Rioting in the U.S.
 

I thought I'd create a topic about what's happening in the U.S. if anybody wants to talk about it. The rioting which began with the murder of George Floyd is getting worse.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Preemptively:

This is about a current/important event, so that's fine. It's subject to being closed if and when it gets too heated, starts going around in circles, or becomes an excuse to bring up stuff already discussed regularly in past political (closed) threads. This is a movie site, after all, and that's what we're trying to be about. Threads like this must exist sometimes out of necessity, but only insofar as they don't interfere with the movie part.

Okay, disclaimer done. :)

I was watching the news last night and saw how the violence is escalating. It's starting to feel like Armageddon.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

People: Police uses too much violence!
Police: Uses even more violence.

I guess the police think they're above everyone and can do whatever they want. If they had arrested Chauvin on the spot, I doubt there would be all this rioting.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Rioting at the time of coronavirus !! This free for all could spread the virus even more.

I hope the riots don't have a Chinese connection. China in this situation is set to benefit maximum from any weakening of the US .

Yeah, I guess these rioters think they're immune to the coronavirus.

The term Antifa is being used to describe the rioters. To me they're terrorists. I doubt there's any connection to the Chinese.

A Chinese connection to the riots??? Here we go again...

For heaven’s sake, let’s not generalize. First people we call when we’re in trouble is the police!

So you don’t like the cops & the rioters are “terrorists”. Pick a side!

I'm referring to cops like Chauvin. Certainly not all cops are bad. Terrorists are always in the wrong.

From my limited knowledge...the 'rioting' is more about looting and vandalism, then about righting an injustice.

It seems to have escalated into the same mindless violence that the 'anarchist' movement caused a few years ago. The same elements seemed to be involved again too.

The police forces around America haven't done much at all to stop the wholesale destruction of business and properties. IMO they've been way too passive. One FBI agent was killed and another wounded, many cops have been wounded too.

The original killing of the black suspect, was wrong, very wrong. But destroying and killing innocent people is also very wrong. It's time for the National Guard to step in and use force if necessary. This disrespect for society's rules needs to stop now.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

What I can never understand is the looting or - even worse - burning down of their neighbors’ small businesses. Many business owners are begging them to stop because they have no insurance.

I don't understand it either, but it seems to happen whenever there's a major protest. IMO, I think there may be an evil satanic element involved, and satanists thrive on fear and are the cause of chaos. Last night when I was watching the news, I saw someone walk past the camera displaying what I believe to be a satanic hand signal - the middle and ring fingers were folded down leaving the index and pinky pointing up. Of course it could mean something else. I'm just guessing here.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Yeah, however righteous the cause, protesting on a certain scale (and of certain things) is pretty much always used by people of bad faith as an excuse to destroy and loot. And destroy and loot not just people who have nothing to do with the injustice, but sometimes even people supporting the protesters!

Managing to support the protest while still condemning this is a level of nuance that most people seem confusingly incapable of, too, as if the fear of not being seen as fully supportive of the cause is enough to stop them from condemning inarguably heinous actions that emerge from it, even indirectly.

And you're guessing wrong. You're letting your own phobias cloud your decision making process. I assure you that the riots are not caused by Satanist.

Everyone needs to recite the Saint Michael prayer. ✝️ :cool:

It's prayed at the end of most every Mass now.

Everyone does not need to follow your particular faith:rolleyes:

I know. I really like it. Very apropos.

"If you're not cop, you're little people." -Bryant

Only posting in here once.

First things first: Turn off the news media and start watching videos from people on the ground. The media has an agenda they are going to push. The current administration has an agenda they are going to push. They are both already doing it, so if you want to see what is truly going on you need to turn to citizen shot footage.

Secondly, the majority of looting/violence/unrest is being perpetrated by far-left and far-right groups to push their own agendas. We've got billionaires busing people into these cities to promote upheaval. White supremacist organizations are actively infiltrating crowds and enciting violence. Antifa splinter cells are organizing supply chains and sowing chaos, as well.

This is straight up terrorism, and it is NOT domestic terrorism. These perpetrators are being funded and supported by international organizations. White supremacy is a serious international issue and we are doing nothing to combat it.

For the second time in the last 4 years we are seeing interference from international hate groups. This is a far bigger issue than police brutality. We are fighting international terrorist organizations that sow and revel in violence.

