Rioting in the U.S.

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If white privilege isn't a fact...and doesn't apply to all white people...AND is more in line with people in the same social, economic and political circles...then it's not white privilege at all, it's economic privilege.

See what I think you're doing is: seeing the world from your own viewpoint: your white and not poor...so then you view most all white people as living like you do in relative comfort and then label that white privilege. But that's a fallacy as millions of white people are dirt poor and millions of blacks and minorities are middle or upper economic class.
Even tho you’re poor have you ever went into a high end shop and looked around and maybe asked a question about something? If you didn’t get a “oh, you can’t afford that” or “you wouldn’t understand what that is” that would be white privilege.



You ready? You look ready.
Quit posting, don't shut it down for everyone else who wants to chat. But then, who cares about fair?
you have made it abundantly clear life ain’t fair for white people



You misunderstood my post (or maybe I wrote it poorly). What I was trying to say is, if you believe there's white privilege it's because of your own life's viewpoint. If you and the majority of white people you know have it good, it's easy to hold that up as an example of how most white people live...ergo white people live in privilege. If you were a poor white person your viewpoint would be very different.

If you meant something else by white privelge please explain. It sounded like you were saying economic privilege is white privilege.
You saw the example he gave me, something that can't even be considered a privilege. In my experience, people either use something like that or something that is actually majority privilege.



As a Finn, I find this whole white privilege and collective guilt annoying. We (using a similar historical generalization as black) have had our independence for a bit over a century. Before that, we were governed by either Sweden or Russia, and our folks were sent to fight their wars. Finns were also raided and sold to slavery to the east (Russia, Crimea, and even further) in large quantities. We were actually in high demand because we were considered both exotic and capable slaves. We've never had any colonies, either. Where's our historical privilege? What should we apologize to Africans?

I don't take a stance on this latest police brutality case (I haven't bothered to look for a full video, but the coronary report seemed to say that the cause of death wasn't asphyxiation). As a whole, statistics don't support massive, murderous racist tendencies in the US police force (as far as I know white criminals get killed more often per X cases). Statistics do support considerably higher crime rates for black though, which can (and to some degree, should) cause some bias in assessing certain situations.

But then again, I'm the biggest pos on these forums (at least I think that's what Camo once said)
__________________



Removed some posts. Will close the thread if need be.

Do not reply to this topic if you do not want to discuss it. And repeating things counts as not wanting to discuss it.



Ghouls, vampires, werewolves... let's party.
I hope we all can agree that George Floyd was murdered by Derek Chauvin. Either Chauvin intended to murder him, or he had a serious problem in his failure to comprehend three simple words, I can't breathe.



28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
As a Finn, I find this whole white privilege and collective guilt annoying. We (using a similar historical generalization as black) have had our independence for a bit over a century. Before that, we were governed by either Sweden or Russia, and our folks were sent to fight their wars. Finns were also raided and sold to slavery to the east (Russia, Crimea, and even further) in large quantities. We were actually in high demand because we were considered both exotic and capable slaves. We've never had any colonies, either. Where's our historical privilege? What should we apologize to Africans?

I don't take a stance on this latest police brutality case (I haven't bothered to look for a full video, but the coronary report seemed to say that the cause of death wasn't asphyxiation). As a whole, statistics don't support massive, murderous racist tendencies in the US police force (as far as I know white criminals get killed more often per X cases). Statistics do support considerably higher crime rates for black though, which can (and to some degree, should) cause some bias in assessing certain situations.

But then again, I'm the biggest pos on these forums (at least I think that's what Camo once said)

Independent coroner stated he did die from asphyxiation.



28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
I hope we all can agree that George Floyd was murdered by Derek Chauvin. Either Chauvin intended to murder him, or he had a serious problem in his failure to comprehend three simple words, I can't breathe.

I think everyone agrees on that.



Independent coroner stated he did die from asphyxiation.
Did he actually examine the body and since when is someone hired by the victim's family independent? Regardless of that and the fact that you only chose to reply to that small part of my post, I do repeat that I don't have a solid stance on this particular event because I feel I don't have enough information. The main points of my post were the absurdity of white privilege and white guilt from my (Finnish) historical point of view, and the lack of statistical evidence that supports US police rampantly killing black people.



Yea I would say that there's no such thing as independent when the person is hired, but that goes for the other autopsy that was performed as well.



