Law enforcement gets rough at Utah rave....

[Sedai]

I go to these things sometimes, and I think a few other MoFos attend on a regular basis, so I thought this may be of some interest. 90+ law enforcement agents descended upon a Drum and Bass party in Diamond Valley, Utah. The party was on private property, and the promoters had obtained what the city had told them were all the legal permits needed, had provided bathroom facilities, marked trails, and hired security to handle any rowdy folk that showed, and as an attempt to keep drugs out of the party. These is a brief aside about that last point I will get to in a few, it is frightening and completely absurd at the same time. They had also secured on-site medical professionals in case of any medical issues that might arise during the event. In other words, and this is coming from an old rave vet, they had really gone to a lot of trouble to stay in the confines of the law for their dance party, which is something VERY few promoters even think about doing, let alone set in motion and follow though. The promoter claims he spent upwards of 20k to insure his event was safe, legal, and fun for those in attendance. I will say again, this was on a private ranch, and the owner was attending the event.

From all witness account, up to and including those who escaped the raid with video cameras and still shots, the vibe was fantastic, there were zero violent people, and everything was going extremely well. At about 11:30 PM, a helicopter appeared in the valley and began scouting the party. After a few minutes it came in for a low strafe and 90+ officials in full riot gear, with automatic weapons, helmets and tear gas guns. In the first few minutes, the party goes are seem sort of bewildered and confused as to what is happening, but from the video, it appears a few of the men jump on stage and attempt to shut down the music. From what I can see, all the DJs and the promoter immediately comply with what they are being told, but the officers start spewing profanity and threatening jail time to the DJs. I clearly heard a line with profanity threatenin jail time, myself. From what I can tell, no one is giving the cops any **** whatsoever. Off camera a ruckus starts. The cam is on a tripod as it was set to record the DJs and live acts all evening, so we can;t see exactly what happens at first, but from the accounts, a police dog had attacked a dancer. once the photographer get sthe can into ahndhelp mode, and focuses on what is happening, there is mayhem in the desert. Four officers are beating the dancer while the dog mauls him (It turns out the kid was fifteen or so). everyone is running in every direction, and these stormtooper officers are everywhere, waving machine guns and screaming at everyone with guns pointed. Other people start freaking out, and the cameraman becomes overwhelmed and is just trying to take it all in on video.

Now, from all accounts, when we see the camera go off, the kid filming has been attack had been tackled by an officer from the side, and the camera goes flying. Apparently , another party-goer saw this happen, recognized the video camera as important evidence and grabbed the thing and ran like a bastard, and he got the camera out and to the press. More eyewitness accounts state the agents were smashing any camera they could find.

60 arrests were made, most for possession of drugs and refusal to cooperate with a police officer. Now, the promoter had hired a security agency to try to minimize the drug element at the party, which had been somewhat successful, as the sercurity team had conifscated a fair amount of drugs from the party goers. When told this, the agents arrested the security guards for possession. Uh, ok.

Ok, enough chattering out of me. I am posting a few links, to both official and unofficial news sources, as well as a link to FreeTalk Live, which did a two hour podcast on the issue. I think this will turn out to be an important event, and wanted to give it to you folks here at MoFo to chew over.

And remember, you heard it here first...Off the record, on the QT, and very hush-hush.

"Official Story" (http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci_2961967)

The Sploid Version (http://www.sploid.com/news/2005/08/22/troops-raid-utah-rave-with-guns-gas-118551.php)

The sploid site seems a bit shifty, but the video and eyewitness accounts do not. Take Sploid with a grain of salt, though. Still, I have been going to these parties for many years, and have never seen anything to make me think a troop of 90+ soldiers in armor were needed to break one up. Ravers and violence just don't mix....

Here is the Freetalk Live site..

Freetalk (http://www.freetalklive.com/)

EDIT: More stories cropping up....

RAID (http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/82205utrave.cfm)

And here is an eyewitness account from DJ Apollo, who played at the event.

