Amy Winehouse dies at age 27

[Sinny McGuffins]

Amy Winehouse was found dead this afternoon (FULL STORY (http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Showbiz-News/Amy-Winehouse-Found-Dead-At-Home-In-Camden-London-Police-Confirm/Article/201107416036201?lpos=Showbiz_News_Carousel_Region_0&lid=ARTICLE_16036201_Amy_Winehouse_Found_Dead_At_Home_In_Camden%2C_London%2C_Police_Confirm)).

She becomes the sixth famous rock and roll star to die at the young age of 27, after Brian Jones, Janis Joplin, Jimi Hendrix, Jim Morrison and Kurt Cobain all died at the same age.


http://blogposttoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Amy-Winehouse.jpg

R.I.P. Miss Winehouse, such a shame to see such a talent go to waste.

[KasperKristensen]

Every time a young person dies is a tragedy. I can't be affected by all of them.

[Yoda]

Sad stuff. Seemed like she'd been on this road for a long time.

[iluv2viddyfilms]

Expected. Not a surprised at all. I enjoy her music and listened to her mainstream enterance album back in 2006 or whenever that was, but I can't get entirely heartbroken over these celebrities that "live by the sword" and then die too soon.

It's sad she won't be making music, but I wonder what she overdosed on. Immediate gratification is one hell of a strong force against us humans, and she feel victim to it, the way others have.

It's kind of odd how when people go through trials and tribulations in life, how it almost becomes a badge or a trophy to wear showing the world - whether it's cancer, drug addiction, suicide, alcoholism, war stories, and on and on and on. We define ourselves in part by our tragedys that are uncommon for the average Joe to face. In our need to feel unique/special from our fellow man we use these to achieve that. I'm guilty of it to, but still I don't know why this need exists.

She sang about going to rehab and being no good, knowing what would happen eventually, yet did not get help or was beyond help. I dunno. I can't feel much for a person I've never met - or I should say, have no connection to.

We all have celebrities that we mourn the loss or or at least feel emotional to their tragedy - James Dean Marilyn Monroe - in my case Monty Clift and Jean Seberg, but it's only on a superficial level.

[akatemple]

Yeah I can't say I didn't see this coming, but it is still really sad. I really like a lot of her songs, she was very talented.

[ash_is_the_gal]

i didn't really like her music at all. actually, i kinda forgot all about this chick. she kept popping up in the media awhile back when she went fast down the spiral, but there's so many of them now i didn't so much care or register it.

i know she was popular a few years ago, but didn't she only make an album or two? other than "lived hard/died young", she hardly belongs mentioned in the same sentence as Joplin, Hendrix, or Morrison.

[will.15]

i didn't really like her music at all. actually, i kinda forgot all about this chick. she kept popping up in the media awhile back when she went fast down the spiral, but there's so many of them now i didn't so much care or register it.

i know she was popular a few years ago, but didn't she only make an album or two? other than "lived hard/died young", she hardly belongs mentioned in the same sentence as Joplin, Hendrix, or Morrison.
Time will tell that, if we are still talking about her long after her death.

[honeykid]

First thing I did when I heard was find out how old she was. She made it. 27.

[Monkeypunch]

I liked her CD, it was, at one point, my most played album on iTunes. It's a damn shame she couldn't clean herself up. She had to join the "Stupid Club."

[Naisy]

I dont really find this sad... maybe that's just the jackass within me. I know I regularly get told I should respect the dead, but I still don't respect Hitler, I didnt like or respect her in life, im not going to respect her the death (She made her choices and happily stayed her way). Especially over the single mother of two who can die of a terrible accident every single day without worldwide coverage. I'll have a lot more respect for the solider who gets killed fighting for freedom and only gets a six second mention on the news.

[ash_is_the_gal]

i don't know, it's like... i think when people say they find her death sad, they aren't saying they respected her life or anything like that. at least, i don't think so. i think people feel sorry that people like this exist - people quite lost and unable to pick themselves up. and even especially sad that someone with quite obvious talent and potential genius to go to such waste.

i admit i could never understand anyone with such a mind frame. i don't understand people who can live their lives so extremely recklessly that they destroy themselves and any relationship or support system they might have.

and now she's dead and will never get a chance to do anything about it, ever. so yeah, that's really, really sad.

[TheMightyCelestial]

Besides the much publicized addiction, I didn't know much about her other than that I really enjoyed her music. And being old skool, there aren't too many of today's artists that I can say that about.

R.I.P. Ms. Winehouse.
Small as it may be, thanx at least for the few songs that help to contribute to the enjoyment that I get from my iPod during my evening jogs.

[SamsoniteDelilah]

Toss me in the "jackass" bin with Naisy. I find myself unmoved, and unsurprised. She made her choices, and it was the end of a talented voice to the rest of us, but there are many more who will gladly take her place.

