Why are modern movies still good but modern pop music not? [Archive]

90sAce

08-02-15, 07:19 PM

I'm too bored with the 'modern music sucks' stuff once again.
It's not a cliche statement.

Fact of the matter is according to a lot of seasoned musicians (Slash, Rob Zombie, Gene Simmons etc) it's harder for a musician to make it big based on talent alone these days than it was in the past.

Basically record labels are more likely to favor individuals or groups with strong Youtube or Twitter followings, since this lessens the risk on the part of the record label. In the past this wasn't a venue.

This means there's less incentive for a band or individual to actually learn an instrument (unless they really are just in it 100% for the art).

In the same vein that it's cheaper to use CGI than "real special effects".

doubledenim

08-02-15, 07:23 PM

needs more nostalgia

Mr Minio

08-02-15, 07:30 PM

It's not a cliche statement. It is. Either way, a false one.
it's harder for a musician to make it big based on talent alone these days than it was in the past What does it have to do with the alleged absence of good music today?
This means there's less incentive for a band or individual to actually learn an instrument (unless they really are just in it 100% for the art) There's still a great number of bands and talented instrumentalists. Still doesn't have anything to do with thread's title.
In the same vein that it's cheaper to use CGI than "real special effects" But there are still films without CGI and they are great, old or new. It seems to me you're only talking about the mainstream. And I mean, like, the most mainstream stuff you can think of. There's so many good recordings being released every year, it's unbelievable.

90sAce

08-02-15, 08:07 PM

It is. Either way, a false one.

You're talking about artists which 90% of people haven't heard of - which is a no-brainer and not even worth mentioning, since it's essentially the same as saying "cows go moo" and attempting to look profound.

What does it have to do with the alleged absence of good music today?
There's still a great number of bands and talented instrumentalists. Still doesn't have anything to do with thread's title.

Better question is what does underground music have to do with the music industry as a whole?

It's obviously not having a significant impact of the current state of the industry.

But there are still films without CGI and they are great, old or new. It seems to me you're only talking about the mainstream.

Wow you can read a title! Congrats.

Why are modern movies still good but modern pop music not?

And I mean, like, the most mainstream stuff you can think of. There's so many good recordings being released every year, it's unbelievable.
The fact that "good artists" are being relegated to the underground will have an effect on the overall scope of music, since like it or not, even talented artists will have less practical incentive and opportunity to explore their full potential if they aren't rewarded for it.

Do you really think the Beatles for example would have recorded all that they did if they had never had an opportunity to make it big, and had been relegated to playing at nightclubs?

popcornsteve

08-02-15, 08:10 PM

In the good old days, they had PROPER instruments. Damn those Swedish House Mafia charlatans!!
I mean, come on, this is a little too close to having to go and poo in a hole in your back gardens because in your day, there was no inside toilets. There have always been elements of pop music that are, well, a bit bubblegum. That's not particular to this generation.

Please don't let us get into an altercation over the merits and worth of streaming music instead of buying it in a shop. If Taylor Beyonce/Prince/ACDC et al wasn't making money out of it, then they wouldn't do it. Go and have a look at the 'artists' that were at the launch of Tidal and tell me that all of those creative types are putting their weight behind it for the love of the music or the buckets of cash they could make if they had better overall control over a release media they already know works.

The argument that musicians (however they choose to make it) have less avenues to express their creativity is simply not true, frankly. I have been in and out of several generations of the music industry and purely on merit, this period is more ripe for musical discovery, due to the many varied formats of receiving it. I know for a fact that I have discovered at least a dozen artists in the past month that I would never have come across using conventional methods on the good old days and they benefit from that too.

Zotis

08-02-15, 08:38 PM

Since it's essentially the same as saying "cows go moo" and attempting to look profound.You straw manned Mr Minio, and then psychologically projected the very thing that you were doing. :rotfl:

It's not at all, you're simply talking about artists which 90% of people haven't heard of... Better question is what does underground music have to do with the music industry as a whole?

It seems to me you're only talking about the mainstream. And I mean, like, the most mainstream stuff you can think of. There's so many good recordings being released every year, it's unbelievable.
The fact that "good artists" are being relegated to the underground will have an effect on the overall scope of music, since like it or not, even talented artists will have less practical incentive and opportunity to explore their full potential if they aren't rewarded for it.

Do you really think the Beatles for example would have recorded all that they did if they had never had an opportunity to make it big, and had been relegated to playing at nightclubs?Music that 90% of people haven't heard of is still mainstream, lol. 10% of 7 billion is 700 million, that's a lot. You just proved Mr Minio's point by talking about The Beatles. And you clearly do not know one single thing about underground music. For one thing underground music has more of an effect on the overall scope of music than mainstream music, because mainstream music is just superficial rip offs of underground music, like Screamo, Emo, and Metal. You have these whiny kid's with black blow dried hair screaming into a mic thinking they're all three genres at the same time when they're really just Metalcore.

Top 40 has gone downhill, because they are motivated by shallow greed and popularity, and mass media/marketing/consumerism doesn't care about "quality," only what sells. But there is so much more to "mainstream" music than that, and underground music is thriving thanks to the internet.

You know 90'sAce, it's really nothing new. You still have no idea what you're talking about.

Mr Minio

08-02-15, 08:41 PM

You're talking about artists which 90% of people haven't heard of - which is a no-brainer and not even worth mentioning, since it's essentially the same as saying "cows go moo" and attempting to look profound. You're being inconsistent here. The title clearly claims it is the modern pop music that is no longer good. All of it, mainstream or obscure. That's what the sentence says. And you also compare all genres of modern filmmaking to only one specified genre of music and even then cut it down only to contemporary releases. It's almost as if you wrote: Why are modern TV shows good, but modern literature written by Coelho not? But let me read the other part of your post before you accuse me of nit-picking.

Better question is what does underground music have to do with the music industry as a whole? An even better question is what do music industries have to do with the quality of music nowadays? It seems to me you are only complaining about the MAINSTREAM contemporary music that sucks. Yeah, a big chunk of it blows.

It's obviously not having a significant impact of the current state of the industry. And it never had. Underground artists were either obscure, relatively known only to the cult followers, or worked their way to the mainstream. Same thing nowadays.

Wow you can read a title! Congrats. Thanks, bro. I appreciate that.

Why are modern movies still good but modern pop music not? Pop music has long lost it's meaning as 'popular'. Not every popular music is pop music and there's a bunch of pop-oriented artists that are pretty obscure.

Do you really think the Beatles for example would have recorded all that they did if they had never had an opportunity to make it big, and had been relegated to playing at nightclubs? Who knows. Anyway, once again, this has very little to do with the title of this topic. You are more interested in degradation of music industry and how it promotes talentless, but money-making artists rather than really talented musicians that are not so certain money-farmers, than the actual quality of nowadays music regardless its popularity.

foster

08-02-15, 08:47 PM

If you think modern music is bad, that's because you're OLD.

Every old person ever has complained about new fangled music their kids are listening to.
Look at history, Learn from it. Introspect.

But it is interesting how this "old people" effect doesn't seem to apply to films. Perhaps thats because we are only just now in the age of convincing CGI and have the capability to produce all these special effects.

mark f

08-02-15, 08:51 PM

If you think modern music is bad, that's because you're OLD.
This is for me, not him.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw9oX-kZ_9k

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:07 PM

You straw manned Mr Minio, and then psychologically projected the very thing that you were doing. :rotfl:

That's incorrect, "pop" specifically refers to music which tops the charts - not "popular" music as an entire genre.

Music that 90% of people haven't heard of is still mainstream, lol. 10% of 7 billion is 700 million, that's a lot.

Not compared to 7 billion. "Lot" is releative

You just proved Mr Minio's point by talking about The Beatles. And you clearly do not know one single thing about underground music.

I know enough to know that "underground" music isn't a genre.

For one thing underground music has more of an effect on the overall scope of music than mainstream music, because mainstream music is just superficial rip offs of underground music,

That's not how it's always been. The Beatles, Aerosmith, etc were a popular bands and were critically acclaimed as innovative - like you're saying yourself there are less popular bands and artists today who are innovators, but rather just recyclers.

like Screamo, Emo, and Metal. You have these whiny kid's with black blow dried hair screaming into a mic thinking they're all three genres at the same time when they're really just Metalcore.

Comparing "metal" to emo is the worst thing I've heard so far in this thread - that shows a huge lack of understanding of the genres.

Top 40 has gone downhill, because they are motivated by shallow greed and popularity, and mass media/marketing/consumerism doesn't care about "quality," only what sells. But there is so much more to "mainstream" music than that, and underground music is thriving thanks to the internet.

I'm not talking about "top 40" exclusively - I'm talking about music which is prevalent in the industry as a whole, including record labels.

You know 90'sAce, it's really nothing new. You still have no idea what you're talking about.
I know what I'm talking about much more than you do.

Zotis

08-02-15, 09:08 PM

I think by pop music he just means top 40, not the actual genre of Pop.

Mr Minio

08-02-15, 09:12 PM

Look at history, Learn from it. Introspect. Bach's music was often believed to be confusing, Mozart's too complicated and chaotic, Many composers now considered geniuses have been criticized in their times. Figures, there's a little bit of truth in what you're saying.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qw9oX-kZ_9k
"Sell this on ebay and ill kick yo narrow ass!"

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:16 PM

If you think modern music is bad, that's because you're OLD.

9 years younger than you.