Finally, police militarization is a serious issue, and it's precisely why these groups WANT this type of unrest. Police units have amassed weaponry to an unprecedented scale, and police unions have actively thwarted thousands of investigations with collective bargaining.

And our courts are too spineless to reestablish the rule of law.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicksib.../#78dd87e12877

https://www.reuters.com/investigates...munity-scotus/

I urge everyone to be safe if you are protesting. This is all some serious deep state ****.

Black Lives Matter

I blame the media for a lot of this crap. The murder of George Floyd had nothing to do with race but all they talk about is the racial injustice. That doesn't make what happened any less evil but call it what it is. I'm so sick of everything being automatically attributed to race. It's disgusting. What's the excuse for Daniel Shaver's murder and so many others? Racism is a problem but it's not the problem here. Misidentify the problem and it won't be solved. Police, most of which are wonderful, need to be trained differently, and they need to treat the public like they are their customers. With most jobs, if you talk smack to a customer, you can be fired. There needs to be more mutual respect to start with and then build upon that. This officer was written up how many times? He should've been gone long ago.

Are you sure?

Attorney General William P. Barr has issued the following statement:

“The greatness of our nation comes from our commitment to the rule of law.

The outrage of our national community about what happened to George Floyd in Minneapolis is real and legitimate. Accountability for his death must be addressed, and is being addressed, through the regular process of our criminal justice system, both at the state and at the federal level. That system is working and moving at exceptional speed. Already initial charges have been filed. That process continues to move forward. Justice will be served.

Unfortunately, with the rioting that is occurring in many of our cities around the country, the voices of peaceful protest are being hijacked by violent radical elements.

Groups of outside radicals and agitators are exploiting the situation to pursue their own separate and violent agenda.

In many places, it appears the violence is planned, organized, and driven by anarchistic and far left extremists, using Antifa-like tactics, many of whom travel from out of state to promote the violence.

We must have law and order on our streets and in our communities, and it is the responsibility of the local and state leadership, in the first instance, to halt this violence. The Department of Justice (including the FBI, Marshals, ATF, and DEA), and all of our 93 U.S. Attorneys across the country, will support these local efforts and take all action necessary to enforce federal law.

In that regard, it is a federal crime to cross state lines or to use interstate facilities to incite or participate in violent rioting. We will enforce these laws.”

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/attor...loyd-and-riots

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

I guess I shouldn't bring up the Louisville police shooting death of a black man this morning and the subsequent firing of the police chief.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

What's boggling is not one person (that I know of or have heard in any from of media) of any color, social status or political affiliation has defended the cop who killed George Floyd or the other cops present that failed to intervene.

No one has attempted to rationalize or justify what was captured on that 9 minute video.

Every media network that voices opinions has agreed (for the first time in a long time) this was horrible! Every person from the President to his opposing candidate, down to other cops themselves have expressed it was an appalling act injustice.

Yet, right now, untold thousands of completely innocent citizens are being victimized, assaulted, robbed, beaten and having their property & businesses utterly and permanently destroyed for no reason by rioting criminals, when everyone agrees with the cries of "justice for George."

7 people were shot there Thursday during protests but it doesn't seem to be big news. It's all bad as far as I'm concerned.

Don't know who this cop is but he's awesome

https://youtu.be/ykDvAkURTKY

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Glad I live in the middle of nowhere so I don't have to deal with any of this silliness.

I had to get rid of FB. I think my twitter is next. Everyone and their Granny had their two cents. What's stupid is literally nobody disagrees that it was disgusting and and dude should be in jail and will be. So what is the point of all this?

For what it's worth if you actually look at the numbers .000003% of Americans were killed by police last year. Even less if you just count the brothers. If you add up African Americans and Hispanics killed by police the last two years combined it doesn't equal Caucasians in the same time period. Then you factor in justified force and the number gets even lower. You were about 10 times more likely to get killed by black on black crime last year than a cop.

Man I am all for some police reform and law reform. You feel more paranoid then protected when police are around. Hopefully we come out of this better, but it feels like this divide is here for a long time.

Lol if I am not mistaken that is Grady Judd. Polk County police chief in Florida...not too far away from me. I'd listen to Bubba The Love Sponge out of Tampa occasionally and he would sometimes be on his show ha.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

I mean, if falling for and/or perpetuating falsehood became awesome all of a sudden then sure. the "Antifa" threat of breaking into homes is complete bull****. This started from a few specific twitter accounts. Whether they're Trump supporters or just doing it for ****s and giggles (both?) isn't certain, but it's certainly fake. You could tell before it even hit the news.

