Alec Baldwin accidentally kills crew member with prop gun

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Today's news adds that there was one live bullet in the gun, for some as-yet unknown reason.
I see a humongous lawsuit coming down the pike if this is indeed the case.

I feel so sorry for Baldwin. Because you know heís always gonna blame himself as he pulled the trigger. Iíve often thought if I were a movie extra that I would be terrified to have someone fire a gun at me. I probably couldnít do it.
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I never liked Alec Baldwin for a variety of reasons. Now, before you write me off as a heartless bastard, let me finish.
I wouldn't wish anything like this on my worst enemy. There are only victims here and this is something that those involved who are still living may never recover from.

So I pray for Alec, his family, along with those injured and the families of the deceased.
Precisely my perspective. I think Baldwin has a terrific sense of humor, is VERY funny, but I've disliked him for many, many other reasons unrelated to his acting or comedic abilities.

And yes, wouldn't wish this on anyone and am praying for everyone involved in this as they struggle to live with it in the aftermath.



This incident is a tragedy for everyone involved and the sad thing is most likely this was caused by carelessness on the part of the propmasters/gun handlers, who didn't check the gun carefully enough for a live cartridge.

Of course this is all speculation, but I believe the propmaster would be required to have the gun test fired at a gun range using live ammo to insure it functions perfectly. Then after live firing & after bringing the gun onto the set & as the actor was being handed the gun...at each of those check points the gun should've been checked to make sure it was clear of live ammo. Then of course no one should ever be standing in the direct path of the gun when it is fired. Just so sad.



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The word is that they were not filming on this day, but prepping for shooting. Perhaps they were working on blocking a scene. Word is that it was a real gun and not a prob gun (e.g., one made of rubber or which only fires blanks). Apparently, the prop master shot live ammo out of it that day. The type of gun in question is a apparently a 45 western style single action revolver.

Questions:

1. If they weren't filming, why was there a real gun on set?

2. Why did Baldwin both cock the hammer and then depress the trigger with the barrel pointed at people?

3. Why didn't Baldwin clear the weapon? Even if you think it is loaded with blanks, Baldwin should know that blanks can kill within 20 feet and that people are most often by the gun that is "unloaded." Opening the loading gate and turning the cylinder would have saved a life. A five second operation. If someone hands you a real gun, it doesn't matter if it was cleared by a prop master, range officer, your dad, or Jesus Christ - you are responsible for safe handling of that thing and rule #1 is to assume that it is loaded.

4. Why would you block a scene with a real gun? You don't need visual authenticity on prep day. Why wasn't that a rubber gun?

I think this reveals a bad policy in the movie industry. If only one person is absolutely responsible for safe handling of weapons on a set, then you have a model with a single point of failure leading to a catastrophe. Safe gun handling is common sense turned in habitualized behavior. Actors handle guns much more frequently than the public does, so they should be taught basic handling and take minimal personal responsibility (to not assume that it is unloaded, to not point it at anything you are not willing to destroy, to know what is behind the target, and to not put your finger on the trigger unless you are willing to accept BOOM as a possible outcome).

Finally, remember the empathy you have today for Baldwin (who once tweeted this https://www.the-sun.com/wp-content/u...33-1.jpg?w=960) when you hear of a gun enthusiast who makes a mistake in their hobby and negligently discharges a weapon. We have all done things behind the wheel of a car that could have killed a family, if for no other reason than that we were distracted for a moment. I think Mr. Baldwin is now quite tragically in a moment where he does know "how it feels to wrongfully kill someone."




1. If they weren't filming, why was there a real gun on set?
If they were filming. Why would there be a real gun on set?



These were pictures taken of Alec Baldwin outside the Santa Fe County Sherriff's office following the shooting incident. He's clearly distraught.



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These were pictures taken of Alec Baldwin outside the Santa Fe County Sherriff's office following the shooting incident. He's clearly distraught.
I donít think anyone doubts this. Canít even imagine his pain.



You ready? You look ready
I'm seeing a lot of conjecture in here. The fact that the last time this happened was back in 1993 is a testament to how safe the industry actually is when it comes to guns in movies. Just think of how many movies have been made in that period of time with guns in them? Yeah, a LOT.

That said...obviously something went wrong with said safety standards, and someone is bound to get sued.