George Floyd was saying he couldn't breathe while he was still standing up, and when people are getting arrested they will say a lot of things. That doesn't matter to me because he didn't need that kind of restraint, he died, and the officer let it happen and/or contributed to it. Morally I think it's just as bad regardless of what the legal defense may be.



You ready? You look ready.
If you disagree about the culpability of history in current day society you are a racist.

If you qualify the death of George Floyd in any manner other than complete condemnation you are a racist.

If you claim that white privilege doesn’t exist or can’t exist you are a racist.

If you believe socio-economics are the deciding factor of your treatment in America you are a racist.

If you don’t believe we have a responsibility as society to answer to history you are a racist.

You have always been a racist if these statements apply to you but, if you believe them now, you are actively choosing racism. And I don’t **** with racists clowns. 🤡

Get the wax out of your ears, learn to listen, learn to read, learn to think, learn to have compassion for the shared history of a community and answer for the shared blame. Don’t be a racist clown. 🤡

Apparently, we are more interested in protecting fragile mindsets than fixing things.

If you disagree with this post then I’m pretty sure you missed the day when God was handing out souls.

This place has become a save haven for racists, and I don’t even know why I bother with it anymore. It’s evident that I have to take responsibility for my part in continuing to support such a community, and in light of this weakness I will be largely absent for the coming weeks.

To everyone else in here who has effectively condemned racism: You are the proud owner of a brain and you have a beautiful soul, and I hope you consider your own culpability in continuing to mingle with racists.

https://www.businessinsider.com/whit...rotests-2020-6

https://www.lawfareblog.com/riots-wh...ccelerationism



If you disagree about the culpability of history in current day society you are a racist.

If you qualify the death of George Floyd in any manner other than complete condemnation you are a racist.

If you claim that white privilege doesn’t exist or can’t exist you are a racist.

If you believe socio-economics are the deciding factor of your treatment in America you are a racist.

If you don’t believe we have a responsibility as society to answer to history you are a racist.

You have always been a racist if these statements apply to you but, if you believe them now, you are actively choosing racism. And I don’t **** with racists clowns. 🤡

Get the wax out of your ears, learn to listen, learn to read, learn to think, learn to have compassion for the shared history of a community and answer for the shared blame. Don’t be a racist clown. 🤡

Apparently, we are more interested in protecting fragile mindsets than fixing things.

If you disagree with this post then I’m pretty sure you missed the day when God was handing out souls.

This place has become a save haven for racists, and I don’t even know why I bother with it anymore. It’s evident that I have to take responsibility for my part in continuing to support such a community, and in light of this weakness I will be largely absent for the coming weeks.

To everyone else in here who has effectively condemned racism: You are the proud owner of a brain and you have a beautiful soul, and I hope you consider your own culpability in continuing to mingle with racists.

https://www.businessinsider.com/whit...rotests-2020-6

https://www.lawfareblog.com/riots-wh...ccelerationism
I've always condemned racism and spoke of not wanting to judge anybody by skin color. If you want me to be honest, I see a lot of what you say as racist.



The intersection of economics and race is complicated, at minimum. If somebody feels that isn't true, then there's not much to talk about, because they think the world is a lot simpler than I do and any explanations I give them will be unacceptably nuanced.

Anyway, with something like race I look for signs that tell me whether someone is arguing in good faith or not. For example, whether they seem to genuinely want to explain things (though people need to be careful about coming into a heated discussion with the idea that they're just going to instruct others), or whether they seem to be actively looking for a reason to use the "R" word in order to not have those discussions.

Either way, the basic edict of "don't reply if you don't want to discuss this" still applies. I have no patience for clapback theory. I think it's juvenile and tricks people's brains into releasing endorphins for winning arguments they're actively avoiding.



28 days...6 hours...42 minutes...12 seconds
Did he actually examine the body and since when is someone hired by the victim's family independent? Regardless of that and the fact that you only chose to reply to that small part of my post, I do repeat that I don't have a solid stance on this particular event because I feel I don't have enough information. The main points of my post were the absurdity of white privilege and white guilt from my (Finnish) historical point of view, and the lack of statistical evidence that supports US police rampantly killing black people.

Did he actually examine the body? Did the first examiner examine the body? Is he hiding information to protect his co-workers?


Maybe more examiners should be hired for a general consensus.


From your point of view and many other white people, white privilege does not exist. I think it does. I've never been pulled over because of the colour of my skin, had people follow me in stores, hold onto their purse tighter, etc. This is the world we live in, Cricket would say that's not privilege its black under privilege. To me that's him agreeing with my statements but not wanting to admit it and finding different phrases.