The Daily KOS (http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/8/22/13030/7546)

[SamsoniteDelilah]

"Investigators learned that no permit had been requested for a mass gathering which requires a bond and Utah County Commission approval for groups larger than 250, said Gilbert." <~~That's a problem, and the legal justification for the raid itself (NOT the violence or destruction of property that the police carried out... just the raid).


Also, whether it's private property or not, posession of drugs is illegal, so those with drugs were bound to get arrested once the raid went down. And to clarify: I'm not talking about the security guards. Arresting them was bogus and no way will that stick.

Police brutality, on the other hand.. sucks... and should be prosecuted, which I'd imagine we'll be seeing for months to come.

[Equilibrium]

damn ive been following this story closely since im a raver (no drugs though) and an avid breakdancer at parties like this....this is ridiculous and its put me in a horrid mood.

[Caitlyn]

I'll have to read more about this before I comment too much but the idea of a S.W.A.T. team being called in for something like this makes my skin crawl…

[Darth Stujitzu]

Going to show my age here, but back in 1990 and 1991 I worked for an illegal rave company, and had similar run ins with the law. Drugs are part of the scene, and if taken by adults with medics on site, surely it's down to personal choice. I never saw any hassle or trouble at these gigs until the police turned up with their heavy handed treatment of us all as if we were criminals. Eventually the city's council enforced a 12:30 curfew on clubs, a ludicrous Big Brother style dictatorship, and introduced huge fines for the organisers and staff of the raves.
Again these raves were done very professionaly, and were well organised, bearing in mind that all were consenting adults, I could never understand their attitude towards these events. Not everyone who goes to clubs or raves are drug dealing maniacs, yes I agree that irresponsible drug dealers should be stopped, but what's wrong with people letting off steam in a controlled enviroment. Holland provides free drug sampling in clubs, so if you drugs are cut with anything harmfull or toxic you know in advance. Surely this is a better option.
The company I worked for did hire a dancer and dress him in full police uniform once, I've never seen so many people freak out so quickly, especially when he started break dancing!!!

[Darth Stujitzu]

Just rememberred the story about Ozzie Osbourne at a festival.
Ozzie and his band were back stage when his manager walked in and said that the Police had arrived. After consuming the rest of their drugs very quickly, Ozzie and his band were amazed when Sting and the rest of Police walked in. Heard this story ages ago, don't know how much truth there is in it, but it still makes me laugh. :laugh: :yup:

[Caitlyn]

Just rememberred the story about Ozzie Osbourne at a festival.
Ozzie and his band were back stage when his manager walked in and said that the Police had arrived. After consuming the rest of their drugs very quickly, Ozzie and his band were amazed when Sting and the rest of Police walked in. Heard this story ages ago, don't know how much truth there is in it, but it still makes me laugh. :laugh: :yup:

I love it... :laugh:

[Piddzilla]

My personal opinion is this: I think the story Sedai told us is really creepy and for the police to act like that is just stupid. I guess they wanted to statuate an example, like showing who's in charge but with the possible result of creating more hate and mistrust against the law enforcement. On the other hand, what Darth said, that taking drugs is a personal choice and that he doesn't understand why the authorities have to bother if it's all going on in controlled forms. Drugs happen to be illegal, except for in countries like Holland, and for the police to not try and stop that would be for them to not do their job, to think anything else would be naive. And I don't see why the police should treat ravers differently than other drug users and abusers in society - wouldn't that be a bit unfair? Now, what I consider to be the top solution - and I have attended a few raves myself in the past - clearly is that the cops go there undercover, which they do for the most part. Then they don't disturb the party and at the same time they don't expose themselves as cops. The point is, whatever our opinions about drugs are, for the police to do their job as effectively as possible without causing trouble for those who don't cause trouble. ;) You can't expect the police to look the other way when there are drugs around, but I also think we should expect the police to behave in an intelligent and respectful way.

