View Full Version : Soulmates: Romantic Notion or Immature Cop-Out?
SamsoniteDelilah
03-13-06, 01:58 PM
This was touched on in another thread...
Do you believe there is one person out there who is perfect for you? That's not to say they're perfect (hopefully no one expects that) but perfect for you? Have you ever thought you'd found "the one"? Do you still?
I've never been in a relationship that i felt was gonna last forever. But i've been in ones which felt very good - very compatible, but with enough friction and difference to keep things interesting ;)
Relationships aren't exactly my strong suit, but i do believe there's more than one woman out there i could love enough, and who could love me enough, for us to have some good 'long-distance', well, love :) ;)
SamsoniteDelilah
03-13-06, 02:22 PM
That's kinda where I am with it too, Gg.
I used to believe there was That Perfect Someone out there.... And when I met people who seemed really well-matched for me, I usually thought "this is IT!" way early in the relationship, and because of that, I was willing to overlook areas where we really didn't match up.
Now, I believe that there are qualities I need in a partner, and some I need to avoid, and that there are probably a lot of people who meet that criteria. It's a matter of meeting someone who has those qualities, and I've gotten a lot more... awake... about the whole process. The star-crossed, doe-eyed phase is fun, and I really think it's necessary to have that with someone, as a balance for later when you're looking at their dried toothpaste that has somehow ended up stuck on your hairbrush... But I no longer see that phase alone as a determinant of whether it's a good match or not.
The star-crossed, doe-eyed phase is fun, and I really think it's necessary to have that with someone, as a balance for later when you're looking at their dried toothpaste that has somehow ended up stuck on your hairbrush... But I no longer see that phase alone as a determinant of whether it's a good match or not.
Heh, yeah good way of putting it. It's gotta be there, but there's gotta be more too.
And hey, you can put up with the ole toothpaste-hairbrush? Now that's the kind of attribute i look for in a lady ;)
SmegFirk
03-13-06, 04:33 PM
I think I was negative enough in the other thread,:o
Godsend
03-13-06, 04:40 PM
I don't believe in destiny. I don't believe in fate. I don't believe in the one.
People tell me, "Hey! That's what love is!" I tell them they've seen too many movies. I believe the thought of a perfect someone that you were DESTINED to be with corrolates with unconditional love, which is VERY powerful.
I think it's possible to find someone that's perfect for you. In fact I believe there's more than one person that fits your needs. Finding that person is the hard part though. They might exist, but coming across them is something else.
A perfect someone? Absolutely. Destined by a creator or an architect or whatever you want to call it? No.
I honestly think it depends on the indvidual(s). It is almost like a religious preference, seriously. Some believe that there is the perfect someone for them, and others do not. I do not feel that either is wrong. Personally I think that in the unromantic scheme of things we can chemically/physically be attracted to someone be it pheremones or whatnot which make us think that they are the perfect mate, but in fact is nothing more than lust or for lack of a better word (I did say unromantic:) ) horny. On the other hand there is more to a mate than the ability to buckle your knees just by looking at them. Respect is the biggest value to me, if you find someone who truly respects you and whom you respect then it definitely is a step in the right direction. If they respect you and buckle your knees, then well......:)
SmegFirk
03-13-06, 05:03 PM
...I think it's possible to find someone that's perfect for you. In fact I believe there's more than one person that fits your needs. Finding that person is the hard part though...
this is exactly why I have never subscribed to the notion that there is such a thing as the one. Plenty of people make a mockery of the idea anyway. Being with somebody and saying "he/she is definitely the one for me", and then something happens three months, three years, whenever, down the line and then they say "he/she obviously wasn't the one". Repeat until cynical heh.
With regards to finding these people that are compatible, things are surely easier now that they were years ago. People meeting and getting together from different countries and even continents, I was once engaged to a Canadian for god sake lol, also helps to dispel the idea that there is only one special person out there for everybody.
also helps to dispel the idea that there is only one special person out there for everybody.
I agree about the "one" part. Certainly with billions and billions of people in the world there is more than just "one" personality out there that connects with you and makes them perfect, but, and this is a big but; there aren't thousands, and in the big scheme of things, if you really find someone who seems to be the one and you cannot find any reason whatsoever not to take a leap of faith yet you fail to do so you have noone else to blame but yourself. I am an avid supporter of chance, because without it you do not experience life to its fullest.:)
SamsoniteDelilah
03-13-06, 05:19 PM
I think I was negative enough in the other thread,:o
I have been called "unromantic" for my views on the whole issue, so I know where you're getting the "negative" thing, but really... I think it's a lot more romantic to think that two people can meet and truly appreciate each other for who they each are, rather than it being a "this is bigger than both of us" situation, where the individuals are, in effect, along for the ride. Actively choosing a person seems a lot more positive and sweet and romantic, to me.
Godsend, yup... same page. :)
If they respect you and buckle your knees, then well......
uhhhh yup. :)
chicagofrog
03-13-06, 05:20 PM
I honestly think it depends on the indvidual(s). It is almost like a religious preference, seriously. Some believe that there is the perfect someone for them, and others do not. I do not feel that either is wrong.
If they respect you and buckle your knees, then well......:)
i humbly agree. let them all choose.
note: if they respect you (and you them) but do *not* buckle your knees, tis not the one.
note: if they respect you (and you them) but do *not* buckle your knees, tis not the one.