[ash_is_the_gal]

i admit i am neither surprised or particularly moved by this turn of events myself. when i said it was a waste of talent i was speaking extremely generally - i don't even know any of her songs and had no interest in the type of music she did, so i wasn't speaking with my own opinion. i don't have positive or negative feelings either way.

i was talking about the type of person Miss Winehouse represents more than anything - which again, she wasn't really as open a book as most people like to think. i'm sure most of us saw her plastered in the media for a lot of ****, but that hardly gives anyone any insight into what the **** was wrong with this chick or why she was unable to care enough to help herself.

that's always the case with these kinds of people. i know a few of them in my real life, too. i feel terrible more for people i know because it's more likely to affect people i care about. if i have any feelings for the likes of Amy Winehouse, or any celebrity that you would tag under the same character, it'd be that of fascination and confusion.

it's too bad that talent couldn't have been given to someone more useful.

[will.15]

I don't listen to that kind of music so I don't know what the hell she sounded like, but I remember when she did an early album, or maybe the very first, the music critics getting real excited at a time when they were condemning everyone else. She was supposed to be a major breakthrough artist, but her addictions and other problems apparently prevented her from growing as an artist. At least Elvis and Michael Jackson left an impressive body of work before self destructing.

I decided to pay my respects to Amy and listen to her on youtube. What was the big deal? Singing old soul and jazz songs in an imitation black voice? The black women do it better. Did she write songs or is that all she did? Still the earliest appearances are clearly better with a stronger voice and still looking like a normal human being. Later on she is getting mighty ugly and the voice already seems shot.

[TheUsualSuspect]

They tried to send her to rehab but she said no, no, no.


Bad taste?

Probably.

Then again, for someone with so much talent to throw it all away and no one be surprised at the fact that she died...it says a lot.

No sympathies for her, but sympathies for her family.

[iluv2viddyfilms]

Toss me in the "jackass" bin with Naisy. I find myself unmoved, and unsurprised. She made her choices, and it was the end of a talented voice to the rest of us, but there are many more who will gladly take her place.

Well I'm also in that jackass bin, so join the crowd. But I do enjoy reading honest realistic reactions instead of "Sad. She'll be missed. Now, who the **** drank my last beer in the fridge?" Because I'll earn the super jackass award for this, but really in the context of things, someone drinking the last beer is far more tragic to us as individuals than the death of a celebrity we are impartial to.

And I'll take my flogging standing up like a real man now.

[Sexy Celebrity]

The thought I keep thinking in regards to Amy Winehouse's death is that she committed suicide as a way of being a member of that group of important musicians that died at age 27. Jimi Hendrix, Jim Morrison, Janis Joplin, Kurt Cobain all died when they were 27. Now we have Amy Winehouse we can add to that list.

I personally don't think Amy Winehouse was all that important musically. I know she was very popular for awhile and received rave reviews and everyone talked about how f---ed up she was. She's been getting boo'ed for odd behavior at her concerts recently and she's even been cancelling tours because of this.

So, unless her death is determined to be something else, I suspect Amy's committed suicide. I really do. I think she wants the attention and wants to be famous for years to come. I don't know what that woman's problems were, though. Don't really care, either.

[Tacitus]

I personally don't think Amy Winehouse was all that important musically

I think that the girl was a sparkling talent (saw her live before all the hoo-ha) but her problems robbed her, and us, of anything resembling a legacy worth more than a handful of songs.

She seemed to stop functioning at the same creative level when her demons were at the door and when you compound that with her living in the age of media hounding even the arse-end of celebrity it meant that to a lot of people she was no more important than Jade Goody, also no longer with us.

To add further fuel to Sexy's fire, Ms Goody was also 27 when she died...

[Skepsis93]

Sure, she had talent. But she decided to throw away that talent with drink and drugs. Therefore that talent means squat to me.

I don't think anyone can deny this was inevitable given her track record. It's a shame that a genuine talent has gone to waste, but I have no sympathy whatsoever for the woman herself.

[christine]

Agree with Tacitus, she could sing and she did have talent but drink and drugs blew all that away. The pressures of being in the media spotlight must be absolutely relentless, besides all the hangers on. Some people can cope I suppose, but some people just aren't strong enough. Seems like her mum and dad tried their best but she just got overwhelmed, poor kid.
Any loss of young life is terribly sad, but the events in Norway are on a scale that's hard to take. Seeing the news reports and reading the papers this morning is really upsetting.

[Piddzilla]

Some people in this thread wouldn't know a true artist even if she snorted a line of coke from their own personal pedestal.

R.I.P. Amy... Great voice - great artistry. Really sad to not have you around anymore.

[Ash_Lee]

She didn't really "do it to herself" though. If it hadn't been drink and drugs it could just as easily have been any other vice you can think of. Addiction is not something that can be turned on and off at will, some people can break free, others can't. There's a reason so many ex-alcoholics never drink again, because they know that the second that liquid hits the back of their throat they'd instantly fall off the wagon and may never get back on again.