I would just take your word for it because that part doesn't matter to me. It's the take no shlt attitude that does.

I get it. We're an emotional species and so we're easily persuaded by words that evoke a strong emotional response. That's a problem. This guy's a cop and I would expect someone in his profession to do some research or something before going on camera and spewing nonsense.

There's a lot of organized rioting and looting, and cities are burning down. Lowlifes are getting away with it because the wimps in charge are being lax. That's not the way it should be.

Organized anarchy. It seems almost like an oxymoron. If the situation gets any worse, someone ought to declare Martial law.

lol not too mention Biden and Steve Carrell and some others are bailing out some of these rioters. Basically encouraging it. Hopefully they did their homework and only bailed out peaceful protesters but I seriously have my doubts.

I hate to say it, but when you look at social media, and the messaging by the people in the middle of it all, it looks democrat/liberal driven. Maybe that's just because I'm in Massachusetts otherwise known as liberal hell.

I don't always agree with you, Chris (especially about certain board politics), but this was a damn good post!

lol I was seeing a girl who lived right outside NYC and worked in the city at the end of last year. I was planning to move up there after the holidays. Had a job lined up. But the relationship fell apart after Xmas. Saved me from being in that COVID cesspool and I work in healthcare. Plus I don't think I can live in such a blue state. God bless people who can, I like my no state income tax :laugh:.

No doubt.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

The far left in my country India at least has some ideological connection with China and takes a pro China stance in many India China disputes. Reason is that China is at least officially a communist state though it has given up communist economic policies for a long time now.

The far left connection in these riots makes me wonder of some Chinese influence on those rioters . Is China stirring up trouble in anticipation of backlash from america over coronavirus?

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

What's funny is my town in WV just had a peaceful protest a day ago and literally nothing was burned down. Only one guy was arrested and it was a guy who got out of his car and tried to fight the protesters because they were blocking the road. Everywhere else is getting way outta hand. One witness in Dallas described the city as a "warzone" with the FBI coming in with drones being used and shutting down the whole city.

Obviously my town is big but not the size of ones like NY, LA, DC, Dallas, or Chicago so im not surprised if this is being escalated by certain organizations infiltrating protests in these bigger cities.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Breaking Geneva Convention. Kewl.

EDIT: Apparently they're not. Sorry for misinformation.

My take on the problem with the US Police,

-You have 50 sovereign states all with differing laws.
-In each state you have State Police, bigger cities have their own dept, and County Sheriffs, then various Federal agencies.
-So, over 3000 sheriff "fiefdoms" elected by the community, I'm not sure if State Superintendents are elected or not.

So the problem with the above is inconsistency, as far as I'm aware all European countries have 1 police force, divided into areas/counties with their own commissioners, but all answerable to Government.

So all it takes is a couple of bad areas led by bad cops, or elected by good God fearing folk to keep the "lower class" citizens in line. Go to Netflix right now and you can find dozens of documentaries about shocking miscarriages of justice.

Then to compound the problem,

-Shocking lack of punishment against Police unless there is a video.
-Thin Blue Line, Brothhood mentality, us vs them, anyone who dares inform against another cop will suffer(see officer fired for stopping officer choking suspect).
-Militarization of Police, are they the army or there to protect their communities? It isn't clear sometimes. How many people or pets have to die in over aggressive no knock raids?
-Financial cost of fighting back against injustice, and laws making it near impossible to sue Police.
-Awful Police Unions who fight tooth and nail for the very worst officers.
- Low or virtually non existant educational requirements in the US to become a Police officer.

I believe the vast majority of Police are likely decent folk but the setup in the US makes it too easy to be a bad cop and get away with it, particularly in rural southern areas.

Good post^^and yes it's important to remember the innocent pets.

There's some awful videos out there. Family get raided due to a bad tip off and some incompetent Officer playing Rambo shoots the small family dog LOCKED IN ITS CAGE! They find about 1 spliff worth of Marijuana.

Another one they raid a town Mayor by mistake and shoot his labrador. Why shoot a barking scared dog? Same thing as shooting someone running away that is no threat.