Just awful

EDIT: Assuming someone who is anti-gun is gunna truly know about gun safety and handling procedures? It's Hollywood
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I donít think anyone doubts this. Canít even imagine his pain.
I feel extremely sorry for him, the victim and her family. He's going to have to live with the guilt for the rest of his life.



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If they were filming. Why would there be a real gun on set?
Authenticity, I suppose.

Also, it's simple to fire blanks through a real gun, which makes it convenient.



Authenticity, I suppose.

Also, it's simple to fire blanks through a real gun, which makes it convenient.
Did not know this.

Someone else mentioned how many times guns have been used in movies & Iím just now thinking of movies where the gunshot had been extreme. Butch Cassidy springs to mind right away. Reservoir Dogs is another where they all shot each other at the end. I guess it is amazing that more accidents havenít occurred.



This is so horrible. And while figuring out who was negligent will obviously be the next piece of news about this, nothing can bring back Hutchins, or help Baldwin or the others who were hurt or traumatized by this incident.

if I were a movie extra that I would be terrified to have someone fire a gun at me. I probably couldnít do it.
I was an extra once in a film and had a prop gun pointed at me and it was one of the most NOPE!! moments I've ever experienced. Because in that moment I was like "Who is this 20-something person? Who trained him? Who checked that gun?"



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Did not know this.

Someone else mentioned how many times guns have been used in movies & Iím just now thinking of movies where the gunshot had been extreme. Butch Cassidy springs to mind right away. Reservoir Dogs is another where they all shot each other at the end. I guess it is amazing that more accidents havenít occurred.
There is a database for guns in movies

http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Main_Page

It details which firearms are real and fake or fudged to be another gun (a lot of real guns are featured in films).

I think that the prop masters have largely done their jobs well as this appears to be an exceedingly rare occurrence.

On the other hand, Ruby Rose just torched the WB over alleged unreported serious injuries to stunt people on Batwoman, so who knows how much stuff, in general, is suppressed. Even so, a gun injury or death would seem to be hard to suppress as a story. I'd guess that there are some people politely carrying shrapnel and who have a scar or two from movie sets which involved an incident with a gun, but that it is unlikely that there are many, if any, unreported deaths. All in all, Hollywood has a solid safety record with firearms.

Even so, guns are still deadly weapons and you only have to mess up once. You have a legit question with regard to why real guns should be on movie sets.

Moreover, the idea that the prop master is God can also make the prop master the sin-eater (it's YOUR fault if anything goes sideways). The tragedy here is that Baldwin could have popped open the loading gate and turned the cylinder to inspect the condition of the weapon. Baldwin isn't a bad guy and it's ludicrous to think he was thinking of doing anything other than trying to make entertainment... ...but... but... ...if he'd inspected the gun, he could have discovered its condition.

From time to time we would perhaps do well to remember that people occasionally die or really hurt themselves to give us a brief thrill as we sip soda and munch popcorn (think of all those Jackie Chan injury reels).

I am not a fan of method acting and hyper-realism the exposes actors, stunt people and hands on set to real danger, is in the same category. I mean, I love Sorcerer, but Friedkin was a madman and took unnecessary risks (just as he did on The French Connection).



My God. This is is horrifying. This honestly sounds like the plot of a "Columbo" episode where some criminal mastermind intended to kill someone, but used a prop gun in order to disguise his true motive and portray the incident as if it was something that happened accidentally to escape the consequences. That obviously didn't happen here, but I had no idea that prop guns could be dangerous, and that they could actually result in someone's death as well, similar to a real gun. If I were Alec Baldwin, I would feel so horrible, and yet, he likely didn't do anything wrong here, but will need to live with being the cause of this tragedy anyway, albeit indirectly. I've never been a fan of Alec Baldwin, but I am definitely wishing him peace and strength tonight!



It's brought back discussions on the death of Brandon Lee (also reported to have been killed by a "prop gun")...

As well as issues surrounding the alleged suicide of George Reeves - a lot of theories surrounding his death, including one where he accidentally killed himself with a "blank".



...The tragedy here is that Baldwin could have popped open the loading gate and turned the cylinder to inspect the condition of the weapon. Baldwin isn't a bad guy and it's ludicrous to think he was thinking of doing anything other than trying to make entertainment... ...but... but... ...if he'd inspected the gun, he could have discovered its condition...
The tragedy is that the person responsible for the gun left a live bullet in it! I don't believe it's up to the actor to know firearms and spin the cylinder to check for bullets like they do in...well movies!

