Vive la résistance!

[Django]

Vive la résistance!

Let's hear it for the French Resistance to Bush's right-wing militant agenda!

:D :yup:

[Naisy]

What the hell is this thread for may I ask? Is there a point? an issue or even anything to discuss, im sorry I pled ignorance and can honestly say I dont know whats going on here.

[Revenge of Mr M]

No point, he just feels like showing himself up

[Yoda]

Originally posted by Naisy
What the hell is this thread for may I ask? Is there a point? an issue or even anything to discuss, im sorry I pled ignorance and can honestly say I dont know whats going on here.It's here to speak out against America's ham-fisted, imperialistic agenda. :rolleyes:

[Caitlyn]

I think this thread is about as asinine as the uproar over the word “French fry”..... :rolleyes:

[Steve]

Hear hear! In every anti-Bush march from here on out, we should replace 'American' with the much more noble qualifier 'French' to everything. So now instead of calling it American football, it's French football. Who's up for an All-French Burger at Friday's?

Blah.:sick:

[Danger Diabolik]

Originally posted by Caitlyn
I think this thread is about as asinine as the uproar over the word “French fry”..... :rolleyes:

So is the attitude that the French are taking with the world.

I won't rant incoherently,
but I have a lot to say about France, Germany and Russia,
and whether anyone here takes it as a rant, or not, it's your opinion, and you're entitled to it.

The latest NON-aggressive proposal (NON-aggressive, people) by the U.S. and Britian was rejected by France without even looking at it. What does that tell you about the French and how ignorant they really are? They didn't even read it or look at it, they just rejected it. If that dosen't spell ignorant, what does?

France and their singleminded ignorance is the problem, NOT the United States and Britian. We bend over backward for them and they still give us their wine and cheese covered middle finger.

And Germany and Russia have their own agendas:

Basically, the countries opposing the US: France, Germany
and Russia, have always been enemies, but they are using
this opportunity to band together and get back at America for toppling their regimes in the past. And if there is ANY nation who has no right to criticize the U.S. about aggression, it is Germany.
( I don't think I need to explain this one folks.)

It's not about OIL, it's not about INNOCENT CIVILIANS, it's a chance for 3 traditional European enemies to take down their common enemy (the US) so they can continue their old world bickering that led to WW1 and 2.

Do you think that they really give a **** about each other
outside the UN? No...if America isolated Europe after WW2, and NATO and the UN never existed, Europe would STILL be in flames because of the old world imperialist attitude that there can only be one master of all the countries of Europe.

So think about this the next time you agree with France, Germany or Russia-they have alterior motives bent on suiting their OWN needs, while feeding the world a cover story about their concern for human rights and innocent civilians.

And yes, I still think that Saddam and Bin Laden have to die. The world does NOT have to bend to the will of every terrorist, or terrorist supporter, who thinks that the world is going to bend to his or her will every time they strap a bomb onto their back or smash jetliners into American landmarks...

[Django]

The point I'm making here is that the French, by opposing Bush's push for a war in Iraq, are making a stand against right-wing militancy, in the same way that the French Resistance fought against the Nazi occupational forces during WWII.

[MyRobotSuit]

.

[Django]

What's that supposed to be? An Adolf Hitler Barbie doll?

LOL! :D

[The Silver Bullet]

Your threads suck.

[Piddzilla]

Originally posted by Django
The point I'm making here is that the French, by opposing Bush's push for a war in Iraq, are making a stand against right-wing militancy, in the same way that the French Resistance fought against the Nazi occupational forces during WWII.

You are aware of that Chirac himself is a right-wing militant, I hope. Let me remind you that he was the mind behind France's atomic bomb tests in the 90's and that he's these days fraternising with dictators like Mugabe at the same time that he claims to be a peace dove. He was also the one closing the deals with Saddam in the 90's, selling Mirage planes, among a lot of other things.

Chirac is just the type of guy who would fit into the Vichy government during the german occupation in WWII. An opportunist.

[The Silver Bullet]

It is important to note that Chirac is not all for peace, but is all for making France an important political force again.

[Django]

Originally posted by Piddzilla


You are aware of that Chirac himself is a right-wing militant, I hope. Let me remind you that he was the mind behind France's atomic bomb tests in the 90's and that he's these days fraternising with dictators like Mugabe at the same time that he claims to be a peace dove. He was also the one closing the deals with Saddam in the 90's, selling Mirage planes, among a lot of other things.

Chirac is just the type of guy who would fit into the Vichy government during the german occupation in WWII. An opportunist.

Maybe so, but if Chirac is an opportunist, he is only opportunizing on the majority of opinion in his own country. The French people as a whole are opposed to this war--and not only the French--the opposition to the war is a global phenomenon. People everywhere--average, ordinary people--are demonstrating in opposition to the war. Even in the US!

[Caitlyn]

And Saddam Hussein is sitting back laughing his ass off at all of them plotting his next manipulative move…

[Beale the Rippe]

Originally posted by Django
The point I'm making here is that the French, by opposing Bush's push for a war in Iraq, are making a stand against right-wing militancy, in the same way that the French Resistance fought against the Nazi occupational forces during WWII.

Maybe you've been asleep during all of this Django, but the reason the French is opposing us and our war is becuase they have huge money tied up in Saddams oil. They are afraid that if we kick Saddam out, they will loose money. I can't really blame them, becuase, although what they are doing is morally wrong, their economy demands it. I remember stating this earlier, but heres it goes again. Everyone always accuses this war of being over the oil. Well maybe it is, I don't know, I'm not Bush. But whatever were doing for gain, France is doing 10 times that. The "French Resistance" as you put it is their to cover their own corruption, not stand against the right. But enough of that.

You aren't comparing conservatives to Nazis are you?

Another thing is that durnig WWII the French had a little system of appeasment. They appeased Hitler as opposed to attempt to stop him. They didn't see him as much of a threat. Mistake. They invaded France anyway, and THEN there was a French resistance. Frances incompetant system of appeasment caused the deaths of many people, including millions of Jews that they paved the way for to be slaughtered. (Not to say that France intended this, but had they tryed to stop them...the results might've been different).

I don't mind your liberal posts Django, but at least get your facts straight. There are several valid things you could complain about or compliment instead of this "French Resistance" crap. ;)

[Yoda]

I'm gonna Ziggy a movie line here and make it my own:

"The greatest trick Saddam ever pulled was convincing France his warheads didn't exist."

[Beale the Rippe]

LMAO..(or LOL whichever you prefer)!:laugh:

[The Silver Bullet]

I disagree. I am sure that France do know his warheads exist. But I think that they think they can kill two birds with one stone and not have a war, and be a relevent political power again, by opposing the war. I do think that they have the right to oppose it though, whatever their motives. But to say that France is stupid. Or to call France and Germany Old Europe just because they disagree with American policy [does that make me Old Clayfield? Or what?] is wrong.

[Beale the Rippe]

I think Yoda was only kidding, and I love the Usual Suspects joke.

