on the side of interventionism as represented by Team America). The random humour in Anchorman isn't that random anyway - "Loud noises" isn't just said in a vacuum, it punctuates the sexist overreacting by the other anchormen and Brick just says it because he doesn't grasp why everyone's yelling but he joins in anyway, which underscores just how silly they're being when faced with a woman who they see as a threat to their own authority. Makes about as much sense as "I like you, you have balls, I like balls."

Both Henry and fury road are shallow nonsense. You're not here for the story, but for the spectacle. They're both equally good in that regard, as is Kolovrat, but Henry is the only one that isn't drenched in propaganda. Eastern or western propaganda is propaganda all the same, and propaganda movies are never good. That's also the reason I didn't bring up Hero (2002).
That's a loose definition of propaganda that could cover just about any film that has themes or messages. Films are artworks that are made by people with viewpoints - even something as shallow as Hardcore Henry is still shallow in a very particular way that reflects its creators' views, however deliberately. Remember that it ends with the reveal that

WARNING: "Hardcore Henry" spoilers below
Henry's kidnapped wife is actually the villain's wife who has been manipulating him all along and who is brutally killed by having her fingers severed while hanging from an airborne helicopter.


Maybe I'm not here for the story, but that doesn't negate the fact that the film is telling a story and that this of all possible stories is the story that they decided to tell. What do the filmmakers want me to feel when they end the movie like this? Am I supposed to cheer at such retribution? Why? Not to mention how tacked-on it feels when the character in question has barely been featured in the film anyway and isn't even the main villain. The best action movies don't just work because they provide good action, but also because they give you a reason to care about the characters at the heart of the action (even the "shallow" ones). Fury Road works because it gives lean but efficient characterisation to its cast that feeds into its narrative and action, while Hardcore Henry fails because most of its characters are such non-entities (the exception being the annoying comic relief sidekick) that it's near-impossible to care what happens to them. What makes Fury Road propaganda anyway? The fact that it dares to suggest that women are people too? That's an extremely poor reason to lump it in with the likes of Triumph of the Will.



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If he yelled "Yeah, what he said!" or "AAAAAAAA!", that'd make sense, but there's no context in which "loud noises" doesn't come across as random. If you want another example, take that fight with the other reporters (the one before the "that escalated quickly" line). Cut it out of the movie and you lose nothing.

The difference between a "movie with a message" and "a propaganda movie" is that the former acknowledges that morality isn't black and white.
One is "Y has a point but X is still preferable".
The other is "X good Y bad".
Take the South Park episode "Cartoon Wars". It supports people making controversial content, but it acknowledges that it can have consequences. If it was propaganda, it'd just be about Kyle fighting an evil censor or something.

And as for that feminist thing, fury road isn't saying "women are people", it's saying "women are superior". All the "good" men in that film are 100% submissive. If there was a scene in which Max saves the others due to his strength, courage, competitive drive or anything else that comes with higher testosterone, it'd be fine. Then its message would be "patriarchy has a point but feminism is still preferable". But fury road views men just like its villain views women: as disposable, interchangable servants.
Besides, nobody'd disputing that women are people. Maybe wizardchan dwellers, but normal people simply acknowledge our biological differences. That doesn't make women inferior or unworthy of respect.
Finally, it doesn't matter if you agree with it or not, you can't deny that feminism is being pushed by those in power. There's nothing "daring" or "edgy" about it anymore, at least in the west. I'm a catholic, but if Poland put out a cheesy catholic propaganda movie, I wouldn't say it's "stunning and brave" because the west hates it.



Movie Forums Squirrel Jumper
I wouldn't say all the good men are submissive in Fury Road. Max escapes captivity first chance he gets and he takes all the women hostage at first. Not exactly a submissive man, is it?



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I could argue the necessity of the anchorman brawl on the basis of how it's the absurdity of this extremely petty anchorman rivalry writ large, plus it has not one but two payoffs in how the Tim Robbins anchor is the one who throws Veronica into the bear pit and also how Wes Mantooth, Ron's much-hated arch-rival, is ultimately willing to demonstrate his respect for him after Ron is willing to risk his life for Veronica in the bear pit. Not like I won't contest other comedies of this nature, but I do reckon Anchorman does a surprisingly good job of justifying its more random humour (and I say this as someone who used to dislike it).