I've seen some of these and they make me ill.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Here is my issue with this:

How come in all the cases (Such as these), it's always someone "resisting" an officer? If an officer tells me to stop, you better believe I'll stop. Even that young Trayvon Martin guy got in a physical altercation with a security guard (ZImmerman).

Why not just be respectful and walk away?

Why push an officer over the edge? They wake up and deal with horrible situations. That's there lives. Why are you messing with them?

Hasn't anyone heard "Don't start nothing, won't be nothing?".

When you mess with a cop by "resisting", then you asked for it.

Why disrespect someone who's line is literally on the line every single day.

Also, it's never a Chinese person or some Indian immigrant?. If someone is racist, they are racist to everybody.

Why it's usually an African American who is the victim?

I don't think it's an external issue, this is an internal issue within the African American community.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

We have had several nights of protest here about this issue. The Plaza area was vandalized Saturday night and Sunday, the news showed the protest. Everything was under control until the 8 pm curfew then a few individuals started throwing frozen water bottles at the police officers. I just couldn't believe it. Our mayor was all for the protest but then people disrespect him and the city by acting out when it was a curfew. **shakes my head**

OMG, let's not blame the victim! And lets NOT blame the entire African American community!

George Floyd was handcuffed and on the ground, there was no need for a cop to crush his neck with his knee for eight minutes straight. That's just monstrous.

I do support the police and believe the overwhelming of officers are good & brave people who risk their lives daily to keep us safe. But in this one case there was one helluva bad cop who caused a needless death. Was the cop racist? I don't know. Just because he's white and the suspect was black doesn't automatically make him a racist, even though the media loves to say that. We need to hold individuals accountable for their actions and stop judging people by their skin color.

I didn't see that much resistance from George Floyd. He was impaired, and officers need to be able to deal with people who are impaired or suffering from mental illness in a better way.

It's true that it happens to blacks more than other minorities. It's not a mystery to me that it's because as a group they commit a lot of crime. I would also guess that they are more hostile towards police because of what society tells them, and also what they have gone through. It's a vicious circle, and that's why I don't like the whole racial injustice thing in specific cases that don't warrant it. I think the only way to effectively combat this problem and defeat it is with true solidarity, meaning take the race out of it. I don't think it helps to cite race in these instances. Even when it's a factor, it's something we have to get past and conquer.

Wow. You must be joking. That’s one of the most insensitive comments I’ve read.

A protest a mile from my house in Brockton just turned ugly and my dogs are going crazy from the booms. Got both cars backed into the garage so if someone comes into my driveway they're getting run over.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

I downloaded a police scanner app and was listening to LIVE reports about looting, gunfire, and people being shot. It's getting depressing.

You have a two car garage?
Lucky.

:napoleon:

I feel so much better now that they brought in the midget police

Stay safe, buddy.

They're called little people. 🙂

Saks Fifth Avenue all boarded up like in a war zone. Mercenaries & their dogs on guard. That’s Saint Patrick’s Cathedral next door.

For whatever reason, John McClane is afraid to post here, so he's posting comments to me, instead. I find this inappropriate.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Sometimes people want to engage in a short private discussion rather than invite public argument. Plenty of legitimate uses for it, at least. Or they want to add a comment but otherwise let the argument die out, which I think is a very constructive way of doing things, rather than escalating. It's nice when people can let things go, and this allows them to do so without just going silent/while still clarifying a point.

I think you might want to talk to them directly before posting private communication, regardless.

What is inappropriate is you publicly posting a private comment, (unless the person who sent it gave you permission to do so).

If you don't want John McClane sending you comments tell him so, don't try to publicly shame him into stopping.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

I need to leave this thread before more white people claim they know how to solve the issue, if this even is race related or praise the horrible acts from corrupt cops even further.

Just step away and shut up.

I think only one person said anything that sounded like praise for the cop involved in the killing. All the rest of the post (that I've read) condemned the cop.

I prefer to discuss these things in thread so others can weigh in, but John McClane and I often talk privately about these types of issues when they pop up. The good thing about that is I think it's easier for us to stay cordial and remain friends even when we have very differing opinions.

See I think this is part of the problem, but of course it's not malicious on your part. White or black it shouldn't matter we are all in it together. I don't know how to solve it but I do know the world will be a better place when we don't hear what the skin color of the people involved is.

The desire to be equal is good, but the reality is the total opposite.

Yeah, it seems like he's got issues of his own.

Do you think it is now socially acceptable to be racist towards whites?