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe


Maybe you've been asleep during all of this Django, but the reason the French is opposing us and our war is becuase they have huge money tied up in Saddams oil. They are afraid that if we kick Saddam out, they will loose money. I can't really blame them, becuase, although what they are doing is morally wrong, their economy demands it. I remember stating this earlier, but heres it goes again. Everyone always accuses this war of being over the oil. Well maybe it is, I don't know, I'm not Bush. But whatever were doing for gain, France is doing 10 times that. The "French Resistance" as you put it is their to cover their own corruption, not stand against the right. But enough of that.

You aren't comparing conservatives to Nazis are you?



And I don't recall calling France any names. I said their actions were not moral, but I also said how I understand why they are doing this. I think their country NEEDS it. It doen't make it right though. I also said that France was incompetant during parts of WW2, because they were. (You may have been talking to someone else though).

[Django]

Originally posted by Caitlyn
And Saddam Hussein is sitting back laughing his ass off at all of them plotting his next manipulative move…
Caitlyn, baby, you give Saddam Hussein way too much credit! I seriously doubt that he's capable of the sort of manipulation you attribute to him. If anyone is doing the manipulating, it's Bush and his cronies.

[Django]

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

Maybe you've been asleep during all of this Django, but the reason the French is opposing us and our war is becuase they have huge money tied up in Saddams oil. They are afraid that if we kick Saddam out, they will loose money. I can't really blame them, becuase, although what they are doing is morally wrong, their economy demands it. I remember stating this earlier, but heres it goes again. Everyone always accuses this war of being over the oil. Well maybe it is, I don't know, I'm not Bush. But whatever were doing for gain, France is doing 10 times that. The "French Resistance" as you put it is their to cover their own corruption, not stand against the right. But enough of that.
Yeah, everybody's doing this for the oil! The French govt. is doing it to protect their oil interests and Bush is doing it to protect his oil interests. The difference is that Bush is willing to go to war and massacre thousands of people, not to mention cripple the US economy, to protect his oil interests. The French, at least, are voicing opposition to Bush's militancy and are expressing the voice of good conscience as a result.

To accuse the French, blandly, of corruption with the same breath that you use to defend Bush is so ludicrous that it defies comprehension! :rolleyes:

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

You aren't comparing conservatives to Nazis are you?
Yes, frankly, I am! The Nazis were militant right-wing bastards--so's Bush and his gang.

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

Another thing is that durnig WWII the French had a little system of appeasment. They appeased Hitler as opposed to attempt to stop him. They didn't see him as much of a threat. Mistake. They invaded France anyway, and THEN there was a French resistance. Frances incompetant system of appeasment caused the deaths of many people, including millions of Jews that they paved the way for to be slaughtered. (Not to say that France intended this, but had they tryed to stop them...the results might've been different).
If anyone had a "little system of appeasement", it was the British. What you say applies to the British, not the French. The British tried to appease Hitler--in fact Edward IV of England, after abdicating his throne, even cut a deal with Hitler to restore him to the throne. But what ensued was the Battle of Britain, in which the British learned, to their regret, that Hitler was a con-man extraordinaire. The French were certainly not appeasing the Germans, as far as I know. They had been on opposite sides of the fence in WWI and were rival colonial powers in Africa. However, Hitler ended up occupying France and that's what led to the "French Resistance".

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

I don't mind your liberal posts Django, but at least get your facts straight. There are several valid things you could complain about or compliment instead of this "French Resistance" crap. ;)
No, Beale, YOU get YOUR facts straight! I respect your insights, but you really need to consider the facts before making your comments! :yup:

[Beale the Rippe]

Originally posted by Django

Yeah, everybody's doing this for the oil! The French govt. is doing it to protect their oil interests and Bush is doing it to protect his oil interests. The difference is that Bush is willing to go to war and massacre thousands of people, not to mention cripple the US economy, to protect his oil interests. The French, at least, are voicing opposition to Bush's militancy and are expressing the voice of good conscience as a result.

To accuse the French, blandly, of corruption with the same breath that you use to defend Bush is so ludicrous that it defies comprehension! :rolleyes:


Yes, frankly, I am! The Nazis were militant right-wing bastards--so's Bush and his gang.


If anyone had a "little system of appeasement", it was the British. What you say applies to the British, not the French. The British tried to appease Hitler--in fact Edward IV of England, after abdicating his throne, even cut a deal with Hitler to restore him to the throne. But what ensued was the Battle of Britain, in which the British learned, to their regret, that Hitler was a con-man extraordinaire. The French were certainly not appeasing the Germans, as far as I know. They had been on opposite sides of the fence in WWI and were rival colonial powers in Africa. However, Hitler ended up occupying France and that's what led to the "French Resistance".


No, Beale, YOU get YOUR facts straight! I respect your insights, but you really need to consider the facts before making your comments! :yup:

Comments Galore:

I completely retract my statement that Bush may be doing this for the oil. I dont know what I was thinking. I know 100% that this isn't becuase of oil on our side. Do you know why Django? Do you know how much oil we get from Saddam? What would we gain? Answer this one quickly please. I'll comment when you've either given me a correct answer or proven how uninformed you are.

To compare the right wing to nazis (I won't dignify that group with a capital letter) shows a complete lack of sophistication with regard to politics. That's a label that liberals slap on people almost as often as they raise the spectre of racism. When all else fails in an argument, call someone a nazi or a racist and sit back in your smugness. This is really pretty funny. I always try to respect the other side's opinion. I have never compared liberals to nazis or other dispicable groups. The Bush administration has never started a holocaust, and to say that they could would be insanity. Not cool Django

War has a history of being beneficial to the economy Django. Take the Great Depression for example.

On the French issue, I think you should get past the WWII issues and get a bit better informed about the current situation. Appeasement was not the best word to use. It should have been slithering. Are you aware of how much the French are supplying the Iraqis with regard to rocket technology?

The French, in particular, as arrogant and smelly as they are (I've been there on multiple occasions) are protracting this situation by not adding to a unified front. How can you not understand that if that a-hole saddam (again, no capital) saw the entire world was united, would be far more compliant. With weasels like the French, Germans, etc., he sees a lot more wiggle room. That's common sense. We'll kick his ass and when it's over the French will have no part in the reconstruction of the country and will lose due to their arrogance (and aroma) once more. The French have a history of taking the path of least resistance. The French has a long history of not winning a war. They also have a long, long history of having to be bailed out of things.

You're right about British appeasement, I remember Neville Chamberlain waving his paper proclaiming peace. And the US went and bailed his naive ass out of the fire also. I can only take solace in knowing that the French won't profit from their folly this time around. They'll lose all of that invested blood money in Iraq and be exposed for the smelly liars they are.

If it were not for the US, the Canadians would be speaking French, the French would be speaking German, The Germans would be speaking Russian, the Russians would be speaking Chinese, the Chinese would be speaking Japanese and the Japanese wouldn't be trying to be just like us.