I obviously can't change your mind or open your eyes. You cant change mine or pull the wool over them. I've stated that I'm leaving this thread multiple times but just keep coming back. Nothing is advancing with these discussions, we are going in circles. So when I dont reply to whoever posts a reply; dont take that as an I dont have anything to say, or I'm insulting you. I'm just tired of going in circles.


Like I've said and Cricket, Citizen Rules, John McClane among others...the man was killed, the cops should be found guilty, the riots are wrong, the police are out of line with protestors. We are in agreement with that and I'll take my leave.



Did he actually examine the body? Did the first examiner examine the body? Is he hiding information to protect his co-workers?
That was an honest question. I don't how such legalities work in the US (can anyone bring their own doctors to examine the body?). And I was considering mentioning that isn't the "hiding information" angle a pure conspiracy theory (or is it not, as the cause is just)? I, personally, have more faith to the county coroner.

From your point of view and many other white people, white privilege does not exist. I think it does. I've never been pulled over because of the colour of my skin, had people follow me in stores, hold onto their purse tighter, etc.
For me, the big question is where is the line between causality (all of your examples are things that seem to happen to ethnic groups that have considerably higher crime rates than, for example, whites - in Finland Roma are in a very similar situation) and racism (which in my opinion would be purely based on the color of skin and generally just being different). Prejudices are built on information and past experiences, they're rarely born out of nothing.



matt72582's Avatar
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I've avoided this, for many reasons, and instead of quoting 50 posts, I'll just say a few things. Socio-economics DOES play a part. I think its a combination of many things, and in a span of a few minutes, the brain working like a computer sometimes act on instinct (which doesn't mean it's accurate and/or fair). Obviously skin color is a huge determining factor, because its something you can't hide and I think most people would rather be racist "inside" than take a chance. To me, there's nothing more annoying than "black lives matter" vs. "all lives matter". I don't like agendas. I support any group protesting, even if I don't agree with them. The more I disagree with something, the more I want to know why.


What I would like is for more to be inclusive about the whole thing. I think its wise if someone on TV says "Black, brown, and poor people are not treated fairly" because then it includes more people, and some who might feel left out would join the cause or at least be conscious of what's going on and investigate more. Or simply using poverty would kill two birds with one stone, but the main thing is, it wouldn't leave out a small percentage of people who won't get noticed, instead of an all-exclusive group, which leads to some people who don't fit a certain group category to feel, "Hey, I've been screwed by the police, but they don't care about me" which I think leads to a backlash, and resentment between mostly poor people, instead of the system itself. I browse on Twitter, and saw a conversation where one said, "Asians don't need affirmative action because they're doing fine". All of them? Isn't that a stereotype? I like to include all people, to emulate a fist, rather than dividing us (making us easier to control and divide) into little fingers. People should also know that most will only see highlights - anything that makes news for the respective news stations (and their target audience). I also think there are agent provocateurs, infiltration, and a distortion of what's happening. If I was against the protestors, I'd spray-paint things like "White Lives Don't Matter" to stir things up, so millions could say "See? See??". I was watching graffiti in NYC which seemed to be by one or two guys by looking at the color and handwriting. The US doesn't seem to have a "let's have a conversation" mindset. People always say "Never discuss politics and religion", until things get out of hand, and then it's all out chaos. I was listening to my neighbors talk while I was on my porch, and when a few criticize our governor (Whitmer), I'm going to assume they might just defend Trump no matter what, even though I don't like either one of them (nor Biden), and when another neighbor told me "I don't know your politics, but Trump isn't setting a good example", then I might not hesitate to criticize him. She really liked when I corrected her phrase of "the lesser of two evils" to "the evil of two lessers". I'm a very political person, and it's exhausting, so I try to avoid it, and have, but I think if everyone spoke what was in their hearts and minds, we might get more ideas, instead of binary thinking without nuance. I bring up my neighbors because I think a lot of people will remain silent unless they speak to their bubble, whether it's people they work with, friends, family, or in the case I mentioned, where I live, because I've lived here for 5 years and have enough chaos in my life and around this area, so I use the internet anonymously sometimes to experiment. I noticed something simple as an avatar can prejudice and manipulate. If for example I say the same thing on a platform, but once doing it with a white beautiful blonde woman and pasting the same exact comment with a man, or an empty avatar. Be interested in accuracy instead of validating things you've thought for years. There's nothing wrong with saying, "I was wrong". People shouldn't be quick to jump at people for feeling a certain way. We can't know everyone's life with a few posts.