Not the "one", but certainly a good choice for both, because dissapointment is too rampant these days.....
Strummer521
03-13-06, 05:37 PM
Personally I think I'm probably destined to be alone. Not destined by fate but by various social and psychological factors. In other words, I don't really believe in a divine sort of fate...more like a fate that is created by society and it's groups as well as specific individuals. This provides the odds as to what is most likely to happen. I think two people can completely click in a soulmate kind of way, but I think "love at first sight" is bullsh*t that people use to manipulate.
SmegFirk
03-13-06, 05:46 PM
..if you really find someone who seems to be the one and you cannot find any reason whatsoever not to take a leap of faith yet you fail to do so you have noone else to blame but yourself....
absolutely... although I used to be guilty of this until my early 20's. Until then I was pretty shy and would keep quiet in the hope that something would happen without me having to pluck up the courage to say something... thankfully I realised this was getting me nowhere.
Not that everything is all roses now, but at least I can say I am doing my best :p
Darth Stujitzu
03-13-06, 06:54 PM
Well, call me an old romantic, but I do believe in Soulmates.
My Mum and Dad were definetly soulmates, and this is probably why it is so hard for my mum now my dad's gone.
I still hope to find someone, but even if you find your perfect match, it still takes work and loads of communication to make it work.
Still, until I find that lucky lady, I plan to have loads of fun, now ladies, no fighting, stop biting and form an orderly que...... :randy:
adidasss
03-13-06, 07:02 PM
i think we should rename the randy smiley to darth smiley, i do believe there's no other person that comes close to his randyness on this site, in fact i think he's the only one that uses it....;)
oh and no, i don't believe there's a soulmate, it would depress me if that were true, the chances of meeting that "perfect" person that was "made" for you would be like winning the lottery....
Godsend
03-13-06, 07:10 PM
Personally I think I'm probably destined to be alone. Not destined by fate but by various social and psychological factors. In other words, I don't really believe in a divine sort of fate...more like a fate that is created by society and it's groups as well as specific individuals. This provides the odds as to what is most likely to happen. I think two people can completely click in a soulmate kind of way, but I think "love at first sight" is bullsh*t that people use to manipulate.
Ehhh....you can be saying that right now, but you have to remember that there's tomorrow...and next week...and next month. Then again, no one knows you better than yourself.
Stemming off the subject of love and romance, I'd like to put in a little something. I'm 17 and obviously I come across most of my relationships in high school. Of course, that's natural.
This is the point in life where everyone is experimenting and testing the boundaries (which I believe is bull****). Now once again this is coming from a high schoolers point of view. These kids 14-18 run around saying "OH I LOVE ______ SOOOOOOOOO MUCH!" by their lockers. The next week, it's someone else. This is the immature cop-out you were speaking of Deliliah. Does it exist in adults? ABSOLUTELY!
Now this is my opinion. Marriage is supposedly supposed to be the final (or second to last) step in a relationship. This is when the knot is "tied" and "unbreakable". This is when you're supposed to stop all the horse **** and settle down. You can no longer fool around and what not because this is it. Couples (and I don't know if most) usually enter marriage with a huge "FCK IT!" party known as the bachelor/bachelorette party. Making sense now? There's that immature cop out.
Sure I might be a person of morals and values and they don't necessarily mix in with yours, but it's my opinion.
I doubt I'm making much sense. I've been sick and drugged like no other.
Back to my rambling and views on high school immaturity. A teacher of ours asked how many people in the class had boyfriends/girlfriends. A significant amount, as you might guess, raised their hands. He asked how many of them felt as if they were in love with them. Once again, the significant amount raised their hands. Then he asked if those who were in love were going to get married with their partner.
No one raised their hand.
This is basically aimed for strummer. What my teacher basically proved was that you're young and.... STUPID! Now I'm not calling you stupid. I looked at your profile and it didn't mention a year towards your birthday, but you still have time!
Anyways, I'm done. Bored.
Beflabbergasted.
:p
Darth Stujitzu
03-13-06, 07:10 PM
i think we should rename the randy smiley to darth smiley, i do believe there's no other person that comes close to his randyness on this site, in fact i think he's the only one that uses it....;)....
It's only cause I ain't getting any good lovin', or bad lovin' for that matter!!!!!
Must not use the randy smiley...............make the bad smiley go away!!!!
adidasss
03-13-06, 07:13 PM
@godsend....psstt...maybe he's butt oogleh...;)
Godsend
03-13-06, 07:17 PM
@godsend....psstt...maybe he's butt oogleh...;)
If I think I know what your saying, and I don't think I do, I think I should say uh oh
thmilin
03-13-06, 07:36 PM
I'm pretty much with 7thson and Godsend. Wow, biblical, huh? :D
I have a religious/world/scientific/romantic view. The world we live in is conceived of many minds, beliefs, and parts. Thus, the existence we have can be made of many parts. To wit:
Religious.
I believe in a higher power, it's not necessarily God (for if God exists, is he seriously sitting there plotting out your romantic future? i think not). But, he/she could possibly cast an eye down to you when you're born and say, "I imagine this one with a shy, sweet, brave girl." And, lo and behold, it eventually occurs.
I believe when we arrive in this world, events conspire to have us learn and grow, and urge and encourage us toward a goal (enlightenment, whatever - becoming the best you can be with what you've been given in this lifetime). Along the path, there are many lessons, and these lessons include relationships of all kinds - also romantic ones.