Her death wasn't the result of a personal lifestyle choice, it was the result of a mental illness that stopped her from leading a normal life, that stopped her from being able to cope with the world around her once she'd dabbled. Sure, she should never have tried the stuff in the first place, but hers wasn't exactly a normal life. Most of us would never develop a cocaine addiction for example, not necessarily because we have less addictive personalities, but also because finding the stuff would prove next to impossible. We hear enough stories on TV, in magazines and in autobiographies about how easily obtained these things are in the Celeb World, I don't find it hard to imagine how easy it would be for her.

I'm curious, do those who think Amy brought this on herself also think sufferers of chronic depression need to cheer up? That people with tourettes need to behave themselves? That people with dyslexia are simply less intelligent than their peers?

Addicts aren't weak, and they're not selfish, they just need help. It's a mental illness, it's not shameful. These people don't just need support groups and medical advice, they need to be understood by a wider audience, something I dearly hope happens as a result of yet another young celebrity losing their life to illness in the public eye.

Amy Winehouse has my fullest and sincerest sympathy, as do her family and friends.

[Yoda]

I don't think the two are analogous. You are born with depression, but not born addicted to drugs or alcohol.

I am certainly sympathetic to the idea that some people are very heavily predisposed to addiction, and that you can't just browbeat every addict out of being an addict, but I don't think we can say there is no component of choice, either, particularly at first. Certainly not to the degree that I would put it directly alongside conditions one's born with.

[ash_is_the_gal]

I don't think the two are analogous. You are born with depression, but not born addicted to drugs or alcohol.

it seems pretty obvious that Winehouse had very little if any self-esteem, something routed in depression. the addictive personality is just a symptom of the cause.

[wintertriangles]

You can't be born with depression, it's an emotion not a disease

[ash_is_the_gal]

Oh boy

here we go

[filmgirlinterrupted]

You can't be born with depression, it's an emotion not a disease

Genetics do have an effect on your susceptibility to depression.

[Godoggo]

You can't be born with depression, it's an emotion not a disease

No, not clinical depression. It's a mental illness.

[Ash_Lee]

I don't think the two are analogous. You are born with depression, but not born addicted to drugs or alcohol.

I am certainly sympathetic to the idea that some people are very heavily predisposed to addiction, and that you can't just browbeat every addict out of being an addict, but I don't think we can say there is no component of choice, either, particularly at first. Certainly not to the degree that I would put it directly alongside conditions one's born with.

Not specifically to drugs or alcohol no, but that's not really the point. Studies have been done which show that some people can be genetically predisposed to addictive behaviour, so it actually can be something you're born with.

If someone with addictive tendencies never came into contact with hard drugs or only drank occasionally that doesn't necessarily mean they'll never be an addict. You can't become a heroin addict if you never take heroin.

As for the choice at the start, yes drug addicts do make that initial choice of whether to take it or not, but for some that's where the choice ends. Can it really be said that it's a person's choice when they're injecting needles into their bodies in places they rarely notice, because they've run out of other places to do so?

[Ash_Lee]

It's also suddenly occurred to me that I'm discussing addiction, and my avatar is Doctor House :laugh:

[will.15]

All I Know is some people as screwed up as her have overcome their addictions. Some addicts turn their life around like Robert Downey Junior and some die from it. Mental illness or addiction or whatever she had is not incurable. But first you have to want to get better, to admit you have a problem. Winehouse never did that from all accounts so that makes her less sympathetic to me.

[Tacitus]

I wonder if her death hadn't coincided with the senseless slaughter of complete innocents in Norway?

The whole thing takes me back to Richie Edwards' disappearance. He was another who just seemed too fragile to cope with, well, life.

[Sexy Celebrity]

All I Know is some people as screwed up as her have overcome their addictions. Some addicts turn their life around like Robert Downey Junior and some die from it. Mental illness or addiction or whatever she had is not incurable. But first you have to want to get better, to admit you have a problem. Winehouse never did that from all accounts so that makes her less sympathetic to me.

That's kinda harsh. Winehouse was only 27. Robert Downey Jr. was having problems all the way up to his late 30's/early 40's. Amy Winehouse just happened to have died at a young age. I don't know hardly anything about Amy Winehouse, but I think she still had time to turn her life around. Robert Downey Jr. gets a free pass because he was successful (for now) but yet he took longer to do it?

Plus, I would say Robert Downey Jr.'s example is even worse because he did manage to beat his problems and now he's become this uber-cool actor and role model. He sends a message to people, whether he wants to or not, that yes, you can experiment with drugs. Do it. If you get addicted or your life turns to crap because of it, don't worry, you can beat it all and come out on top someday like Robert Downey Jr.! Don't worry -- Robert went through it all and look where he is now. Try drugs -- Robert's an example that they don't have to wreck your life totally.