But your idea of "good" is Lady Gaga right? So... yeah.

Every old person ever has complained about new fangled music their kids are listening to.

Some have been more right than others. Industrialization and capitalism tend to have negating effects on quality when quantity becomes excessive, and we have had this occur in unprecedented degrees in the post WWII era.

What's your opinion on the effect of industrialization on the industry - and how the industrial boom of the post WWII baby boomer era has affected capitalism and consumerism as a whole.

Look at history, Learn from it. Introspect.

Bro I was studying history, philosophy, back in the 90s when you were listening to the Offspring and cutting your wrist over your rejections, lol.

I do more introspection in 10 minutes than you will if you live 10 lifetimes - and that's no exaggeration.

But it is interesting how this "old people" effect doesn't seem to apply to films. Perhaps thats because we are only just now in the age of convincing CGI and have the capability to produce all these special effects.
What's interesting is that young 32 year old punks who's taste in music doesn't go beyond Lady Gaga - when I knew who 14 year olds in HS who knew more about music, the industry, capitalism's effect on the industry, etc than you do, junior - JK ;)

Mr Minio

08-02-15, 09:17 PM

@90sAce
https://warosu.org/data/3/img/0003/97/1387411769891.jpg

Hit Girl

08-02-15, 09:17 PM

Why are modern movies still good but modern pop music not?

I think this is an entirely personal view. It can't be objectively measured.

On the other hand there is Sturgeon's law that states that 90% of everything is crud. I'm sure there was plenty of crappy music way back when, it's just that over time we have forgotten about it.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:20 PM

@90sAce
https://warosu.org/data/3/img/0003/97/1387411769891.jpg
What, I can't be both? :cool:

jiraffejustin

08-02-15, 09:22 PM

9 years younger than you.

But your idea of "good" is Lady Gaga right? So... yeah.

The Fame Monster has a bunch of good, fun tracks. Plus Beyonce's verse on Telephone is really awesome.

Mr Minio

08-02-15, 09:22 PM

I'd love more people to give their opinion in this thread. The original poster's intentions are pretty obvious by now, but I believe this thread has a potential and can spawn an interesting discussion.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:25 PM

The Fame Monster has a bunch good, fun tracks. Plus Beyonce's verse on Telephone is really awesome.
Thanks for the recommendation.

While I agree that there are some good tracks and albums currently going mainstream, I feel that the innovativeness is decreasing, and that many artists are simply copying the same formula as older artists.

MovieGal

08-02-15, 09:27 PM

I listen to whats out there now... and even whats currently played in Europe... and Im old!

jiraffejustin

08-02-15, 09:28 PM

Thanks for the recommendation.

While I agree that there are some good tracks and albums currently going mainstream, I feel that the innovativeness is decreasing, and that many artists are simply copying the same formula as older artists.

Innovation is at an all-time high. Not just in the way music is made, but the entire way the business side of music is handled.

Modern music is often created using "not-instrument" computers, and the stuff you can do with that technology actually provides a unique and limitless amount of possibilities. You'd just have to be open to listen to music with "no instruments."

Guaporense

08-02-15, 09:28 PM

There is a lot of good pop music being made today:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rD9MTuQLkGE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKkdR5RBK24

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:30 PM

Here's a good article explaining some of the concepts at work here:

http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2014-07-08/why-music-is-dying

Guaporense

08-02-15, 09:31 PM

Innovation is at an all-time high. Not just in the way music is made, but the entire way the business side of music is handled.

Modern music is often created using "not-instrument" computers, and the stuff you can do with that technology actually provides a unique and limitless amount of possibilities. You'd just have to be open to listen to music with "no instruments."

You can say that in North America in particular musical talent moved from rock to rap. Since I prefer rock over rap there are fewer North American stuff I like made in recent years compared to the past, however.

The decline of rock in the Anglo Saxon countries began around 1991, when Nirvana's monumental piece of garbage, Nevermind, was released. :D

Most of my favorite music comes from Europe, South America and Asia nowadays. Modern output of US+Canada is almost irrelevant for my listening.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:31 PM

There is a lot of good pop music being made today:

That's not "pop" music, that's underground music..

Pop music in the sense that I'm referring to refers to music which is currently topping the charts - singles and albums which are going gold, platinum, etc.

Not "popular music" as an entire genre.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:32 PM

The decline of rock in the Anglo Saxon countries began around 1991, when Nirvana's monumental piece of garbage, Nevermind, was released. :D
I agree with you about Nirvana and grunge starting the downfall of rock, and being responsible for all of the pop punk/emo/alternative garbage which came after it.

jiraffejustin

08-02-15, 09:32 PM

When the first thing an article is mentioning is Taylor Swift, then I don't think we are actually talking about the artistic quality of music.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:34 PM

When the first thing an article is mentioning is Taylor Swift, then I don't think we are actually talking about the artistic quality of music.
The article wasn't mentioning her as being a beacon of musical talent or quality.

Guaporense

08-02-15, 09:37 PM

That's not "pop" music, that's underground music..

Pop music in the sense that I'm referring to refers to music which is currently topping the charts - singles and albums which are going gold, platinum, etc.

Not "popular music" as an entire genre.

Ensiferum is super big in Finland. They always top the charts there.

Same thing with the Brazilian power metal band Angra, they always make the top 15 at the Oricon charts in Japan.

Or the German heavy metal bands Accept and Unisonic which made the top 10 charts in Germany in their last albums.

Neither Angra, Accept, Unisonic and Ensiferum are mainstream in the US, but they are elsewhere. So, there exists more countries in the world besides the US. You talk about the US as if the world was the US, but it is not. Should be careful when you make claims regarding music when restricted to American music and not about music in general.

In North America mainstream rock was killed simultaneously by:

1 - Bad influences (Nirvana) which lowered the artistic standards of the bands.

2 - Decline in human capital supply as musical talent moved from rock to rap.

3 - Decline in revenues as sales of albums in North America collapsed by 65% between 2001 and 2014, due to internet piracy. This decline in revenues meant that there is now a smaller market for mainstream rock bands selling millions of albums while there is now a stronger market for underground bands appealing to small niches thanks to the internet in spreading information about those underground bands.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:39 PM

You're being inconsistent here. The title clearly claims it is the modern pop music that is no longer good. All of it, mainstream or obscure.

"Pop" music in this sense is referring to music which is charting well, not to a "style" of music.

It can include any genre.

An even better question is what do music industries have to do with the quality of music nowadays? It seems to me you are only complaining about the MAINSTREAM

This should've been immediately obvious.

And it never had. Underground artists were either obscure, relatively known only to the cult followers, or worked their way to the mainstream. Same thing nowadays.

People who've lived in the industry are stating that it is harder today for artists to get major record deals unless they are already well-known (ex. on Twitter, Youtube, etc) than it was in times past

Who knows. Anyway, once again, this has very little to do with the title of this topic. You are more interested in degradation of music industry and how it promotes talentless, but money-making artists rather than really talented musicians that are not so certain money-farmers,

Correct

than the actual quality of nowadays music regardless its popularity.
I'm not interested in the quality of music which is not charting in the mainstream - my point is that it is harder for "purists" today who are truly about the art to break into the mainstream. You jumped the gun and didn't bother to read because you just assumed I was dissing your favorite music.

mark f

08-02-15, 09:40 PM

The Battle of the Century: 90sAce vs. Guaporense

Get your red hots!

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:41 PM

Ensiferum is super big in Finland. They always top the charts there.

And how many Americans have heard of them?

I'm talking about the American music industry.
Same thing with the Brazilian power metal band Angra, they always make the top 15 at the Oricon charts in Japan.

Neither Angra and Ensiferum are mainstream in the US, but they are elsewhere. So, there exists more countries in the world besides the US. You talk about the US as if the world was the US, but it is not. Should be careful when you make claims regarding music when restricted to American music and not about music in general.
Yes, i'm talking about the American music industry - I'm not aware of the state of Japan or Scandinavia's industry.

But also keep in mind that America's industry is so huge it'll inevitably help shape those of other nations, for better or worse.

Monkeypunch

08-02-15, 09:47 PM

Guaporense

08-02-15, 09:48 PM

Yes, i'm talking about the American music industry - I'm not aware of the state of Japan or Scandinavia's industry.

But also keep in mind that America's industry is so huge it'll inevitably help shape those of other nations, for better or worse.

Artists influence other artists and US metal band heavily influenced bands outside of the US when metal was popular in the US. Now metal is not popular in the US anymore but it is still strong as ever in Europe and South America, so now most metal bands there are influenced by metal bands from Europe and South America. So the lack of popularity of a genre of music in the US doesn't mean the genre will lose popularity in other countries.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:50 PM

You know, it's all subjective. Pop is garbage now, in your opinion. I grew up in the 90's, I loved all the alternative rock that came out in that era when i was a teenager, but lately, as a 40 year old man, it leaves me cold. I wonder what these people are so sad about because I'm no longer the fountain of hormonal angst that I was when it was recorded. Older music holds up more for me, Led Zeppelin, Motley Crue, The Who, Alice Cooper, Frank Zappa...all in constant rotation on my iPod.

I work in a restaurant, and we play pop music over the radio for the diners, and frankly, I like a lot of it. It's fun, something that a lot of rock just isn't. That's why it's popular, I reckon. I'd rather listen to an upbeat tune like Taylor Swift, Lady Gaga, or Meghan Trainor than some deep voiced butt-rock guy whining about something. Yes, I'm surprised by this too.
I'm not a fan of the alternative rock myself - I prefer the more brazen style of the 60s-80s.