Bottom line Django, if you compare the current President to a Nazi, you lack creativity and that bores me. You are as common as all those other whiney-ass liberals who ignore the facts and use tired old platitudes to bolster your hollow arguments.

Please read the NY Times article this week by William Safire and get some more of the documented facts (Yes Facts!!. I know you liberals don't like to use them) about the French involvement in Iraq and why they don't want us to get in there.

[Naisy]

Originally posted by Django

Caitlyn, baby

I was going to stay well away from this debate until take little line, back of Django she is way out of your touch. She is a fantastic person who deserves your respect, not to be called baby, as if she was your object, get over yourself, your not that good.


you give Saddam Hussein way too much credit! I seriously doubt that he's capable of the sort of manipulation you attribute to him. If anyone is doing the manipulating, it's Bush and his cronies. [/B]

how is Bush being maniplative may I ask Django? sure he is rallying his nation for war, just as Hussein is, he is telling his people that all of his enermies will suffer, so I would hardly call him a victim yet

Originally posted by Django
[B]
Yeah, everybody's doing this for the oil! The French govt. is doing it to protect their oil interests and Bush is doing it to protect his oil interests. The difference is that Bush is willing to go to war and massacre thousands of people, not to mention cripple the US economy, to protect his oil interests. The French, at least, are voicing opposition to Bush's militancy and are expressing the voice of good conscience as a result.

To accuse the French, blandly, of corruption with the same breath that you use to defend Bush is so ludicrous that it defies comprehension! :rolleyes:


As you said in a previous thread, the French have some morality in this and all I can say to that is BWAHWAHWAHAHAHAHA :scream: are you out of your mind? what your suggesting is so completely idiotic, its almost too hard to comprehend, your saying that this war will be about Oil? thats it, has it entered your mind for even one second there might be another reason like, I dont know...FEAR???, Bush may possibly fear Suddam is creating weapons and if not, be a threat in using them against the united states? is it possible this war might just be for the people of the united states in protecting them against a possible future nuclear attack? or is it just about some freakin black water? I think not, maybe its part of the situation but to say that it is the main reason or the only reason, is just stupid. Whats more the french have their own reasons as well, any of it Moral? I seriously doubt it, nothing moral about being willing to kill your own bothers, the French have their reasons and I doubt its because they are just being good friends to the world. Youve got issues, have a nice day

oh and nothing in my above post is personal :D

[Caitlyn]

Originally posted by Django

Caitlyn, baby, you give Saddam Hussein way too much credit! I seriously doubt that he's capable of the sort of manipulation you attribute to him. If anyone is doing the manipulating, it's Bush and his cronies.

Django…I am not a baby and definably not your baby… nor do I appreciate being referred to as such…As far as I am concerned you have exhibited a rather naïve view of Saddam Hussein and his agenda and I can’t help but wonder what your attitude would be if Bush were taking steps against Pakistan instead of Iraq…

Yes, frankly, I am! The Nazis were militant right-wing bastards--so's Bush and his gang.

I think you owe every American on this board an apology for that statement…

[Caitlyn]

Originally posted by Naisy

I was going to stay well away from this debate until take little line, back of Django she is way out of your touch. She is a fantastic person who deserves your respect, not to be called baby, as if she was your object, get over yourself, your not that good.


Thank you... Sir Naisy... :)

[filmfreak]

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

You're right about British appeasement, I remember Neville Chamberlain waving his paper proclaiming peace. And the US went and bailed his naive ass out of the fire also.


Yes we may have tried to appease Hitler, even going so far as the England football team returning the Nazi salute in 1939, but to say the the US bailed our asses out of the fire is ridiculous. We were fighting WWII for almost two years before the dithering US decided to get involved as the US government regarded it as a European war. It wasn't until after Pearl Harbour that the US got involved by declaring war on Japan. The only reason their attention was turned towards Europe is because Germany & Italy immediately then declared war on the US. It was six months before US airmen were involved in conflicts and six months after that before US troops were actually involved in combat in Europe.

The appeasement came before any military action was committed by Germany and was done to try to avoid the atrocities that were seen during the first war, still fresh in the memories of many Europeans. There were also only two days between Germany invading Poland, an ultimatum being delivered and declaration of war.

And as for your comment about If it were not for the US, the Canadians would be speaking French, the French would be speaking German etc.I think there may be a few Dutch, Australian, British, African, Polish etc that would have something to say about that. Yes the US played a part. A big part. But to say its all down to the US is nonsense.

Its the American revisionist history in effect again. Good example. Recent Hollywood film about the Enigma device. U-571. American forces capturing the device? I don't think so. I do believe the British were responsible for that one. My problem with this is that many people who see that film will believe that thats how it happened and consider the film as reference material.

[The Silver Bullet]

She is a fantastic person who deserves your respect, not to be called baby, as if she was your object, get over yourself, your not that good.

Get over yourself, you're not a cop...

[Django]

Originally posted by Caitlyn

Django…I am not a baby and definably not your baby… nor do I appreciate being referred to as such…As far as I am concerned you have exhibited a rather naïve view of Saddam Hussein and his agenda and I can’t help but wonder what your attitude would be if Bush were taking steps against Pakistan instead of Iraq…
Ooh...I think I'm in love! :love: Come on, Caitlyn! Can't you take a joke? :laugh:
Regarding Saddam, I don't think I'm being naive at all. I just think the situation has been blown way out of proportion by the Bush White House and that Saddam Hussein is nothing close to the threat that he has been made out to be.

Originally posted by Caitlyn

I think you owe every American on this board an apology for that statement…
You're kidding, right?

[Django]

Originally posted by Naisy

I was going to stay well away from this debate until take little line, back of Django she is way out of your touch. She is a fantastic person who deserves your respect, not to be called baby, as if she was your object, get over yourself, your not that good.

What is this? The friggin' Victorian era? :rolleyes:

[Beale the Rippe]

Originally posted by Django


You're kidding, right?

I think an apology necessary. Do you have any idea of the atrocities that the Nazis commited? To compare the two shows a complete lack of knowlege and intelligence. That statement was anti-american, no matter what your political beliefs are. You don't compare the current president, or any president to a Nazi. If you said this to try to get your point across without really thinking about the comment, thats forgivable. If these are your true feelings, then you aren't worth talking to. End of discussion.

Oh and Django. The U.S. gets only 6% of its oil from Iraq. Anyone that says this is a war about oil is uninformed. If we were to go to war for oil, we'd fight against Canada, Venezuela, or Mexico, our biggest recources for oil, or Saudi Arabia, who we get larger amounts of oil than the almost non-existant 6% we get from Iraq. Thank you for not posting back on this. It proves my point that you have no clue about what your talking about.

