Marvel Studios flicks are soulless cash cows.

I don't expect any flick to do Avenger's money. Not even future Avenger movies.

Now again, I LOVE these flicks. Hell the MCU is one of the very few guaranteed flicks I will see in the theater. There are SO MANY movies that I see the trailers for and I JUST DO NOT CARE to see. Especially this past summer! I would love for this MCU quality to continue. Especially if they can actually get the rights back for the Fantastic Four.

But I do think their days are getting shorter. Sure they had some out right surprises like the financial and fan favorite Guardians of the Galaxy and Ant-Man was a surprisingly great flick. But Spider-Man: Homecoming did not do as good as past Spider Man flicks and had a full DCEU 70% drop off the second weekend (but that could also be that it was the 2nd Spider Man reboot). In addition Dr Strange did not make quite as much as other flicks (damn fine movie IMO though). And Ant-Man (though a GREAT film IMO) was a relative disappointment in the box office. Though to that film's defense it was the best possible scenario given how jacked up the production of that movie was.

Now Marvel is in the best possible scenario to make this last longer. They have uber producer Feige to keep the brand consistent, they have created a functioning superhero movie universe (unlike DC who looks like they want to distant themselves from the DCEU), and they have drawn creative talent that has made a talking raccoon and a sentient shrubbery into household names. This could last longer then most film movements. But I think when this film movement does end, it will die like the Western. The Western was around for many decades, but when those flicks came to a end they very rarely make another one, let alone another one that is good let alone profitable.

I am a fan of a guy named Raz0rfist and he as a video where he waxes philosophical on the matter if you want to check it out. It is a 5 minute video.

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Fear and Loathing in MoFo... The Gunslinger 45's Top 50 Favorite Films

In the 10 Ring: Gunslinger45's reviews

Spider-Man: Homecoming dropped 62.2% in its second weekend. Also, Spider-Man: Homecoming DID, in-fact, do as well as past Spider-Man films. The film improved on the domestic totals for The Amazing Spider-Man and The Amazing Spider-Man 2 on a substantial level, and had a production budget that is speculated as being as much as 100 million less than The Amazing Spider-Man 2. On a worldwide spectrum, Spider-Man: Homecoming has, thus far, made 747 million worldwide, ahead of The Amazing Spider-Man 2, and about 10 million behind of what The Amazing Spider-Man made. The kicker here is that, once more, Homecoming had a smaller budget, and also, did better on a domestic level, which is the best territory for film studios, on-account of how much they receive in-comparison to some other areas.

Something else you might not be aware of is that Spider-Man: Homecoming still hasn't debuted in the second largest territory in the film industry: China. This is because China has a "blackout season" where no foreign titles are playing in theaters, meant to boost local film growth (their film Wolf Warrior 2 will attest to these benefits). Homecoming is expected to open sometime in September. If the film is able to match the total from The Amazing Spider-Man film, it will finish out its theatrical run with about 850 million worldwide, which would make it the second grossing Spider-Man worldwide (not adjusted for inflation, but more profitable than The Amazing Spider-Man 1-2 with ease).

Doctor Strange also exceeded expectations, making almost 700 million off a budget of only 165 million. It didn't make as much as some other Marvel films, and its budget reflects that. Even still, in-comparison to other Origin stories, it continued Marvel's growing success. Ant-Man, however, I agree, was an anemic return on investment.

All fair points, (though to my defense I was quoting a ball park figure for the drop). Either way that was a very noticeable and larger second week drop then the generally normal 50% drop off.

And as for my "past Spider-Man flicks" I admit I should have been clearer and stated that this film did not exceed any of the Sam Raimi flicks domestically (even without adjustment for inflation). It has exceeded the Amazing Spider-Man movies. Now my biased ass will admit this is more then likely due to the fact that Homecoming is a vastly superior movie to the previous mediocre Amazing Spider-Man flicks.

Also I was not aware it had not opened in China yet. That should add anywhere from another $50-100 million to the world wide box office. Good for Marvel and I know Sony needs the money.