Plus the "grunge" scene which started the whole alternative trend was just an aesthetic - not only was the music not all that great, but plenty of songs had been written prior to that dealing with profound subject matter - all "grunge" did was invent a gloomy, whiny aesthetic.

Guaporense

08-02-15, 09:50 PM

I'm not a fan of the alternative rock myself - I prefer the more brazen style of the 60s-80s.

Plus the "grunge" scene which started the whole alternative trend was just an aesthetic - not only was the music not all that great, but plenty of songs had been written prior to that dealing with profound subject matter - all "grunge" did was invent a gloomy, whiny aesthetic.

Grunge is awful.

Guaporense

08-02-15, 09:52 PM

You know, it's all subjective. Pop is garbage now, in your opinion. I grew up in the 90's, I loved all the alternative rock that came out in that era when i was a teenager, but lately, as a 40 year old man, it leaves me cold. I wonder what these people are so sad about because I'm no longer the fountain of hormonal angst that I was when it was recorded. Older music holds up more for me, Led Zeppelin, Motley Crue, The Who, Alice Cooper, Frank Zappa...all in constant rotation on my iPod.

I work in a restaurant, and we play pop music over the radio for the diners, and frankly, I like a lot of it. It's fun, something that a lot of rock just isn't. That's why it's popular, I reckon. I'd rather listen to an upbeat tune like Taylor Swift, Lady Gaga, or Meghan Trainor than some deep voiced butt-rock guy whining about something. Yes, I'm surprised by this too.

Happy pop?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBt__U37Ymc

:D

Though one problem I have with stuff like J-Pop is that it is very homogeneous and I can't listen to it for more than 15 minutes.

90sAce

08-02-15, 09:57 PM

I think the fact that Lady Gaga is being heralded as a "talented" mainstream artist is a good example of the lack of innovation.

The only thing that Gaga is is an image and a persona - her actual music is not incredibly innovative.

I think it's an example of the "hipster" mentality that anything "nonconformist" = "talented".

doubledenim

08-02-15, 10:01 PM

You guys keep an eye out for the ghost of Layne Staley tonight. :eek:

90sAce

08-02-15, 10:03 PM

You guys keep an eye out for the ghost of Layne Staley tonight. :eek:
Alice in Chains ain't bad - mainly because they weren't pure "grunge", they still kept the hard rock aesthetic and only adopted the grunge "chic".

foster

08-02-15, 10:09 PM

For some reason 90sace wants to know what I consider good pop music.
I think this is meaningless, because now we are discussing individual taste rather than observing a trend in human history.

People like the music they grew up with, for me it's the 90s. My favorite band is Bush but I'm an old person!! I'm 32.

Having said that, there are some songs that I enjoy in the current decade of pop music.
Just to humor 90sace I'll put these two songs here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CmadmM5cOk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrUvu1mlWco

Citizen Rules

08-02-15, 10:16 PM

People like the music they grew up with... That's true for me too. I kept an interest in new music until the late 90s. Now I don't know what new music sounds like.

90sAce

08-02-15, 10:20 PM

For some reason 90sace wants to know what I consider good pop music.

Whelp I was being facetious - but I think your "old people" comment is pretty superficial.

It's really not that simple - for example a lot of people claim that the "hair metal" of the 80s was a downgrade or the genre - sure some of them might've just been old geezers, but a lot of people still agree with points made there.

And for every old fart who won't listen to anything that wasn't on the radio when they were in college, there's a young whelp who won't listen to anything that isn't on Top 40 radio or itunes.

I think this is meaningless, because now we are discussing individual taste rather than observing a trend in human history.

Thing is dude, I was discussing actual trends, not just tastes. I have my own tastes and biases, but I was trying to talk about observable trends.

I was thinking specifics - such as how record labels are shying away from hiring artists who don't already have an established online fanbase, as well as how indie artists are claiming that file sharing is making it harder for them to start a career. You brushed it all of as just "old people babbling".

And a couple others here didn't read past the title, and got offended just because they thought I was saying there is "no good music in existence today... period" which is silly.

People like the music they grew up with, for me it's the 90s. My favorite band is Bush but I'm an old person!! I'm 32.

Oh Bush... well I mentioned the Offspring so I was close.

Having said that, there are some songs that I enjoy in the current decade of pop music.
Just to humor 90sace I'll put these two songs here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CmadmM5cOk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrUvu1mlWco
Thanks.

Out of curiousity though - do you really think that Taylor Swift or Miley Cyrus are musical innovators? I don't myself.

Yeah there have always been bland pop acts (ex. the Monkees compared to the Beatles or Stones) - but in my opinion the ratio of bland, to innovative and talented is decreasing due to various factors.

MovieGal

08-02-15, 10:28 PM

well Im old and I like Maroon 5

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09R8_2nJtjg

foster

08-02-15, 10:32 PM

Taylor swift writes her own songs! Yes she is an innovator.

90sAce

08-02-15, 10:35 PM

Taylor swift writes her own songs! Yes she is an innovator.
I think that Taylor Swift has talent yeah, though her music is definitely not my taste.

I don't think one's going to argue that the ratio of popular acts who don't write or even play their own instruments (in favor of synthesizers) is a lot higher than it's been in the past though.

On the other hand, I don't know what can actually be "done" about it since I think given the rise of technology it's somewhat inevitable.

Zotis

08-02-15, 10:45 PM

That's incorrect, "pop" specifically refers to music which tops the charts - not "popular" music as an entire genre.

Way to change the subject to avoid acknowledging your logical fallacies. For your information though, Pop music is a genre that originally derived it's name from "popular music" but has since evolved into it's own genre with many sub-genres.

Not compared to 7 billion. "Lot" is releative

Try making a comparison relative to the topic of conversation.

I know enough to know that "underground" music isn't a genre.

*Thunderous applause.* That is possibly the most hilarious thing I've ever heard you say. I have some sad news for you though. No one thinks that underground music is a genre. I hate to break it to you, but that right there which you think you have, is not knowledge.

That's not how it's always been. The Beatles, Aerosmith, etc were a popular bands and were critically acclaimed as innovative - like you're saying yourself there are less popular bands and artists today who are innovators, but rather just recyclers.

Actually there's more by sheer numbers. You're just vaguely over generalising.

Comparing "metal" to emo is the worst thing I've heard so far in this thread - that shows a huge lack of understanding of the genres.

I'm not sure where you got the idea that I was comparing Metal to Emo from this, "For one thing underground music has more of an effect on the overall scope of music than mainstream music, because mainstream music is just superficial rip offs of underground music, like Screamo, Emo, and Metal. You have these whiny kid's with black blow dried hair screaming into a mic thinking they're all three genres at the same time when they're really just Metalcore." Perhaps you're confusing Metalcore with Metal. Perhaps you also don't understand that I'm talking about how people will call music like Bullet for My Valentine, Emo, Screamo, and Metal when they aren't any of those three genres.

I'm not talking about "top 40" exclusively - I'm talking about music which is prevalent in the industry as a whole, including record labels.

Well you're confusing everyone with your layman speech by making up your own definition and then arguing with people. You've called bands on major labels with widely successful record sales "obscure" and "underground" just because you haven't heard of them.

I know what I'm talking about much more than you do.

That's probably true, but in far too literal a sense.

This post genuinely made me laugh out loud in my chair at work. 90'sAce, you're hilarious. You're so delusional. You're a constant source of amusement.

This thread is getting quite a pace. So I can't really keep up, and to be honest I'm losing interest. All the best of luck to everyone trying to talk some sense into this raving madman. I think he's a lost cause though.

MovieGal

08-02-15, 10:48 PM

I like how he says "old people dont listen to modern music" but I do.. and Im almost 50!

foster

08-02-15, 10:48 PM

I didn't start listening to music until I was 16 and drove to high school.
These days I mostly listen to film sound tracks, everything in my life revolves around film.

90sAce

08-02-15, 10:49 PM

You're being inconsistent here. The title clearly claims it is the modern pop music that is no longer good. All of it, mainstream or obscure.

"Pop" music is referring to music which is doing well on the charts, not to "pop" as in the specific style.

I suppose "mainstream" would've been the better word choice - I'm sorry I'm not as semantically precise as you'd have liked me to be.

It seems to me you are only complaining about the MAINSTREAM contemporary music that sucks. Yeah, a big chunk of it blows.

Exactly - I thought this was pretty obvious from the opening post - seems you only read the title, or just used it as an excuse to derail into semantics.

Pop music has long lost it's meaning as 'popular'

"Popular music" can also refer to the entirety of the genre (rock, rap, country, etc) as opposed to classical or "art" music - so it seems there's no sementics here which you would have been happy with.

Who knows. Anyway, once again, this has very little to do with the title of this topic.

I think you're aware of what the thread was about (you surmised it yourself) and are simply being pedantic with semantics.

You are more interested in degradation of music industry and how it promotes talentless, but money-making artists rather than really talented musicians that are not so certain money-farmers
Exactly. "Modern music" referring to the modern music industry.

Just as when someone in the states mentions "modern film", they're typically referring to Hollywood's film industry - not underground films recorded on a camcorder, or the Cannes film festival, or an obscure Indonesian film

foster

08-02-15, 10:49 PM

I like how he says "old people dont listen to modern music" but I do.. and Im almost 50!