[Django]

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

I think an apology necessary. Do you have any idea of the atrocities that the Nazis commited? To compare the two shows a complete lack of knowlege and intelligence. That statement was anti-american, no matter what your political beliefs are. You don't compare the current president, or any president to a Nazi. If you said this to try to get your point across without really thinking about the comment, thats forgivable. If these are your true feelings, then you aren't worth talking to. End of discussion.
I'm sorry, Beale, but I won't apologize for my comments about the Bush administration. Yes, I have a very clear idea of the kinds of atrocities the Nazis committed and also of the kinds of atrocities the current administration is capable of committing. So I'm sorry if this offends you, but that's how it stands. Basically it seems to me that people like you like to perceive Nazis as some kind of foreign evil--an evil far removed from anything that you or your friends are capable. That's understandable, considering that it's a normal human response. The truth, however, is that Nazism fuels itself on precisely that kind of puritanical, xenophobic, holier-than-thou sentiment. Xenophobia lies at the heart of many of the atrocities that the Nazis committed, and don't tell me that we haven't seen our share of xenophobia in the US in recent times. So I don't apologize, and I'm sorry if that offends you. And it's not intended to be anti-American either.

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe

Oh and Django. The U.S. gets only 6% of its oil from Iraq. Anyone that says this is a war about oil is uninformed. If we were to go to war for oil, we'd fight against Canada, Venezuela, or Mexico, our biggest recources for oil, or Saudi Arabia, who we get larger amounts of oil than the almost non-existant 6% we get from Iraq. Thank you for not posting back on this. It proves my point that you have no clue about what your talking about.
Oh, come on! Iraq has some of the richest untapped oil reserves in the world! Bush is the former governor of Texas and, undoubtedly has major connections in the oil industry. Why is Bush so anxious for REGIME CHANGE in Iraq? To make Iraq a haven for democratic ideals? Yeah, right! Au contraire--it is to get his greedy hands on Iraqi oil and so to make his buddies rich and get rich too, in the process. Please don't tell me that this is not painfully obvious to anyone who pays the least bit of attention to what's going on in the world. And please, don't feed me any more of that phoney right-wing idealism and righteous indignation crap. It's more than I can stand!

[Steve]

Why not merge this thread with the Iraq opposition thread?

Just a thought.

Django, don't apologize to anyone, whether Naisy comes to their defense or not. Beale, I admire your rejection of the whiny-ass liberal platitudes. Bullsh!t is bullsh!t and should be treated as such, on the right as well as the left. Anyway, I'm sticking to the Iraq opposition thread. Ciao.

[Beale the Rippe]

You really don't have any idea of what your talking about? What kind of atrocities are you expecting? What in the U.S's history could possiblt lead you to this Anti-American opinion. (Whether it was intended to be anti-american or not, it is). I want some statistics on this one Django. Prove to me you aren't a complete liberal moron. Please. Liberals, Liberals, Liberals....whatever shall our country do.

[Caitlyn]

Originally posted by Django

You're kidding, right?

No….

[Django]

Beale: a) I am not a liberal--just conscientious. b) Regarding statistics--you've heard the expression, haven't you? "There are 3 kinds of lies--lies, damned lies and statistics." 'Nuff said! Statistics prove nothing.

Caitlyn: Please see above regarding my position on this issue. I do not feel obliged to apologize to anyone for expressing my honest opinion regarding the current administration. You've heard of freedom of speech, haven't you? Well, if freedom of speech protects the friggin' Ku Klux Klan, it damn well better protect me! (Sorry for my use of mild profanity, but that's where I stand!)

[Beale the Rippe]

Thats what I thought. You can't pull up any STATISTICS or FACTS to back up your fallacies. What a shame. Another complete liberal moron.

[Piddzilla]

The level of this debate... unbelievable. Conservatism equals fascism and the opposite of a fascist is a liberal? Wow! You learn something new every day...

[Beale the Rippe]

You miss the point Pidzilla. Its perfectly cool to criticise the leadership of this country. Its perfectly alright to criticise the war, (although I'd prefer that Django would say something valid once and a while. He never semms to be able to back up what h says. Time after time he is challenged to, and every time he finds a way to change the subject or avoid giving statistics that don't exist to back up his phoney claims.) But to call the president a NAZI is wrong. No matter how much you dislike or hate the president or his policies, you don't call him a NAZI! Am I the only person besides Caitlyn that understands the weight of this comment, and how offensve, not to mention idiotic it is? Does anyone else notice how he wasn't able to back this claim up with any facts, or statistics? He provides no form of evidence at all. And still he posts his childish liberal attacks at Bush which are rooted in something much less than fact. This shows a complete lack of intelligence on the part of Django.

[Django]

Beale, I'd love to debate with you at length and address each of your points in detail and feed you up to your ears with facts and statistics. However, I have a deadline to meet and I just don't have the time right now. Maybe another day. Ciao!

[Yoda]

Originally posted by Django
Caitlyn: Please see above regarding my position on this issue. I do not feel obliged to apologize to anyone for expressing my honest opinion regarding the current administration. You've heard of freedom of speech, haven't you? Well, if freedom of speech protects the friggin' Ku Klux Klan, it damn well better protect me! (Sorry for my use of mild profanity, but that's where I stand!)
Is this a joke? No one's attacking your right to free speech. That's nothing short of paranoia. What they did say, however, was that your comment was incorrect and offensive. To use your analogy: wouldn't you say the KKK "owes an apology" to blacks? I'd sure as hell hope so.

That said, just because it's an "honest opinion" doesn't mean it's not offensive and wrong. If you want to defend your statement, you should adequately demonstrate a reasonable comparison. Better yet, just admit that it was hyperbolic, over-the-top political namecalling and we'll all move on.

[Django]

Originally posted by Yoda

Is this a joke? No one's attacking your right to free speech. That's nothing short of paranoia. What they did say, however, was that your comment was incorrect and offensive. To use your analogy: wouldn't you say the KKK "owes an apology" to blacks? I'd sure as hell hope so.

That said, just because it's an "honest opinion" doesn't mean it's not offensive and wrong. If you want to defend your statement, you should adequately demonstrate a reasonable comparison. Better yet, just admit that it was hyperbolic, over-the-top political namecalling and we'll all move on.
My comment may have been a bit excessive--I admit that. However, I don't believe it is far removed from the truth. American soldiers, not German ones, committed terrible atrocities in Vietnam--war crimes beyond any doubt. With Dubya's war, we see Vietnam being replayed before our eyes. Is Dubya so far removed from, say, for example, Richard Nixon or Sen. McCarthy, that he is incapable of allowing history to repeat itself? (I hope that's grammatically correct, but it's so late/early, that I really don't care.)

[n7of9]

Originally posted by Django
American soldiers, not German ones, committed terrible atrocities in Vietnam--war crimes beyond any doubt

wtf??? now its my turn to ask you to back up your flippant comments...can you please back this comment up...Germans weren't in vietnam (i'm sure that's not what you were implying)!!! and what war crimes beyond any doubt?? please explain....

[Naisy]

Originally posted by Caitlyn



Thank you... Sir Naisy... :)


Originally posted by The Silver Bullet


Get over yourself, you're not a cop...