If there was a blank lined up for the next shot (of the gun) then spinning the cylinder by anyone without knowledge of firearms would be stupid as it could misaligned the blank with the firing pin. I believe it's already been pointed out that Baldwin has an anti-gun stance and it makes no sense to expect that he knows how to spin a cylinder in a 19th century firearm to check for live bullets, that's the job of...the prop master/or the person in charge of firearms (I believe they have their own title these days something like weapons master).



The tragedy is that the person responsible for the gun left a live bullet in it! I don't believe it's up to the actor to know firearms and spin the cylinder to check for bullets like they do in...well movies!
Agreed. Even if you have a moderate understanding of how something works (be it a gun, an expensive camera, a pulley rig, ANYTHING), if you are in a professional environment where it is someone's job to make sure that thing is safe--for you and for others--the last thing you should do is mess with that thing. Especially if, like you say, tinkering with it could actually create a dangerous situation.

The more I think about all this the worse it seems. I feel like the revelation about how the bullet actually ended up in that gun is either going to be infuriating or really infuriating.



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I stand by my assertion that anyone waving around anything that could possibly injure someone is also responsible to be sure it will not. And I don't agree that someone who might be anti-gun would NOT be gun-safe. I could envision such a person being MORE diligent about such things due to their feeling guns are horrifically dangerous.

That doesn't mean I don't feel absolutely horrible for Mr. Baldwin. I do. He's getting my prayers over this, for sure. But anyone who touched that thing and pointed it at someone should have found a way to be sure that it was safe to do so. Cardinal rule of dealing with firearms of any sort.



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The tragedy is that the person responsible for the gun left a live bullet in it! I don't believe it's up to the actor to know firearms and spin the cylinder to check for bullets like they do in...well movies!


The 4 Rules applies to everyone. They apply everywhere, all the time, to anyone competent to hold a weapon. One who is not competent, should not pick one up (this is why children are taught to NOT pick up a gun). Any competent adult, however, can learn and follow these rules, as they are simple and practicable.

Baldwin has been handling firearms in the movies since the 1980s. As an actor, he handles firearms more frequently than the average person.

As a person who handles guns, he has an obligation to be aware of safe-handling rules and follow them.

If there was a blank lined up for the next shot (of the gun) then spinning the cylinder by anyone without knowledge of firearms would be stupid as it could misaligned the blank with the firing pin.
Don't take this the wrong way, but you don't know how guns work. You can't just spin the cylinder of a revolver when it is locked up, nor is this how you inspect to see if they are loaded.

It is a very simple thing to unload/check a single-action revolver. See the video below. It demonstrates how Baldwin should have safely checked the revolver in about two minutes.



And if you are not competent to clear the gun, don't pick it up.

I believe it's already been pointed out that Baldwin has an anti-gun stance
Oh, he not only has an anti-gun stance, he has had no mercy for the mistakes of others.

https://www.the-sun.com/wp-content/u...33-1.jpg?w=960

There is a bitter irony in this, because now he does know, and you have much more empathy for him, than he has historically had for others.

Regardless, if you don't like guns and aren't willing to learn how to safely handle them, then don't handle them.

[quote=Citizen Rules;2247656]and it makes no sense to expect that he knows how to spin a cylinder in a 19th century firearm to check for live bullets,[quote]

On the contrary, it is the responsibility of anyone who handles any gun of any era, to learn safe-handling before actually handling it. A Colt-style single action revolver is a simple device and is simple to handle safely. It is much easier to handle safely than a modern stirker-fired pistol like a Glock. It is for this reason that it is commonly recommended to train people to shoot handguns staring with a single action revolver in a small caliber like .22, as this is the hardest to screw up with.

that's the job of...the prop master/or the person in charge of firearms (I believe they have their own title these days something like weapons master).
Industry norms do not absolve you of your moral responsibility to know and practice safe handling of firearms. Once you are holding that device, it is under your control and is your responsibility. Baldwin has handled more guns than any of us and for many decades. He should really have learned the rules by now. This was not a toddler handed loaded gun. Again, if the Hollywood norm is that the prop master is the only one responsible for safe handling, then Hollywood is screwing up.

We should note that Baldwin is also a producer on this show, so he has another layer of responsibility here (i.e., to provide for a safe set ). And the scuttlebutt is that the crew had already walked out over safety concerns one time.