Am I this mysterious he ?

Generalizations almost never apply to every individual.
The whole field of sociology is meaningless if you try to apply it to a particular person. It's only good for understanding large scale masses.

MovieGal

08-02-15, 10:52 PM

Am I this mysterious he ?

Generalizations almost never apply to every individual.
The whole field of sociology is meaningless if you try to apply it to a particular person. It's only good for understanding large scale masses.

Nope, whoever said it.. its on them.. but I think 90s referred to it as well..

I listen to modern radio play in the US and over in Europe.. so in hence, I listen to pop or "popular" music...

there are some bands I listen to that are not popular but thats good... I have 6 decades of music under my belt of what I listen to at least...

90sAce

08-02-15, 10:59 PM

Am I this mysterious he ?

Generalizations almost never apply to every individual.

If you think modern music is bad, that's because you're OLD

[/I]The whole field of sociology is meaningless if you try to apply it to a particular person. It's only good for understanding large scale masses.
Not if they ignore the actual arguments being made and claims which the arguments are based on.

Claiming "music is bad" as a blanket statement might be just nostalgia talking, but making actual points about trends in the industry is a different ballpark.

MovieGal

08-02-15, 11:01 PM

well I dont think some of the modern music is bad... there is music that plays that is not a genre I care for... others listen to ... believe me... women who have teenage daughters.. listen to what their daughters do...

I know.. I went thru Fall Out Boy, All American Rejects, From First to Last, Panic at the Disco!, Disturbed, Marilyn Manson.. etc...

MovieGal

08-02-15, 11:07 PM

Thanks guys.. I just listened to my favorite FOB song and now one of my favorite AFI songs...

Gatsby

08-03-15, 01:08 AM

90sAce

08-03-15, 01:10 AM

A few atrocious song like the one above shouldn't be the reason why mainstream music should be heavily critcized. Yes, music 2010 onward sort of sucks compared to the earlier decades in my opinion, but that's just my case, because I prefer prog rock/jazz and right now the music trend is not focused on the two. Art is subjective and will always be that way.
Yeah, it's subjective to a degree. If it was purely subjective though there'd be no reason to review movies, music, etc at all from a critical POV - since someone, somewhere will like Plan 9 from Outerspace more than Citizen Kane.

Mr Minio

08-03-15, 01:19 PM

I already said everything I wanted to say in this topic, so let me just comment on some posts:

The Battle of the Century: 90sAce vs. Guaporense

Get your red hots! Holy cow! The biggest troll currently posting on MoFo versus one of the most touchy and easy-to-get-offended MoFos!

Yes, i'm talking about the American music industry - I'm not aware of the state of Japan or Scandinavia's industry. What I love about Japanese pop is that the producers are often appreciated more than the artists. Arguably not better known, but still really appreciated. Like Yasutaka Nakata. The guy is a genius. Just look:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4znsXCH_2Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pb3IdLdIc6s

The artists are supposed to look cute (you know, KAWAI and stuff like this) and sing (often with many voice improvement tools) + make a great show live. The producer is responsible for making good music. Japanese pop is very different from American pop and K-pop (which from what I heard gives me an idea they're just copying American pop, but I'm too ignorant of the genre to actually make such statement as a whole, it applies to some artists I've heard, though).

Also lol @ 90sAce's comment on my profile.

90sAce

08-03-15, 01:28 PM

Holy cow! The biggest troll currently posting on MoFo versus one of the most touchy and easy-to-get-offended MoFos!

Case in point about you just acting like a twit. By definition you were trolling here, getting offended because I used "the wrong word" in the title even when the meaning was clear.

If "trolling" a punk like you who didn't even come to this thread for serious discussion bothers you so much, then there are therapists who are willing to listen to you - there's no reason for you to vent your grievances here on a site you're not even forced to post on, unless you're just in need of attention you aren't getting from mommy or something, or are too cheap to pay for a therapist who actually wants to listen to that.

By proper definition though bro you're a troll, since you didn't come here to discuss the subject, just to derail onto a tangent about the obscure music you like, and how "not ALL modern music is bad" - when no one was saying so to begin with. (And yes, the music you've mentioned so far is obscure by the standards of the American music industry and has never been mentioned on any of the US Billboard charts, if that offends you sorry, but it's true).

What I love about Japanese pop is that the producers are often appreciated more than the artists. Arguably not better known, but still really appreciated. Like Yasutaka Nakata. The guy is a genius. Just look:

Again you were aware I was talking about the mainstream American music industry - you said so yourself - now you're just bringing up other modern music niches so you can find something to be offended about ("Wah! 90sace said modern music is bad! But I know tons of great modern music! Wah!")

That's all your posts here amounted to you - you didn't even address any of the points mentioned, such as the effect of the internet on the music industry vs. the film industry.

You seem to me just to be one of those hipsters who gets easily offended at the mere suggestion that someone is "dissing your music", and feels the need to vent your offense loudly to the world (in spite of that being a decidedly unmanly thing to do).

Not only were you wrong about me dissing the entirety of modern music in existence, but I've seen plenty of people on this site diss music, movies and art which I like, but unlike you I don't feel the need to loudly vent my butt-hurt rather than discuss the fine points of the argument, and unlike you I'm also not so lacking in common sense to see why doing that makes a guy look like a tool. lol

Also lol @ 90sAce's comment on my profile.
Hope it struck a nerve, if so then mission accomplished.

bluedeed

08-03-15, 01:34 PM

Lol @ this thread.

>I like x
>I don't like y
>explain to me why x != y assuming my opinions are fundamental truths about the world

matt72582

08-03-15, 01:35 PM

90sAce

08-03-15, 01:36 PM

Lol @ this thread.

>I like x
>I don't like y
>explain to me why x != y assuming my opinions are fundamental truths about the world
I mentioned specific points here - such as how the rise of social media leads to artists being more likely to make record deals based on their 'online following' rather than their talent. You're free to discuss those.

If you're here just to troll like Mr. Minie because you assumed I was "bashing your music" then do it somewhere else.

90sAce

08-03-15, 01:38 PM

I went to 3 concerts last week... Neil Young, Eagles, Steely Dan - young people everywhere....

When given a chance, greatness won't be ignored. Most new movies I see are pretty bad, but you mentioned you avoided older films, which is eliminating a lot of greatness, joy that you're preventing yourself.. (I know so many people who refuse to watch B&W films, and it baffles me, for many reasons, but most importantly, because no one can give me a reason why)
I've been studying music, movies, and pop culture as part of a project - I'm toying with the idea of starting a critic or commentary business so I'm focusing primarily on entertainment which is relevant enough to be mentioned in magazines like EW.

I don't "avoid" older films just because they're old, but right now they're further back on my list as far as films to catch up on.

bluedeed

08-03-15, 01:44 PM

I mentioned specific points here - such as how the rise of social media leads to artists being more likely to make record deals based on their 'online following' rather than their talent. You're free to discuss those.

If you're here just to troll like Mr. Minie because you assumed I was "bashing your music" then do it somewhere else.

The point is that you're really starting with an answer rather than a question, even though you phrased it as one. This is all trying to reason or justify your taste in broader terms, the answer to which is almost always that you're not well versed enough Ito make that assessment. And that you misspelled my bro Mr Minio's name

EDIT: I figured out the answer, it's because 90s Ace has poor taste

90sAce

08-03-15, 01:48 PM

The point is that you're really starting with an answer rather than a question, even though you phrased it as one. This is all trying to reason or justify your taste in broader terms, the answer to which is almost always that you're not well versed enough Ito make that assessment. And that you misspelled my bro Mr Minio's name
I'm well versed enough to discuss the American Music Industry (the Billboard charts, etc).

This is what the thread was clearly about - not about Japanese, Indonesian or... Basque popular music, or music which has no chance of ever being on the Billboard Top 200 albums. I'm not aware of how Japanese popular music has changed today since the 60s, so that's a topic for another thread.

Basically you and him seem to be offended that it wasn't "all-inclusive" of the entire world, when it wasn't intended to be to begin with - it was about music which is relevant within the American corporate music industry today.

matt72582

08-03-15, 02:54 PM

Sometimes I have to watch or listen to a lot of mediocre stuff to get at the great stuff, but it's worth it! Old, new, foreign, domestic, drama, adventure, etc etc.

Mr Minio

08-03-15, 06:17 PM

Case in point about you just acting like a twit. By definition you were trolling here, getting offended because I used "the wrong word" in the title even when the meaning was clear. I like the word, twit. I got another one for you: f*ckwit. You can use it on me, if you like. I like the word.

If "trolling" a punk like you who didn't even come to this thread for serious discussion bothers you so much, then there are therapists who are willing to listen to you - there's no reason for you to vent your grievances here on a site you're not even forced to post on, unless you're just in need of attention you aren't getting from mommy or something, or are too cheap to pay for a therapist who actually wants to listen to that. So far it's you having a gigantic butthurt, so perhaps you need some help?

(And yes, the music you've mentioned so far is obscure by the standards of the American music industry and has never been mentioned on any of the US Billboard charts, if that offends you sorry, but it's true) Cool. From now on, my definition of 'obscure' is anything that has never been mentioned (or rather I never heard being mentioned) on any of my friend's Facebook page. Scorsese wasn't. Guess, he's the most obscure director now. :p

Again you were aware I was talking about the mainstream American music industry - you said so yourself - now you're just bringing up other modern music niches so you can find something to be offended about I already said everything I wanted to say about the topic... I mean your interpretation of the topic's meaning, well, I told you what you wanted to hear and I even agreed with you on this one.