World.
Similar to the above, the world at large has an impact on who we are, what we will be. It can be "Mother Earth" or "Nature" or just, "Life" - however people see it, it's the whimsical turn of events, chance and coincidence, cruel karma and ironic cruelties. The world turns without a real care to your feelings or needs but often delivers you as many kindnesses as cruelties. You can't help these, any more than you can help a storm or a blue sky.
Along with this, you can't help it when someone is placed in your path who is magnificent, or not. Sometimes the world tilts of its own volition - its own will. Is that will specific? Could be, maybe not. The World may say, here you go, a woman who will break your heart and leave you devastated. You'd loathe the result at first, but decades later, discover it prepared you for the fabulous person you ended up marrying, and never divorced.
Scientific.
I believe in lust in first sight. This is chemical and the most common. We meet someone who, at that time in our physiological, emotional, and psychological development, fires off synapses and pheromones that make us "weak in the knees." We can't get enough, the chemical high is awesome. They couldn't have done this to us at any other point of our lives - it only works in that moment.
The immediacy is intense, and we know it's unique. It is very unique, that specialness is tied to who you are, and who they are, in that moment. However, who you are, and who they are, is destined to change fairly soon, and it's unlikely the relationship will last through it.
The "lust at first sight" lasts for a very short while. I generally call it the 6th month factor. Within 3 months your high tapers of. More outgoing, impatient people end it right there. Some linger, worrying over being a quitter or telling themselves it can't have been a lie, they felt so much for this person at first. So you overlook things and generally at the 6th month mark, you learn to move on (someone iniates a breakup, regardless, whether it's you or the other person).
If it goes on for longer than this it's usually because one or both people are in denial.
Romantic.
I do believe in love at first sight. I think it's rarer, actually, like, nearly impossible. I think it is possible to recognize the potential to not only lust for a person but also love them at the same moment you first see/meet them. However if you navigate the lust waters poorly, you won't ever get a chance to develop into love. If you make it past the 6 month mark and still have strong feelings for the person, then it is indeed, potentially love.
I believe in a "the one" but I think that one is so rare you are likely to never, ever meet them. A perfect conglomerate of person who would never rub you the wrong way and always encourage you to be your best while themselves always being their best - perfection? Perfection is called that for a reason, it's next to impossible.
But you can find people who are "perfect for you." I believe there a handful of truly exceptional "perfect for you" people out there in the world for every person. I call these "great loves." These great loves will cross your path and the sad thing is sometimes the time just won't be right. Ie, you'll meet a great love when you're 6, and they'll move away, and you'll never see them again or know what happened to them. Such is life. [See "World" view for explanation. :)]
You can meet a great love when you yourself are a mess. Thus, you'll have an intense relationship that detonates because one or both of you is not "your best self in that moment." Because it goes badly, you may never try again. Or, if the love between you is strong enough, time, distance and development will cause you to find one another and try again.
Numbers
I've got numbers. I believe there's a "one" but I may never meet him. If he exists, it's somewhere I'll never go, or he's 80 and is about to die, or he'll be born in 15 years and I'll die before he's old enough to date.
I believe there are 4-7 great loves (some number like that, not exact), and you may only meet 2-3 of them. There are maybe a dozen strong loves (people you can live with, think about marrying, even have kids with), and only a handful of those may ever occur.
Then there are what are truly "lovers" - someone meant for you to bond with, just like a friend you care about, who will enter and leave your life and potentially even keep in touch. You may live together for short periods, date for a long time, etc., but you know you won't be together forever, because your connection just isn't that strong enough and the two of you aren't truly "matched" on a romantic level (ie, it's more like lust + friendship, but you tried to see if it'd be love).
the kook factor
I realize this could come off as nuts or random. It's truly what I think, developed over years. It's changed and morphed. This is why when I have to state my religion somewhere I often put "Other" ... my beliefs fit me, and are as flexible as life is changeable. :)
SamsoniteDelilah
03-13-06, 07:39 PM
...This is the point in life where everyone is experimenting and testing the boundaries (which I believe is bull****). Now once again this is coming from a high schoolers point of view. These kids 14-18 run around saying "OH I LOVE ______ SOOOOOOOOO MUCH!" by their lockers. The next week, it's someone else. This is the immature cop-out you were speaking of Deliliah. Does it exist in adults? ABSOLUTELY!...
I can't believe you brought this up, because I've been feeling a rant brewing on the very same topic. I have friends ranging in age from 14 to 54 and yup adults absolutely do take that immature cop-out. Hearing a woman in her 50's say "I know he's not good for me, but I looooove himmmmm" makes me want to <edited for violent content>. It's nothing more than a refusal to take responsiblity for her own choices, when she says that. And what's driving it? Sex. People put sex over their own self-worth. That is insane. NO one can lead a happy life if it's run by their hormones. And it's depressing when actual grown-ups don't realise that.
Now this is my opinion. Marriage is supposedly supposed to be the final (or second to last) step in a relationship. This is when the knot is "tied" and "unbreakable". This is when you're supposed to stop all the horse **** and settle down. You can no longer fool around and what not because this is it. Couples (and I don't know if most) usually enter marriage with a huge "FCK IT!" party known as the bachelor/bachelorette party. Making sense now? There's that immature cop out.
YES! :D Agreed on that, too. If you need a big blow-out and final fling before getting married... you're not mature enough to get married.
