Western Hall of Fame II

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Citizen, I really do find your criticism of Soldier Blue intolerable, biased, and unfair. I would be fine with it if you just had higher standards, but those were more sentiment than actual criticism. The way you describe it makes it sound like The Wizard of Gore. Your criticisms of the characters I think demonstrate a dislike for the characters, but not an assesment of their portrayal and execution. I would call the movie a little campy by todays standards, but not for the era, much less the genre. I think it's a case of not liking the movie and just criticising all the things you didn't like.

I was actually kind of annoyed at first, but took some time to think about it more and cool off. I could dissect your post in detail and it could be an interesting debate, but I don't think this is really the time or place.
If you officially join this HoF, I'd be happy to rewatch Solider Blue and give it another chance.



The Salvation




I was well aware of this movie but there's a reason I didn't have it on my watchlist. I didn't think it would be that good. It's definitely my type, bleak and brutal, so I did enjoy it. I just think it's average at best. It's too bad because I thought it started out strong. Many will praise the cinematography, but it's not a look that I especially like. Mads Mikkelsen was great in The Hunt, but I think he lacks charisma and has a weird look about him that strikes me cold. He's probably great as the serial killer in Hannibal. Some will like it, but I'd be surprised if it doesn't finish last in this HoF. It may make the countdown because of Mads and the fact that it's recent, but if I'm being honest, I don't think it deserves to.



If you officially join this HoF, I'd be happy to rewatch Solider Blue and give it another chance.
Oh gosh, ya know what I probably should, but I just don't know...

It's a great idea, and I should re-watch it too. Heaven forbid I should actually come around a little more to your side and realise it's not as great as I thought.

Nominations are supposed to be anonymous though, so will you rewatch it even if I don't nominate it?

There is at least one other movie I'm thinking of nominating, but I can rewatch that regardless.

I can't think of 25 Westerns I would nominate for the upcoming list so I do need to watch more Westerns. I've been thinking a lot about my participation in the MoFo lists and HoF's and my overall pressence on movieforums.com. It is probably the forum I've dedicated the most time to and stuck with for all these years.

Alright, ya know what, I shall. I actually want to be a MoFo, not just someone who grazes the forums when I feel like it.

So, count me in.



Oh gosh, ya know what I probably should, but I just don't know...

It's a great idea, and I should re-watch it too. Heaven forbid I should actually come around a little more to your side and realise it's not as great as I thought.

Nominations are supposed to be anonymous though, so will you rewatch it even if I don't nominate it?

There is at least one other movie I'm thinking of nominating, but I can rewatch that regardless.

I can't think of 25 Westerns I would nominate for the upcoming list so I do need to watch more Westerns. I've been thinking a lot about my participation in the MoFo lists and HoF's and my overall pressence on movieforums.com. It is probably the forum I've dedicated the most time to and stuck with for all these years.

Alright, ya know what, I shall. I actually want to be a MoFo, not just someone who grazes the forums when I feel like it.

So, count me in.
Yes if Soldier Blue was your movie nomination I would happily rewatch it, as I haven't seen it in several years. Or you could probably nominated any western you want, that's the fun part about HoFs, we get to watch a wide variety of films and then people watch our choice too.



Ok, Zotis is in.
Updated list of noms:
The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly - ahwell
The Cowboys - edarsenal
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance - Wyldsyde 19
The Ox-Bow Incident - Citizen Rules
Rio Bravo - Keyser Corleone
The Salvation - Siddon
The Shooting - Hey Frederick
The Great Silence - Zotis

Sorry for procrastinating and not putting these on the first post, I’ll really try soon but I’m still on mobile and I want to do it on a computer.



The Ox-Bow Incident

Literally every single person I'm following on Letterboxd gave this a 3.5/5... I guess I'll break the trend and bump it down just 1/2 star. It was clearly a solid film, and will probably make my list for the Westerns Countdown, but I couldn't help getting a bit bored by the end. I liked Henry Fonda, but no one else really, and I wish the characters were a bit more fleshed out. I would have preferred this at maybe thirty minutes longer so we could have more time to get to know the characters. It feels very rushed as it is.

Still very entertaining and thought-provoking.

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Ok, Zotis is in.
Updated list of noms:
The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly - ahwell
The Cowboys - edardenal
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance - Wyldsyde 19
The Ox-Bow Incident - Citizen Rules
Rio Bravo - Keyser Corleone
The Salvation - Siddon
The Shooting - Hey Frederick
The Great Silence - Zotis

Sorry for procrastinating and not putting these on the first post, I’ll really try soon but I’m still on mobile and I want to do it on a computer.
Another good one that's already a strong contender for my list.




The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962)

This is a good example of a movie I needed to rewatch! Yes, I'd seen it before and liked it, but I didn't remember a damn thing about it. It's interesting that this movie comes at the end of director John Ford's brilliant career and it marks the end of an era in westerns. With the coming of Clint Eastwood and the much more action packed, violent spaghetti westerns that would dominate the 1960s, The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance hearkens back to the heyday of westerns. And yet it's modern in that it revolves around the changing events of a fictional western town through time, much like America had changed during the 20th century. We see the western frontier town go from the wild west days when a bad man like Liberty Valance could rule the roast...to the later days when rule of law and societal norms had caught up to the little town of Shinbone.