That's all your posts here amounted to you - you didn't even address any of the points mentioned, such as the effect of the internet on the music industry vs. the film industry Thanks to the Internet little known artists can actually easily become famous among fans of certain genres.

You seem to me just to be one of those hipsters who gets easily offended at the mere suggestion that someone is "dissing your music" I haven't gotten offended in this thread even once. So far it's you calling me twits.

Hope it struck a nerve, if so then mission accomplished.

http://images.sodahead.com/profiles/0/0/2/4/1/7/1/2/3/unsuccessful-troll-99868790645.jpeg

I wanted to stop answering your posts, but you're so hilarious I can't stop doing it and laughing. :)

If you're here just to troll like Mr. Minie because you assumed I was "bashing your music" then do it somewhere else. This is beyond ridiculous. xDDDD Also, who the hell is Mr. Minie?

This is what the thread was clearly about - not about Japanese, Indonesian or... Basque popular music, or music which has no chance of ever being on the Billboard Top 200 albums. I'm not aware of how Japanese popular music has changed today since the 60s, so that's a topic for another thread. Oh, hold on... wait a second... you only mean American music?! WHY DIDN'T YOU PUT IT INTO THE TITLE OF THIS THREAD?!

90sAce

08-03-15, 07:08 PM

I like the word, twit. I got another one for you: f*ckwit. You can use it on me, if you like. I like the word.

So far it's you having a gigantic butthurt, so perhaps you need some help?

That's cool bro - point is you weren't here to discuss the industry, just to shoehorn in your rant about "non mainstream music" and nitpick over a single word in the title.

Cool. From now on, my definition of 'obscure' is anything that has never been mentioned (or rather I never heard being mentioned) on any of my friend's Facebook page. Scorsese wasn't. Guess, he's the most obscure director now. :p

Scorsese is influential in the industry and has won several Oscars including ones for recent films like the Departed.

Feel free to show me where the Japanese pop you mentioned is influential on the American film industry, has topped the Billboard 200 charts, has won Grammys, etc.

It's common sense. The thread was about music artists which are popular or influential on the charts and in the corporate music industry here in the West - not about "underground pop music".

I already said everything I wanted to say about the topic... I mean your interpretation of the topic's meaning, well, I told you what you wanted to hear and I even agreed with you on this one.

Thanks to the Internet little known artists can actually easily become famous among fans of certain genres.

In theory they can yeah - currently I don't see them having any huge influence on the direction the industry has been heading in - and that was one of my entire points, that the industry is becoming more commercial and considering "talent" less relevant than ability to sell singles on Itunes.

The best example someone used in this thread is Taylor Swift - and she's no Eddie Van Halen

I wanted to stop answering your posts, but you're so hilarious I can't stop doing it and laughing. :)

Aw boo hoo

Oh, hold on... wait a second... you only mean American music?! WHY DIDN'T YOU PUT IT INTO THE TITLE OF THIS THREAD?!
I mean music which is relevant in the music industry.

There are plenty of foreign artists which are relevant in the industry and have charted successful artists and singles, or have influenced trends in the mainstream industry, but obviously not the music you were talking about

Better question is, why did you assume the thread was talking about all music industries worldwide when it clearly was referring to the American industry (it even mentioned "Breaking Bad" as an analogue in the American film/TV industry).

If you ran into a guy at a bar who told you the "economy sucks" - would you assume he's talking about the US economy, or would you immediately contradict him because you think the economy of... Tanzania is doing just fine. rofl

This is beyond ridiculous. xDDDD Also, who the hell is Mr. Minie?

My bad, I meant Miss Minie

MovieGal

08-03-15, 09:51 PM

Ensiferum is super big in Finland. They always top the charts there.

you know I listen to a lot of Finnish bands and only 5% of Americans may know of them.. and the only way people here know of them.. is because of me posting them... or recommending them to people who I think will enjoy them.

90sAce

08-03-15, 10:18 PM

Europe has had some good power metal bands like Gamma Ray, it never caught on in the US like it did in Scandinavia apparently

MovieGal

08-03-15, 10:23 PM

One of the lesser known bands was "Crumbland" .. they opened for "Disturbed".. in Finland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9ni260UXjo

Edit: another band that isnt popular at all here in the US.. I would say less than 1% actually know of them... and I learned of them from a German friend at a Finnish band's forum

They are a mix of old time cinema music with rock lyrics.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ti5RnGGaR3U

ursaguy

08-03-15, 11:53 PM

90sAce

08-03-15, 11:58 PM

Music is a lot like cartoons. The ones from when you were between 7-14 are the best ever, the ones from before you were born are the overrated ones, and the ones from after you turned 21 are terrible. There's very little objective about music quality, it's mostly opinions about objective things. Rock is less prominent now than at any point since it's inception. That's a fair statement. Saying that statement is a bad thing is an opinion. In my opinion, I don't like how elements of EDM are dripping over into literally every other genre with relevance. I can't say that makes music today awful. The mid 2010s will always be better than the Right Said Fred/Vanilla Ice landscape of the early 1990s.
Thing is I can't totally say I agree with that.

I like a lot of stuff that was made before I was born better than a lot of stuff I grew up with. And there is plenty of music which I "like" but wouldn't argue is critically good (ex. the song "Get Rollin' by Limp Bizkit); as well as plenty of stuff I hate but agree has critical merit (I'm not a huge fan of the Beatles but totally respect their talent and creativity).

Plus just as some "old folks" will say anything new is "bad", plenty of young or overly idealistic folks will just say it's good because it's "new" or current; that's why so many trends get started but few of them stick for long (like Disco in the 70s for example).

Harry Lime

08-04-15, 12:06 AM

There was actually a study done on this but I forget almost everything about the paper I read except that music is getting worse every day. I'm way too lazy to search for it right now.

Miss Vicky

08-04-15, 12:21 AM

the ones from before you were born are the overrated ones.

:confused:

Most of my favorite artists made it big in the 60s and 70s. I was born in 1981.

90sAce

08-04-15, 12:22 AM

There was actually a study done on this but I forget almost everything about the paper I read except that music is getting worse every day. I'm way too lazy to search for it right now.
I think it's an example of supply and demand at work - as supply of mediocre artists increases demand for talent goes down.

Prior to the information age someone like Soulja Boy couldn't score a platinum hit just by uploading a video onto the net. (Not to mention I just learned that song was actually nominated for a Grammy - if that's not a testament to the declining standards in modern music i don't know what is, lol)

To date though I haven't heard of an A-list Hollywood actor getting discovered from a video they self-uploaded to Youtube; if Hollywood decides to turn to Youtube as a talent pool for actors or directors we might see a similar decline in film quality.

ursaguy

08-04-15, 12:33 AM

If you're mature enough to fairly look at different eras and decide for yourself what you like or don't like, regardless of trends, then my post wasn't really aimed at you. I'm talking about the majority crowds. The young people that think any band that their father has on CD is gross and the old people that hate rap for not being singing are all irrational. To people who think like that, I'm saying that it's a pretty common cycle that will never change. If you're saying things like "music now isn't as good as it was when I was a kid", there's a good chance that your parents said the same thing. Neither of you is objectively right.

Miss Vicky

08-04-15, 12:54 AM

I don't think it's really irrational to hate rap for "not being singing," if you're a fan of singing. But maybe that's just me.

"music now isn't as good as it was when I was a kid", there's a good chance that your parents said the same thing.

While I know you said that your comments aren't directed at me, I really don't think this statement is as universal as you think it is. Growing up I knew a lot of adults who were fans of the pop and rock songs that were popular in my childhood and teen years - including my mother who regularly listened to bands like Guns N Roses, Poison, U2 and INXS in the 80s and bands like Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, and R.E.M. in the 90s.

I became very interested in classic rock and began a Fleetwood Mac obsession in my mid teens (following their 1997 reunion). Thanks to the internet, I found that there were a lot of other like minded teens, though I also knew several classmates who appreciated older music as well. My interest in the older generation's music actually annoyed my mother, who actually yelled at me to "get your own music!"

ursaguy

08-04-15, 01:05 AM

I don't think it's really irrational to hate rap for "not being singing," if you're a fan of singing. But maybe that's just me.

It was a random example, but still that seems like a more personal thing. It doesn't mean that culture is degrading.

Zotis

08-04-15, 01:11 AM

I hate bowls for not being plates.

90sAce

08-04-15, 01:25 AM

I hate bowls for not being plates.
I hate tin bowls for not being platinum plates.

90sAce

08-04-15, 01:26 AM

It was a random example, but still that seems like a more personal thing. It doesn't mean that culture is degrading.
Degradation of an industry due to excessive commercialization does not automatically equate to "culture" degrading.

Frightened Inmate No. 2

08-04-15, 02:30 AM

That's not how it's always been. The Beatles, Aerosmith, etc were a popular bands and were critically acclaimed as innovative - like you're saying yourself there are less popular bands and artists today who are innovators, but rather just recyclers.

how exactly is someone like lady gaga less "innovative" than ******* aerosmith?

90sAce

08-04-15, 02:32 AM

Just out of curiosity who's the target audience for tripe like this anyway?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6j4f8cHBIM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP6XpLQM2Cs

I mean it's too racy for kids, but too annoying and stupid for adults - so it's either targeted to juvenile delinquents or emotionally retarded adults who think this is "good" - lol.