At least with Amy Winehouse dying, there's a deeper message: Do this and die like her. She is a warning.

[wintertriangles]

Plus, I would say Robert Downey Jr.'s example is even worse because he did manage to beat his problems and now he's become this uber-cool actor and role model. He sends a message to people, whether he wants to or not, that yes, you can experiment with drugs. Do it. If you get addicted or your life turns to crap because of it, don't worry, you can beat it all and come out on top someday like Robert Downey Jr.! Don't worry -- Robert went through it all and look where he is now. Try drugs -- Robert's an example that they don't have to wreck your life totally.People who read into things like that deserve what they get. Naivety is a hell of a vice these days.

[akatemple]

VH1 and a few other stations are playing a lot of her videos today, they just seem to play Rehab more then the others, seems kinda mean to be doing that to her.

[Godoggo]

That's kinda harsh. Winehouse was only 27. Robert Downey Jr. was having problems all the way up to his late 30's/early 40's. Amy Winehouse just happened to have died at a young age. I don't know hardly anything about Amy Winehouse, but I think she still had time to turn her life around. Robert Downey Jr. gets a free pass because he was successful (for now) but yet he took longer to do it?

I was thinking this too.

If people want to want to think Whinehouse deserved what she got, be my guest. I don't agree with you, but I can at least understand that. However, vilifying one addict for dying, but finding another sympathetic because they survived doesn't set well with me. Downey could have died, but because of circumstances or whatever he didn't. I certainly commend Downey for being able to recover. It's a so very hard thing to do. But he and Whinehouse were swimming in the same pool; if she deserves contempt, so does he.


Plus, I would say Robert Downey Jr.'s example is even worse because he did manage to beat his problems and now he's become this uber-cool actor and role model. He sends a message to people, whether he wants to or not, that yes, you can experiment with drugs. Do it.


This part of your post, I disagree with. I can't imagine anyone examining Downey's life and coming up with that message. I still think all he went through would be a deterrent from doing drugs in the first place. I would hope. :skeptical:

[Sexy Celebrity]

VH1 and a few other stations are playing a lot of her videos today, they just seem to play Rehab more then the others, seems kinda mean to be doing that to her.

Yeah, but how many videos does she even have? I think I read that she's only had two released albums -- a third was finished, but hasn't been released yet. It's not like she's Michael Jackson with a bunch of hit videos he's starred in over the years.

[Sinny McGuffins]

My favourite Amy Winehouse song, "You Know I'm No Good"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-I2s5zRbHg&ob=av3n

"I cheated myself, like I knew I would
I told you, I was trouble
You know, that I'm no good"

[Sexy Celebrity]

This part of your post, I disagree with. I can't imagine anyone examining Downey's life and coming up with that message. I still think all he went through would be a deterrent from doing drugs in the first place. I would hope. :skeptical:

It all depends on the person. I don't know of any people who do drugs because Robert Downey Jr. did them, but I can imagine that he'd be like a drug role model to people in a bad way instead of a good way. Especially with men.

I mean, as I see it, drugs are alluring. Drugs are going to be something that people will always seek out, no matter if there's tons of horror stories about them out in the world. All it takes is someone to know that Robert Downey Jr. survived drugs for them to make the decision to try it. Maybe they know his story or maybe they find him cool and like a role model or something, but it's a fact that Robert Downey Jr. didn't die from drugs.

I don't know who might reason with themselves to do drugs just because Robert Downey Jr. did them -- to be honest, it sounds like something I might say to myself if I was ever in the situation. But, hey, now I have Amy Winehouse being dead to scare me into the other direction.

[will.15]

The difference between Downey and Winehouse, he was an addict longer, but he could also function better than her. His life didn't unravel until he was much older. She was a complete mess in the late stages of her very young life. Downey had a reputation for showing up on the set sober.

I find Downey more inspiring than Winehouse (although he comes across like a real jerk in interviews). Maybe that is why he survived and she didn't. He is full of himself.

Even Judy Garland got past forty.

[Sexy Celebrity]

I find Downey more inspiring than Winehouse (although he comes across like a real jerk in interviews). Maybe that is why he survived and she didn't. He is full of himself.

I find this part interesting for some reason. How did being full of himself help Downey survive? Amy Winehouse was never full of herself? Did she take herself too seriously and self destruct that way? I find this little reason you threw in at the end kinda vague and I'm curious to know more of your feelings. We must get to the bottom of why she died and he did not!

[will.15]

It all depends on the person. I don't know of any people who do drugs because Robert Downey Jr. did them, but I can imagine that he'd be like a drug role model to people in a bad way instead of a good way. Especially with men.

I mean, as I see it, drugs are alluring. Drugs are going to be something that people will always seek out, no matter if there's tons of horror stories about them out in the world. All it takes is someone to know that Robert Downey Jr. survived drugs for them to make the decision to try it. Maybe they know his story or maybe they find him cool and like a role model or something, but it's a fact that Robert Downey Jr. didn't die from drugs.