As for Dr Strange while it is by no means a bomb (quite the contrary) it was still not as profitable as other origin flicks; just out grossing Thor: The Dark World, and just behind Captain America: Winter Soldier. And all of those movies tend to cost around 170 bucks give or take an additional 10 million. Part of this I think is that Marvel has adapted their A list super heroes and (catapulted a few lower tier to the A List). Now they have to try and introduce characters that will be of great appeal and noticeable to the Marvel and comic faithful (like me), but might not appeal to a wider audience, and paired with DC's DCEU there is a very real worry of superhero over saturation.

But as I said in my last post, Marvel is in the best possible scenario to shake those worries. They have repeatedly made great movies and even franchises out of lower tier comic characters. Guardian of the Galaxy was an obscure title before James Gunn happened, Daredevil was niche before Netflix, and I remember growing up in the 90's when Captain America and Iron Man were not A List heroes and took a back seat to the X-Men and Spider-Man. And that is just the MCU as even a D-list hero like Blade made 2 badass movies (and one turd).

The next two Marvel movies Black Panther and Captain Marvel I think are safe bets. Black Panther we got a peek at in Civil War, I think Chadwick Boseman is going to crush it, and the guy who made Creed is the director. I expect a great movie and I think the audience will agree. And Captain Marvel is headed by an Oscar winning actress who even gives great performances in blockbusters like Kong: Skull Island.

What I think will determine how long this MCU gravy train goes is what gets adapted post Infinity Wars. Marvel has two Avengers movies (part 1 Infinity Wars drops in May of next year) and the conclusion (untitled) will hit May 2019 (according to Box Office Mojo). Now we will get a Guardians of the Galaxy 3, Spider-Man will get a sequel, and I can see trilogies for Black Panther and Captain Marvel if they do well (which I think they will). And a Dr Strange sequel where Chiwetel Ejiofor as the villain? That will not only be awesome, but I think Ejiofor can easily become the next great (or at least an actually good) Marvel villain in the likes of Loki, Ultron, or The Kingpin on Netflix. But after that Marvel is going to have to choose their next property VERY carefully. They need a character who can be profitable, doesn't feel over saturated, and cast a lead and hire a creative team and director that will essentially be Iron Man 2.0, cuz after Infinity Wars ends they are going to have to essentially start anew building off the established Marvel Cinematic Universe.

As for DC... well their last few flicks (save Wonder Woman) are not helping the comic book movie biz.

We can only hope for the best.

I disagree and I think the numbers showed that Doctor Strange was on-par with the average origin film in the Marvel Cinematic Universe (you compared it to Winter Soldier and Dark World, two films that were sequels, not origin films), improving on Captain America: The First Avengers and the first Thor film. The only ones it didn't surpass were Iron Man (which was, for the first phase, the "backbone" of the whole Cinematic Universe), Guardians of the Galaxy (a breakout success), and Spider-Man: Homecoming (because it's Spider-Man). Bringing it full-circle, I also want to argue the point that if Doctor Strange follows the precedent set by the other sequels in Marvel, it will see increases in its sequel. That's something I think is worth highlighting, a lot of these films are more like investments in what they will become. There is a marketing plan I think is rather transparent in its logic.

After The Avengers, they quickly released Iron Man 3, having a huge bump at the box office, and I think they're already grooming Spider-Man for a similar bump by having it be a direct follow-up to Avengers: Infinity Wars.

That's something I think Marvel does better than most other franchises, in that it knows how to market its films. For instance, how Black Panther, a newer title, is positioned the same month as Deadpool broke out, and "coincidentally," the first mainstream blockbuster featuring an African America superhero is being released on Black History Month.

As for DC, Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice under-performed, but Suicide Squad righted the ship (regardless of how horrible it was), and Wonder Woman was a hit. I believe its deciding prospects will be seen in the Justice League film. Right now though, it's the Wonder Woman Extended Universe.

I think the threat of superhero saturation is real, but I also believe we haven't seen any real clear indication that fatigue has set in. Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice under-performed (although, didn't flop), but the general consensus is also that it sucked. Wonder Woman, which received positive reviews, was a hit, especially because its more conservative budget. I think audiences have only shown that they will show up in droves if they feel something is worth their time.

I also don't think there are "too many" superhero films, but, instead, I think that there are "too few" in other areas, the reason it feels so saturated is because it doesn't have a whole lot of competition. Seeing 5 superhero films a year isn't that much in the grand-scheme of things.