Oh and the kunt in the 1st video looks like one of the blue aliens from "Avatar" with a spray-on tan.

90sAce

08-04-15, 02:36 AM

how exactly is someone like lady gaga less "innovative" than ******* aerosmith?
Well man, even Aerosmith did actually write profound material, and the band members could actually play instruments (ex. The song "Janie's Got a Gun" deals with profound subject matter); their lyrics were also more creative.

They aren't the height of innovation but in my opinion, they're an example of how even the "pop" oriented artists used to be better in past decades.

On the flip side Lady Gaga is known for stuff like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgpQzLPWiKY

I haven't heard a Lady Gaga song that strikes me as anything special; if it weren't for her crazy videos I think she'd be forgotten amongst a million other artists who sound almost exactly the same.

Swan

08-04-15, 02:44 AM

90sAce and this forum could write a bad romance. Ra ra ah ah ah!

90sAce

08-04-15, 02:51 AM

90sAce and this forum could write a bad romance. Ra ra ah ah ah!
Even Lady Gaga is Joe Satriani compared to artists like the ones I linked above, lol

Iroquois

08-04-15, 03:20 AM

Eh, Nicki Minaj and Ke$ha are pretty tolerable as far as modern pop goes. "Stupid Hoe" at least has some abrasive personality that makes it stand out even among Minaj's more generic club raps.

Also, Aerosmith is a half-baked Rolling Stones knock-off that lost what little edge they had after the Toxic Twins got clean and they started making a comeback in the '80s so holding them up as an example of how good pop music could be is...not the best idea.

Tugg

08-04-15, 03:22 AM

While I know you said that your comments aren't directed at me, I really don't think this statement is as universal as you think it is. Growing up I knew a lot of adults who were fans of the pop and rock songs that were popular in my childhood and teen years - including my mother who regularly listened to bands like Guns N Roses, Poison, U2 and INXS in the 80s and bands like Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, and R.E.M. in the 90s.

I became very interested in classic rock and began a Fleetwood Mac obsession in my mid teens (following their 1997 reunion). Thanks to the internet, I found that there were a lot of other like minded teens, though I also knew several classmates who appreciated older music as well. My interest in the older generation's music actually annoyed my mother, who actually yelled at me to "get your own music!"
Your mother listening to music when you were a baby might have influenced your taste.

90sAce

08-04-15, 03:28 AM

Eh, Nicki Minaj and Ke$ha are pretty tolerable as far as modern pop goes. "Stupid Hoe" at least has some abrasive personality that makes it stand out even among Minaj's more generic club raps.

Bro she used "stupid hoe" as the only words of the entire chorus - and moaned "buuuutt" for an entire verse.

Oh and the song had a female using a emphasim "suck my dicK"... (well at least I thought it was a female). :eek:

Also, Aerosmith is a half-baked Rolling Stones knock-off that lost what little edge they had after the Toxic Twins got clean and they started making a comeback in the '80s so holding them up as an example of how good pop music could be is...not the best idea.
They're an example of how even a "standard" pop act of earlier eras is quite a cut above in terms of overall talent and listen-ability.

"Janie's got a Gun" definitely has a profound message - show me anything Ke$ha or Nicki Minaj have made that has an ounce of similar substance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqQn2ADZE1A

Acts like the Beatles, Stones, Jimi Hendrix, etc are better examples of raw talent and ambition, sure. But hey even Aerosmith could play instruments, and sing without the use of autotune. Elton Jonn's another example - to me he doesn't stand out in any way and I don't even care for his music, but hell at least it was music

As far as ones which are tolerable go - Taylor Swift and Lady Gaga are some of the ones I'd mention - hell even Justin Bieber and One Direction aren't "bad bad" compared to stuff like the above (not anymore than NSYNC or New Kids on the Block were).

jrs

08-04-15, 03:37 AM

Zotis

08-04-15, 03:46 AM

90'sAce, you're just looking at examples of some mainstream music that you don't like, and comparing it to music that you like. I don't see the point. So what if Aerosmith is better than Lady Ga Ga. What a pointless reason to make a thread. You just argue for the sake of arguing. Whenever someone demonstrates popular current music you just make up some reason to exclude it from your personal definition of "pop music," which is not a real definition of "pop music." At least half of the arguments in here are because you didn't properly explain your terms, and then you insulted people for not understanding you because you thought it was "obvious." Well obviously it wasn't obvious. You're so arrogant, you think people are stupid if they don't understand you, or if they don't speak in such a way that you can clearly understand them, which by the way is a double standard. And no matter what anyone "proves" to you, you just move on to the next thing to argue about like it doesn't even matter.

I wish you would just stop. It's not psychologically healthy for you to argue so much.

90sAce

08-04-15, 03:52 AM

Whenever someone demonstrates popular current music you just make up some reason to exclude it from your personal definition of "pop music," which is not a real definition of "pop music."

Take a look at how many Youtube hits the videos for your music are getting compared to "Gangnam Style" and "Anaconda"... and then see what I mean. lol

Yeah I'm aware that you probably listen to music which is better made than Nicki Minaj or Ke$sha - but apparently record labels are passing your favorite bands over in favor of dime-a-dozen acts like that.

I'd think that'd make you a little pissed and interested in how the music industry is changing instead of just wanting to argue against me.

You're so arrogant, you think people are stupid if they don't understand you, or if they don't speak in such a way that you can clearly understand them, which by the way is a double standard. And no matter what anyone "proves" to you, you just move on to the next thing to argue about like it doesn't even matter.

My second post in the thread explained what I was talking about more clearly - I used examples of notable musicians like Slash and Gene Simmons who are venting similar sentiments.

So yeah personally I think the point was made. Just because someone somewhere is still listening to disco doesn't mean "Disco is dead" is a false statement. I made it clear I was talking about problems in the modern industry, not "all of music in existence".

Iroquois

08-04-15, 03:56 AM

Bro she used "stupid hoe" as the only words of the entire chorus - and moaned "buuuutt" for an entire verse.

Oh and the song had a female using a emphasim "suck my dicK"... (well at least I thought it was a female). :eek:

Are you referring to the bit where it's all "I wish I wish I wish a bitch wouuuuuuuuuuuld"? Besides, she's hardly the first person to do entire choruses consisting of song titles. Also, please try to provide criticism that doesn't resort to transphobia.

They're an example of how even a "standard" pop act of earlier eras is quite a cut above in terms of overall talent and listen-ability.

"Janie's got a Gun" definitely has a profound message - show me anything Ke$ha or Nicki Minaj have made that has an ounce of similar substance.

You asked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-t0_5cfrDyk

Much like "Janie's Got a Gun", it's a song about a young woman reacting to the violent behaviour of an abusive father (though there are sufficient differences). It's also got a soulful R&B groove that's far removed from the abrasive nature of "Stupid Hoe", so it also shows that Minaj has more versatility than her outsized hot-pink aesthetic might suggest.

Acts like the Beatles, Stones, Jimi Hendrix, etc are better examples of raw talent and ambition, sure. But hey even Aerosmith could play instruments, and sing without the use of autotune. Elton Jonn's another example - to me he doesn't stand out in any way and I don't even care for his music, but hell at least it was music

As far as ones which are tolerable go - Taylor Swift and Lady Gaga are some of the ones I'd mention - hell even Justin Bieber and One Direction aren't "bad bad" compared to stuff like the above (not anymore than NSYNC or New Kids on the Block were).

Even Nickelback can play instruments and sing without the use of AutoTune, so I don't see how that's such a big deal when it comes to making music that is more authentic or inherently superior to synthesised work.

One Direction is definitely tolerable, Bieber not so much.

jrs

08-04-15, 03:58 AM

At least Lady Gaga is going to be in American Horror Story: Hotel. Kudos for her. Plus she has style and flair (aside from the meat dress and such). Plus she is talented, a heck of good dresser away from the stage and she can be really funny. Her comedic style is absolutely hilarious, especially when she's on SNL.

Frightened Inmate No. 2

08-04-15, 04:15 AM

jrs

08-04-15, 04:17 AM

Nothing beats 80's music.:cool:

Frightened Inmate No. 2

08-04-15, 04:19 AM

it's also best not to use evidence from noted arrogant a$$hole gene simmons.

jrs

08-04-15, 04:20 AM

it's also best not to use evidence from noted arrogant a$$hole gene simmons.

http://images1.villagevoice.com/imager/u/original/6513263/zcrissx.jpg

90sAce

08-04-15, 04:23 AM

obviously you hate modern pop music and there's nothing we can say to change that, but i don't see why you care so much. people are going to like what they like, and taylor swift, lady gaga, carly rae jepsen etc. make well-written and well-produced songs that resonate with people and are catchy. just because they don't have guitar solos doesn't mean it isn't quality music, and at some point not being a competent instrumentalist shouldn't be enough to disqualify you from being talented. there's so much easily-accessible and often innovative stuff out there being released all the time that can suit any taste, so there's really no reason to get worked up about the state of modern pop music, unless of course you just want to feel superior to the mentally-inferior masses, and believe me, two years ago i felt that exact same way.
I don't hate the entirety of modern pop music, just the trend I see it going in (Cee Lo Green, and J Cole are a couple fairly recent pop artists that I like for example).

I mean, hypothetically what if the film industry did away with actors entirely and made films only in CGI - would you be okay with that?