I don't know who might reason with themselves to do drugs just because Robert Downey Jr. did them -- to be honest, it sounds like something I might say to myself if I was ever in the situation. But, hey, now I have Amy Winehouse being dead to scare me into the other direction.
But you would probably tell yourself I am strong like Downey. I can get through this. i am not a screwed up mess like Winehouse.

I also think the notion what brought about her end might be the news about Norway is pretty funny. I see no evidence Winehouse cared about anyone but herself. Addicts tend to be pretty self absorbed and not much interested in world events.

[Godoggo]

The difference between Downey and Winehouse, he was an addict longer, but he could also function better than her. His life didn't unravel until he was much older.

Lots of "functioning" addicts die.

[Sexy Celebrity]

But you would probably tell yourself I am strong like Downey. I can get through this. i am not a screwed up mess like Winehouse.

But the problem is -- what if I find out that I'm gonna get addicted to the drug? What if it takes over my life and I don't realize it? LOTS of people think they're strong and will get through this -- and they don't. Lots of people think they're not addicts and they are.

I also think the notion what brought about her end might be the news about Norway is pretty funny. I see no evidence Winehouse cared about anyone but herself. Addicts tend to be pretty self absorbed and not much interested in world events.

Well, yeah, it's one reason why I think it could even be a suicide. Especially when you figure she's 27 and she would join that "Dead 27 year old famous musician" club. I mean, that right there is gonna stick with her forever. She will forever be linked to Janis Joplin, Jimi Hendrix, Jim Morrison and Kurt Cobain because of that. To me, this would be a good reason to off yourself if you were really that crazy and self absorbed.

[Godoggo]

But the problem is -- what if I find out that I'm gonna get addicted to the drug? What if it takes over my life and I don't realize it? LOTS of people think they're strong and will get through this -- and they don't. Lots of people think they're not addicts and they are.

This. :up:

[will.15]

I find this part interesting for some reason. How did being full of himself help Downey survive? Amy Winehouse was never full of herself? Did she take herself too seriously and self destruct that way? I find this little reason you threw in at the end kinda vague and I'm curious to know more of your feelings. We must get to the bottom of why she died and he did not!

I think he is cocky and that quality helped him get through it. He had a screwed up childhood with a talented father who was also a big time druggie and also self destructed. That might have been a factor in him taking drugs. He had an inner strength that helped him get through his problem. Maybe it was around the house growing up. Winehouse appeared to be more like Garland, full of insecurities and inner demons.

[Sexy Celebrity]

I think he is cocky and that quality helped him get through it. He had a screwed up childhood with a talented father who was also a big time druggie and also self destructed. That might have been a factor in him taking drugs. He had an inner strength that helped him get through his problem. Maybe it was around the house growing up. Winehouse appeared to be more like Garland, full of insecurities and inner demons.

While I can't say you're wrong and I appreciate the observation, I also feel that things like cockiness and being around a druggie father and having a screwed up childhood aren't always tools for inner strength. I imagine there's got to be dead drug addicts who had the same traits. Robert Downey Jr. must have had a host of reasons that kept him alive and helped him get over it. Winehouse can't be like Garland, either, if Garland was able to last longer.

[will.15]

I gotta admit lenny Bruce was pretty cocky. He still died at forty.

[Sexy Celebrity]

I gotta admit lenny Bruce was pretty cocky. He still died at forty.

Nobody's cockier than Death.

http://growabrain.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/01/08/grim_reaper_death.jpg

[7thson]

I hate when the writing is on the wall and yet we all build that wall anyway.

[ash_is_the_gal]

But first you have to want to get better, to admit you have a problem. Winehouse never did that from all accounts so that makes her less sympathetic to me.

if anything, i just feel more sympathy for a person like that.

[ash_is_the_gal]

He had an inner strength that helped him get through his problem. Maybe it was around the house growing up. Winehouse appeared to be more like Garland, full of insecurities and inner demons.

oh christ, will, stop already with the baseless conclusions. in actuality, you have no idea what Winehouse was like. your "she appeared to be this and she appeared to be that" are vague and seen through the eyes of a person who has little sympathy and is extremely cynical. surely, you can see that (and don't call me shirley).

[mark f]

R.I.P. Amy. I didn't know much about you but you deserve some rest.

http://img.metro.co.uk/i/pix/2007/09/winemouseINS_450x300.jpg

[will.15]

oh christ, will, stop already with the baseless conclusions. in actuality, you have no idea what Winehouse was like. your "she appeared to be this and she appeared to be that" are vague and seen through the eyes of a person who has little sympathy and is extremely cynical. surely, you can see that (and don't call me shirley).
Even a cursory look of how her life was spinning out of control it is clear she had demons. I have actually made less assumptions about her than some other people have on this board.