...Back to my rambling and views on high school immaturity. A teacher of ours asked how many people in the class had boyfriends/girlfriends. A significant amount, as you might guess, raised their hands. He asked how many of them felt as if they were in love with them. Once again, the significant amount raised their hands. Then he asked if those who were in love were going to get married with their partner.
No one raised their hand.
Yeah, this is part of a spooky syndrome. It's no longer ok to just date, any more. You go from smiling at someone to immediate insta-relationship. And the second that's over, there's so much pressure to get into another one. People act like they're going to disappear if they don't have a boyfriend or girlfriend.
SamsoniteDelilah
03-13-06, 07:53 PM
Great post, Thmilin! :)
Chance and happenstance and timing are all major factors in how we grow, and how we percieve those things we encounter along the way. Took me a really long time to get my head around that.
Darth Stujitzu
03-13-06, 07:59 PM
I've been single for a long time ( shock, horror, gasp from all Mofos ) I don't feel the need for a girlfriend to be a complete person, but I'm still hopefull of finding that special girl to settle with and have kids with, but I'm in no rush.
If you're not happy with who you are, how can you expect someone else to be?
Too many of my friends have rushed into long term relationships or marrige, and as a result they are now in unhappy partnerships with people they are not really suited to.
Still they feel the need to badger me into settling down, my dreams lie elsewhere, and so does my future soulmate, I hope.
Godsend
03-13-06, 08:20 PM
I'm bascially athiest. I don't view religion as a necessity. In fact I view religion as genetics. You're born into it and if you have the spiritual knowledge you'll go ahead and make your own choice to as to what religion you want. Nothing more, nothing else.
My morals and values are here due to a small little philosophical stage I went through with my life. I started asking those "deep" and "rooted" questions. Too bad I didn't get any answers. And then I started to look for quotes and and I found them to be pure bull****.
And then somebody told me to take life by the horns.
And then I did. But I went a step further. I cracked it's frigging neck and had a grand feast. Ever since that day, I feel as if I am the ruler of my own domain...but then again, I am 17.
Anyways, back to my morals, sure there was some religious influence on me, but not that much. I believe a person does not need religion or any belief to be a good person. You don't need any of it. It's not a mind set, but an action set. You can talk the talk, but can you walk the walk? Something so simple makes it's so much bigger.
Coming back onto the topic, I'm aware of the fact I have GREATLY aligned my views of love/romance on morals and values. The supposedly "good" morals and values. On a social platform, you can call me a conservative. Go for it. Yet, I still let people go ahead and make their own decisions. It does, indeed, ruin it for others. For ex. everyone now a days is supposedly doing drugs (high school point of view). The ones that are doing drugs are the loudest, most obnoxious. They, sadly, represent the rest of us. In return we're in the same category.
Now let's not entirely go into the subject of drugs. It's touchy. It's personal, but I need to bring up another point.
Drugs in relationships. Requiem for a Dream or whatever that movie was called. We see it all the time. I've been watching The Sopranos religiously and see it from Chris and Ade's point of view. It's so ridiculous how MATURE ADULTS that are IN LOVE will allow one another to SUFFER and HURT.
Pfft. I spit at society.
:)
thmilin
03-13-06, 08:29 PM
spit spit spit! tis true. mature and immature adults and children "in love" often allow one another to suffer and hurt. most usually it's not a pure love anyway, it's a selfish love, which to me, is not really love. but that's why they do that crap.
samsonite, i thank you. ;)
my mother always told me that there is someone out there for e everyone...and i believe that too...
chicagofrog
03-14-06, 10:03 AM
Not the "one", but certainly a good choice for both, because disappointment is too rampant these days.....
never said the contrary 7thson :) , like you agreed, not the *one* though, and some, like myself (probably unfortunately for their own happiness's sake) will never settle for less.
chicagofrog
03-14-06, 10:08 AM
I believe in lust in first sight.
me too. but i don't agree - or hope i don't have to agree??? - about the short term thing you associate with it. if the chemistry really *is*, if its strength is real enough, it'll be lasting.
or: is it coincidence my true love, and the maybe two other loves i met, all were at first sight?
This was touched on in another thread...
Do you believe there is one person out there who is perfect for you? That's not to say they're perfect (hopefully no one expects that) but perfect for you? Have you ever thought you'd found "the one"? Do you still?
Whoa. MoFo got deep!
..yes.
chicagofrog
03-15-06, 08:19 AM
I think it's possible to find someone that's perfect for you (...)Finding that person is the hard part though. They might exist, but coming across them is something else.
1) i thought THAT was hard. the hardest, have you thought about it, is you might find the right person, but *you* are not the right person for her/him.
now, try and calculate the probabilities that A not only finds Z but represents the ideal for Z, just like Z is A's ideal...
2) add to that the fact that if ever A met Z at a time when Z is not ready, too late or too soon, it wouldn't be the right moment...
(cuz yes, tis not all about the right person, tis about the right person at the right moment!),
and tell me, what the heck are the probabilities of finding that person?
3) and look around, what's the percentage of couples that break up, matrimonies that divorce, and saddest of all maybe, how many (even among your friends) just settled/are settling for something much less than the perfect love, whether it is good sex but no passionate conversations, conversations yes but with boring sex, friendship only, and most often, just security and not being alone (cuz friends, society, books, movies, media, etc, consider it abnormal to be alone for more than, let's say, 6 months (and i'm being nice), and for oneself too, cuz one can be scared of ending alone)...
meaning, most either never had such an expectation in life, or gave it up.
not that they didn't have reasons to, judging by the reasoning above...