Basically I see the modern music industry going too capitalist - even Award shows like the Grammys seem to care more about how much the artist sells more than anything thing else (how else would "Crank That" by Souljia Boy have been a Grammy nominee - especially when you compare that to rappers like Tupac or Biggie).

jrs

08-04-15, 04:26 AM

Just curious, is there any link between modern movies and modern pop music here? Or is this just an argument about music?

90sAce

08-04-15, 04:30 AM

Are you referring to the bit where it's all "I wish I wish I wish a bitch wouuuuuuuuuuuld"? Besides, she's hardly the first person to do entire choruses consisting of song titles. Also, please try to provide criticism that doesn't resort to
transphobia.

Uh oh, the PC Police are coming for me.

Plus you're not saying she actually is a tranny are you? I was joking at how little sense the lyrics made and basically implied herself that she's a tranny. It'd be the equivalent of a male rapper saying "eat my p$ssy". Even a figure of speech is supposed to make a little bit of sense.

You asked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-t0_5cfrDyk

That's suprisingly decent. Guess which one has about 10X the views of the other though.

Plus if I wasn't fortunate for you to share that with me, there would've been no way in hell I'd have bought the album based off of "Stupid Hoe" or "Anaconda" alone.

So a legitimate point is still being made, since I'd bet the majority of people who've downloaded "Stupid Hoe" on Itunes have never bothered to listen to her full length album. Back in the day before digital downloads you had to buy the entire album; nowadays this isn't the case, so this could play an interesting role on the industry's future.

90sAce

08-04-15, 04:32 AM

Just curious, is there any link between modern movies and modern pop music here? Or is this just an argument about music?
I was just comparing the two industries and theorizing why in my humble opinion, the music industry is becoming more medicore while the film and TV industry are still remaining decent - hell maybe even becoming more innovative in a lot of ways with shows like Mad Men, the Sopranos, etc

jrs

08-04-15, 04:38 AM

Uh oh, the PC Police are coming for me.

https://uproxx.files.wordpress.com/2013/02/gta-4-toystory-woody-2.gif?w=650

Frightened Inmate No. 2

08-04-15, 04:47 AM

I don't hate the entirety of modern pop music, just the trend I see it going in (Cee Lo Green, and J Cole are a couple fairly recent pop artists that I like for example).

I mean, hypothetically what if the film industry did away with actors entirely and made films only in CGI - would you be okay with that?

Basically I see the modern music industry going too capitalist - even Award shows like the Grammys seem to care more about how much the artist sells more than anything thing else (how else would "Crank That" by Souljia Boy have been a Grammy nominee - especially when you compare that to rappers like Tupac or Biggie).

the music industry has always been like this though. journey didn't become popular because they're such talented musicians or whatever, it was because they wrote catchy songs that people could sing along to. same thing with dozens of popular artists from the past. just look at what some of the most popular songs of the 80s were that played on the radio and tell me they had "depth." then of course there was disco, which i've never cared for, but there's hardly any more artistry in that then there is in lady gaga. there was never a time when the music industry wasn't going to go with the thing that would sell the best. besides, with the internet you can get whatever you want so there is always going to be good stuff out there no matter how capitalist the music industry gets.

also, beck won album of the year at the grammys last year for a slow and contemplative and decidedly non-commercial album, and the grammys have never been relevant anyway and get less relevant every year.

Iroquois

08-04-15, 04:51 AM

I mean, hypothetically what if the film industry did away with actors entirely and made films only in CGI - would you be okay with that?

Even at the absolute lowest quality of both mediums, at the end of the day it'd still be easier to pick up a camera and aim it at real people rather than go through the effort needed to render an entire film in CGI.

Uh oh, the PC Police are coming for me.

Plus you're not saying she actually is a tranny are you? I was joking at how little sense the lyrics made and basically implied herself that she's a tranny. It'd be the equivalent of a male rapper saying "eat my p$ssy". Even a figure of speech is supposed to make a little bit of sense.

Whether she is or not is irrelevant. Granted, Minaj herself is at fault. A lot of her work features thematic content derived from her becoming a breakout female star in a male-dominated genre like rap (that's the whole point of "Anaconda", where she basically appropriates "Baby Got Back" in order to make a point about objectification, but with lines like that in "Stupid Hoe" she does kind of shoot herself in the foot.

That's suprisingly decent. Guess which one has about 10X the views of the other though.

Plus if I wasn't fortunate for you to share that with me, there would've been no way in hell I'd have bought the album based off of "Stupid Hoe" or "Anaconda" alone.

So a legitimate point is still being made, since I'd bet the majority of people who've downloaded "Stupid Hoe" on Itunes have never bothered to listen to her full length album. Back in the day before digital downloads you had to buy the entire album; nowadays this isn't the case, so this could play an interesting role on the industry's future.

Well, you did just ask me to find a song of a similar level of profundity and artistic merit. The question didn't say it had to be a hit, but I guess that's on the powers that be who decided not to make it a single.

I was just comparing the two industries and theorizing why in my humble opinion, the music industry is becoming more medicore while the film and TV industry are still remaining decent - hell maybe even becoming more innovative in a lot of ways with shows like Mad Men, the Sopranos, etc

It's fundamentally far too difficult to accurately compare both industries since TV is dedicated to playing a long game over the course of many episodes and seasons whereas music is much more ephemeral and omnipresent. Also, if we're talking about popular music in particular then it'd make more sense to compare it to shows that are also fundamentally lightweight and wide-aiming such as The Big Bang Theory or The X-Factor.

Frightened Inmate No. 2

08-04-15, 05:00 AM

also, the movie equivalent of modern pop music would have to be the huge cgi blockbusters that you seem to have a problem with anyway. someone like paul thomas anderson or quentin tarantino or whoever your idea of a good modern director is (and i have no idea what your film taste is) would be the equivalent of arcade fire or radiohead, who aren't really top 40 artists.

90sAce

08-04-15, 05:32 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pn1VGytzXus

Obvious rip-off of South Park:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-efxJ_XVht8

Zotis

08-04-15, 05:54 AM

Take a look at how many Youtube hits the videos for your music are getting compared to "Gangnam Style" and "Anaconda"... and then see what I mean. lol

Yeah I'm aware that you probably listen to music which is better made than Nicki Minaj or Ke$sha - but apparently record labels are passing your favorite bands over in favor of dime-a-dozen acts like that.

I'd think that'd make you a little pissed and interested in how the music industry is changing instead of just wanting to argue against me.

My second post in the thread explained what I was talking about more clearly - I used examples of notable musicians like Slash and Gene Simmons who are venting similar sentiments.

So yeah personally I think the point was made. Just because someone somewhere is still listening to disco doesn't mean "Disco is dead" is a false statement. I made it clear I was talking about problems in the modern industry, not "all of music in existence".I don't see what my music has to do with anything. And if your second post in the thread explained what you were talking about more clearly, it obviously wasn't clearly enough to avoid a stream of pointless arguments based on misunderstandings.

90sAce

08-04-15, 05:56 AM

I don't see what my music has to do with anything.
Record labels aren't investing as much time and energy in musicians who play instruments and are really "in it for the art"

http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/slash-comments-on-gene-simmons-rock-is-dead-remark/

Zotis

08-04-15, 07:03 AM

Record labels aren't investing as much time and energy in musicians who play instruments and are really "in it for the art"

http://www.blabbermouth.net/news/slash-comments-on-gene-simmons-rock-is-dead-remark/Okay, well you confused me by bringing my music into it. I thought you were trying to make some point about my music specifically, and I couldn't wrap my mind around why you'd want to do that.

ash_is_the_gal

08-04-15, 01:40 PM

Acts like the Beatles, Stones, Jimi Hendrix, etc are better examples of raw talent and ambition, sure. But hey even Aerosmith could play instruments, and sing without the use of autotune.i don't see why the ability to play instruments should be where the line is drawn on who has 'real' talent - what about Michael Jackson, Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey to name a few? these are all huge examples of huge talents who have had enormous influence on pop music. none of them play any instruments, but they were performers with huge sets and dance routines, much like Lady Gaga, Beyonce, Katy Perry, or Taylor Swift, really. and regardless of whether or not auto tunes was used in older music, i think basically everyone knows that studio albums are often smoothed over and edited when need be. which is why sometimes people complain about seeing a live performance vs. listening to the album at home. how is that really any different?

I'd bet the majority of people who've downloaded "Stupid Hoe" on Itunes have never bothered to listen to her full length album. Back in the day before digital downloads you had to buy the entire album; nowadays this isn't the case, so this could play an interesting role on the industry's future.

listening to a song you like on YouTube is kinda similar to when people used to mainly listen to all the popular songs that came on the radio - it was a jumping off point to hear the most popular songs that were being played over and over again. do you really think that if someone is a fan of Nicki Minaj and Anaconda, they really never will bother to check out her other music? that's just silly. kids today are just as into listening to music and exploring their favorite artists as they were back in the 60s or whatever. i don't see why technology would change that. i know that when i find a song i really like by someone, one of the first things i do is check out their other stuff. i don't think you're giving people enough credit here.

donniedarko

08-04-15, 01:49 PM

J cole is a pop artist?