[ash_is_the_gal]

Even a cursory look of how her life was spinning out of control it is clear she had demons. I have actually made less assumptions about her than some other people have on this board.

OK, but how does that prove she was somehow less strong or more out of control than say, Robert Downey Jr?

[ash_is_the_gal]

The fact that Amy died when she did isn't a shock, but then, would anyone had been shocked if Robert Downey Jr had died while he was still addicted? I'm thinking no, a thread similar to this would have popped up and those who are calling Amy selfish or weak (and she was, but that's not the point) would be saying the same thing about him. Robert Downey Jr is damn lucky he never OD'ed, because this easily could have been him.

I'm not trying to make Amy Winehouse out to be a saint, cause she wasn't. People make judgements about people all the time, so this is no different. However, the only person who could possibly know what it was like for Amy Winehouse is Amy Winehouse.

We can't know, we never will know.

[Deadite]

I think it's disgusting to speak ill of her. She was just another messed up person who died. Everyone here's going to die sooner or later too, no matter what you do, so there's no point in gloating over her stupid mistakes.

[Piddzilla]

About depression, which is not an emotion, by the way; people with a tendency to develop depressions have very often inherited that genetically from their parents. Still, you don't become a depressed person just because you're mom or dad was one. And similarly, your parents may have had the genetic prerequisites for developing depression without ever doing so, while you, on the other hand, do. Depressions are often triggered by emotionally traumatic events in your life. Without treatment the depressed person can end up being in a really bad shape, often turning to self-medication (alcohol and various drugs) and in some cases to suicide (some people define a drug overdose, depending on the circumstances, as a form of suicide).

About being addicted to drugs, Layne said it better than me:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9GAEFTeWko

[ollanik]

Rip

[will.15]

OK, but how does that prove she was somehow less strong or more out of control than say, Robert Downey Jr?
She is dead and he's not.

Her last public appearances were disasters. He was always sober and never caused problems when shooting a movie.

[Deadite]

That's a dumb oversimplification. You have no idea what kind of support Downey may have had at the right time that helped him that she might not have gotten. You don't know what reason Downey is still alive and she's dead. There could be any number of unknowns that contributed to his still being here/her death.

Some of it was most likely just plain luck. It's easy to say now she was weak and he was strong but that's just your own uninformed generalization.

[Yoda]

Yeah, we can't really work backwards from the outcomes to assume that they were completely different even as addicts. And if they were completely different, wouldn't that undermine using his example to criticize her, anyway?

[will.15]

My criticism is she never sought help, never tried to get better. Even wrote a song saying she wouldn't go to rehab. He tried and backslided, then finally turned his life around. Many addicts do make the decision to get better and do. They hit what they realize is bottom and turn it around. Her bottom was her death.

[ash_is_the_gal]

will, please stop talking.

thanks.

[will.15]

I'm not talking, I am writing and you don't have to read it.

[ash_is_the_gal]

But i'll feel better knowing you've stopped.

;)

[Deadite]

That doesn't prove anything. The death has no meaning in it, nothing that sums her up as a person. Her actions in life up to that point defined her, yes, but for all you know one single variable you don't know about could have changed everything and she might have lived and went on to have a great career, and Downey could be the one dead instead.

He hit bottom, she hit bottom. If he had died and she had lived, it would have nothing to do with strength or weakness, and you would probably be talking about how weak Downey was to not get help in time. You're not proving anything about either of them by contrasting them. You're just guessing. You don't really know why Downey is alive and she is dead, however many times you try to compare them. You just don't know.

[ash_is_the_gal]

Don't bother trying to reason with him. He'll just toss it aside by restating the same thing again.

[Yoda]

Er, she did go to rehab. She just relapsed multiple times.

I'm not defending her decisions. She has to be somewhat responsible for them, and I'm not going to go as far as to say that addiction is 100% something that happens to you. I believe there has to be a choice component, even if only initially. But we can't just compare her to some other celebrity and judge her based on that standard. No two addicts are alike.

All we know is that coming back from addiction appears, in general, to be possible. We don't know much of anything about how easy it is, let alone how easy it is for a specific person. I think by all accounts Downey Jr. was an addict, but not necessarily one with underlying mental health problems. I'm not sure we can say the same for Winehouse.

[Brodinski]

I sympathize with her family and friends. They lost someone very dear to them and that's always very painful, no matter how fvcked up that person was. They don't think of her in terms of 'talented addict', but in terms of 'daughter', 'niece' or 'friend'.

As for Amy herself, I can't say I was surprised. Frankly, I don't care about her death. Then again, I don't care much for anyone if I haven't directly or indirectly (and by this I mean family of a close friend, not knowing Amy through her vids and interviews) known them. Maybe it's my lack of empathy shining through there.