[Sedai]

I'll have to read more about this before I comment too much but the idea of a S.W.A.T. team being called in for something like this makes my skin crawl…
I am interested in your opinion, and had you in mind while posting. I know you to be fair and level headed, as well as a girl in blue. Love the new Av, btw. Although I will miss the Caity Av I have always known.... ;)

[Sedai]

My personal opinion is this: I think the story Sedai told us is really creepy and for the police to act like that is just stupid. I guess they wanted to statuate an example, like showing who's in charge but with the possible result of creating more hate and mistrust against the law enforcement. On the other hand, what Darth said, that taking drugs is a personal choice and that he doesn't understand why the authorities have to bother if it's all going on in controlled forms. Drugs happen to be illegal, except for in countries like Holland, and for the police to not try and stop that would be for them to not do their job, to think anything else would be naive. And I don't see why the police should treat ravers differently than other drug users and abusers in society - wouldn't that be a bit unfair? Now, what I consider to be the top solution - and I have attended a few raves myself in the past - clearly is that the cops go there undercover, which they do for the most part. Then they don't disturb the party and at the same time they don't expose themselves as cops. The point is, whatever our opinions about drugs are, for the police to do their job as effectively as possible without causing trouble for those who don't cause trouble. ;) You can't expect the police to look the other way when there are drugs around, but I also think we should expect the police to behave in an intelligent and respectful way. I concur. If they had a legit reason to bust this party, they should have handled it differently. I just keep wondering why almost 100 officers in battle armor were needed for this thing. Zero weapons found. Really, I think five officers could have handled it. When the talent on stage was approached, they immediately complied with the officers and shut the sound down. At that point, one officer could have spoken though amplification and shut the event down. Everyone would have left quietly. I know this, because, having spun at many a party, I have seen it happen numerous times. People just grab their stuff, and head for the exits. I think showing such immediate force, and bringing attack dogs, was a bad idea. People got frightened, and when they saw the brutality start, everyone just freaked.

Oh, another thing I forgot to mention is that the promoter took out a 2 million dollar insurance on the event.

[Darth Stujitzu]

My personal opinion is this: I think the story Sedai told us is really creepy and for the police to act like that is just stupid. I guess they wanted to statuate an example, like showing who's in charge but with the possible result of creating more hate and mistrust against the law enforcement. On the other hand, what Darth said, that taking drugs is a personal choice and that he doesn't understand why the authorities have to bother if it's all going on in controlled forms. Drugs happen to be illegal, except for in countries like Holland, and for the police to not try and stop that would be for them to not do their job, to think anything else would be naive. And I don't see why the police should treat ravers differently than other drug users and abusers in society - wouldn't that be a bit unfair? Now, what I consider to be the top solution - and I have attended a few raves myself in the past - clearly is that the cops go there undercover, which they do for the most part. Then they don't disturb the party and at the same time they don't expose themselves as cops. The point is, whatever our opinions about drugs are, for the police to do their job as effectively as possible without causing trouble for those who don't cause trouble. ;) You can't expect the police to look the other way when there are drugs around, but I also think we should expect the police to behave in an intelligent and respectful way.