Originally posted by Django

What is this? The friggin' Victorian era? :rolleyes:


Hee hee a few drinks and you never know what comments your going to spark :D

[Piddzilla]

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe
You miss the point Pidzilla. Its perfectly cool to criticise the leadership of this country. Its perfectly alright to criticise the war, (although I'd prefer that Django would say something valid once and a while. He never semms to be able to back up what h says. Time after time he is challenged to, and every time he finds a way to change the subject or avoid giving statistics that don't exist to back up his phoney claims.) But to call the president a NAZI is wrong. No matter how much you dislike or hate the president or his policies, you don't call him a NAZI! Am I the only person besides Caitlyn that understands the weight of this comment, and how offensve, not to mention idiotic it is? Does anyone else notice how he wasn't able to back this claim up with any facts, or statistics? He provides no form of evidence at all. And still he posts his childish liberal attacks at Bush which are rooted in something much less than fact. This shows a complete lack of intelligence on the part of Django.

No, you guys miss the point. It's pretty obvious that Bush is not a nazi so why are you even debating over that? And why are you using the word "liberal" as a curse word? What is really the issue here?

[The Silver Bullet]

Oh, Naisal. Like I wasn't joking...
You crazy kids and your drugs.

:D

[Beale the Rippe]

Liberal is not a curse word. Django's comments are liberal, as are his views. He claims to not be a liberal, but he is, and being a liberal is not something to be ashamed of. (Although several organizations are giving liberals a bad name as of late. These organiztions, such as ACLU are completely out of line, and this is where the stereotyping comes. Sometimes I generalize with my opinions, so forgive me). If a conservative says something attacking someone and that is uncalled for, then I'll point that out. The reason that we are debating is because the statement made by Django has yet been resolved. (I don't think resolved is the correct word). (And Django, I don't think Nixon was a NAZI either). Pidzilla, there is no other issue here that I'm aware of. Don't try and make one.

[Caitlyn]

Originally posted by Django

My comment may have been a bit excessive--I admit that. However, I don't believe it is far removed from the truth.

Your comment went way beyond being excessive when you called “Bush and his gang” Nazis thereby labeling every American citizen a Nazi… Which leads me to a question… I know on another thread you stated you were born in Bombay, India but now live on the west coast of the United States… I’m curious as to how long you have lived in the United States and if in fact you are an American citizen?

[The Silver Bullet]

I don't think calling Bush a nazi is accurate. But saying that such a comment is calling all Americans nazis is wrong, and blatantly so. Not every American citizen voted for Bush, and not every American wants Bush representing them. So, if someone says Bush is a nazi, there is no way you can assume they are saying that every other American is a nazi too. Because they're not.

To be honest, I find the zealous American patriots just as annoying as the bleeding heart protestors. It is all so boring watching the two groups go at each other like dogs in a cage.

[Beale the Rippe]

You think the whole cage thing is boring? I love it!

[Django]

Originally posted by n7of9


wtf??? now its my turn to ask you to back up your flippant comments...can you please back this comment up...Germans weren't in vietnam (i'm sure that's not what you were implying)!!! and what war crimes beyond any doubt?? please explain....

I didn't say that there were German soldiers in Vietnam. I said that there were American soldiers in Vietnam. Regarding war crimes, what I am referring to are the numerous incidents involving wanton cruelty and disregard for human rights exhibited by the US military in Vietnam--cases in which the entire civilian population of entire villages were wiped out by trigger-happy American soldiers for no apparent reason. Please don't tell me you deny that such things ever happened! Please study the history of the Vietnam war before expressing moral outrage at my very insightful comments.

[Django]

Originally posted by Piddzilla


No, you guys miss the point. It's pretty obvious that Bush is not a nazi so why are you even debating over that? And why are you using the word "liberal" as a curse word? What is really the issue here?
True--George W. Bush is a member of the Republican Party, not the National Socialist Party. True, George W. Bush does not wear military regalia, nor does he sport a kooky mustache or wear a swastika on his chest. In that sense, George W. Bush is NOT a Nazi, I admit that.

HOWEVER, I submit that the policies of George W. Bush are not far removed from the policies of Hitler's National Socialist Party. Perhaps not the same, but, at the same time, not far removed.

Regarding so-called "Liberals"--which seems to have become a name that right-wing fanatics randomly attach to anyone who happens to disagree with them, whatever the reason--whatever you may say about "Liberals"--at least they stand for "liberation"--and that's something I agree with them on. I'm a strong believer in liberty and liberation, and I say that your liberties, e.g. your civil liberties, are not something you take for granted. And I say this from experience. Politics is a dirty game and politicians will always try to compromise on the civil liberties of the populace if it gets them what they want--money and power. Therefore, I make no apologies for jealously guarding whatever few civil liberties I may have. Liberty is a precious commodity and should be protected with care and concern.

[Django]

Originally posted by Caitlyn


Your comment went way beyond being excessive when you called “Bush and his gang” Nazis thereby labeling every American citizen a Nazi… Which leads me to a question… I know on another thread you stated you were born in Bombay, India but now live on the west coast of the United States… I’m curious as to how long you have lived in the United States and if in fact you are an American citizen?
Like I said, "Bush and his gang" may not explicitly be Nazis. However, the policies of the current administration are Nazi-like, especially with respect to the institutionalized xenophobia we are witnessing everywhere today and the right-wing militancy and belligerency in their push for a war in Iraq. And my comments regarding Bush are in no way intended to label EVERY US citizen--not unless you happen to identify or ally yourself with Bush and his cause. To be frank, I have little sympathy for those who do. No, I am not a citizen, but I have been a resident in the US for several years.

[The Silver Bullet]

How about you start replying to every post that you want to reply to in the same reply? Triple posts? That is just retarded.

And for the record, how many posts have you made about movies since you've been here?

[Django]

Sorry, but I just don't feel obligated to explain myself to you. :)

[n7of9]

django, why does every darn thing have to be politicized?? because you make it so!!

i think SB's question was quite fair...why not answer him with one of your self proclaimed "very insightful comments"....what about answering caitlyn's question, or do you just answer questions which suit you?? (yes, that's a question too)

[Piddzilla]

Originally posted by The Silver Bullet
I don't think calling Bush a nazi is accurate. But saying that such a comment is calling all Americans nazis is wrong, and blatantly so. Not every American citizen voted for Bush, and not every American wants Bush representing them. So, if someone says Bush is a nazi, there is no way you can assume they are saying that every other American is a nazi too. Because they're not.

To be honest, I find the zealous American patriots just as annoying as the bleeding heart protestors. It is all so boring watching the two groups go at each other like dogs in a cage.

I totally agree with everything in this post. However, it's not the fact that these two groups are debating that is boring - it's the level of the debate and the namecalling used.