I always care more when it all seems so random. When I heard about the massacre in Norway, I was driving my car and I had to force myself to focus on the road, because my thoughts were elsewhere at that point. First thing I did when I got home, was message a Norwegian pal of mine to check if he and his family were ok. Same goes for the current famine that Somalia is being hit hard with. I've seen people on the news saying they had to walk for miles in search of water and food, losing many of their relatives along the way. They had to leave these people behind next to the 'road' they were walking on, because they had no time to bury them.

When I then hear about Amy Winehouse who had the world at her feet, but messed it all up, the question I ask myself is: why should I care?

[Sexy Celebrity]

Well, when Brodinski puts it all that way, then, yeah, to hell with Amy Winehouse.

http://img2.timeinc.net/people/i/2009/startracks/090316/amy_winehouse240.jpg

[ash_is_the_gal]

Meh. I don't think anyone should have an obligation to care about this, but then again, i don't think anyone is obligated to care about what happened in Norway, either.

Is there some kind of assumption that posting in this thread means we care about her?

[Sexy Celebrity]

We are fascinated by her death.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqqBs6kkzHE&ob=av3e

[Brodinski]

Is there some kind of assumption that posting in this thread means we care about her?

Did I say we did?

[ash_is_the_gal]

No, but are you keeper of the thread?

Anyway, I used the word "assume" for a reason. I'm more interested in discussing cases like Amy instead of Amy herself because i think it's interesting.

[Brodinski]

Discuss away. You have my permission.

[christine]

jesus please stop. Someone has died, you might not care but place yourself in the shoes of her family. How would you like your daughter/sister/friend discussed and their life picked over like this? unbelievable.

[Piddzilla]

I sympathize with her family and friends. They lost someone very dear to them and that's always very painful, no matter how fvcked up that person was. They don't think of her in terms of 'talented addict', but in terms of 'daughter', 'niece' or 'friend'.

As for Amy herself, I can't say I was surprised. Frankly, I don't care about her death. Then again, I don't care much for anyone if I haven't directly or indirectly (and by this I mean family of a close friend, not knowing Amy through her vids and interviews) known them. Maybe it's my lack of empathy shining through there.

I always care more when it all seems so random. When I heard about the massacre in Norway, I was driving my car and I had to force myself to focus on the road, because my thoughts were elsewhere at that point. First thing I did when I got home, was message a Norwegian pal of mine to check if he and his family were ok. Same goes for the current famine that Somalia is being hit hard with. I've seen people on the news saying they had to walk for miles in search of water and food, losing many of their relatives along the way. They had to leave these people behind next to the 'road' they were walking on, because they had no time to bury them.

When I then hear about Amy Winehouse who had the world at her feet, but messed it all up, the question I ask myself is: why should I care?

No one is saying that you should and no one is comparing the death of Amy Winehouse to the Oslo/Utøya massacre or famine in Somalia. It is possible to be affected on a personal level of all those things at the same time without one thing taking away any sympathy from the other - really. In fact, I would honestly welcome a thread about the famine on the African horn and what the western world should do about it. I think this is a terribly urgent matter that require more than coquettish posts in a thread devoted to the memory of Amy Winehouse.

[Sexy Celebrity]

I'm sorry to say this, Christine, but this is not the only place in the world that's harshly judging Amy Winehouse - and - she is a celebrity. A very famous celebrity who's on all the news channels, every magazine, you name it. This is not just some random woman who died. Amy Winehouse didn't want this kind of attention? She shouldn't have been famous and died this way. Her family deserves no say in what we choose to say about her here.

[TheUsualSuspect]

Neg rep for a joke, some people are wound way too tight.

I had her death as a facebook status to let people know, it got 5 likes. Messed up world we live in right?

We live in an age where dozens of people die in Norway and people are more concerned with a drug addicted singer that died. It's sad.

[Piddzilla]

Neg rep for a joke, some people are wound way too tight.

We live in an age where dozens of people die in Norway and people are more concerned with a drug addicted singer that died. It's sad.

So, if the Norway massacre hadn't happen it would be ok to post in this thread? If the massacre had been in Pakistan or Sudan or Afghanistan, would it have been ok to express sadness over the fact that Amy Winehouse is dead?

[TheUsualSuspect]

A death is a death, sad indeed.

My point is that people are more 'concerned' with a drug addicted singer that's been out of the limelight for a few years and dies and a more heartbreaking tragic story is completely shut out. You are taking what I said and are going way too far to one side of it. My whole point is that the media always goes for the more popular story, than the more "world orienting" one.

Does she have my sympathies? No. The people brutally massacred do.

Why bother to bring in those other countries? It tells me you're just pissed off looking to start something rather than trying to engage in an actual conversation.

[Sinny McGuffins]

We live in an age where dozens of people die in Norway and people are more concerned with a drug addicted singer that died. It's sad.Who said we're more concerned? Her death has nothing to do with the Norway massacre. I made this thread because I very much liked Amy Winehouse as an artist, and we have a sub-forum for music related topics.