Pussy Galore

08-04-15, 02:29 PM

I've not read all the thread, but I think what you are criticing is more society than music since you refer to pop as the music that tops the charts. Why do you think Lady Gaga, Nicki Minaj, One Direction, etc. tops the charts it's because people listen to them, the popular singers are the products of their environment of their society, they produce what they think will be liked by the fans. In the 60's people loved The Beatles, it was the time, it was what the Young people, the ''hip'' ones used to listen to. As for films, it is the same you are just more knowledgeable of it. The movies that are more mainstream, that make more money are total ****, if you search I'm sure you'll find some Fincher, Wong Kar Wai, Woody Allen or Christopher Nolan of music, but they aren't pop.

matt72582

08-04-15, 03:08 PM

90sAce

08-04-15, 03:55 PM

J cole is a pop artist?
He has charted singles on pop radio. That by definition makes him one in my book. The "genre" isn't imporant

90sAce

08-04-15, 03:58 PM

I think technology took a lot of the humanity out. It's not really art when you have a bunch of automated machines to do all the work. If you need "auto-tune" because you can't hit the correct note, well, you know where we're at.

As for film, it's become so formulaic. Put this star, with a star from another industry, and you get x amount of dollars. Special effects instead of great writing; car chases, softcore porn, blood and guts, very silly and redundant.

I guess it doesn't surprise me that the movies from 40+ years still resonate with people, they still top every "Greatest Movies" lists, and they had such little technology... I think part of this is the culture, blind compulsive greed.. I think the 80's had the biggest drop-off in all forms of arts, entertainment, politics, etc etc...
I think it's being marketed to a young demographic today.

Back before the internet a kid would have to actually get his parents to take him to the store and buy the CD/Casette - so I think they were more concerned with making it both appealing to adults.

Today the "middleman" has been eliminated and they can market directly to kids. who can just download anything the want on Itunes or stream it on Youtube or Spotify.

ash_is_the_gal

08-05-15, 10:20 AM

i don't see why the ability to play instruments should be where the line is drawn on who has 'real' talent - what about Michael Jackson, Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey to name a few? these are all huge examples of huge talents who have had enormous influence on pop music. none of them play any instruments, but they were performers with huge sets and dance routines, much like Lady Gaga, Beyonce, Katy Perry, or Taylor Swift, really. and regardless of whether or not auto tunes was used in older music, i think basically everyone knows that studio albums are often smoothed over and edited when need be. which is why sometimes people complain about seeing a live performance vs. listening to the album at home. how is that really any different?

listening to a song you like on YouTube is kinda similar to when people used to mainly listen to all the popular songs that came on the radio - it was a jumping off point to hear the most popular songs that were being played over and over again. do you really think that if someone is a fan of Nicki Minaj and Anaconda, they really never will bother to check out her other music? that's just silly. kids today are just as into listening to music and exploring their favorite artists as they were back in the 60s or whatever. i don't see why technology would change that. i know that when i find a song i really like by someone, one of the first things i do is check out their other stuff. i don't think you're giving people enough credit here.
i'm quoting myself here because you conveniently didn't respond to it, 90sAce. shall i assume you've changed your stance and are in agreement with me then?

;)

Guaporense

08-06-15, 09:40 PM

Guaporense

08-06-15, 09:43 PM

Music is a lot like cartoons. The ones from when you were between 7-14 are the best ever, the ones from before you were born are the overrated ones, and the ones from after you turned 21 are terrible.

As a hardcore fan of both music and cartoons I would say that about 90% of my favorite music is from before I was 7 and most of my favorite cartoons are from either after I was 14 or before I was 7.

Though I guess what you say is mostly true for more casual listeners of music or watchers of cartoons.

honeykid

08-07-15, 08:52 AM

This whole thread is based on the lie that modern movies are still good.

ash_is_the_gal

08-07-15, 01:15 PM

This whole thread is based on the lie that modern movies are still good.I'm seriously about to start reading everything you say when you talk about films in Eeyore's voice.

90sAce

08-08-15, 12:26 AM

i'm quoting myself here because you conveniently didn't respond to it, 90sAce. shall i assume you've changed your stance and are in agreement with me then?

;)
Nah I'm saying that I feel there's an over-abundance of medicore music on the airwaves today, not that talented artists don't exist.

I think it's easier today for artists with less talent to get noticed via the internet, and the advent of digital downloads means that music is being produced in greater abundance with a younger demographic as the primary target audience, hence it's becoming more commercialized and about "selling catchy singles" than about talent - since a 13 year old with Itunes isn't very hard to please.

90sAce

08-08-15, 12:52 AM

Here's another doozie.

90 lb hipster chick trying to act "gangsta" - I seriously thought this was a joke at first but apparently it's for real - this makes Vanilla Ice look badass in comparison.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WJFjXtHcy4

90sAce

08-08-15, 12:55 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfVsfOSbJY0

A few atrocious songs (that shouldn't have become popular anways,I call it the Yotube effect) like the one above shouldn't be the reason why mainstream music should be heavily critcized. Yes, music 2010 onward sort of sucks compared to the earlier decades in my opinion, but that's just my case, because I prefer prog rock/jazz and right now the music trend is not focused on the two. Art is subjective and will always be that way.
That song is bad, yeah I agree - lol :p

But that was actually an indie track which just happened to go viral on Youtube; what sucks is that we have mult-million dollar record companies producing tracks just as bad or worse than this, and managing to sell millions of downloads on Itunes nonetheless

Guaporense

08-11-15, 07:31 PM

This whole thread is based on the lie that modern movies are still good.

Indeed. Good Hollywood movies were all made between 1968 and 1991. :sick:

Guaporense

08-11-15, 07:39 PM

The decline of American music market:

https://musicbusinessresearch.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/figure-5-the-recorded-music-market-in-the-us-2000-20131.png

And note that it's not corrected for inflation and for the increasing population of the US: revenues of the music market declined from 17 billion in 2013 dollars to 6.4 billion. Since population increased by more than 10% per capita expenditures on music collapsed by like 70%.

The same decline occurred all across the world thanks to internet downloading. Though in Japan the decline was smaller than in the US, still significant.

As result since the year 2000 there was a decline of the "super artist" that means those super famous bands who sell hundreds of millions of albums are not emerging anymore: So bands like Led Zeppelin, AC/DC and Pink Floyd which sold over 200 million records are not appearing anymore. Who is the biggest music icon of the West of recent years? Taylor Swift, how many records she sold? 40 million. That's nothing!

90sAce

08-25-15, 06:30 AM

Iroquois

08-25-15, 06:57 AM

And what has she put out other than 100 different singles about her ex-boyfriends? :D

Every major single off 1989? "Blank Space" in particular is supposed to criticise the media and people who stereotype her as "the woman who sings about all her exes".

90sAce

08-25-15, 06:59 AM

Every major single off 1989? "Blank Space" in particular is supposed to criticise the media and people who stereotype her as "the woman who sings about all her exes".
Didn't think you were a Swift fan - thought you were more of a Buddy Holly type.

90sAce

08-26-15, 05:48 AM

i honestly think that if some folks had been born in the 70s they'd be saying disco is the "best music ever" and that "only old people" disagree :)

Iroquois

08-26-15, 05:53 AM

Didn't think you were a Swift fan - thought you were more of a Buddy Holly type.

I'm a lot of things.

Zotis

08-29-15, 03:43 AM

This is for you 90'sAce.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcmylxQ0ma4

90sAce

08-29-15, 08:50 AM

This is for you 90'sAce.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcmylxQ0ma4
Thing is I "grew up" with the same styles of music as everyone else listened to - but when I discovered the "older stuff" I enjoyed it more.

So it's not just bias toward "what I grew up with" - I really prefer a lot of the styles (especially rock) of the 80s, 70s, to the styles which became popular starting in the 90s and on into the 2000s and beyond.

Zotis

08-29-15, 10:49 PM

^You just don't get it.

Guaporense

08-30-15, 05:41 PM

I actually agree with 90's Ace that it's true mainstream British-American music has declined. It's actually a consensus among many people and economic evidence supports that hypothesis: Per capita expenditures on music in the US was around 40-60 dollars from 1970 up to 2000, after 2000 it collapsed from 60 dollars to 20 dollars. As a result major rock/pop groups emerged in smaller quantities after 2000.

bluedeed

08-30-15, 06:05 PM

You're not suggesting that this is a reason though, are you? Because the number of movies made per year by Hollywood is continually dropping as well. There's a splintering of markets right now, between TV, Movies, Music, and hugely the Internet.

Guaporense

08-31-15, 03:03 PM

However movies box office revenues have not declined at least not like the collapse from 2000 to 2014 in music, declining by almost 70%.

Well, in Japan in the 1960's and early 1970's movie box office revenues also declined by an even greater magnitude (like 75%) due to the explosion of manga and TV. But in the US the movie industry never had such hard hit.

Sir Toose

08-31-15, 03:12 PM

There are flashes of good music out there (good as defined by my taste anyway). Having grown up in the 70's, I can say that there seems to be a lot more music out there in comparison. I have to sift through lots more of what I don't like to find what I do like.

I think it's the same with movies. I'm sure some MoFo statistician will correct me but it seems like I can't keep up with modern releases.

-KhaN-

08-31-15, 03:32 PM

Saying modern music in general is bad is not objective. What is modern? Something made in last few years? Or something that has that new vibe to it? Or both? Because Ice Cube, still makes music, is he modern then? Hell no. But then again, when I see what kind of idiots are getting famous ... Auto-tune, stupid lyrics, teen boys with more make-up then girls... I mean Justin Biber and stuff, its depressing and pathetic, but thanks to God, that ain't everything, every period in time had good and bad, every.

For me as rap fan, these times are not even close to what came before, but there are still gems out there.