I've been back and forth a hundred times on this. If there really is one perfect person for me, I'm pretty sure I've already found her and lost her.
speedbump
03-15-06, 01:17 PM
I don't believe in one person for everyone...you can make many different relationships work if you put effort into it and grow together in the long run.
chicagofrog
03-16-06, 01:32 PM
If there really is one perfect person for me, I'm pretty sure I've already found her and lost her.
that's two of us.
I don't believe in one person for everyone...you can make many different relationships work if you put effort into it and grow together in the long run.
What in the world does that mean?
allthatglitters
03-18-06, 04:04 PM
I am scramblign along and I was only able to skim what most said, and I hoep to carve some time out later in the day to read what y'all had to say because it seems interesting and thought-provoking enough. I myself believe that love is more than a feeling, more than just a chance occurance. Love is what we choose to do, essentially. I do believe in soulmates, but I am more apt to contribute the success of those souful relationships to comittment and hard work. It ain't easy but it sure as hell is worth it.
that's two of us.
ain't it a B!tch?
I've found mine. There's nobody else more perfect for me.
linespalsy
03-22-06, 02:33 AM
Dragging this topic into the cinemas for a moment, I rewatched My Dinner With Andre a couple of weeks ago and something the Andre Gregory character said in that movie popped up out of the abyss when I looked at this thread. He was taking issue with a justification for cheating that bothered him: that the strong passion that goes hand in hand with love eventually wears out and then it's perfectly natural/fine to seek it elsewhere. I see one moral argument that people should take responsibility for their sexual choices (how?) but I think there's another one here, that responsibility means trying to break down emotional/social walls separrating you from object of affections. It's really tough because part of that is getting over basic insecurities that I think tend to get grossly exaggerated the closer you get to someone, though Gregory's character put it as seeing past social roles and being able to react spontaneously to someone rather than habitually. I certainly agree with the second part, which doesn't seem to be that controvercial in theory but that is really tough to get at because there's true spontineity and then symbolic, ritualized spontineity that you see in porn or romantic movies, which is always parallel to the idea of it because it can only be defined through ritual.
so yeah, I think romance and immaturity (maybe lack of sophistication is a better term) go hand in hand most of the time, but basically I do agree with the idea of soulmate (even though the definition of a soul is pretty nebulous), except that instead of just one there are any number of potential soul-mates.
That said, I'm also a pretty immature and lazy guy, and in most cases perfectly content to interact vacuously with people or not at all.
Sexy Celebrity
03-22-06, 10:17 AM
I believe there's a "one" but I may never meet him. If he exists, it's somewhere I'll never go, or he's 80 and is about to die
If he's 80 and a MILLIONAIRE about to die, you might want to put out an ad looking for him, see if he also believes in soulmates. Anna Nicole Smith obviously did and look at her now. :D Trimspa, baby! :D
birdygyrl
03-22-06, 11:16 AM
I mentioned in another thread that the one thing I regret losing the most was the One. He got away, or I should be honest and say I let him go. I was young and immature at the time and didn't see his wonderful qualities for what they were. He was loving, warm, caring, responsible, not to mention handsome, and I let it go for someone who was more reckless. I wish I'd had the insight I have now. This is not to say that there wouldn't have been a few speedbumps along the way. I believe that to be true of all relationships. Its not smooth sailing all the time. I think those bumps are what pulls couples together or splits them apart. I've been in many relationships but none had the depth that would have led me to believe that they were my soulmate. Even my short lived marriage. I thought it a good thing at the time and was committed to making it work. Too bad the ex didn't have the same degree of commitment. I never thought of him as my soulmate, but he was close. He was a decent hard working man and I thought we had a good chance. But it wasn't meant to be. So going forward I guess I will have to "settle" a little because I've already had my gift.
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 11:32 AM
So going forward I guess I will have to "settle" a little because I've already had my gift.
but is it fair for the one you're with, even if some go by the motto "ignorance is bliss" and don't let him know he's never gonna be the *one*???
birdygyrl
03-22-06, 11:48 AM
I guess I was just looking at it from a purely selfish perspective. I'm not sure what to say. Telling somebody that they aren't the "one", well, I think I might be honest and let them know about the "one" that was in my past. I don't think I would ever say "You're not my ideal soulmate, love, but you'll do in a pinch." Maybe that's not fair, but its what I would probably do. I would love the person and make them feel loved. Maybe that's all we can ask, to give our best.
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 12:12 PM
I might be honest and let them know about the "one" that was in my past. I don't think I would ever say "You're not my ideal soulmate, love, but you'll do in a pinch." Maybe that's not fair, but its what I would probably do.
thanx for the honesty. but, how are you gonna tell them without making them feel more than "not your ideal soulmate" that would "do in a pinch"?
and oppositely, would you accept yourself being just that for them, in case *the one* was already in their past too?
Darth Stujitzu
03-22-06, 12:42 PM
Love is a very complex thing, its had me confused many a time. I still don't believe I found my special one ( I don't mean Jose Mourinho, Chelsea fans!!! ) so I'm still out there looking. I suppose there is always the worry that when you do find that special someone, that you are not their ideal mate, and as you pointed out, sometimes ignorance is bliss.
