Top 5 Westerns

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The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance
(Shame on anyone who didn't include this. )

How the West Was Won
(Not a great movie, but it was the first one I saw as a kid in the theater, and it looms large in my memory.)

The Big Country
(Chuck Connors: "You wanted me pa?" Burl Ives: "I did when you was born.")

Wyatt Earp
(Kevin Costner (paraphrasing) telling Bill Pullman why he doesn't want him as a deputy: "You're not a deliberate man. I don't sense that about you.")

The Shootist
Unforgiven
The Wild Bunch
Hallalujah Trail (what can I say; stupid but fun)
John Wayne classics like Stagecoach, Searchers, Red River
Anthony Mann/Jimmy Stewart
Dozens of others

Agree about Vera Cruz being under appreciated.



RIP www.moviejustice.com 2002-2010
Posted my thoughts on Posse, but I reckon I'll slap em' here as well.

Posse (1975, Kirk Douglas)




It's been several years since I've given this cult western gem a view, and I was surprised at how little the shine has vanished. Posse's uniqueness glares at the audience in story and character, if not in filmmaking technique. The film is beautifully shot by Fred J. Koenekamp, but otherwise is a very straight forward bit of storytelling. Kirk Douglas plays a villain masked as the hero, who is a U.S. Marshall tracking down Bruce Dern's train robber. The reference of the title remains ambiguous at the closing credits. Does it refer to the posse of lawmen helmed by Douglas or the posse of outlaws being led by Dern?
One of the best things about the film is the misanthropic take on the so-called "good guys." Douglas is only interested in doing good so long as it can benefit him. His sworn posse is interested only in dollars and their own personal gains. In fact, during one of the film's most morbid moments, Bo Hopkins along with a couple of others in Douglas' posse elect to bed down a couple of teenage tarts in favor of listening to their boss' campaign speech. This brutal take on how selfish and corrupt human nature can be, fits right in with other 1970's revisionist westerns. I don't hesitate to rank Posse alongside the decade's other classics; The Outlaw Josey Wales, McCabe & Mrs. Miller, and The Hired Hand.
The ending is especially brilliant, and is one of my favorite conclusions of any film I've seen. Bruce Dern has perhaps his best role and creates something so singular that only he could pull it off the way he does. As the viewer, we both love and hate Dern's character. Of course by the time the credits roll, there is no victor here as both sides are bankrupt of human generosity. Or is that last term an oxymoron? This film may seem to think so.

Grade: A-
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The Professionals (1966, Richard Brooks)



Somewhat of a minor classic of the western genre, the first half of the film shines, but once our four protagonists; Lee Marvin, Burt Lancaster, Robert Ryan, and Woody Strode, reach their goal, the film goes down hill. The plot is very simple with the four men for hire going on a mission to rescue a millionaire's "kidnapped" wife (Claudia Cardinale) from a Mexican revolutionary (Jack Palance). I don't usually mind these star ensembles, but this one felt like a bit of a wash with several of the actors having nothing to do. Woody Strode, a western regular during the 60's, has nothing to do once Cardinale is rescue. Aside from a few grimances at the camera and shots of him running around he does nothing, not even getting as much as a full line of dialogue in. Robert Ryan is also wasted as he takes second seat to Marvin and Lancaster who play themselves. Of course Marvin and Lancaster are more screen personalities and presences than full fledged thespians, and God bless them for that, but they need good stories. This ensemble is promising with a nice setup, but it quickly falls to pieces.
Cardinale's character could have been interesting, but she lines seem poorly written. The only good scene she has is when attempting to seduce Lancaster in an effort to sneak his gun away ala Joanne Dru in Red River. Even this is a western archetype. Cardinale is much more interesting and dynamic in Once Upon a Time in the West which came out several years later. Also I noticed a similarity between the themes in this film and The Wild Bunch, with of course the later being a brilliant piece of filmmaking and storytelling. Both films have a nice ensemble of men going on a mission to Mexico toward the end of the western time period who are outgrowing their usefulness becoming anachronisms of their time. Where The Wild Bunch succeeds in being deep and meaningful, not to mention bloody violent, this film comes off as a half-hearted buddy film between Marvin and Lancaster with Marvin playing the straight-man and Lancaster filling in for the goof, even if he is a deadly goof. The film's conclusion feels tacked on and I get a vibe from it that there must've been a last minute rewrite. Even Jack Palance as the sympathetic heavy has little to do except brandish a mustache and his best Mexican accent. Oh and the cliche' bit where Marvin dresses up as a Mexican doning a sombrero and poncho feels like it belongs in another film entirely.

Grade: C



Bright light. Bright light. Uh oh.
I mean, I'm the first to say that I like the 1975 Posse tons and believe it should be seen by all, but I'd never tell anybody to watch it and then to avoid The Professionals which is obviously a Top Five western to me. Then again, that's probably your point.
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RIP www.moviejustice.com 2002-2010
I mean, I'm the first to say that I like the 1975 Posse tons and believe it should be seen by all, but I'd never tell anybody to watch it and then to avoid The Professionals which is obviously a Top Five western to me. Then again, that's probably your point.
That's why you're you and I'm me. I don't lie about what I like and dislike in order to play some kind of devil's advocate, if that's what you're saying. According to my standards of what makes a film good, Posse is far better.



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Semper Fooey
The five best comedy westerns:

Destry Rides Again

The Scalphunters

Cat Ballou

Support Your Local Sherrif

Blazing Saddles

Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid and True Grit have a lot of comedy, but I don't think they quite qualify as comedies

I like Evil Roy Slade better than Blazing Saddles, but it was made for television.



If I was going to pick my Top 5 Westerns it would have to be....