As for Fury Road, it's like ironpony says, Max is still comparatively strong and independent but not enough to truly save himself - the whole point is that he has to co-operate with Furiosa (and vice versa) in order to truly make his escape work (and even then he still goes above and beyond to help retake the Citadel). You also have a character like Nux who is set up to be a disposable servant of Immortan Joe (and glad about it) but he ultimately learns that he is more than that and rejects the ideology that makes him disposable. The fact that it's the villain who treats men as disposable should underline that the film finds such an idea disagreeable (and the film doesn't have to concede anything to the patriarchy anyway).



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Midsommar is overrated, see The Wicker Man instead.
Yes, either the original or the remake will do. For entirely different reasons, of course.



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(and the film doesn't have to concede anything to the patriarchy anyway).
Yes it does. If it wants to treat it like a real problem, and not like some nebulous boogeyman, it needs to approach it realistically. It needs to acknowledge how it got here, why people choose to stick with it, and then oppose it.
If you want an example of such a movie, watch "Heart of a Dog" (1981)

And regarding Max and Nux, neither is portrayed as "good" until they start to submit. That's their entire character arc: one goes from a drifter to a white knight, and the other goes from a son who' desperate for approval to a simp who's desperate for approval. Keep in mind that every wizardchan dweller was a white knight at some point in his life.



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It got here because Immortan Joe (who is implied to have been a soldier if his collection of badges is any indication so that already invokes a patriarchal institution like the military) is able to occupy the only available water supply in the middle of a desert and can therefore set himself up as a living god whose every need and want must be met by his subjects. People choose to stick with it either out of survival (like Furiosa working her way up through the ranks just to be able to escape) or because they are honestly devoted to Joe against their own best interests because they don't know any better (like the War Boys sacrificing themselves for his battles). People ultimately oppose it because they realise that this supposedly godlike warlord really is just a broken-down old man who treats everyone else like they're beneath him and that his reign of terror needs to end. Obviously, a Mad Max movie isn't exactly going to be 100% realistic, but I don't think it has to be in order to get its point across (and a character like Nux actively working to redeem himself adds more nuance than just automatically treating every man on Joe's side as a lost cause). As for Max himself, he's just following the standard Mad Max arc where he starts the movie alone, gets roped into some wasteland conflict between a ruthless warlord and a band of underdogs, and ultimately sides with the underdogs (reluctantly/selfishly at first, then ultimately choosing to be their hero) and, once the underdogs have won, he is once again left alone to have another adventure. Road Warrior in particular makes a good point of addressing out how Max's lone wolf tendencies make him almost as uncivilised as any raider and how it's important to actually have more of a reason to stay alive than just survival.



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Another overrated movie for me is A Clockwork Orange, but not sure what to see instead. City of God, or is that too different?



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Another overrated movie for me is A Clockwork Orange, but not sure what to see instead. City of God, or is that too different?
The question comes down to why exactly you consider a particular film overrated and why you would pick another film as an alternative (like what is the common ground between A Clockwork Orange and City of God, that they're both about violent delinquents? That's a reach that doesn't really get at how both films have different goals and approaches).



You mean me? Kei's cousin?
"Paranormal Activity"(2007) is overrated see "Poltergeist" (1982 or even 2015) instead.
Agreed.
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Another overrated movie for me is A Clockwork Orange, but not sure what to see instead. City of God, or is that too different?
The question comes down to why exactly you consider a particular film overrated and why you would pick another film as an alternative (like what is the common ground between A Clockwork Orange and City of God, that they're both about violent delinquents? That's a reach that doesn't really get at how both films have different goals and approaches).
It's less about the story and more about the mood, really. I'd rather sort City of God with Spirited Away (relaxing) than Clockwork Orange (shocking).

If you want a good Clockwork Orange supplement, try Seven and a Half (2006). It's a little cheesy but the shock value is strong, and the story makes great use of it