Then again, what woman wouldn't be smittened with a red blooded horny Scotsman???
Gotta go, Pussycat Dolls are on MTV.
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 12:44 PM
what woman wouldn't be smittened with a red blooded horny Scotsman???
those who prefer a green blooded kinky Frogman?? :D
Darth Stujitzu
03-22-06, 12:46 PM
Ooooooooooooh la la! :randy:
Us Scotsmen look better in a skirt though, if only someone would tell Jean Paul Gaultier that!!!!
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 12:55 PM
he never got over his Scottish ex-boyfriend...
Darth Stujitzu
03-22-06, 12:58 PM
It wasn't me, I have an alibi, I was out with Richard Gere's hamster that night!
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 01:00 PM
and this thread used to be about "romantic notions"... :)
birdygyrl
03-22-06, 01:11 PM
I have no idea how I would put it into words. I think by letting them know that there was a "one" already might tip them off that the position had been filled. (Unless they might think there is room in this world for more than just one "one.") And as far as accepting myself, as long as that person made me feel loved and loved me as best as they could, I would have no regrets. Most of us have a past and it would be realistic to believe that they could have had somebody that had been their "one." I think we are all just trying to be happy and live as fulfilled people. I would take the person's love with care and nuture it. I wouldn't think less of it because I wasn't their ideal. I would love them with all my heart and treasure them, even if they weren't my "one" or I theirs. I don't see what can be gained by being brutally honest and saying the words you aren't the "one" I've been searching for. Maybe that's a cop out but its my very humble opinion.
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 01:33 PM
Maybe that's a cop out but its my very humble opinion.
which is a very honorable one. i wish we all could, and by "we", you know whom i mean. the idealistic part won't let that happen though, for more than a coupla months every 3 years or so. the meaning of life, probably.
SamsoniteDelilah
03-22-06, 02:03 PM
I guess I'm wondering now, what is going to be the difference in how you relate to someone if you think they're "the one" from if you don't? Will you put up with less from them? Will you not be as good to them?
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 02:09 PM
1) Will you put up with less from them? 2) Will you not be as good to them?
1) i guess it'd be a consequence, wanted or not, since there would be less "perfect" things to compensate
2) not consciously, i mean: willingly (at least if one is a good-hearted person), but someone sensitive and sensible enough would feel the difference between being just loved, and totally (cor)responding to their lover's hopes, expectations, dreams, etc...
SamsoniteDelilah
03-22-06, 03:09 PM
1) i guess it'd be a consequence, wanted or not, since there would be less "perfect" things to compensate
2) not consciously, i mean: willingly (at least if one is a good-hearted person), but someone sensitive and sensible enough would feel the difference between being just loved, and totally (cor)responding to their lover's hopes, expectations, dreams, etc...
Total correspondence is never going to happen. You're describing the condition of being in the womb, not being in a relationship. To put that sort of expectation on a love relationship is unrealistic and ultimately unloving to your partner: you're demanding that they never differ from you, and if they do, then you've just said you'll love them less.
undercoverlover
03-22-06, 03:46 PM
'What is a friend? It's a soul dwelling in two bodies.' - Aristotle
I don't believe that a soul mate is someone we're in love with or that we're going to marry.
Once of my best friends who i've known for years, I think she's my soul mate. She's like the other half of me (probably the better natured side too).
I dont agree that the notion of soul mates refers to partners. Think aboiut what you think a soul is first and then think about soul mates, we might have different answers.
chicagofrog
03-22-06, 04:24 PM
Total correspondence is never going to happen. you're demanding that they never differ from you, and if they do, then you've just said you'll love them less.
this is oversimplifying something admittably complicated. total correspondence (intellectual, opinions, etc...), NO. total chemistry, yes. and a propos "differing", differences can be complimentary. and back to chemistry! if they're not, as they most often are not, they don't complement each other, they oppose each other.
plus, how did you take from my "compensation" thing something as radical as total correspondence? is that not overinterpretation based on (a false) assuming you know what is meant but actually not written?
I guess I'm wondering now, what is going to be the difference in how you relate to someone if you think they're "the one" from if you don't? Will you put up with less from them? Will you not be as good to them?
I wouldn't even date anyone at this point unless I thought there was a possibility of a long-term relationship in it, i.e. we "click" or have really good intellectual/physical chemsitry. Doesn't mean I expect it to happen, just that the possiblity is there. It doesn't have to be "the one" - that's something you probably discover after a while anyway.
I used to waste a lot of time dating guys I knew I wouldn't want to emotionally invest in, just because I felt like going out and doing something. Then again, I wasn't even attracted to my first two boyfriends, at all, until months after knowing them on a regular basis, so what I'm actually saying is this: I have no ****ing idea, Delilah. Heh but you already knew that. :D
plus, how did you take from my "compensation" thing something as radical as total correspondence? is that not overinterpretation based on (a false) assuming you know what is meant but actually not written?
Hey, froggie, it might be where you said "and totally (cor)responding to..."
Just a hunch.
chicagofrog
03-25-06, 01:37 PM
hei, thanx for the hunch, Moo! :)
what i meant is there is a difference between
1) feeling someone corresponds to your dreams
and
2) the absence of differences (in opinions, taste, etc...) between 2 persons.
as a matter of fact, among one's expectations, one can be that the perfect person *does* have different opinions and tastes
hei, thanx for the hunch, Moo! :)
what i meant is there is a difference between
1) feeling someone corresponds to your dreams
and
well now that you realize that you didn't express yourself properly and that Delilah was correct in calling you on it, you can grovel at her feet for forgiveness.