1. High Plains Drifter (1973 Clint Eastwood ).
2. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance ( 1962 John Wayne Jimmy Stewart ).
3. My Name Is Nobody ( 1973 Henry Fonda Terrence Hill ).
4. Breakhart Pass (1975 Charles Bronson Richard Crenna and Jill Ireland ).
5. Eldorado (1966 John Wayne Robert Mitchum James Caan ).

If I was going to give an honorable mention for western/comedy it would definetly be Cat Ballou (1965 Jane Fonda Lee Marvin Dwayne Hickman ).



Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (1969)
Shenandoah [1965]
Rio Bravo [1959]
Hombre [1967]
Shane [1953]
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The reference of the title remains ambiguous at the closing credits. Does it refer to the posse of lawmen helmed by Douglas or the posse of outlaws being led by Dern?
I didn't find the title ambiguous at all. It refers to the posse that Douglas formed and that Dern took over. Early on (I think when we first see Douglas, but it's been years since I looked at this film, which by the way is one of my favorites) there's a picture of him and his posse which he or someone describes as "the most famous posse" ever. The marshall that Douglas plays is known for this efficient posse he formed and leads because they're good at tracking down and apprehending bad guys, especially those who rob the railroad that is backing Douglas's bid to become governor of Texas. Douglas is apparently considered a shoo-in for the office, which worries his posse about what's to become of them. Douglas says don't worry, the railroad will give you jobs as guards--at a cut in pay of course. To which the Indian lawman reminds him that the railroad doesn't hire Indians.

It's plain Douglas used the posse as a stepping stone for his political ambition but has no real loyalty to them. Outlaw Dern, however, admires their ability and efficiency, especially when they easily trick his less-savvy outlaw band into giving away their position by firing at too great a range and methodically move in and kill the outlaws one by one, with Dern the only one to escape.

Later when Dern captures Douglas, he prods the posse into collecting the money to replace his loot that burned in a fire. They rough up the townspeople but only come up with part of the money, at which point Dern says, "Close enough. Let's ride." At that point, most of the posse realize they've crossed the line from lawmen to outlaw and that the pay is better. And Dern does hire Indians, leaving Douglas's character trying in vain to track down and capture this efficient, deadly band of gunmen that he had made into a posse and that Dern remade into outlaws.

I read somewhere that Douglas was first cast to play the outlaw and Dern the ambitious marshall, but Douglas talked the director into reversing roles. Dern always made a really good badman.

His sworn posse is interested only in dollars and their own personal gains. In fact, during one of the film's most morbid moments, Bo Hopkins along with a couple of others in Douglas' posse elect to bed down a couple of teenage tarts in favor of listening to their boss' campaign speech. This brutal take on how selfish and corrupt human nature can be, fits right in with other 1970's revisionist westerns.
Now this I didn't find morbid or reprehensible at all! What red-blooded young man wouldn't prefer a roll in the hay to listening to anyone's political speech, especially knowing his boss is moving on up without him, based largely on the posse's reputation? Selfish? Corrupt? Revisionist? Naww! Since the beginning of time, boys and girls have slipped away to play slap and tickle. That's just human nature. For example, Audie Murphy, the most decorated hero of WWII, was just 20 years old and still recovering from wounds that ended his military career when he came back to his native Texas and was given a parade through downtown Fort Worth. But Murphy didn't show up for the big dinner given in his honor that night, with state and national politicians and generals and their staffs and wives all gathered to greet and meet him. Instead, Murphy was in his hotel room in bed with the elevator girl.

I think you were a little hard on The Professionals, especially on Marvin and Lancaster. Marvin always put certain little nuances into each of his characters that make them different from each other, and as I've said before many times in this forum, he's the only actor who really looks like the gun he's carrying on screen is a real weapon. Other actors only look like they're carrying props.

Lancaster was always one of my favorites--just his presence and that toothy smile and the fact he was still so physical even at that age.

Yet having said that, if it came down to a showing of The Professionals or Posse, I'd go with Posse.



I read somewhere that Douglas was first cast to play the outlaw and Dern the ambitious marshall, but Douglas talked the director into reversing roles.
Mark F. just informed offline it was Kirk Douglas who directed Posse. Well, no wonder he let himself switch roles!



Put me in your pocket...
My Top five.....
The Big Country (1958)
Dodge City (1939)
Shane (1953)
Destry Rides Again (1939)
True Grit (1969)

My Top five on the lighter side...
The Harvey Girls (1946)
Way Out West (1937)
Ruggles of Red Gap (1935)
My Little Chickadee (1940)
Oklahoma! (1955)



Thx
"Only 4 quatloos left on the THX account..."
1. Shane

2. The Searchers

3. High Noon

4. The Magnificent Seven

5. High Plains Drifter

(6. The recent hip-hop/western version remake of My Mother The Car. )

Hey Hollywood, try opening your mail or look through your dumpster, maybe you'll find some original scripts and won't have to remake movies that shouldn't have been made in the first place.

Thx



Welcome to the human race...
Just realised I never actually listed a top 5...

The Good, the Bad and the Ugly
Once Upon a Time in the West
Dead Man
Unforgiven
McCabe and Mrs. Miller
The Wild Bunch


Yeah, I know it's six, but trying to pick which one should be removed is proving difficult. Maybe Dead Man, but who knows?



The Good, the Bad and the Ugly and Dead Man was mine favorite westerns release movies ever.



1. Once Upon a Time in the West
2. Toombsone
3. Unforgiven
4. The Good the Bad, and the Ugly
5. The Wild Bunch



01 Once Upon A Time In The West
02 Unforgiven
03 The Wild Bunch
04 The Good, The Bad & The Ugly
05 Keoma
07 Companeros
08 Great Silence
09 Boot Hill
10 Valdez Is Coming



My fave is Tombstone. The new version of True Grit was great too.