Of course what happened in Norway is tragic and horrendous. If you think we care about her death more than the deaths of those innocent people in Norway then you're very much mistaken.

[will.15]

And let's face it, her family doesn't know and probably doesn't care this forum exists. People talking about you when you're alive and after death is the price of fame.

[Sinny McGuffins]

My whole point is that the media always goes for the more popular story, than the more "world orienting" one.Every news show I've seen since Saturday has still had the Norway incident as the main headline, followed by Amy Winehouse's death. Most newspapers have been the same too.

And lots of major news stories occur and or not talked about in these forums, doesn't mean the members don't know or care about them.

[TheUsualSuspect]

Who said we're more concerned? Her death has nothing to do with the Norway massacre. I made this thread because I very much liked Amy Winehouse as an artist, and we have a sub-forum for music related topics.

Of course what happened in Norway is tragic and horrendous. If you think we care about her death more than the deaths of those innocent people in Norway then you're very much mistaken.

I'm not talking about the people here, I'm talking about the people out there. :rolleyes:

[TheUsualSuspect]

Every news show I've seen since Saturday has still had the Norway incident as the main headline, followed by Amy Winehouse's death. Most newspapers have been the same too.

And lots of major news stories occur and or not talked about in these forums, doesn't mean the members don't know or care about them.

Since then, most likely.

I'm talking about the day of and after, it was ALL Winehouse and then an add on blip at the ending regarding the Norway situation.

Although, there are still people today talking more about Winehouse than Norway.

[Piddzilla]

A death is a death, sad indeed.

My point is that people are more 'concerned' with a drug addicted singer that's been out of the limelight for a few years and dies and a more heartbreaking tragic story is completely shut out. You are taking what I said and are going way too far to one side of it. My whole point is that the media always goes for the more popular story, than the more "world orienting" one.

Does she have my sympathies? No. The people brutally massacred do.

Why bother to bring in those other countries? It tells me you're just pissed off looking to start something rather than trying to engage in an actual conversation.

Why bother to bring in Utøya and Somalia in this thread? Start your own! We have dozens and dozens of threads on this forum devoted to the memories of dead celebrities and you don't post derogatory posts about the deceased person in those threads, do you? Why not? People die like flies all the time, every day, every second - and it's coquettish of you to point out that there's worse things in life than the death of Amy Winehouse. As if we didn't know that. That doesn't mean that you can't feel sad about the fact that she's dead at the age of 27, which to me is much sadder than if Paul Newman or Elizabeth Taylor die at an older age.

You would never in a million years had made a remark like you did in the other post if the massacre had been in an African or Asian country. That's why I brought those countries up.

[Sinny McGuffins]

Since then, most likely.

I'm talking about the day of and afterThe day of was Saturday.

[Piddzilla]

Since then, most likely.

I'm talking about the day of and after, it was ALL Winehouse and then an add on blip at the ending regarding the Norway situation.

Although, there are still people today talking more about Winehouse than Norway.

I assure you that is not nearly the case in Sweden, where I live.

[Sexy Celebrity]

That doesn't mean that you can feel sad about the fact that she's dead at the age of 27, which to me is much sadder than if Paul Newman or Elizabeth Taylor die at an older age.

Maybe to you, but not to me. Personally, I feel more for both Paul Newman and Elizabeth Taylor dying over Amy Winehouse. I don't care if Amy was younger -- wasted life? Big deal. Especially if she did in fact bring it on herself.

It's more disturbing, but it's not really sadder.

[mark f]

Once again, R.I.P. Amy.

Perhaps this thread should R.I.P. too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sONfxPCTU0

[Sinny McGuffins]

This death is sadder than that death. That death is sadder than this death... Seriously, guys.

[Piddzilla]

Maybe to you, but not to me.

Yeah, as I said: to me. Remind me to tell you how little I care the next time someone you care about dies.

[TheUsualSuspect]

Piddzillia, you're an Amy Winehouse fan, I get it. Now take the stick out of your ass. You don't know anything about me,so sit down and shut up before you make accusations.

Second, it's all relevant. Happened on the same day, death in the news. A thread about Amy Winehouse dying and I bring up the fact that people are more concerned with her death than others in Norway, just because she was a celebrity. You flip your ****. I don't know what your damn problem is, but you need to chill the **** out.

What derogatory post did I have? Did I say I was happy she was dead and that she can burn in hell? Did I say I hoped her death was long and gruesome? No, I said I wasn't surprised.

Jesus Christ man, go cry in a corner. You're making this more personal than it has to be. I'm done with this **** and you.

[Sexy Celebrity]

Yeah, as I said: to me. Remind me to tell you how little I care the next time someone you care about dies.

*bitchslaps you in advance*

[Yoda]

Alright, I'm closing this thread. It appears people can't discuss this topic without insulting each other.