2) the absence of differences (in opinions, taste, etc...) between 2 persons.
as a matter of fact, among one's expectations, one can be that the perfect person *does* have different opinions and tastes
Indeed, desiring that one's partner or potential mate shares the exact same viewpoints and tastes, is an exercise in narcissism, not love.
SamsoniteDelilah
03-25-06, 08:23 PM
'What is a friend? It's a soul dwelling in two bodies.' - Aristotle
I don't believe that a soul mate is someone we're in love with or that we're going to marry.
Once of my best friends who i've known for years, I think she's my soul mate. She's like the other half of me (probably the better natured side too).
I dont agree that the notion of soul mates refers to partners. Think aboiut what you think a soul is first and then think about soul mates, we might have different answers.
It seems that the term has a slightly different meaning on your side of the pond. What you describe here, I'd call "kindred spirits". "Soulmate" here, would be.... did you ever see "The Music Man"? Shirley Jones sits in a windowsill gazing wistfully out at nothing specific and sings "Goodnight, My Someone", convinced that out there, somewhere, is one man who is already her perfect opposite, and they just have to find each other.
SamsoniteDelilah
03-25-06, 08:30 PM
I wouldn't even date anyone at this point unless I thought there was a possibility of a long-term relationship in it, i.e. we "click" or have really good intellectual/physical chemsitry. Doesn't mean I expect it to happen, just that the possiblity is there. It doesn't have to be "the one" - that's something you probably discover after a while anyway.
I used to waste a lot of time dating guys I knew I wouldn't want to emotionally invest in, just because I felt like going out and doing something. Then again, I wasn't even attracted to my first two boyfriends, at all, until months after knowing them on a regular basis, so what I'm actually saying is this: I have no ****ing idea, Delilah. Heh but you already knew that. :D
I wouldn't date just to date, at this point, either. I enjoy staying home too much. :p The 'soulmate' thing is often used to get around the criteria you're mentioning here, though. It's the notion (in the way I've heard the term used, anyway) that you can click with someone physically and they can be exciting, and you can throw out any objective stuff, like intellectual connection or emotional intelligence. For instance, I know this couple... ex couple, actually... and he's an addict. And he said to her recently "you can't walk away from this. You and I are connected deeper than any of the details of our lives", trying to make her come back to him, despite the fact that he's totally incapable of actually having a relationship right now. It got me thinking.
chicagofrog
03-26-06, 10:29 AM
you can grovel at her feet for forgiveness.
even as a foot fetishist, i doubt it'll be in this life, my subjective lass
Darth Stujitzu
03-26-06, 07:39 PM
Shy, sexy Scottish scorpio, seeks hot chick for long romantic walks, candelight dinners, exciting trips abroad and a lifetime of love and romance.
Will settle for kinky sex and fast food though!!!!!
Do you believe there is one person out there who is perfect for you? That's not to say they're perfect (hopefully no one expects that) but perfect for you? Have you ever thought you'd found "the one"? Do you still?
The perfect one is the one you are in love with at this moment. Yes, I have found him, I hope :laugh:
chicagofrog
03-27-06, 08:31 AM
Will settle for kinky sex and fast food though!!!!!
or kinky food and fast sex?? :p
undercoverlover
03-28-06, 01:47 PM
It seems that the term has a slightly different meaning on your side of the pond. What you describe here, I'd call "kindred spirits". "Soulmate" here, would be.... did you ever see "The Music Man"? Shirley Jones sits in a windowsill gazing wistfully out at nothing specific and sings "Goodnight, My Someone", convinced that out there, somewhere, is one man who is already her perfect opposite, and they just have to find each other.
its not because im from england at all, its just that it think that the term soul mate doesnt have to be specific to people that we're in love with. I know what you mean when you're talking about soulmates I just dont think that it has to be a relationship with a partner. Even if I could prove that soulmates arent just relationship partners, i still wouldnt think that kindred spirits are the same as soulmates.
Incidentally I don't think theres someone for everyone. I think the idea of having one person out there who we're meant to be with is kind of like the lottery, out of how many billions of people on the earth, what are the chances of finding the one for you. Lucky for you if you find them and good luck to those that search but I'm happy finding someone to be happy with, not someone who im destined to be with.
Ophelia
03-28-06, 05:40 PM
The perfect one is the one you are in love with at this moment. Yes, I have found him
Ditto.
SamsoniteDelilah
03-28-06, 06:07 PM
..Incidentally I don't think theres someone for everyone. I think the idea of having one person out there who we're meant to be with is kind of like the lottery, out of how many billions of people on the earth, what are the chances of finding the one for you. Lucky for you if you find them and good luck to those that search but I'm happy finding someone to be happy with, not someone who im destined to be with.
Agreed. I think it's much more important to look for someone capable of resolving issues than one with whom you believe there won't be any.
allthatglitters
04-14-06, 03:22 AM
More thoughts on love
I feel very strongly about differentiating between love and lust. Lust is an immediate emotion, commonly mistaken for love. Love is a concious choice that grows with time. I totally believe in true love. But I think that for a relationship to last it requires more than just love. A relationship needs commitment.