I'm not being naive, no matter what people are going to take drugs. My point was that I would rather see the police doing something more productive than arrest people with minor amounts of drugs for personal use, instead they should be actively pursuing the dealers and their bosses. Everyone knows drugs are illegal, but that knowledge alone is not stopping recreational drug use. In regards to Holland, I think their government has taken a responsible attitude towards recreational users, wouldn't you rather know in advance if the E your about to take could be fatal? There was a spate of deaths in Glasgow due to a shipment of E's cut with rat poison, most of the deaths were young girls in their teens trying E for the first time.
I'm not a huge supporter of making certain drugs legal, but I'm being realistic in that no matter what happens people aren't going to stop taking drugs overnight. Smoking kills, drugs can kill, alcohol can kill, but it still goes on every day, time to try a different approach, as at the moment the police are not winning the war against drugs, we have to better educate people, and encourage them to try and be as safe as possible.
60% of Heroin deaths in Scotland could be avoided if the people who were with them at the time phoned an ambulance quicker, but the stigma attached discourages people from this action, they are more worried about being charged by the police than saving a life.
Drugs should not be legal, but I would rather that people weren't so afraid of the consequences should things go wrong, and were encouraged to seek help safe from prosecution.
I lost a very close friend to drugs, and while I'll never touch drugs again, some of my friends are still regular users even after this tragic event.
I haven't got any answers, but we need to look at alternatives, as the current course of action in Scotland doesn't seem to be working.
Can't comment on America, just what I see on the news, sorry got carried away, don't like being called naive!

[Sedai]

"Investigators learned that no permit had been requested for a mass gathering which requires a bond and Utah County Commission approval for groups larger than 250, said Gilbert." <~~That's a problem, and the legal justification for the raid itself (NOT the violence or destruction of property that the police carried out... just the raid).
This newspaper article was written by people who weren't there, using information taken from the police. Seeing as how every single eyewitness account says this isn't true, and now that the promoters/land owners are filing suit agains the state of UTAH because they claim they did in fact have the permits, I am filing this article under bad press, as it clearly is. Also, hos is not having a permit legal justification for a 90+ man swat team in full body armor with attack dogs, tear gas, tazers and helicopters? These were stormtroopers, coming in like they were in Saigon. There is no justification for this.

Actually, what kind of country is this this? Since when can't large groups of people get together on private property? My crew has thrown numerous 500+ person parties, outdoors, on PUBLIC property, had the cops come, and were allowed to continue. These people were nazi stormtroopers, exercising excessive force over the citizens of this country. Last time I checked, the American people were allowed to assemple peacefully. Is this not the case? I believe the constitution says it is....

Dark times.

[Piddzilla]

To Darth: The discussion on whether or not drugs should be illegal is really complicated. What I meant when I used the word "naive" was that I think it is naive to think, when we all know that drugs are illegal, that cops should leave those people alone who use drugs "responsibly". You make some interesting points, but to me the problem of drugs killing people does not lie in the legal-illegal discussion but in the drugs themselves. Drugs kill people because they are dangerous, not because they are legal or illegal. There are factors that leads to death that might be minimized if drugs were legal, but on the other hand making drugs legal would increase the deaths because of other factors. I guess it all comes down to politics in the end...

Personally I am against all kind of legalization of hard drugs like heroin and cocain as well as ecstacy. That doesn't mean that I don't understand why people take it or that I automatically look down on all people who use drugs. On the contrary, I can understand them very well, based on personal experiences.

[Sedai]

It is now coming to light that the US national guard was present at this raid. I just need to ask, does anyone else have a problem with the US military being used on US soil to attack a dance party? If this was a drug issue, where was the DEA? If it was just a permit issue, why didn't the Utah local/state police handle it on their own?

This is a bit frightening...

[Darth Stujitzu]

Sounds very heavy handed to involve the military.
From the description of this incident, you'd think it was held by Al Queda, such was the show of force.

To Piddzilla, yeah drug use raises all sorts of debates, can't really see a viable sollution to the problem at the moment, and for obvious reasons it is a topic that affects me quite personally.
I have had a very varied and challenging life, and I try to be as open-minded as possible, but I guess sometimes you can't help but become personally involved in certain aspects that strike a chord with you. I try to use humour as often as possible, life can be pretty crap sometimes, but humour helps me through the crap times. I guess I can come across as being shallow and one dimensional, but I have very strong beliefs and politics that for the most part I keep to myself, but every once in a while I can't help but being outspoken, drugs is one issue I feel very strongly about, but yes it is a very complicated issue.

[Sedai]

This site is posting text accounts from many people who were at the party. Take everything with a grain of salt, of course, but if even half of this stuff is true, it's still chilling.