Another thing. I would never dream of calling the Bush administration nazis but Django does have a point when he compares the current american government to the Third Reich government. They're not ideologically similar and every similarity is of course strictly theoretical. What the Bush administration is doing now and the way it is doing it has more in common with the start of the second world war than anything Saddam has ever done. This doesn't mean that Bush is a nazi of course.

And what's up with this interrogation of Django?? I believe some people here haven't commented on the comments I made about their comments (did you get that comment?). Maybe you should do that before you start ganging up against someone else for not giving you the answers you want to hear.

[The Silver Bullet]

Sorry, but I just don't feel obligated to explain myself to you.

Last edited by Django on 03-19-2003 at 04:04 PM

Something about the fact that you edited you post makes me think that you did feel obligated, but anyway. My question is fair. I have no problems with you discussing the same stuff in here over and over and over and over and over and over again [and then some] but I would like to know what else you are getting out of the site. I'm sure that there are message boards dedicated to war, war and only war somewhere out there. Why a movie site? Honestly?

[jrs]

Originally posted by Django
Sorry, but I just don't feel obligated to explain myself to you. :)



You should, for you have made a mockery out of this board and some people on it. I hope you're ashamed of yourself.

[The Silver Bullet]

LEONARD NEMOY: I just have to go and get something from my car...
PIMPLY FACED KID: I don't think he's coming back...

[Naisy]

Originally posted by The Silver Bullet
How about you start replying to every post that you want to reply to in the same reply? Triple posts? That is just retarded.

And for the record, how many posts have you made about movies since you've been here?

Well as matter of fact he has had 21 posts in movie related threads, but most of which are one liners, thank you posts and half-wit jokes. :yup: :) nothing against you Django, the man asked a question, im just anwsering.

I know im being a smart@rse but it was too good an op to pass up

[Django]

Silver Bullet, I edited the post to change the word "obliged" to "obligated". Sorry, but I STILL don't feel any compulsion to explain myself. I can post what I want. It's not repetitive. Most of the threads I started have become multi-page debates over important current issues. This may be a movie forum, but my non-movie related posts are restricted to the "Intermission" zone. Must stuff isn't repetitive nor is it lame. Your saying so doesn't make it so. Nor is my stuff propagandistic--it's honest self-expression. I have posted a lot of stuff in movie-related threads, including a pretty insightful review of the movie Daredevil. None of my jokes are half-witted. If you don't happen to get the joke, it doesn't make the joke half-witted. Perhaps you lack the wit to fully comprehend its nuances. I haven't mocked or insulted anyone. I have plenty of people on the board who agree with the things I have said. If a few people happen to disagree with me or dislike me, get over it! I have as much right to be here as anyone else! If you don't like what I say, too bad! I have as much right to express myself as you and you have no right to try and shut me up. I have ABSOLUTELY NO OBLIGATION to explain ANYTHING to ANYONE! I'm only doing so because I'm basically a nice guy who tries to get along with everyone, even the most obnoxious people out there, like, for example, the guy who calls himself "Shapeshifter" or something like that, and that other guy called "Danger Diabolik". I think that they are the characters who need to explain the hate-filled propaganda they have been posting on this forum. And, also, I think Yoda owes us an explanation about why such people have been allowed to get away with the things they have posted, while one of my threads was deleted simply because it contained the word "war" in the title, whereas it had nothing whatsoever to do with war. Makes you think that there is a deep bias running through the forum at some inner level--a bias that needs to be seriously addressed and rectified.

[Yoda]

And, also, I think Yoda owes us an explanation about why such people have been allowed to get away with the things they have posted, while one of my threads was deleted simply because it contained the word "war" in the title, whereas it had nothing whatsoever to do with war. Makes you think that there is a deep bias running through the forum at some inner level--a bias that needs to be seriously addressed and rectified.
Django, let me put this as poltely as possible: you have no idea what you're talking about. You are new here. That's great; we love new people. But at the same time you have not been privy to a NUMBER of events which show your accusations to be completely baseless. Perhaps you think yourself such an amazing judge of character that you can formulate these opinions through the Internet and a small handful of posts over just a couple weeks, but I think you're just quick to jump to conclusions. If one of us is speaking rashly based on our disagreement, it appears just as likely to be you.

People here have never been silenced for saying things I disagree with. Ever. EVER. A member once (basically) accused me of being like a member of the KKK. I kid you not. I didn't ban him, or really even warn him. I didn't even close the thread. If you're trying to imply that I somehow come down on those who say things I don't like, you don't have a leg to stand on.

I don't see why I owe you any explanation. If a member says something you think inappropriate, PM me or another moderator about it and we'll take a look. In case you didn't notice there are sometimes 100s of posts a day on this forum, and believe it or not, I can't read most of them. Odds are I haven't even seen whatever it is you're so up in arms about.

[theshape82]

looks like your damned resistance didn't work lol
we're at WAR!!!!
this has been a long time in the making

[Danger Diabolik]

Originally posted by Caitlyn


Your comment went way beyond being excessive when you called “Bush and his gang” Nazis thereby labeling every American citizen a Nazi… Which leads me to a question… I know on another thread you stated you were born in Bombay, India but now live on the west coast of the United States… I’m curious as to how long you have lived in the United States and if in fact you are an American citizen?


Django also said:
And my comments regarding Bush are in no way intended to label EVERY US citizen--not unless you happen to identify or ally yourself with Bush and his cause. To be frank, I have little sympathy for those who do. No, I am not a citizen, but I have been a resident in the US for several years.

Well, well, WELL....it seems you DO owe us an explanation, Django, for your blatant scorn for us and our country when you aren't even a naturalized citizen yet.

You live in America,
and complain about our foreign policies and ways of life when you aren't even a citizen yet. My advice is that until you ARE a citizen, and you know the full political complexities of America and her people, is to just shut the hell up. You can have an opinion when you pay your taxes, and when you are naturalized and contribute to society like the rest of us.

This makes me sick. And Yoda is right: you DON'T know what you're talking about. I may not either sometimes, but that's how it goes, and ebing the way you've acted lately, I think I can say with a fair degree that I DO know what I am talking about.

I'm getting sick and tired of hearing crap from people who aren't even American citizens yet, thinking they can just walk all over the system and get the life THEY want while the rest of us bust our asses for it as well as paying our taxes to provide them with the easy life they are currently enjoying.

I work for a living. I don't sit behind a gas pump or a convenience store counter everyday reading the works of Salman Rushdie. And I resent your blatant attitudes about our government and our people. You have a lot to learn friend.

Do you even pay your taxes yet, or do you keep your business
tax-free by rolling it over and handing it to your next of kin the minute they step off the boat? How long have YOU taken advantage of the system? You know you have, or else you wouldn't be here. You don't care about America or her people, just the money you can make here.

You bitch about America, but you change your tune when that tax-free check comes in every week, don't you? Just remember that the good life you have here comes to you courtesy of 'The Great Satan' you seem to villify during 2-week stretches before payday arrives. Don't get ballsy with US because you can waltz back home with a boatload of tax-free money whenever you feel like it.