With my Calvinist inclination (I am not orthodox by any means), I suppose I do believe in soul mates. But of course there is a catch. I believe that two people can be romantic soul mates, essentially destined and made for eachother, but they both have to make a concious decision to make things work.
Soulmates are a romantic notion, but notion implies a sort of fairy-tale quality that midwestern sweethearts running a farm (the majority of soulmates I tell ya) never have. True romance to me, is love that endures. Soulmates become immature copouts when couples use it as an excuse to avoid asking eachother the hard questions. *It's in an immature coput to belive that love takes care of itself, or that love is all the provisions a relationship needs.
*I just realized that I've been somewhat doing this. I've avoided thinking about the religion question (he's Jewish, I am Christian), because I think that our connectivity will magically iron everything out.
Be afraid. be very afraid! Love is pain, with joys along the way. (or) Love is joy, with pains along the way.
___
And now that the callous bumper sticker slogan is out of the way, back to the nuts and bolts of "the common malady of love" (see Agatha Christie's Murder on the Orient Express, new, updated version).
_______
You know I just cant leave without saying that I feel that people are breaking down the great machine of marriage and happiness. And it sucks big time. Why, I sat there in the room with my office mate, who I should mention is a guy of questionable sexual preference (why that's important? :confused: seems...), and listened to him drone on into the phone to some random family member about a male friend who is thinking of leaving his marriage, NOT because he has problems w/the wife, but because they are more "like roommates" now.
There's no pizzazz, so hubby dearest cant "justify" staying married?
???
WHO raised these people?? I mean, what sadist conned these people into thinking that an ENTIRE life of monagamy would be like a gigantic, life long honeymoon, and continual orgasm, a spring break of all breaks? Really! Real simple. Real, real simple.
I'd like to add to your thought Glittergirl. I also think that general happiness can be mistaken for love. If someone is generally miserable, and meets someone who shows them enough kindness to make them happy, I think that that happiness could easily be mistaken for love.
^
http://www.goldsteinusa.com/images-q/2-cents-300-bw.jpg
Dog Day Afternoon Nap
04-18-06, 02:45 PM
Love is something we strive for and seldom get, now lust is something we can reach, often get and rarely strive for, lust wins sadly in this day and age, although I think love and companionship are not the myth some people seem to think it has become, there are soulmates out there as such, it's just maybe these days people don't settle for one person because society today (and the high divorce rate) dictates that people aren't in it for the long haul and divorce has IMO aided the get out for one or other partner when the going gets tough.
When my parents got married (and thank christ they did or I'd be a complete bastard!) the divorce rate then was low because people stuck it out and worked through the bad times to get them to the better times ahead, then the 70's hit and mum and dad got divorced.
If divorce were not available then soulmates might find their club not so exclusive.
chris w
04-18-06, 03:58 PM
I'm a child of divorce myself, and as such I think it would be easy to assume that I would have an F*** you attitude to romance,love and all the trimmings.
However, I would like to think of myself as a fairly old fashioned romantic.I pull the chair out for my lady friends,I hold open doors,and most importantly,I LISTEN to them. This,I would think has something to do with being raised by three women,although,my two brothers are hardly the most romantic types(ones a PHD and a real cold fish and the other is a chef obsessed with sex).At the end of the day,I think divorce has had a profound effect on how we view the notion of love and the soulmates scenario. We are a generation born into broken homes and teenage pregnancy,where most couples could give a **** about being happy togther.They just want to be personally satisfied.And selfish attitudes are never a good foundation for a relationship.
I think being in a relationship is like being part of a painting in progress.You need to work on it for a real long time in order to divert the eye away from the brushstrokes.(Boy that's a metaphor stretched pretty thin,I know.)
Anyway,I still live in hope that the soulmate does exist. If it doesn't then I might just have to fall in love with myself.;)
SamsoniteDelilah
04-18-06, 04:17 PM
...If divorce were not available then soulmates might find their club not so exclusive.
Nor would murderers, but that's another thread. ;)
Thanks for your thoughts, y'all, this has been a good read, so far.
I'm a child of divorce myself, and as such I think it would be easy to assume that I would have an F*** you attitude to romance,love and all the trimmings.
However, I would like to think of myself as a fairly old fashioned romantic.I pull the chair out for my lady friends,I hold open doors,and most importantly,I LISTEN to them. This,I would think has something to do with being raised by three women,although,my two brothers are hardly the most romantic types(ones a PHD and a real cold fish and the other is a chef obsessed with sex).At the end of the day,I think divorce has had a profound effect on how we view the notion of love and the soulmates scenario. We are a generation born into broken homes and teenage pregnancy,where most couples could give a **** about being happy togther.They just want to be personally satisfied.And selfish attitudes are never a good foundation for a relationship.
I think being in a relationship is like being part of a painting in progress.You need to work on it for a real long time in order to divert the eye away from the brushstrokes.(Boy that's a metaphor stretched pretty thin,I know.)
Anyway,I still live in hope that the soulmate does exist. If it doesn't then I might just have to fall in love with myself.;)
I find myself in the same boat. Rest assured that for someone like you, there is a soulmate out there. Just make sure that you're ready for them when you meet them (even if it is yourself :p ). ;)
people stuck it out and worked through the bad times to get them to the better times ahead
Unfortuatly for some the better times didn't come, they were locked into bad relationships for ever, at least divorce allows these people to get out. :yup:
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