UPDATE: The promoters have posted a statement on UT Raves website, claiming they had obtained Utah state mass gathering permit # 2005-11, in addition to the health permit. They are starting the court processes this week...

It also seems, from a few minutes of perusal on some of the local Utah sites, that a fair number of parents are getting involved, and standing behind their children. It also seems that the permits were gone over by an lawyer, pre-party, to make sure all is in order, he is now involved as well.

In more troubling news, people are starting to claim that the sites that are posting this video are being rerouted at DNS, shut down, or forced to remove the video by federal officials...

Apparently the agents had no significators on their gear. No SWAT, POLICE, or US ARMY logos were displayed, which I believe is a violation of the law... Caity, can you ring in on this one?

Word is getting out that a few guns were in fact confiscated....from the residence near the party. It seems the woman who lives there is now filing suit for illegal search and seizure.

At first, the police stated there were no injuries at the gathering, and no force was used. Now, the police are stating there actually were injuries.....from the mosh pit. At a techno festival? That is so.....preposterous. Aren't Mosh pits at death metal shows and the like, I have never been near one? Say....I saw people doing drugs at the Billy Joel concert once, why don't they bust that up with swat teams?

[Caitlyn]

I doubt very seriously if the national guard was involved and feel sure it was only various law enforcement agencies… almost all of which are equipped with military style equipment…

Sedai, do you have a good link to the video or did I miss it... I've watched 3 so far and all were too dark to be able to tell for sure what was going on in a few places...

[SamsoniteDelilah]

This newspaper article was written by people who weren't there, using information taken from the police. Seeing as how every single eyewitness account says this isn't true, and now that the promoters/land owners are filing suit agains the state of UTAH because they claim they did in fact have the permits, I am filing this article under bad press, as it clearly is.
Fair enough.

Also, hos is not having a permit legal justification for a 90+ man swat team in full body armor with attack dogs, tear gas, tazers and helicopters? These were stormtroopers, coming in like they were in Saigon. There is no justification for this.
I didn't say what happened was justified. I said if they didn't have a permit (which was what that article *albeit wrongly* said), then there was legal justification to shut down the party.

Actually, what kind of country is this this? Since when can't large groups of people get together on private property? My crew has thrown numerous 500+ person parties, outdoors, on PUBLIC property, had the cops come, and were allowed to continue. These people were nazi stormtroopers, exercising excessive force over the citizens of this country. Last time I checked, the American people were allowed to assemple peacefully. Is this not the case? I believe the constitution says it is....

Dark times.
I can't answer the "since when" part of your question, but this is from Wikipedia and describes the reasons why permits have typically been required:
The freedom of assembly in order to protest sometimes conflicts with laws intended to protect public safety, even in democratic countries: in many cities, the police are authorized by law to disperse any crowd (including a crowd of political protesters) which threatens public safety, or which the police cannot control. The idea is to prevent rioting. Often local law requires that a permit must be obtained in advance by protest organizers if a protest march is anticipated; the permit application can be denied. Sometimes this bureaucratic power is abused by lawmakers if the protest is not a popular one in the community or with the local government, with the permit process in some cities taking a great deal of time, organization, and even money required before a permit is issued -- and then, when issued, time and location restrictions are sometimes added.

It's clear that excessive force was used in Utah. It's also highly probable that there was abuse of the permit situation on the part of the Utah police and the fact that they went in with the National Guard makes it obvious that they are attempting to scare people out of this sort of gathering. And that's an abuse of power. The situation sucks.

[Sedai]

Fair enough.


I didn't say what happened was justified. I said if they didn't have a permit (which was what that article *albeit wrongly* said), then there was legal justification to shut down the party.