You have a lot to learn about America and her people, my friend, but because you can't see past you alleged correlations between Bush and Hitler, you probably never will.

You don't know anything about the average American citizen or how hard we work for what we have, because YOU don't have to work: you just go out and buy it with your money.

Another rich foreigner who grows a set of balls overnight because he's rich and dosen't need anyone or anything around him now that he has money. America made it possible.

Oh, and BTW-you're welcome........

[theshape82]

hoo-rah danger
:yup:

[Naisy]

Originally posted by Django
but my non-movie related posts are restricted to the "Intermission" zone.


Do you want me to quote you?
New Superhero from Marvel Thread

Hi! Just a quick note to let you know that I'm still around, but too busy to hang around for too long. I'll be back soon, though, so take it easy and enjoy the sunshine!

Finally--someone who recognizes talent when he sees it!


We all make offtopic and pointless posts but no one has ever been silly enough to deny it and say that we restrict our pointlessness in Intermission

I have posted a lot of stuff in movie-related threads, including a pretty insightful review of the movie Daredevil.

Ive read it, ive been through all your posts, my figure above still doesnt change, I mean if you want me to go in depth I can, but I think you will find that 21 will go down dramatically.

None of my jokes are half-witted. If you don't happen to get the joke, it doesn't make the joke half-witted. Perhaps you lack the wit to fully comprehend its nuances.

To quote yourself: Bad joke...good joke...that's a matter of taste, surely!


while one of my threads was deleted simply because it contained the word "war" in the title, whereas it had nothing whatsoever to do with war.

Since Chris is the owner of the site, He doesnt really need to exaplin anything to anyone, he chooses too because he is a nice guy who chooses to get along with everyone. If Chris deleted your thread, he most certainly wouldnt have done so without a reason. I believe in another post you told how Chris (AKA YODA) sent you a PM letting you know his reasons why.

Originally posted by Yoda

People here have never been silenced for saying things I disagree with. Ever. EVER. A member once (basically) accused me of being like a member of the KKK.

Oh that I wanna see :laugh:

If a member says something you think inappropriate, PM me or another moderator about it and we'll take a look. In case you didn't notice there are sometimes 100s of posts a day on this forum, and believe it or not, I can't read most of them.

Or alternativly PM the person who has offended you, you'll find that most people are willing to reason and are polite enough.

[theshape82]

yet again i am compelled to say hoo-rah

[Danger Diabolik]

Originally posted by theshape82
hoo-rah danger
:yup:

Thanks man!

I tried to put it to Django as plainly as possible, and if he still takes it as an insult, well then it's HIS problem.

[Naisy]

I sooo could of been worse, Ive been taking lessons from The Silver Bullet :D, but please Django, you have 135 posts and well just in the Intermission its 110 posts, PLUS add 12 more for the Birthdays and Introductions and 2 for the Indian Burial Grounds

Thats 124 out of 135 posts that are non-related to movies leavin room for only 11 movie related posts and thats not including other pointless posts in the Movie related threads (and if you say there are none, then look at my post above, there it quotes just a couple).

I love STAT's

[Danger Diabolik]

Originally posted by Beale the Rippe
Thats what I thought. You can't pull up any STATISTICS or FACTS to back up your fallacies. What a shame. Another complete liberal moron.

Don't feel bad, Beale. Someday I'll have to tell you about the time the owner of a new age head shop threatened me with arrest because I set her on the straight and narrow about her views on American veterans and her belief that they got what they deserved.

One thing I wish people would STOP doing, is seeing everyone who stands up for America as frothing at the mouth mindless patriots ready to put 30 holes in someone with an assault weapon every time they defend their country. There's a line between mindless patriotism and defending a point of view.

People from other countries don't know squat about us, as well as the new generation of young adults, because liberal fodder clouds the school systems and the sugar coats everything we stand for. And I'm tired of people being labeled as a Nazi or a racist whenever someone DOES set it straight for them.

It seems like we're fuc*ed if we do and fuc*ed if we don't.

[Piddzilla]

These last posts make me sick... No matter how provocing Django has been or how silly his posts are - or where he posts them for that matter (don't we all have our own favourite forums on this site??) - he has never (to my knowledge) attacked anyone personally the way you are attacking and harrassing him now. And Yoda didn't hestitate long before coming to the rescue for that poor soul that Django called fascist, if he now called a specific person here just that. But now Yoda is silent.

Naisy, I'm sure you'll be a terrific private dick. At least a dick.

[Yoda]

Originally posted by Piddzilla
And Yoda didn't hestitate long before coming to the rescue for that poor soul that Django called fascist, if he now called a specific person here just that. But now Yoda is silent.
In all honesty, I'm not sure of what you're saying here at all.

[Piddzilla]

Originally posted by Yoda

In all honesty, I'm not sure of what you're saying here at all.

In all honestly, I think you do, but I don't have the time or the energy to turn this in to the usual Yoda vs. Piddzilla debate, which in the end leads to nothing but a contest of rethorical skills. (By the way, I wrote a long respond on the "tax-topic" some days ago but when I clicked "preview" it disappeared. I'll rewrite it again when my pc and Internet connection works again and the inspiration returns. Just so you don't think you "won". :cool: ).

But anyways, I do believe there must be some rules around here regarding tone and hostility and keeping the posts civilized - if not, there should be. I just think some of the posts on here have turned real hostile and offensive during the last week or so, and someone should take their responsibility as a moderator and do something about that. I don't think personal attacks - whether they come from the left or the right - should be tolerated and especially not encouraged. I don't have a problem being called something because of my views and I gladly call others things now and then too. But when single individuals are being pushed into a corner by several others because of culture, ethnic background or (lack of) citizenship - it is starting to get real ugly. I've been getting reprimands on this site for using the f-word (not by Yoda though - it might have been Lord Slaytan). But when certain people expressed openly racist views (I think it was on a topic regarding Spike Lee. "Blacks should be thankful for slavery" etc.) - nothing happened. Is cursing really worse than racism? In what way am I being more offensive saying **** than when someone is being openly racist??

[Yoda]

In all honestly, I think you do
Here we ago again. What on earth would I possibly gain by pretending to not understand what you're saying? Did someone declare MoFo Conspiracy Week without telling me? Sorry, I'm not buying it. Allow me to demonstrate:

"And Yoda didn't hestitate long before coming to the rescue for that poor soul that Django called fascist"

Breakdown: the "didn't hesitate long" part implies fault, and the "poor soul" comment implies sarcasm. Then again, it's hard to imagine why I would be faulted for pointing out that "fascist" is a completely over the top accusation.

"...if he now called a specific person here just that."

:confused:

"But now Yoda is silent."

About what? I've asked this once before, I believe.


But anyways, I do believe there must be some rules around here regarding tone and hostility and keeping the posts civilized - if not, there should be.
There are and always have been rules regarding tone and hostility. Look, I've spent a s**tload of time on Internet forums. I've been running them, moderating them, and posting in them for years on end. I've got at least 25,000 posts to my credit all over the web. I've been around.