As opposed to continually egging someone on to provoke a reaction?

https://youtube.com/watch?v=vKC0k-Luzxw

Obviously not. But please dont turn this into a whites can be racially discriminated against too arguement.

It seems that many people don't know who Daniel Shaver is. He was a 26yo married father of 2 little girls and a pest control specialist from Texas. He was away for business in Arizona, and for work he used a pellet gun to get birds who would be causing a nuisance high up in the air inside large buildings. At his hotel he met a man and a woman, and they enjoyed a few drinks in his room. One of them asked him what was in the case, a musical instrument? No it's a pellet gun and he showed it to them. A couple in a hot tub down below saw him through the window and called the police reporting a man with a gun.

He walked out of his hotel room and then this happened-

https://youtu.be/VBUUx0jUKxc

The cop did not get convicted, and instead was treated for trauma and received his full pension. If Shaver just happened to be black, there would be screams of racial injustice and rioting and looting. There is no doubt about that. Yet with this, there is no outrage. There's more wrong going on than many people want to admit.

The reason you're not seeing it is because it is now very socially acceptable. Just 1 quick example; Antonio Brown was released from the Raiders after a few issues including calling his general manager "a cracker". A couple days later he was signed by the Super Bowl champion New England Patriots. It's as if he was rewarded for his behavior.

I've seen that video. It's disgusting.


You cannot say this is the same, you cannot say there would be without a doubt rioting. We dont know. George Floyd died over $20, not reports of a gun.


I want to reiterate, that video is disgusting and that officer should be in prison.

The fact you are equating the two is disgusting. I'm out.

Racism is a real problem in this country. Denying it doesn't make it any less real. Derek Chauvin has had 18 complaints lodged against him in the past for racial injustice before these new charges. He's a racist.

I don't like to compare because we all agree they are both horrible, but two differences are that this guy did not commit a crime and the police officer did not get convicted. I believe when there's no conviction, you can at least understand the outrage a little bit more.

I'm not equating Antonio Brown with anything. I'm trying to tell you that racism against whites is now socially acceptable, and there are countless other examples.

I don't doubt that he might be a racist, but there is no evidence that the George Floyd killing was racially motivated. If you have a link detailing his past racism please post it. I looked before and I couldn't find anything, although I agree with his record he should have been gone long ago.

If you were truly outraged by the Daniel Shaver case you’d stop dishonoring his name. Like full stop.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...-white-people/

And also, racism is most certainly a real problem, by all races and against all races. I know this because I know that people are equal regardless of skin color, and because I've seen it.

We aren't all in this together. Black people have faced so much more discrimination over hundreds of years, and white privilege is very much a thing. Here is a great article that pretty much sums my thoughts up - https://medium.com/@realtalkwocandal...m-69273d39d828

I hope everyone here is donating/going to protests (if they can). This is an important issue, and so many white people have sat in silence for too long.

I’ve been waiting on an example of racism against whites for like years now. You still ain’t gave one.

Saying how horrible it was is dishonoring his name?

No, using his death to advance your agenda that white people can experience racism.

Re: Rioting in the U.S.
 

Per the preemptive warning, the temperature in this thread has to go down a bit if it's going to stay open.

Also, do not reply just to say something is stupid/ridiculous/whatever. If you think it's absurd, say why. If you're so distraught by the wrongness of an idea that you can't bring yourself to say why it's wrong in some substantive way, then don't reply.

I gave one on the last page, and while you're asking, if you don't think the term white privilege is racist, is the term black privilege? Or black "insert anything"?

Sorry, you either misunderstood or I presented it wrong. I'm saying if he happened to be black, it would be called racial injustice.

Give me one example of white privilege and I will debunk it.

I think we're ok here. I believe we're all friends on the same side but with different ideas on how to get there.

Well, now you’re just making stuff up, so that’s my cue to leave.

Aye, this is what happens when I break my own promise. 😅

Another cue to bounce.

Always a good time to leave when you claim someone is making something up, but you can't say what that something is;)

For the record, you think white privilege is not a thing?

In your opinion it is and who the f*ck cares? He called someone a cracker...George Floyd was killed. I honestly do not understand why this matters or why you brought it up.


We're talking about a black man who was killed by a white police officer and you're saying....well whites have it tough too it's not fair.

You and me have ZERO idea of what it is like to be a black man in America, so let's stop acting like we do.