I've avoided this, for many reasons, and instead of quoting 50 posts, I'll just say a few things. Socio-economics DOES play a part. I think its a combination of many things, and in a span of a few minutes, the brain working like a computer sometimes act on instinct (which doesn't mean it's accurate and/or fair). Obviously skin color is a huge determining factor, because its something you can't hide and I think most people would rather be racist "inside" than take a chance. To me, there's nothing more annoying than "black lives matter" vs. "all lives matter". I don't like agendas. I support any group protesting, even if I don't agree with them. The more I disagree with something, the more I want to know why.


What I would like is for more to be inclusive about the whole thing. I think its wise if someone on TV says "Black, brown, and poor people are not treated fairly" because then it includes more people, and some who might feel left out would join the cause or at least be conscious of what's going on and investigate more. Or simply using poverty would kill two birds with one stone, but the main thing is, it wouldn't leave out a small percentage of people who won't get noticed, instead of an all-exclusive group, which leads to some people who don't fit a certain group category to feel, "Hey, I've been screwed by the police, but they don't care about me" which I think leads to a backlash, and resentment between mostly poor people, instead of the system itself. I browse on Twitter, and saw a conversation where one said, "Asians don't need affirmative action because they're doing fine". All of them? Isn't that a stereotype? I like to include all people, to emulate a fist, rather than dividing us (making us easier to control and divide) into little fingers. People should also know that most will only see highlights - anything that makes news for the respective news stations (and their target audience). I also think there are agent provocateurs, infiltration, and a distortion of what's happening. If I was against the protestors, I'd spray-paint things like "White Lives Don't Matter" to stir things up, so millions could say "See? See??". I was watching graffiti in NYC which seemed to be by one or two guys by looking at the color and handwriting. The US doesn't seem to have a "let's have a conversation" mindset. People always say "Never discuss politics and religion", until things get out of hand, and then it's all out chaos. I was listening to my neighbors talk while I was on my porch, and when a few criticize our governor (Whitmer), I'm going to assume they might just defend Trump no matter what, even though I don't like either one of them (nor Biden), and when another neighbor told me "I don't know your politics, but Trump isn't setting a good example", then I might not hesitate to criticize him. She really liked when I corrected her phrase of "the lesser of two evils" to "the evil of two lessers". I'm a very political person, and it's exhausting, so I try to avoid it, and have, but I think if everyone spoke what was in their hearts and minds, we might get more ideas, instead of binary thinking without nuance. I bring up my neighbors because I think a lot of people will remain silent unless they speak to their bubble, whether it's people they work with, friends, family, or in the case I mentioned, where I live, because I've lived here for 5 years and have enough chaos in my life and around this area, so I use the internet anonymously sometimes to experiment. I noticed something simple as an avatar can prejudice and manipulate. If for example I say the same thing on a platform, but once doing it with a white beautiful blonde woman and pasting the same exact comment with a man, or an empty avatar. Be interested in accuracy instead of validating things you've thought for years. There's nothing wrong with saying, "I was wrong". People shouldn't be quick to jump at people for feeling a certain way. We can't know everyone's life with a few posts.
No need for multi quote because I can't disagree with anything. It's funny, I feel like I have completely different taste in movies than you do, yet you're someone I usually agree with. With social issues, I also think of you as someone that has very different ideas than me. Yet again, I find it hard to disagree with you because of your thoughtfulness and fairness. You're an interesting cat.



matt72582's Avatar
Please Quote/Tag Or I'll Miss Your Responses
No need for multi quote because I can't disagree with anything. It's funny, I feel like I have completely different taste in movies than you do, yet you're someone I usually agree with. With social issues, I also think of you as someone that has very different ideas than me. Yet again, I find it hard to disagree with you because of your thoughtfulness and fairness. You're an interesting cat.
Thank you, and I feel the same about you. Actually, I love half the movies on your Top 10, and I respect someone like you who doesn't mind being the only voice, and I still remember your video post regarding Christine Blasey-Ford, and regardless of a few differences, I think you're sincere and coming from a good place. Politically, I feel like I'm on an island, because I think political correctness is the ultimate prejudice, and I just can't go with whatever is acceptable (so when groups change, all of a sudden their principles go out the window?) and over 20 years, I've become more lax on some social issues such as guns and immigration, or at least not high priority. I guess I just don't like group-think or when people tell others how they can or cannot feel.