Director John Ford diminishes the characters impact and makes the changing times of an American icon (IE the western town) the principal theme. Initially I was surprised that John Wayne had such little impact in the film, I mean this is not The Searchers or Rooster Cogburn. Here the Duke is just another gear in the machinery that highlights Americana, family and the old west. I guess that surprised me some as I expected with the big name actors that this would be their film...but John Ford wisely puts them into the background so that the overall themes of change can come more into focus.

Good film! and I'm glad it was nominated.


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The Ox-Bow Incident (1942)

The title says it all...The Ox-Box Incident...It isn't an action driven film, nor is it a character driven film. It's a study of a moment in time, a chain of events that lead to an incident. The director puts us in the shoes of the hanging posse. He did that by not giving a backstory on the characters. We don't know anymore about the accused men, than the posse knows. We don't even know much about the outsiders played by Henry Fonda and Henry Morgan, as far as we know they might end up with a rope around their necks.

The events take place in linear time. Those events mostly happen in real time as they occur...there's no flashbacks or intercut stories. The film's one focus is on an incident that happened at the Ox-Bow. I think that worked brilliantly and makes this film much different than other westerns of the 1940s.

I found the events to be very believable because the actors play it very realistically. That's import, as if suspension of disbelief doesn't come into being then a film isn't believable and then the emotional impact of what you're watching has little effect. The Ox-Bow Incident had great effect on me! And that's thanks to the streamlined script, the director and the actors. Henry Fonda is the star and does a great job but it's Dana Andrews who pulls off the near impossible of being a scared, innocent man who's about to be hung. I can't see many actors of that time being able to do what Dana Andrews did.

It's a haunting film that has stayed with me.

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I think I'll pass this. It's not that much because of any of the nominations (though there's two I'm not planning to rewatch) but I just don't want to get burned out with westerns before the countdown so I'll prefer just watching whatever I fancy instead of a premeditated list.

Short note on the nominations still.

The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly
The Great Silence

The two films I don't plan to rewatch as they definitely will be on my list. Leone I rewatched in January and the other maybe two or three years ago.

Rio Bravo
Just rewatched this couple of weeks ago and didn't like it.

The Cowboys
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance

I honestly don't know if I've seen either of these John Waynes (if yes, then it's been from TV as a kid). Not a fan of the Duke so I'll probably steer clear from these (the latter seems little more interesting of the two).

The Ox-Bow Incident
Again I may have seen this as a kid but don't remember either way. Considering the story and it being a CR nomination I'm afraid I wouldn't like it

The Salvation
Weirdly I have a hunch that I've seen this but I have no recollection of the film at all so I may be wrong. As much as I liked Mads as Hannibal Lecter I usually don't like him so probably I'll pass this.

The Shooting
This looks kinda interesting and I've added it to my watchlist.
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The only one I've already seen is The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly. I actually do want to do an in-depth analysis because I think it's an extremely overrated movie and I'd like to dissect it for criticism. A lot of people love it so it can be a touchy subject. I know what it feels like when someone bashes something you love. I have to find a way to do it as neutrally as possible because I think criticism can also be bait for vanity. I've been struggling a lot in my life over criticism, as I'm a very critical person, but I don't like having so many negative thoughts and hurting other people's feelings all the time. We'll see, I'm going to keep thinking about it.

I wanted to nominate The Great Silence over Soldier Blue because I think it's a better movie and I want to rewatch it more than Soldier Blue.

Edit: I think we should have the years beside the movie titles on the first page too, just in case any of them have another movie by the same name. I'd hate to watch one and review it just to find out it was the wrong version. I don't know if any of them actually have another version though, so maybe it doesn't matter, but just thought I'd throw that out there.



I've been struggling a lot in my life over criticism, as I'm a very critical person, but I don't like having so many negative thoughts and hurting other people's feelings all the time.
Hey, you stole my line As a matter of fact I end up hurting myself too because my over criticism really hurts my own attempts at writing (well, that and laziness).

I wanted to nominate The Great Silence over Soldier Blue because I think it's a better movie and I want to rewatch it more than Soldier Blue.
It definitely is. I might not be as critical towards Soldier Blue as @Citizen Rules but still found it very mediocre (which probably isn't much bigger praise considering it should be far more my kind of film than CR's kind).





The Shooting (1966)

I never saw a scene with this shot in the actual movie, so I wonder where it came from and what's happening. A scene cut from the version I watched perhaps? I watched a youtube version and it cut out the opening credits. Anyway... I liked this movie a lot actually. It was a smart film with pretty decent acting and a compelling story that kept me wanting to know what was going to happen next every step of the way. The ending left me pondering. I don't want to give any spoilers, but a young Jack Nicholson played a mean and sharp cold-hearted killer. Millie Perkins plays the attractive female driving the plot's main motivation. There are a lot of interesting dynamics surrounding her manipulative character. It's really the dynamics between the characters that makes the movie, and everything hinted at that goes unsaid.






The Shooting (1966)

I never saw a scene with this shot in the actual movie, so I wonder where it came from and what's happening.

That pic is from Ride in the Whirlwind. Jack and a couple other Cowboys are mistaken for murderers and are being tracked by a group of vigilantes. It's the same director, stars Jack and Millie again and was filmed right after The Shooting. That's another good one but not quite as good as The Shooting, imo.



Rio Bravo

Rio Bravo's my favorite John Wayne film. It's got the right kind of Western attitude: badass, primitive, and full of tension. I loved the way the story progressed and how well it ended up using its characters all to a perfectly satisfactory end result. The characters were a little tropey, but I'm assuming Rio Bravo and other Western movies around that time invented the tropes. I don't know whether John Wayne stole the show or Dean Martin did, but both were fun to watch.