I opted to compare Dr Strange to Thor: The Dark World and Winter Soldier mostly because I thought it would be unfair to compare it to the lesser grossing origin films of Phase 1, since they were made before The Avengers phenomenon and raising the bar for the comic book movie and movie universe franchise, and were not as much of an established brand as they are now.

Spider-Man could very well be a great corner stone to build on. If Feige is connected to every Spider-Man movie and tie in, you got no worries. Otherwise Sony has the very real possibility of f**king it up. If you do however, you get more of Homecoming, which I thought was great. But I am not 100% if Sony will get Feige on their own non-MCU spin offs like the Venom movie. But even if you don't, the MCU Spidey flicks could easily lead to the build up to an Avengers crossover style Secret Wars movie. If they do that, push my concerns aside and take my money!

Best of all possible world for me is if the Marvel Studios can weasel the Fantastic Four rights away from Fox and get the first family of comics on screen in a proper MCU fashion. THAT would most certainly be a new corner stone property and lead to boundless new stores that can play off the now established galactic and mystical segments of the MCU. And it is not like Fox is going to make any money off that license anytime soon after Fan4stic, and that Dr Doom movie is probably going to bomb. But the fact that Fox is even making a Dr Doom movie shows a phase 4 Fantastic Four MCU flick is VERY unlikely.

As for DC, I will say BvS was a huge disappointment critically and financially. I won't compare it to The Avengers (that would be a bit unfair). To make the far more appropriate comparison to Captain America: Civil War, it is still far short critically and financially as that 1 billion dollar plus film. We do agree that Suicide Squad was a financial success, but boy was it a crap film. And I so wanted that movie to be good too since I love David Ayer.

That being said, you and I agree that DC has found the right formula with Wonder Woman. It was a good movie, critically praised, and a hit. We shall see how Justice League pans out. The flick is going through massive reshoots and script changes (which is bad) but they are being done by Joss Whedon; which is good since he was a big part of why the MCU is successful with The Avengers.

We can only hope Whedon can save the DCEU ship. I most certainly agree with you, the future of the DC movies rides entirely on the Justice League movie.

Justice League has me uneasy, I feel so certain that the week leading up to it and the embargo lifts, I will see a 30% or less Rotten score. Synder and Goyer simply aren't great at the helm, even though I enjoyed Watchmen a fair bit. Squad was laughably bad and while I didn't hate Dawn of Justice, it was a mess of a film, with great moments diluted by bad ones. I like that we're having some more unique directors in the fray. Wan is an interesting choice for Aquaman, and if Reeves does half what he did for the last two Apes films for Batman, then we have a Dark Knight caliber film.

When is Justice League coming out? Amber Heard singlehandedly turns me off.

Reeves has the best shot to make a good flick. Though I have heard mixed responses if it will be connected to the DCEU. Which has WB's brand faith in the DCEU in question (at least that is how I see it).

I wrote that so long ago it seems. I am older now, if not much wiser, but I find I have very little energy to argue with people I don't know online anymore. I guess that i was just responding to people expending so much energy on negativity, being angry that things they don't enjoy are popular, rather than singing the praises of things that they feel very passionate about? I don't know anymore. I don't feel like I was being hypocritical or self righteous, but it's all in the past anyways. I still like Marvel flicks, I get that others don't. That's cool.

Rant on, MacDuff.

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"You, me, everyone...we are all made of star stuff." - Neil Degrasse Tyson

https://shawnsmovienight.blogspot.com/

November 17 2017

Thanks guns. Might catch it just to see how bad the dog smugglingvgold digger really is.

Do what ya gotta do. All I know is i liked her in Drive Angry.

I has an excite!

So did I, and Danish Girl. Didnt even know who she was, but she looked about as good in that trailer of the movie that will never be released whatever it's clled as her unforgettable performance in zombieland.

I forget all the time she was in that movie, and it is one of my all time favorite films. Mostly because I keep focusing on Emma Stone.

As an update to an earlier discussion, Spider-Man: Homecoming opened to 70 million in China. I didn't expect it to open so high, considering the delayed release. If the film has a similar multiplier as The Amazing Spider-Man 2 did, then, it has a legitimate chance at finishing close to 900 million. It's at 823 million worldwide now.