I can't answer the "since when" part of your question, but this is from Wikipedia and describes the reasons why permits have typically been required:
The freedom of assembly in order to protest sometimes conflicts with laws intended to protect public safety, even in democratic countries: in many cities, the police are authorized by law to disperse any crowd (including a crowd of political protesters) which threatens public safety, or which the police cannot control. The idea is to prevent rioting. Often local law requires that a permit must be obtained in advance by protest organizers if a protest march is anticipated; the permit application can be denied. Sometimes this bureaucratic power is abused by lawmakers if the protest is not a popular one in the community or with the local government, with the permit process in some cities taking a great deal of time, organization, and even money required before a permit is issued -- and then, when issued, time and location restrictions are sometimes added.

It's clear that excessive force was used in Utah. It's also highly probable that there was abuse of the permit situation on the part of the Utah police and the fact that they went in with the National Guard makes it obvious that they are attempting to scare people out of this sort of gathering. And that's an abuse of power. The situation sucks.
Excellent info. there seems to be a lot of grey area, so I guess we shall just find out, in time. I am wondering, does this apply to private property, and can they do this without a warrent if it is on private property?

[Anonymous Last]

What it looked like to me in the video was that the police were all dressed up and had no place to go.

[Sedai]

I doubt very seriously if the national guard was involved and feel sure it was only various law enforcement agencies… almost all of which are equipped with military style equipment…

Sedai, do you have a good link to the video or did I miss it... I've watched 3 so far and all were too dark to be able to tell for sure what was going on in a few places...
I probably have the same Quicktime version you do... The Utah sherrif has issued a statement saying they didn;t use dogs, gas, guns, batons or profanity. Meanwhile, I just saw a fox news clip video that clearly shows the troops standing around with what look like MP5s or AUGs. Also, one of them has a dog with him, german shepard. In the home video, I clearly hear the troops using profanity, as well as dogs....what gives?


For a little comedy, I saw this quote from a random party goer from Utah...

"BTW, I always thought putting up and taking down my tent was a pain in the ass, it's amazing what an attack dog and three guys with machine guns can do for motivation, the tent came down in under 30 seconds."

[Piddzilla]

I guess I can come across as being shallow and one dimensional,

No, not at all. :)

[nebbit]

Just rememberred the story about Ozzie Osbourne at a festival.
Ozzie and his band were back stage when his manager walked in and said that the Police had arrived. After consuming the rest of their drugs very quickly, Ozzie and his band were amazed when Sting and the rest of Police walked in. Heard this story ages ago, don't know how much truth there is in it, but it still makes me laugh. :laugh: :yup:

http://bestsmileys.com/lol/19.gif

[Sedai]

So, a few folks have asked if there is a higher definition video available, as the pne that is circulating is of somewhat low quality, and somethings are hard to see, especially during the camera moves and when the guy is trying to focus on the beatings. The photographer has stated that they wanted to get the info out asap, and just ripped a lowres .avi to post sooner rather than later. Today, they are working on getting the DVR tape encoded to either DivX or a torrent file so we can get the full res copy to view. I will post a link as soon as it's available...

They state they have also had time now to slow the video down and watch the important sections and are claiming they see the girl in the red shirt get punch directly in the face with a closed fist AFTER she has been bound and subdued, as well as someone who is clearly bound with zip ties getting hit over the head with a baton while dogs maul his leg.....

We shall see....

[SamsoniteDelilah]

What it looked like to me in the video was that the police were all dressed up and had no place to go.
This is very much what it sounds like to me. They went in with a HUGE show of force, armed for bear. They were geared up for resistance and reacted to the slightest hint of it with the force they had reserved for bigger trouble.

Sedai - I haven't seen anything that differentiates between public and private property for the application of permit laws. My thinking is that by "public", you mean places that are already licensed with the state to charge people for admission. (Rather than the book definition of "government property") Places where a business license is in place would have a maximum capacity posted, and insurance in place and all that jazz as part of their business setup. Places where no regular permit to operate a business exists would be exactly the people who'd need to obtain a one-time permit for a large crowd, no?