And having been around, I can say without question that the attitude around here, overall, is one of the more respectful (without being oppressive) that you'll find. If anything I sometimes wonder if I'm too strict about the level of decorum often required.


But when certain people expressed openly racist views (I think it was on a topic regarding Spike Lee. "Blacks should be thankful for slavery" etc.) - nothing happened. Is cursing really worse than racism? In what way am I being more offensive saying **** than when someone is being openly racist??
I don't recall anyone saying that blacks should be thankful for slavery. I do recall someone coming in, make some reasonable, but politically incorrect, comments, being shouted down, then making unreasonable comments, and being shouted down again.

"Is cursing really worse than racism?" Oh come on. Nothing here has happened to indicate that anyone's taking that stance. Ask people like Aniko about the poster who kept rearing his head to post racist comments, whom I had to squash several times. They've only been tolerated in any form when I'd concluded that they'd already been completely discredited by the posters themselves. It's a good thing when a community can, in a sense, moderate itself by democratically knocking down those kinds of comments.

[Piddzilla]

Originally posted by Yoda

Here we ago again. What on earth would I possibly gain by pretending to not understand what you're saying? Did someone declare MoFo Conspiracy Week without telling me? Sorry, I'm not buying it. Allow me to demonstrate:

"And Yoda didn't hestitate long before coming to the rescue for that poor soul that Django called fascist"

My mistake. It was Monkeypunch, not Django, who called what theshape82 wrote "fascism".

Originally posted by theshape82

Anybody sick of people degrading the american ideals?

i have noticed that more and more people are posting threads degrading the american way of life and the american president. i find this sickening and it angers me to see that people, who have no buisness being in america at all, are talking **** about our fair nation, our president, and degrading the ideals of which our fathers/mothers, brothers/sisters, and sons/daughters are fighting for. For the past few months i have loved this site and was hoping to be a long time member, but i will not sit by and listen to a bunch of traitorous sacks of **** bash our nation and everything it stands for!!!!

Originally posted by Monkeypunch

Free speech is an American ideal, as is social and political protest. Trying to shut dissenters up is more like....dare I say it? Facism. And I don't think we want that, now do we?

Originally posted by Yoda

Please. It's not facism to disagree with what people are saying. If he can be accused of trying to "shut you up," your reply can be accused of doing the same in response.

So, it's pretty obvious whose side you're taking on this issue. theshape's post is aggressive and hostile and you're supporting it while you in your role as administrator of this site are actively taking a stand against Monkeypunch's anti-fascist post.

Breakdown: the "didn't hesitate long" part implies fault, and the "poor soul" comment implies sarcasm. Then again, it's hard to imagine why I would be faulted for pointing out that "fascist" is a completely over the top accusation.

Try to for once see the whole picture without breaking it down to pieces.

And it's not an over the top accusation. theshape's post is very hostile against specific types of people ("people, who have no buisness being in america at all", " bunch of traitorous sacks of ****") while Monkeypunch's was written in a civilized way. You, however, decided that theshape82 needed your help and support even before he had had the time to respond to Monkeypunch himself. This is, of course, not a fault from your part - you are free to post on any thread at any time more than anybody else on here. But this just demonstrates where your position as a moderator or administrator is and that I don't only think you are passive as such but also supportive of posts expressing very muddy views. I think this is the best movie site by far, and you should have all credit for that. But with a successful site like this a lot of responsibility comes along.

"...if he now called a specific person here just that."

:confused:

I admit that the way the words follow each other in that sentance is swedish rather than english. Hey, I'm doing my best.

"But now Yoda is silent."

About what? I've asked this once before, I believe.

About the posts on this thread set out to do nothing else than harrass a single individual - what else???

There are and always have been rules regarding tone and hostility. Look, I've spent a s**tload of time on Internet forums. I've been running them, moderating them, and posting in them for years on end. I've got at least 25,000 posts to my credit all over the web. I've been around.

And having been around, I can say without question that the attitude around here, overall, is one of the more respectful (without being oppressive) that you'll find. If anything I sometimes wonder if I'm too strict about the level of decorum often required.

Look, I've been around too and even though I haven't counted my posts (don't know what that should prove anyway) I can say that this is not the first forum I debate on. I have not moderated any of the forums though because I don't kiss administrator's ass - on the contrary, which you might have noticed.

And, yes, this forum used to be one of the most respectful - but not for long if this ****trhowing continues. And I can tell you that this is not the strictest forum around. I've been to www.cinephiles.com a couple of times where they are very keen on not letting things get out of hand like they are starting to do here. "Well, why don't you go back to cinephiles then???" Because I like this forum better. It's more alive. But on there the administrator instantly contacts people like theshape and Django when it start to get too personal, too provocing and too offensive. I'm not saying posts should be deleted, but people should be reminded about the rules when they are starting to get out of line. I have never felt that it was needed before on here, but now I do. But, I realize that you don't so, hey, just forget it....

I don't recall anyone saying that blacks should be thankful for slavery. I do recall someone coming in, make some reasonable, but politically incorrect, comments, being shouted down, then making unreasonable comments, and being shouted down again.

Reasonable?? Politically incorrect?? I don't know about you but I think it's mostly good to be politically incorrect since it shows you can think for yourself. This is not so good though:

"Muhamad Ali's ancestors were once slaves which allowed him to be in America and become a boxer and life a luxury life with money. You think that would have happened if his ancestors weren't taken out of Africa?"

"Slavery brought the black race opprotunities that they would have never had if left on their own. They were hunters and gathers not scientists, doctors or mathmaticians."

"Men and women are not equal, just as the races are not equal. People were made different. Blacks are more physically gifted which is why they make up a majority in professional sports and whites and asians are gifted intelligently, which would explain how those two races make up 99 percent of the worlds technological achievements."

It's in the Ethnic-color thread if you want to check it out. This was just a few of the posts expressing that crap on there. Some of us tried to educate this kid ourselves (couldn't see any shouting though - don't know what you meant with that) so maybe you felt that you didn't have to say anything, even though you were involved on the thread a bit in the beginning of it.

"Is cursing really worse than racism?" Oh come on. Nothing here has happened to indicate that anyone's taking that stance. Ask people like Aniko about the poster who kept rearing his head to post racist comments, whom I had to squash several times. They've only been tolerated in any form when I'd concluded that they'd already been completely discredited by the posters themselves. It's a good thing when a community can, in a sense, moderate itself by democratically knocking down those kinds of comments.

Ok. I'll do it myself then. Have a good day!

[Naisy]

Originally posted by Piddzilla
Naisy, I'm sure you'll be a terrific private dick. At least a dick.

Riiiiggghhhhttt, because giving facts and answering questions with factual answers is such a big mean dicky thing to do :rolleyes: oh please…

[The Silver Bullet]

Let's go fly a kite.

[jrs]

It's nice down here.....I'll join ya. (Via kite string) :laugh: